To All:

Re: Removal of the FAA AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site

Last month the FAA cancelled the AFS-800 Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ's.
Evidently the reason was because the FAA Public Relations folks, the creator
of the FAA's main "How do I become a Pilot?" FAQ web page convinced the FAA
Administrator and AFS-1 that there didn't need to be two different FAQ web
sites within the FAA's various web pages. This, of course, completely
misses the point as to the main purpose of the AFS-800 Part 61 and 141
FAQ's.

For years, the Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ's have been an internet extension of
the old FAA Pilot Examiner BBS from the 80's and early 90's which were
maintained by AFS-600. These FAQ's have served an essential and valuable
function providing DPE's, ASI's, CFI's and everyone in the flying public
with timely and valuable information about Parts 61, 141, SFAR 73 and
certification & regulation policy and issues.

While the FAA's web page "How do I become a pilot..." FAQ's serves the
public adequately for general aviation questions, they are totally
inadequate and completely miss the mark for providing the above-referenced
groups accurate and timely information about specific issues surrounding
Parts 61 and 141. A lot of work has gone into the AFS-800 Part 61 and 141
FAQ's and they need to be preserved and continue to be accessible to the
public.

The FAA Administrator and Director of Flight Standards need to be made aware
of the significant adverse impact removing the Part 61 and 141 FAQ's will
have on the FSDO's, DPE's, CFI's and anyone else who is interested in proper
interpretation of FAA policy and compliance with Parts 61 and 141.

Just a few reasons to reinstate the AFS-800 Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ web
site:

1. The AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site provides valuable guidance to
the flying public and FAA FSDO's on day-to-day application of the Parts 61
and 141 of the FAR's. It provides standardization to not only pilots and
CFI's, but also to FSDO's. It's a good way to get most of the FSDO's
marching to the beat of the same drummer with certification issues.

2. The existing AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site database has already
answered thousands of questions from airmen, CFI's, Pilot Examiners and FSDO
Inspectors. Absent this online resource and database, it will again occupy
thousands of extra hours of agency time to re-research and answer these same
questions as they come up again and again. That would be a waste of agency
resources and a waste of taxpayer's dollars.

3. The FAQ database has helped to promote compliance with the FAR's on Part
61 and 141 issues, thereby promoting increased aviation safety.

4. Omitting the Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ web site will now only increase
the burden on FSDO's to answer questions about application of Parts 61 and
141. Some FSDO's take forever to answer questions and often when an
inspector is done putting his 'spin' on the issue, the answer later proves
to be wrong compared to a legal opinion or AFS-800's answer. Absent that
useful Part 61 FAQ web site, such questions will either now go unanswered,
or the time spent answering them will detract from other safety-related
functions of FSDO personnel.

Likewise, absent the AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ's, there will be no
central, official Flight Standards web site to provide such guidance
pertinent to certification issues. FAA AGC-1 legal resources will also be
burdened by increased solicitation of legal opinions on issues that can be,
or already have been easily answered by the Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ's.

5. The AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site has become the single, most
useful and reliable resource for authoritative information about Parts 61
and 141. AFS-800 wrote the rules. Why not let them keep answering the
questions about what they meant ... by reinstating the Part 61 & 141 FAQ's!

People to contact about your concerns regarding removal of the AFS-800 Part
61 and 141 FAQ web site:

Marion C. Blakey AOA-1
FAA Administrator
800 Independence Avenue SW - Room 1010
Washington, DC 20591
202-267-3111, 202-267-5047 FAX
email:

James J. Ballough AFS-1
Director, Flight Standards Service
800 Independence Avenue SW - Room 821
Washington, DC 20591
202-267-8237, 202-267-5230 FAX
email:

Whether you agreed with the FAQ answers or not, they WERE useful to resolve
61 & 141 issues. If you are concerned about removal of the AFS-800 Part 61
and 141 FAQ web site, please contact the above individuals regarding your
concerns. An email is too easy to ignore. A fax or snail-mail letter would
have more impact on either recipient. Please take the time to make the
above individuals aware of your concerns. Thanks!
- Antique Examiner

Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:

http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/

You found a link, not the documents. If you can still find them, you have a
very magical computer, indeed! Try clicking on the link! While several
links still exist throughout the FAA's web pages, they are invalid links and
the actual Part 61 and 141 documents have been removed from the FAA's web
site. Moreover, AFS-800 has been told to stop working on them.. How so I
know? The day they disappeared, I called AFS-800 (202 267-3844) and asked
them where the FAQ's had gone. I was told that the decision to remove them
came from "upstairs," meaning either from the Administrator's Office or from
the Director of Flight Standards. On 12-06-05, all DPE's who are singned up
for the Designee Notification System received the following email:

"To: >
From: "FAA - Designee Notification System" >
Sent by:
Date: 12/06/2005 12:35PM
Subject: FAQ Part 61 & 141

Where did the website go. The public relations folks wanted to be the ones
answering all the questions presented to the FAA, so it was decided that the
FAQ's would be taken off the FAA website.

If you want this feature back on the FAA website send an email to the
director of Flight Standards requesting this.


OPS DESIGNEE NOTIFICATION SYSTEM"

"Scott Draper" > wrote in message
...
> Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
>
> http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/

How often did these documents change? Someone with a copy can send it any
number of folks here with public websites (you listening Jay Honeck? :) )
and have them post it there. Problem solved.

Marco

"Barry" > wrote in message
nk.net...
> You found a link, not the documents. If you can still find them, you have
a
> very magical computer, indeed! Try clicking on the link! While several
> links still exist throughout the FAA's web pages, they are invalid links
and
> the actual Part 61 and 141 documents have been removed from the FAA's web
> site. Moreover, AFS-800 has been told to stop working on them.. How so I
> know? The day they disappeared, I called AFS-800 (202 267-3844) and asked
> them where the FAQ's had gone. I was told that the decision to remove
them
> came from "upstairs," meaning either from the Administrator's Office or
from
> the Director of Flight Standards. On 12-06-05, all DPE's who are singned
up
> for the Designee Notification System received the following email:
>
> "To: >
> From: "FAA - Designee Notification System" >
> Sent by:
> Date: 12/06/2005 12:35PM
> Subject: FAQ Part 61 & 141
>
> Where did the website go. The public relations folks wanted to be the
ones
> answering all the questions presented to the FAA, so it was decided that
the
> FAQ's would be taken off the FAA website.
>
> If you want this feature back on the FAA website send an email to the
> director of Flight Standards requesting this.
>
>
> OPS DESIGNEE NOTIFICATION SYSTEM"
>
> "Scott Draper" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
> >
> >
http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/
>
>

....and how do they get updated, Marco?

Bob Gardner

"Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
...
> How often did these documents change? Someone with a copy can send it any
> number of folks here with public websites (you listening Jay Honeck? :) )
> and have them post it there. Problem solved.
>
> Marco
>
> "Barry" > wrote in message
> nk.net...
>> You found a link, not the documents. If you can still find them, you
>> have
> a
>> very magical computer, indeed! Try clicking on the link! While several
>> links still exist throughout the FAA's web pages, they are invalid links
> and
>> the actual Part 61 and 141 documents have been removed from the FAA's web
>> site. Moreover, AFS-800 has been told to stop working on them.. How so
>> I
>> know? The day they disappeared, I called AFS-800 (202 267-3844) and
>> asked
>> them where the FAQ's had gone. I was told that the decision to remove
> them
>> came from "upstairs," meaning either from the Administrator's Office or
> from
>> the Director of Flight Standards. On 12-06-05, all DPE's who are singned
> up
>> for the Designee Notification System received the following email:
>>
>> "To: >
>> From: "FAA - Designee Notification System" >
>> Sent by:
>> Date: 12/06/2005 12:35PM
>> Subject: FAQ Part 61 & 141
>>
>> Where did the website go. The public relations folks wanted to be the
> ones
>> answering all the questions presented to the FAA, so it was decided that
> the
>> FAQ's would be taken off the FAA website.
>>
>> If you want this feature back on the FAA website send an email to the
>> director of Flight Standards requesting this.
>>
>>
>> OPS DESIGNEE NOTIFICATION SYSTEM"
>>
>> "Scott Draper" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
>> >
>> >
> http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/
>>
>>
>
>

Well, that's why I qualified it with a question of how much they get updated
before I made the suggestion. Do the Part 61 and Part 141 regs change *that*
much from year to year?

