FAA Exemption Letter (USA)

[Bob 7U]

I haven't heard anything in a few years about the requirement to carry
an FAA Exemption letter in the cockpit. Is it still a requirement or
has common sense prevailed?
The latest info I could find on the SSA web site only extends the
exemption until October 2008.

Thanks,

Bob 7U

[Tony[_5_]]

On Jan 21, 7:34*pm, Bob 7U > wrote:
> I haven't heard anything in a few years about the requirement to carry
> an FAA Exemption letter in the cockpit. Is it still a requirement or
> has common sense prevailed?
> The latest info I could find on the SSA web site only extends the
> exemption until October 2008.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Bob 7U

Exemption from what?

[Todd]

go here: http://aes.faa.gov/

Search for Exemption/Docket "4988"

and you will find 4988H with an expiration date of 10/30/2011 (next
year)

and if you read it, yes, you are still required to carry it in your
glider, along with the original 4988 document.

You can click on the document grid then click download on the left to
get your own personal copy, suitable for framing.

[Burt Compton - Marfa]

For USA Gliders.

The SSA has it covered. Just some of the good behind the scenes work
they accomplish for us.


The Identification Plate Exemption # 4988 and the Extension Letter
(now valid to OCT 30, 2011), are on the SSA website at

http://www.ssa.org/files/member/Data%20Plate%20Exemption%202008.pdf

Yes, you must carry both documents in the glider if you do not want to
secure an external identification plate to your glider.

The exemption letter is reissued by the FAA every 3 years, at the
discretion of the FAA, after the SSA submits a petition.
I believe Judy Ruprecht is submitting this recurring petition for us.

Burt
Marfa, west Texas
USA

[JS]

Just print all the pages on one sheet, it's legal and doesn't even
weigh as much as the airframe.
Jim

[Alan[_6_]]

In article > Burt Compton - Marfa > writes:

>The SSA has it covered. Just some of the good behind the scenes work
>they accomplish for us.
>
>
>The Identification Plate Exemption # 4988 and the Extension Letter
>(now valid to OCT 30, 2011), are on the SSA website at
>
>http://www.ssa.org/files/member/Data%20Plate%20Exemption%202008.pdf
>
>Yes, you must carry both documents in the glider if you do not want to
>secure an external identification plate to your glider.
>
>The exemption letter is reissued by the FAA every 3 years, at the
>discretion of the FAA, after the SSA submits a petition.
>I believe Judy Ruprecht is submitting this recurring petition for us.

To clarify a bit, there are two documents that one must carry for this.

1) The original exemption letter, which is 4 pages long. It can be
downloaded from:
http://www.ssa.org/docs/Exemption4988.pdf

2) Since the original exemption from that letter terminates on Oct 30, 1990,
you also need the extension letter, which is 2 pages long. It is at:
http://www.ssa.org/files/member/Data%20Plate%20Exemption%202008.pdf


Caution, one of the older pages on the SSA site lists these pages of the 2002
update letter, which is now useless. (http://www.ssa.org/docs/080120001.pdf
and http://www.ssa.org/docs/080120002.pdf) You should use the current ones
mentioned above.


As another poster mentioned, there doesn't seem to be any restriction against
2 sided printing, or scaling the pages smaller and putting several on a page.
It probably should be kept readable, but one sheet can be tucked securely away
somewhere.

I keep my own copy in the bag with my logbooks and charts as well. It might
reduce embarassment some day. (There is also a spare yaw string in there.)

Alan

[Tony[_5_]]

I think it's worth noting that Part 45 only applies to aircraft built
under a type certificate.

Tony

[T8]

Does anyone have a comprehensive checklist for required docs and other
"ramp check" items? Preferably one that's been tested?

-Evan Ludeman / T8

[Bob Kuykendall]

On Jan 22, 6:45*am, Tony > wrote:

> I think it's worth noting that Part 45 only applies to aircraft built
> under a type certificate.

