Hi all,

I recently bought a condo. Immediately after closing I was bombarded with
solicitations for disability insurance. I finally agreed to have an agent
come out to the house and go over the details. I subsequently signed the
papers. That was over a month ago.

After several subsequent phone calls over several weeks assuring me that
"we're almost finished" and "it's a done deal" , I was informed, today,
that I would not be insured. I was so disgusted.

I want to try again but with a little more savvy this time.

My question is, to those of you that have faced a similar circumstance,
do you think being a commercial pilot finally disqualified me or something
more sinister, like working for the FAA? I told them I am an ATCS that
just happens to have a commercial pilot's license--- but not current.

So, what's the straight-skinny for this group?

Thanks

"Ins risk?" > wrote in
:

> Hi all,
>
> I recently bought a condo. Immediately after closing I was bombarded
> with solicitations for disability insurance. I finally agreed to have
> an agent come out to the house and go over the details. I
> subsequently signed the papers. That was over a month ago.
>
> After several subsequent phone calls over several weeks assuring me
> that "we're almost finished" and "it's a done deal" , I was
> informed, today, that I would not be insured. I was so disgusted.
>
> I want to try again but with a little more savvy this time.
>
> My question is, to those of you that have faced a similar
> circumstance, do you think being a commercial pilot finally
> disqualified me or something more sinister, like working for the
> FAA? I told them I am an ATCS that just happens to have a
> commercial pilot's license--- but not current.
>
> So, what's the straight-skinny for this group?
>
> Thanks
>
>
>

Your agent knows why you were turned down, ask him/her.

--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams

I think they have to tell you why you were turned down... and now that you
have been denied insurance.. that question pops up on future insurance
applications... you've been "flagged"... you need to know if you were turned
down for risk because of flying... your work.. or your health..

BT

"Ins risk?" > wrote in message
.. .
> Hi all,
>
> I recently bought a condo. Immediately after closing I was bombarded with
> solicitations for disability insurance. I finally agreed to have an agent
> come out to the house and go over the details. I subsequently signed the
> papers. That was over a month ago.
>
> After several subsequent phone calls over several weeks assuring me that
> "we're almost finished" and "it's a done deal" , I was informed, today,
> that I would not be insured. I was so disgusted.
>
> I want to try again but with a little more savvy this time.
>
> My question is, to those of you that have faced a similar circumstance,
> do you think being a commercial pilot finally disqualified me or
> something more sinister, like working for the FAA? I told them I am an
> ATCS that just happens to have a commercial pilot's license--- but not
> current.
>
> So, what's the straight-skinny for this group?
>
> Thanks
>
>

"BTIZ" > wrote in message
news:DuL%d.73113$Tt.58898@fed1read05...
>I think they have to tell you why you were turned down... and now that you
>have been denied insurance.. that question pops up on future insurance
>applications... you've been "flagged"... you need to know if you were
>turned down for risk because of flying... your work.. or your health..


I was "finally" told it was because of the work but the fact that it took
over a month to state as such makes one wonder.

To BTIZ:

Are you sure I would be wasting my time applying with another company?

I would be interested in others holding a commercial or in ATC weighing-in
on this issue.


Thx,


Deprived

ahh.. the ATCS work... having the commercial license does factor in... does
not matter if it is current or not... they have concluded that the ATC work
is too high stress for their cheap risk insurance... you may have better
luck with a more reputable firm... but check.. you may have to tell them you
were denied insurance.. I do not carry specific disability insurance.. but
all my life insurance was attained through companies that understand pilots
and medical requirements.

BT
ARTCC ZBOS (way back when)
retired AF Master Navigator
active Commercial Pilot and Glider CFI

"Ins risk?" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "BTIZ" > wrote in message
> news:DuL%d.73113$Tt.58898@fed1read05...
>>I think they have to tell you why you were turned down... and now that you
>>have been denied insurance.. that question pops up on future insurance
>>applications... you've been "flagged"... you need to know if you were
>>turned down for risk because of flying... your work.. or your health..
>
>
> I was "finally" told it was because of the work but the fact that it took
> over a month to state as such makes one wonder.
>
> To BTIZ:
>
> Are you sure I would be wasting my time applying with another company?
>
> I would be interested in others holding a commercial or in ATC
> weighing-in on this issue.
>
>
> Thx,
>
>
> Deprived
>

Just a sideline comment on a pet peeve of mine - not directly aimed at
the OP:
As the guy on the other end of the stethoscope who deals with insurers
on an hourly basis, let me chime in... The issue that gives me the
most grief is the letter to the customer that says, "Based on
information from your physician we cannot . . . " Of course, this
'customer' is instantly in my office, veins bulging in his forehead,
waving the letter and screaming...

Look folks, everything you tell the doctors office goes into the
record... <write that on the blackboard 100 times>

When you sign a record release the insurance company sends me a copy
and as required by law I send them a photocopy of your medical
record...
Then one of two things happens...
They see something in the chart that triggers their reject button and
you get the letter...
Or they decide to reject you for your credit history <this is a bigger
issue than most folks appreciate>, driving record, or their agent
casually questions your neighbors, checks your trash for liquor
bottles, whatever, and their easy way out is the letter blaming me...

About ten years ago there was one cut rate, mail order, health
insurance company that was going house to house in my rural population
of patients selling really cheap life insurance... Of course 99 out of
100 were rejected because the insurer was skimming the 1% least likely
to die and rejecting the rest and sending the letter blaming me... I
had angry patients threatening me with law suits, gonna punch me out,
etc., and I started filing a complaint with the State Attorney General
on each patient that came in... Faced with some awkward questions that
insurance company quickly disappeared from the state of Michigan, thank
gawd...

denny

Thanks, all, for the comments and I think I'll try again. Even when I was
being interviewed and investigated, I got the impression the company was
constantly looking for a reason NOT to insured.

