Tecumseh Engine Mounting Question [Archive]

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jlauer

October 30th 03, 03:06 AM

Wondering if you have someone could provide an answer to an engine
installation question. I have a hovercraft that uses a Tecumseh LEV
80-120 5.5 hp engine for the lifting propeller.

The question is weather the engine can be mounted with the
piston/spark plug facing down (incline is at 22 degress down angle
from level) without messing up the engine during operation?

I am concerned that the engine might not get enough lubrication tilted
down at 22 degress during its operation?

Thanks

Larry Smith

October 30th 03, 03:18 AM

"jlauer" > wrote in message
om...
> Wondering if you have someone could provide an answer to an engine
> installation question. I have a hovercraft that uses a Tecumseh LEV
> 80-120 5.5 hp engine for the lifting propeller.
>
> The question is weather the engine can be mounted with the
> piston/spark plug facing down (incline is at 22 degress down angle
> from level) without messing up the engine during operation?
>
> I am concerned that the engine might not get enough lubrication tilted
> down at 22 degress during its operation?
>
> Thanks

All the Tecumsehs I've seen have positive pressure oil pumps. Tilting 22
degrees shouldn't be a problem. They sure do get tilted in normal service.

Jerry Wass

October 30th 03, 01:25 PM

<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
<html>
 
Larry Smith wrote:
<blockquote TYPE=CITE>"jlauer" > wrote in message
 <a om</a>...
 > Wondering if you have someone could provide an answer to an engine
 > installation question.  I have a hovercraft that uses a Tecumseh
LEV
 > 80-120 5.5 hp engine for the lifting propeller.
 >
 > The question is weather the engine can be mounted with the
 > piston/spark plug facing down (incline is at 22 degress down angle
 > from level) without messing up the engine during operation?
 >
 > I am concerned that the engine might not get enough lubrication tilted
 > down at 22 degress during its operation?
 >
 > Thanks
All the Tecumsehs I've seen have positive pressure oil pumps. 
Tilting 22
 degrees shouldn't be a problem.   They sure do get tilted
in normal service.</blockquote>
All depends on what he means by 22 deg. down----( from horizontal)---
 Rotating the crankcase 22deg from normal would be ok----bur rotating
the
 engine 90deg + 22deg would NOT!!
  </html>

John Stricker

October 30th 03, 02:09 PM

22° down at the spark plug is quite a bit. Contrary to what Smith thinks,
the LEV doesn't have an oil pump, it's a simple vertical shaft motor. But I
haven't seen him be right about too much on here yet, so that's not too
surprising.

You're probably going to run into problems with oil getting by the rings
when the engine isn't running and putting enough into the cylinder to
potentially hydraulically lock it, not unlike the old aircraft radial
engines with their bottom cylinders.

Is there any way you can turn it so that it's got the engine mounted with
the plug UP 22°? If you can't do that, you're most likely going to run into
problems of oil in the cylinders when at rest and higher than normal oil
consumption when running because the oil's going to want to keep running
back down on into the cylinder, most likely more than the oil rings will be
able to control.

For those unfamiliar with the engine he's talking about, here it is.
http://www.tulsaenginewarehouse.com/catalog/tecumseh/specs/lev100115120/

If you have one of these, you know the oil level plug is just about at the
point where the bottom cover separates from the block. You can see that
parting line in the link I posted. Not take a ruler or something and set it
at about 22° angle. You're going to HAVE to have enough oil in it to cover
the bearing on the bottom side, that's a necessity. So allow about 1/8" of
oil over it, should be a little more, and see where the oil level ends up.
The vast majority of it will end up IN the cylinder under the piston. This
is not a good thing.

Any particular reason you want to use a Tecumseh? I've had many different
variations of them over the years and haven't been impressed with any of
them. I can't say they're any worse than a Briggs, but they're certainly no
better and WAY lower quality than a Honda, amongst others.

John Stricker

"jlauer" > wrote in message
om...
> Wondering if you have someone could provide an answer to an engine
> installation question. I have a hovercraft that uses a Tecumseh LEV
> 80-120 5.5 hp engine for the lifting propeller.
>
> The question is weather the engine can be mounted with the
> piston/spark plug facing down (incline is at 22 degress down angle
> from level) without messing up the engine during operation?
>
> I am concerned that the engine might not get enough lubrication tilted
> down at 22 degress during its operation?
>
> Thanks

Model Flyer

November 4th 03, 01:18 PM

"John Stricker" > wrote in message
...
> 22° down at the spark plug is quite a bit. Contrary to what Smith
thinks,
> the LEV doesn't have an oil pump, it's a simple vertical shaft
motor. But I

Odd, I've stripped many of that series of engines and they had oil
pumps, this allowed them to be used with the shaft more than 15º from
vertical, the restriction on running B&S engines in simmilar
deployments. The pump is driven by the camshaft and uses ports in the
camshaft a valves for the pump and a drill hole to the top of the
case to feed the top main and big end. The limitation from the
virtical is around 25º.