I don't think that's correct. Here's what § 45.1(a) says:

> § 45.1 Applicability.
> This part prescribes the requirements for—
>
> (a) Identification of aircraft, and identification of aircraft engines
> and propellers that are manufactured under the terms of a type
> or production certificate...

The way I read that § 45.1(a), the first "and" means that part § 45
prescribes the requirements for both the identification of aircraft
_and_ the identification of certificated engines and propellers. Note
that the way that sentence is constructed, the qualifier "manufactured
under the terms of a type or production certificate" does not
necessarily apply to "aircraft," so it could be construed as "all
aircraft."

I admit that paragraph (a) might be a bit ambiguous, and I think that
it would be better if it was broken out into two paragraphs, something
like:

(a) Identification of aircraft.

(b) Identification of aircraft engines and propellers yadda yadda...

However, I'm personally convinced that § 45.1(a) means that all of
Part 45 applies to experimental as well as certificated aircraft. That
seems to be the consensus in the RV-series homebuilt aircraft
community, I think that pretty much all of them carry external
dataplates.

Thanks, Bob K.
www.hpaircraft.com

[Burt Compton - Marfa]

On Jan 22, 8:45*am, Tony > wrote:
> I think it's worth noting that Part 45 only applies to aircraft built
> under a type certificate.
>
> Tony

But often your FAA Inspectors ramp checkin' you don't know that.
Probably better to produce the the data plate exemption letter and
move them along.

S/He also expects the manufacturer's Flight Manual in your glider, but
it is not required by the reg (in gliders).
I keep a copy in there anyway -- just to move them along -- and gosh
it IS useful information!

They will ask for your gov't issued photo ID, pilot certificate and
medical. Keep these within reach -- that's the rule.
Yes, medical -- I've met some FAA Inspectors (just a few) that believe
a medical is required to be PIC in a glider.

What they may look for in a glider -- especially if not familiar with
gliders -- is simply your AROW paperwork, the compass correction card,
all placards or labels in place and readable, the TSO tags on your
seatbelts, and the data plate or the SSA/FAA exemption.

If they've seen you assembling the glider they may want to know where
the endorsement from a A&P mechanic is in your glider log. But
gliders (and balloons) are exempted on the basis that rigging is a FAA
required item in training for the pilot certificate or rating in
category glider.

If you have a parachute inside the glider they may ask to see the
rigger's repack card (now 180 days).

Goofy lookin' PDA mounts, oxygen tanks tied with old rubber bands and
sloppy battery wiring may get their attention while strolling around
the ramp.
Canopy covers are a good thing.

If you have an Experimental glider they may be asking to see your FSDO
paperwork. Best keep that up to date if needed as this is a hot point
with FAA lately.

Don't argue that you don't need certain doc's unless you have all the
reg's at your fingertips -- just cooperate to a certain extent, keep
your paperwork current and move them along to the twin engine airplane
over yonder on the ramp. Go into the FSDO on a rainy day and
educate them then on gliders, not on a good soaring day.

99.4 % of the FAA Inspectors are good guys -- really. I've worked
with many and never had a problem -- maybe 'cause I'm familiar with
the reg's and over-prepared.

Oh, and if the Homeland Security / TSA guys come along and you are a
Flight Instructor (glider only) you might want to have that TSA glider
training exemption letter handy as well. Otherwise be prepared to
prove you have taken your "Training Provider" Annual Recurrent
Security Training Course, but that's for another thread.

Kinda makes your head spin, don't it?

Burt
Marfa, far west Texas USA
www.flygliders.com

[BT[_2_]]

Most gliders imported into the US or built within the US were issued a TCDS.
There is your certificate

BT

"Tony" > wrote in message
...
>I think it's worth noting that Part 45 only applies to aircraft built
> under a type certificate.
>
> Tony

[Tony[_5_]]