Marco

"Bob Gardner" > wrote in message
. ..
> ...and how do they get updated, Marco?
>
> Bob Gardner
>
> "Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
> ...
> > How often did these documents change? Someone with a copy can send it
any
> > number of folks here with public websites (you listening Jay Honeck?
:) )
> > and have them post it there. Problem solved.
> >
> > Marco
> >
> > "Barry" > wrote in message
> > nk.net...
> >> You found a link, not the documents. If you can still find them, you
> >> have
> > a
> >> very magical computer, indeed! Try clicking on the link! While
several
> >> links still exist throughout the FAA's web pages, they are invalid
links
> > and
> >> the actual Part 61 and 141 documents have been removed from the FAA's
web
> >> site. Moreover, AFS-800 has been told to stop working on them.. How
so
> >> I
> >> know? The day they disappeared, I called AFS-800 (202 267-3844) and
> >> asked
> >> them where the FAQ's had gone. I was told that the decision to remove
> > them
> >> came from "upstairs," meaning either from the Administrator's Office or
> > from
> >> the Director of Flight Standards. On 12-06-05, all DPE's who are
singned
> > up
> >> for the Designee Notification System received the following email:
> >>
> >> "To: >
> >> From: "FAA - Designee Notification System" >
> >> Sent by:
> >> Date: 12/06/2005 12:35PM
> >> Subject: FAQ Part 61 & 141
> >>
> >> Where did the website go. The public relations folks wanted to be the
> > ones
> >> answering all the questions presented to the FAA, so it was decided
that
> > the
> >> FAQ's would be taken off the FAA website.
> >>
> >> If you want this feature back on the FAA website send an email to the
> >> director of Flight Standards requesting this.
> >>
> >>
> >> OPS DESIGNEE NOTIFICATION SYSTEM"
> >>
> >> "Scott Draper" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> > Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
> >> >
> >> >
> >
http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>
>

Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:

http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/

On 1/5/2006 8:50 PM, Scott Draper wrote the following:
> Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
>
> http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/

I think he might be referring to a huge Word document that
used to be here:

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/afs/afs800/afs840/part_61/media/pt61FAQ.doc

but is no longer. It was pretty interesting. I am now
regretting that I did not keep a copy.

I don't think that the regs themselves change very quickly, Marco, but
interpretations do. It takes a lot of effort and paperwork (public comments,
for example) to change a reg, and the aviation press does a good job of
alerting us to impending changes.

Bob

"Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
...
> Well, that's why I qualified it with a question of how much they get
> updated
> before I made the suggestion. Do the Part 61 and Part 141 regs change
> *that*
> much from year to year?
>
> Marco
>
> "Bob Gardner" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> ...and how do they get updated, Marco?
>>
>> Bob Gardner
>>
>> "Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> ...
>> > How often did these documents change? Someone with a copy can send it
> any
>> > number of folks here with public websites (you listening Jay Honeck?
> :) )
>> > and have them post it there. Problem solved.
>> >
>> > Marco
>> >
>> > "Barry" > wrote in message
>> > nk.net...
>> >> You found a link, not the documents. If you can still find them, you
>> >> have
>> > a
>> >> very magical computer, indeed! Try clicking on the link! While
> several
>> >> links still exist throughout the FAA's web pages, they are invalid
> links
>> > and
>> >> the actual Part 61 and 141 documents have been removed from the FAA's
> web
>> >> site. Moreover, AFS-800 has been told to stop working on them.. How
> so
>> >> I
>> >> know? The day they disappeared, I called AFS-800 (202 267-3844) and
>> >> asked
>> >> them where the FAQ's had gone. I was told that the decision to remove
>> > them
>> >> came from "upstairs," meaning either from the Administrator's Office
>> >> or
>> > from
>> >> the Director of Flight Standards. On 12-06-05, all DPE's who are
> singned
>> > up
>> >> for the Designee Notification System received the following email:
>> >>
>> >> "To: >
>> >> From: "FAA - Designee Notification System" >
>> >> Sent by:
>> >> Date: 12/06/2005 12:35PM
>> >> Subject: FAQ Part 61 & 141
>> >>
>> >> Where did the website go. The public relations folks wanted to be the
>> > ones
>> >> answering all the questions presented to the FAA, so it was decided
> that
>> > the
>> >> FAQ's would be taken off the FAA website.
>> >>
>> >> If you want this feature back on the FAA website send an email to the
>> >> director of Flight Standards requesting this.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> OPS DESIGNEE NOTIFICATION SYSTEM"
>> >>
>> >> "Scott Draper" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >> > Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >
> http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>
>