I doubt that it would be any good for direct drive as there is
nothing to take the thrust from his fan.
--

..
--
Cheers,
Jonathan Lowe
whatever at antispam dot net
No email address given because of spam.
Antispam trap in place

> haven't seen him be right about too much on here yet, so that's not
too
> surprising.
>
> You're probably going to run into problems with oil getting by the
rings
> when the engine isn't running and putting enough into the cylinder
to
> potentially hydraulically lock it, not unlike the old aircraft
radial
> engines with their bottom cylinders.
>
> Is there any way you can turn it so that it's got the engine
mounted with
> the plug UP 22°? If you can't do that, you're most likely going to
run into
> problems of oil in the cylinders when at rest and higher than
normal oil
> consumption when running because the oil's going to want to keep
running
> back down on into the cylinder, most likely more than the oil rings
will be
> able to control.
>
> For those unfamiliar with the engine he's talking about, here it
is.
>
http://www.tulsaenginewarehouse.com/catalog/tecumseh/specs/lev1001151
20/
>
> If you have one of these, you know the oil level plug is just about
at the
> point where the bottom cover separates from the block. You can see
that
> parting line in the link I posted. Not take a ruler or something
and set it
> at about 22° angle. You're going to HAVE to have enough oil in it
to cover
> the bearing on the bottom side, that's a necessity. So allow about
1/8" of
> oil over it, should be a little more, and see where the oil level
ends up.
> The vast majority of it will end up IN the cylinder under the
piston. This
> is not a good thing.
>
> Any particular reason you want to use a Tecumseh? I've had many
different
> variations of them over the years and haven't been impressed with
any of
> them. I can't say they're any worse than a Briggs, but they're
certainly no
> better and WAY lower quality than a Honda, amongst others.
>
> John Stricker
>
>
>
> "jlauer" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Wondering if you have someone could provide an answer to an
engine
> > installation question. I have a hovercraft that uses a Tecumseh
LEV
> > 80-120 5.5 hp engine for the lifting propeller.
> >
> > The question is weather the engine can be mounted with the
> > piston/spark plug facing down (incline is at 22 degress down
angle
> > from level) without messing up the engine during operation?
> >
> > I am concerned that the engine might not get enough lubrication
tilted
> > down at 22 degress during its operation?
> >
> > Thanks
>
>

Larry Smith

November 14th 03, 01:56 PM

"Model Flyer" > wrote in message
...
>
> "John Stricker" > wrote in message
> ...
> > 22° down at the spark plug is quite a bit. Contrary to what Smith
> thinks,
> > the LEV doesn't have an oil pump, it's a simple vertical shaft
> motor. But I
>
> Odd, I've stripped many of that series of engines and they had oil
> pumps, this allowed them to be used with the shaft more than 15º from
> vertical, the restriction on running B&S engines in simmilar
> deployments. The pump is driven by the camshaft and uses ports in the
> camshaft a valves for the pump and a drill hole to the top of the
> case to feed the top main and big end. The limitation from the
> virtical is around 25º.
>
> I doubt that it would be any good for direct drive as there is
> nothing to take the thrust from his fan.
> --
>
> .
> --
> Cheers,
> Jonathan Lowe
> whatever at antispam dot net
> No email address given because of spam.
> Antispam trap in place
>

Ol' Stickler may not be as bright as he thinks he is:

Tecumseh 5 HP Engine, Model# LEV115-350041D

Tecumseh Remote control mechanical compression release Recoil start; solid
state ignition Mechanical governor; oil pump; float carburetor 7/8in. x 3
5/32in. shaft; 3/16in. keyway; 3/8in.-24 tapped end Model LEV115-350041D
U.S.A.

Larry Smith

November 14th 03, 02:02 PM

Ben Haas

November 16th 03, 01:51 AM

About time for BOb to chime in on that model not being CERTIFIED... <G>

"John Stricker" > wrote in message >...
> 22° down at the spark plug is quite a bit. Contrary to what Smith thinks,
> the LEV doesn't have an oil pump, it's a simple vertical shaft motor. But I
> haven't seen him be right about too much on here yet, so that's not too
> surprising.
>
> You're probably going to run into problems with oil getting by the rings
> when the engine isn't running and putting enough into the cylinder to
> potentially hydraulically lock it, not unlike the old aircraft radial
> engines with their bottom cylinders.
>
> Is there any way you can turn it so that it's got the engine mounted with
> the plug UP 22°? If you can't do that, you're most likely going to run into
> problems of oil in the cylinders when at rest and higher than normal oil
> consumption when running because the oil's going to want to keep running
> back down on into the cylinder, most likely more than the oil rings will be
> able to control.
>
> For those unfamiliar with the engine he's talking about, here it is.
> http://www.tulsaenginewarehouse.com/catalog/tecumseh/specs/lev100115120/
>
> If you have one of these, you know the oil level plug is just about at the
> point where the bottom cover separates from the block. You can see that
> parting line in the link I posted. Not take a ruler or something and set it
> at about 22° angle. You're going to HAVE to have enough oil in it to cover
> the bearing on the bottom side, that's a necessity. So allow about 1/8" of
> oil over it, should be a little more, and see where the oil level ends up.
> The vast majority of it will end up IN the cylinder under the piston. This
> is not a good thing.
>
> Any particular reason you want to use a Tecumseh? I've had many different
> variations of them over the years and haven't been impressed with any of
> them. I can't say they're any worse than a Briggs, but they're certainly no
> better and WAY lower quality than a Honda, amongst others.
>
> John Stricker
>
>
>
> "jlauer" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Wondering if you have someone could provide an answer to an engine
> > installation question. I have a hovercraft that uses a Tecumseh LEV
> > 80-120 5.5 hp engine for the lifting propeller.
> >
> > The question is weather the engine can be mounted with the
> > piston/spark plug facing down (incline is at 22 degress down angle
> > from level) without messing up the engine during operation?
> >
> > I am concerned that the engine might not get enough lubrication tilted
> > down at 22 degress during its operation?
> >
> > Thanks