On Jan 22, 12:23*pm, Bob Kuykendall > wrote:
> On Jan 22, 6:45*am, Tony > wrote:
>
> > I think it's worth noting that Part 45 only applies to aircraft built
> > under a type certificate.
>
> I don't think that's correct. Here's what § 45.1(a) says:
>
> > § 45.1 * Applicability.
> > This part prescribes the requirements for—
>
> > (a) Identification of aircraft, and identification of aircraft engines
> > *and propellers that are manufactured under the terms of a type
> > *or production certificate...
>
> The way I read that § 45.1(a), the first "and" means that part § 45
> prescribes the requirements for both the identification of aircraft
> _and_ the identification of certificated engines and propellers. Note
> that the way that sentence is constructed, the qualifier "manufactured
> under the terms of a type or production certificate" does not
> necessarily apply to "aircraft," so it could be construed as "all
> aircraft."
>
> I admit that paragraph (a) might be a bit ambiguous, and I think that
> it would be better if it was broken out into two paragraphs, something
> like:
>
> (a) Identification of aircraft.
>
> (b) Identification of aircraft engines and propellers yadda yadda...
>
> However, I'm personally convinced that § 45.1(a) means that all of
> Part 45 applies to experimental as well as certificated aircraft. That
> seems to be the consensus in the RV-series homebuilt aircraft
> community, I think that pretty much all of them carry external
> dataplates.
>
> Thanks, Bob K.www.hpaircraft.com

ok, i read that wrong. after reading through several other regs and
advisory circulars its obvious that this rule applies to all
aircraft. i guess i better print off that letter...

[Andy[_1_]]

On Jan 22, 11:28*am, Burt Compton - Marfa > wrote:

>the compass correction card

Burt,

Can you please point me to any regulation that requires a compass
correction card, or even a compass, to be fitted in a US registered
glider. I know of no such regulation and a compass is not required by
my minimum equipment list.

A recent AOPA on-line quiz question about correction cards provided an
incorrect answer to this citing a regulation that referenced only
airplanes but asserting it applied to aircraft.

Maybe there's another regulation that I'm not aware of.

My local FSDO is on an inspection spree so it would be good to be
prepared.

thanks

Andy

[SoaringXCellence]

On Jan 22, 1:14*pm, Andy > wrote:
> On Jan 22, 11:28*am, Burt Compton - Marfa > wrote:
>
> >the compass correction card
>
> Burt,
>
> Can you please point me to any regulation that requires a compass
> correction card, or even a compass, to be fitted in a US registered
> glider. *I know of no such regulation and a compass is not required by
> my minimum equipment list.
>
> A recent AOPA on-line quiz question about correction cards provided an
> incorrect answer to this citing a regulation that referenced only
> airplanes but asserting it applied to aircraft.
>
> Maybe there's another regulation that I'm not aware of.
>
> My local FSDO is on an inspection spree so it would be good to be
> prepared.
>
> thanks
>
> Andy

I think Burt's comment was that the FAA inspectors don't always know
that the compass correction card (or compass) is not required on a
glider. Better to have a plan in place than to argue with an
inspector when they're looking to ground your glider.

Mike

[Burt Compton - Marfa]

>
> I think Burt's comment was that the FAA inspectors don't always know
> that the compass correction card (or compass) is not required on a
> glider. *Better to have a plan in place than to argue with an
> inspector when they're looking to ground your glider.
>
> Mike

Exactly what I'm saying -- over prepare a bit, have a easy 5 minute
ramp check, then go fly!

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

Just to confuse the matter further (because I like to do that) might I
suggest a careful reading of 14CFR45.11? The first thing you will
find under "GeneraL" is a "Link to an amendment published at 74 FR
53394, October 16, 2009." If we skip this ammendment for now, you
will read in paragraph (a) that "Aircraft covered under §21.182 of
this chapter must be identified..." So, what does §21.182 say? It
says:

"§ 21.182 Aircraft identification.
(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, each
applicant for an airworthiness certificate under this subpart must
show that his aircraft is identified as prescribed in §45.11.

(b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to applicants for the
following:

(1) A special flight permit.

(2) An experimental certificate for an aircraft not issued for the
purpose of operating amateur-built aircraft, operating primary kit-
built aircraft, or operating light-sport aircraft.