WHAT A WASTE OF TIME!!!!!

Ins,
Don't be too upset. Getting the policy is one thing, actually getting
the insurance company to pay is another if you ever really need it. By
the way, what insurance company was it if you don't mind telling us?

Americo out of Dallas, TX.


So you're saying that a vast majority of applicants ARE turned down because
of even the most slightest hint of a risk?

Thanks for setting me straight. I *did* consider going to Center's flight
surgeon, in about a year, and telling them I am "possessed by the devil"
and have the "urge to run to airplanes into one another." What a hoot!!!
Looks like that won't be happening anytime soon!



"skym" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Ins,
> Don't be too upset. Getting the policy is one thing, actually getting
> the insurance company to pay is another if you ever really need it. By
> the way, what insurance company was it if you don't mind telling us?
>

Didn't mean that most applicants are turned down for the policy.
However, if you read the fine print in those disability policies, and
the construction that the insurance companies put on them, you'd
probably be less enthusiastic about buying one. For example, they
almost all have a significant exclusion period, eg 90 days, 120 days,
180 days. You probably want an exclusion period, anyway, since you
really only need one if you are going to be "disabled" for a lengthy
enough period of time that the loss of income is a significant
financial burden. Also, the longer the exclusion period, the less the
policy costs...which is reasonable and fair.
The rub comes in the insurers' interpretation of the word "disabled."
For example many, if not most, policies require that you be TOTALLY
disabled; and I mean "totally." They require you to be able to do
nothing, literally, except breathe, eat and go to the bathroom (with
assistance). I'm not kidding. If you can lie in bed and address
envelopes, you may not be "totally disabled" under some policies. I
have had cases (I'm a lawyer who handles these kinds of cases, if you
hadn't already figured that out), where the insurer says that if you
can carry out the normal bodily functions-eating, breathing and going
to the bathroom (with assistance)- you are not "disabled".. read
"sorry, Charlie." Really good ones (like the one I have) define
disabled to mean that you cannot do each and all the functions of your
regular employment, although you might be able to some, or even most of
them. Even then, many give only a scaled down benefit. Some require
that you cannot do most of them in order to pay, but if you can do most
(but not all) they won't pay. Some say that if you could do the job,
even if it's in another climate thousands of milers away, but not where
you live, then you aren't disabled; i.e., since you theoretically could
move there and get a job, you aren't disabled. Don't have the money to
move? Sorry, not their problem. Got brain damage, and can't be a
doctor anymore? Hardees is looking for people just like you.
Then there are the medical "Independent Medical Exams" that they
require before they pay. These are usually anything but "Independent."
There are lots of medical whores around who make a pretty penny doing
IMEs for insurance companies who virtually always opine that the person
can really work at something. We have a couple in our town, and all
the insurance companies (and most of the lawyers and other doctors)
know who they are. The insurer will require the claimant to go to a
doctor of the insurance company's choosing (guess who) and get his/her
opinion before they are required to pay dime one. I don't need to tell
you what the result of that is.

you'd
> probably be less enthusiastic about buying one. For example, they
> almost all have a significant exclusion period, eg 90 days,

I was aware of the 90days just to get on board. I also became aware of
waiting 2 years before relying on the "no
questions asked" wait time before pulling or even jusy claiming a legit
claim. and I am MOST aware that IF I were to announce that I was
possessed to by devil and had the urge to run to aircraft into one another,
how long do you THINK it would take for me to get the boot and get my
insurance payments? I doubt I was ever return to a sector again, from
that momnet on.



> The rub comes in the insurers' interpretation of the word "disabled."
> For example many, if not most, policies require that you be TOTALLY
> disabled;

in the case of ATC the disabled could be alleged as all mentaL, and in the
case, my friend, that would be more than enough, right?

what say you, under those revelations? What would YOU decide if you were
on a decision board?

"Ins risk?" > wrote in
:

>
> you'd
>> probably be less enthusiastic about buying one. For example, they
>> almost all have a significant exclusion period, eg 90 days,
>
> I was aware of the 90days just to get on board. I also became aware
> of waiting 2 years before relying on the "no
> questions asked" wait time before pulling or even jusy claiming a
> legit claim. and I am MOST aware that IF I were to announce that
> I was possessed to by devil and had the urge to run to aircraft into
> one another, how long do you THINK it would take for me to get the
> boot and get my insurance payments? I doubt I was ever return to a
> sector again, from that momnet on.
>
>
>
>> The rub comes in the insurers' interpretation of the word "disabled."
>> For example many, if not most, policies require that you be TOTALLY
>> disabled;
>
> in the case of ATC the disabled could be alleged as all mentaL, and
> in the case, my friend, that would be more than enough, right?
>
> what say you, under those revelations? What would YOU decide if you
> were on a decision board?
>
>
>


If you get a disability policy get pay extra and get one with an "own-
occ" definition of disability. That means if your unable to do your own
occupation, your disabled. Most policies now have a hybrid, with
something like an own-occ for 2-5 yrs, then any occ after that. BTW
most policies also have an income definition as well, so if your able to
flip hambergers, your still disabled since your unable to do an occ that
produces a certain percentage of what you were doing....
--
-- ET >:-)

"A common mistake people make when trying to design something
completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete
fools."---- Douglas Adams