Barry wrote:
> To All:
>
> Re: Removal of the FAA AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site
>
> Last month the FAA cancelled the AFS-800 Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ's.
> Evidently the reason was because the FAA Public Relations folks, the creator
> of the FAA's main "How do I become a Pilot?" FAQ web page convinced the FAA
> Administrator and AFS-1 that there didn't need to be two different FAQ web
> sites within the FAA's various web pages. This, of course, completely
> misses the point as to the main purpose of the AFS-800 Part 61 and 141
> FAQ's.

For those who are interested - the Google cache of the Part 141 FAQ is here:

http://tinyurl.com/b3uta

The Part 61 FAQ is not in the Google cache.

- Ray

<<You found a link, not the documents. >>

You're right, I just right clicked and saved it, didn't look at it.

I did keep a copy of the part 61 document. If anyone is interested I will
upload it and post the url.

Chris

"Scott Draper" > wrote in message
...
> Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
>
> http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/

Hey Chris,
Which revision of the Part 61 FAQ's do you have? I've got #19, July 14,
2003. If you've got a version that is newer than mine, I'd appreciate a
copy of it.
Thanks,
Jim

"Chris" > wrote in message
...
> I did keep a copy of the part 61 document. If anyone is interested I will
> upload it and post the url.
>
> Chris
>
> "Scott Draper" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
> >
> >
http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/
>
>

Minds the same version as your Jim


"Jim Burns" > wrote in message
...
> Hey Chris,
> Which revision of the Part 61 FAQ's do you have? I've got #19, July 14,
> 2003. If you've got a version that is newer than mine, I'd appreciate a
> copy of it.
> Thanks,
> Jim
>
> "Chris" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I did keep a copy of the part 61 document. If anyone is interested I will
>> upload it and post the url.
>>
>> Chris
>>
>> "Scott Draper" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
>> >
>> >
> http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/
>>
>>
>
>

I believe that revision #22, dated 07/22/2005 was the last one put
out.


On Sat, 7 Jan 2006 17:21:35 -0000, "Chris" >
wrote:

>Minds the same version as your Jim
>
>
>"Jim Burns" > wrote in message
...
>> Hey Chris,
>> Which revision of the Part 61 FAQ's do you have? I've got #19, July 14,
>> 2003. If you've got a version that is newer than mine, I'd appreciate a
>> copy of it.
>> Thanks,
>> Jim
>>
>> "Chris" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> I did keep a copy of the part 61 document. If anyone is interested I will
>>> upload it and post the url.
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>> "Scott Draper" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>> > Barry, how do you know? I can still find them here:
>>> >
>>> >
>> http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/airmen_FAQ/
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>

Guys,
I think you are missing the point. Are you writing snail mail and asking
that the FAQs be restored? Are you publizing the info to your compadres at
the airport?