(3) A change from one airworthiness classification to another, for an
aircraft already identified as prescribed in §45.11.

So, the requirement to identify per 45.11 DOES NOT APPLY to aircraft
applying for an Experimental certificate issued for Exhibition and Air
Racing. Or Show Compliance with FARs. Or Market Survey. Or Research
and Development. Says so right there. I am not making this up.
Copied directly from the FAA e-CFRs. You can look it up.

Further down in 45.11, it says "On aircraft manufactured before March
7, 1988, the identification plate required by paragraph (a) of this
section..." Well, paragraph (a) exempts aircraft with an Experimental
Exhibition and Racing Airworthiness Certificate from the requirement
for the plate upon application for an Airworthiness Certificate after
that date, so those manufactured before that date are also exempt from
the requirement, as they referenced a paragraph that provides the
exemption. If you have a Standard Airworthiness Certificate,
Experimental Amateur Built, Primary Kit-Built, or Light Sport, you
have to have the dataplate. New or old manufacture.

Now if you would like to really have the waters muddied, read that
ammendment. As I read it, the requirement to identify gliders
manufactured before the initial issue of the regulation (March 7,
1988) has now been removed. The only gliders that must carry the data
plate are those that apply for an airworthiness certificate after
October 16, 2009 (the date of the ammendment). But not if they apply
for Experimental Exhibition and Racing. Did the SSA maybe influence
the FAA to exempt gliders from the requirement for the external
dataplate? Read the ammendment and let's hear what you think it says!


Steve

[Greg Arnold]

Steve Leonard wrote:
> Just to confuse the matter further (because I like to do that) might I
> suggest a careful reading of 14CFR45.11? The first thing you will
> find under "GeneraL" is a "Link to an amendment published at 74 FR
> 53394, October 16, 2009." If we skip this ammendment for now, you
> will read in paragraph (a) that "Aircraft covered under §21.182 of
> this chapter must be identified..." So, what does §21.182 say? It
> says:
>
> "§ 21.182 Aircraft identification.
> (a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, each
> applicant for an airworthiness certificate under this subpart must
> show that his aircraft is identified as prescribed in §45.11.
>
> (b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to applicants for the
> following:
>
> (1) A special flight permit.
>
> (2) An experimental certificate for an aircraft not issued for the
> purpose of operating amateur-built aircraft, operating primary kit-
> built aircraft, or operating light-sport aircraft.
>
> (3) A change from one airworthiness classification to another, for an
> aircraft already identified as prescribed in §45.11.
>
> So, the requirement to identify per 45.11 DOES NOT APPLY to aircraft
> applying for an Experimental certificate issued for Exhibition and Air
> Racing. Or Show Compliance with FARs. Or Market Survey. Or Research
> and Development. Says so right there. I am not making this up.
> Copied directly from the FAA e-CFRs. You can look it up.
>
> Further down in 45.11, it says "On aircraft manufactured before March
> 7, 1988, the identification plate required by paragraph (a) of this
> section..." Well, paragraph (a) exempts aircraft with an Experimental
> Exhibition and Racing Airworthiness Certificate from the requirement
> for the plate upon application for an Airworthiness Certificate after
> that date, so those manufactured before that date are also exempt from
> the requirement, as they referenced a paragraph that provides the
> exemption. If you have a Standard Airworthiness Certificate,
> Experimental Amateur Built, Primary Kit-Built, or Light Sport, you
> have to have the dataplate. New or old manufacture.
>
> Now if you would like to really have the waters muddied, read that
> ammendment. As I read it, the requirement to identify gliders
> manufactured before the initial issue of the regulation (March 7,
> 1988) has now been removed. The only gliders that must carry the data
> plate are those that apply for an airworthiness certificate after
> October 16, 2009 (the date of the ammendment). But not if they apply
> for Experimental Exhibition and Racing. Did the SSA maybe influence
> the FAA to exempt gliders from the requirement for the external
> dataplate? Read the ammendment and let's hear what you think it says!
>
>
> Steve


To make it easier for the curious, I presume the amendment is the one
here: http://tinyurl.com/yc9ufsv.