"Barry" > wrote in message
ink.net...
> To All:
>
> Re: Removal of the FAA AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site
>
> Last month the FAA cancelled the AFS-800 Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ's.
> Evidently the reason was because the FAA Public Relations folks, the
creator
> of the FAA's main "How do I become a Pilot?" FAQ web page convinced the
FAA
> Administrator and AFS-1 that there didn't need to be two different FAQ web
> sites within the FAA's various web pages. This, of course, completely
> misses the point as to the main purpose of the AFS-800 Part 61 and 141
> FAQ's.
>
> For years, the Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ's have been an internet extension
of
> the old FAA Pilot Examiner BBS from the 80's and early 90's which were
> maintained by AFS-600. These FAQ's have served an essential and valuable
> function providing DPE's, ASI's, CFI's and everyone in the flying public
> with timely and valuable information about Parts 61, 141, SFAR 73 and
> certification & regulation policy and issues.
>
> While the FAA's web page "How do I become a pilot..." FAQ's serves the
> public adequately for general aviation questions, they are totally
> inadequate and completely miss the mark for providing the above-referenced
> groups accurate and timely information about specific issues surrounding
> Parts 61 and 141. A lot of work has gone into the AFS-800 Part 61 and 141
> FAQ's and they need to be preserved and continue to be accessible to the
> public.
>
> The FAA Administrator and Director of Flight Standards need to be made
aware
> of the significant adverse impact removing the Part 61 and 141 FAQ's will
> have on the FSDO's, DPE's, CFI's and anyone else who is interested in
proper
> interpretation of FAA policy and compliance with Parts 61 and 141.
>
> Just a few reasons to reinstate the AFS-800 Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ web
> site:
>
> 1. The AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site provides valuable guidance to
> the flying public and FAA FSDO's on day-to-day application of the Parts 61
> and 141 of the FAR's. It provides standardization to not only pilots and
> CFI's, but also to FSDO's. It's a good way to get most of the FSDO's
> marching to the beat of the same drummer with certification issues.
>
> 2. The existing AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site database has already
> answered thousands of questions from airmen, CFI's, Pilot Examiners and
FSDO
> Inspectors. Absent this online resource and database, it will again
occupy
> thousands of extra hours of agency time to re-research and answer these
same
> questions as they come up again and again. That would be a waste of
agency
> resources and a waste of taxpayer's dollars.
>
> 3. The FAQ database has helped to promote compliance with the FAR's on
Part
> 61 and 141 issues, thereby promoting increased aviation safety.
>
> 4. Omitting the Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ web site will now only increase
> the burden on FSDO's to answer questions about application of Parts 61 and
> 141. Some FSDO's take forever to answer questions and often when an
> inspector is done putting his 'spin' on the issue, the answer later proves
> to be wrong compared to a legal opinion or AFS-800's answer. Absent that
> useful Part 61 FAQ web site, such questions will either now go unanswered,
> or the time spent answering them will detract from other safety-related
> functions of FSDO personnel.
>
> Likewise, absent the AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ's, there will be no
> central, official Flight Standards web site to provide such guidance
> pertinent to certification issues. FAA AGC-1 legal resources will also be
> burdened by increased solicitation of legal opinions on issues that can
be,
> or already have been easily answered by the Part 61 and Part 141 FAQ's.
>
> 5. The AFS-800 Part 61 and 141 FAQ web site has become the single, most
> useful and reliable resource for authoritative information about Parts 61
> and 141. AFS-800 wrote the rules. Why not let them keep answering the
> questions about what they meant ... by reinstating the Part 61 & 141
FAQ's!
>
> People to contact about your concerns regarding removal of the AFS-800
Part
> 61 and 141 FAQ web site:
>
> Marion C. Blakey AOA-1
> FAA Administrator
> 800 Independence Avenue SW - Room 1010
> Washington, DC 20591
> 202-267-3111, 202-267-5047 FAX
> email:
>
> James J. Ballough AFS-1
> Director, Flight Standards Service
> 800 Independence Avenue SW - Room 821
> Washington, DC 20591
> 202-267-8237, 202-267-5230 FAX
> email:
>
> Whether you agreed with the FAQ answers or not, they WERE useful to
resolve
> 61 & 141 issues. If you are concerned about removal of the AFS-800 Part
61
> and 141 FAQ web site, please contact the above individuals regarding your
> concerns. An email is too easy to ignore. A fax or snail-mail letter
would
> have more impact on either recipient. Please take the time to make the
> above individuals aware of your concerns. Thanks!
> - Antique Examiner
>
>