[Greg Arnold]

Steve Leonard wrote:
> Just to confuse the matter further (because I like to do that) might I
> suggest a careful reading of 14CFR45.11? The first thing you will
> find under "GeneraL" is a "Link to an amendment published at 74 FR
> 53394, October 16, 2009." If we skip this ammendment for now, you
> will read in paragraph (a) that "Aircraft covered under §21.182 of
> this chapter must be identified..." So, what does §21.182 say? It
> says:
>
> "§ 21.182 Aircraft identification.
> (a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, each
> applicant for an airworthiness certificate under this subpart must
> show that his aircraft is identified as prescribed in §45.11.
>
> (b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to applicants for the
> following:
>
> (1) A special flight permit.
>
> (2) An experimental certificate for an aircraft not issued for the
> purpose of operating amateur-built aircraft, operating primary kit-
> built aircraft, or operating light-sport aircraft.
>
> (3) A change from one airworthiness classification to another, for an
> aircraft already identified as prescribed in §45.11.
>
> So, the requirement to identify per 45.11 DOES NOT APPLY to aircraft
> applying for an Experimental certificate issued for Exhibition and Air
> Racing. Or Show Compliance with FARs. Or Market Survey. Or Research
> and Development. Says so right there. I am not making this up.
> Copied directly from the FAA e-CFRs. You can look it up.
>
> Further down in 45.11, it says "On aircraft manufactured before March
> 7, 1988, the identification plate required by paragraph (a) of this
> section..." Well, paragraph (a) exempts aircraft with an Experimental
> Exhibition and Racing Airworthiness Certificate from the requirement
> for the plate upon application for an Airworthiness Certificate after
> that date, so those manufactured before that date are also exempt from
> the requirement, as they referenced a paragraph that provides the
> exemption. If you have a Standard Airworthiness Certificate,
> Experimental Amateur Built, Primary Kit-Built, or Light Sport, you
> have to have the dataplate. New or old manufacture.
>
> Now if you would like to really have the waters muddied, read that
> ammendment. As I read it, the requirement to identify gliders
> manufactured before the initial issue of the regulation (March 7,
> 1988) has now been removed. The only gliders that must carry the data
> plate are those that apply for an airworthiness certificate after
> October 16, 2009 (the date of the ammendment). But not if they apply
> for Experimental Exhibition and Racing. Did the SSA maybe influence
> the FAA to exempt gliders from the requirement for the external
> dataplate? Read the ammendment and let's hear what you think it says!
>
>
> Steve


Sounds like the amendment exempts gliders manufactured before March 7,
1988, while those manufactured after that date still need the fireproof
data plate but it need not be on the exterior.

[Andy[_1_]]

On Jan 22, 7:02*pm, Burt Compton - Marfa > wrote:
> > I think Burt's comment was that the FAA inspectors don't always know
> > that the compass correction card (or compass) is not required on a
> > glider. *Better to have a plan in place than to argue with an
> > inspector when they're looking to ground your glider.
>
> > Mike
>
> Exactly what I'm saying -- over prepare a bit, have a easy 5 minute
> ramp check, then go fly!

Don't forget to install an oil pressure and oil temperature gauge as
well. They are required for some aircraft so you must have them in
your glider too!

Andy

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

On Jan 22, 9:21*pm, Greg Arnold > wrote:

>
> To make it easier for the curious, I presume the amendment is the one
> here: *http://tinyurl.com/yc9ufsv

Yes, Greg. That is the amendment. And I think it exempts all gliders
manufactured prior to that amendment date, or October 16, 2009.
Remember, the paragraph that talks to March 7, 1988 does not apply to
gliders anymore. So, anything in that amendment for glider applies
from the date of the amendment forward. And any application for
airworthiness for Experimental Exhibition and Racing is still exempt
directly from 21.182.

Of course, getting the FAA person to understand their rule may be
another matter!

Steve