Re: Landing Checklist

[None[_2_]]

Our club has adopted this landing checklist

U undercarriage
S speed
T trim
A airbrakes
R radio intention
E enter pattern

Plug in water, flaps, etc. if you need it. The emphasis is to have it
done and not be doing it along the downwind legl.

[noel.wade]

GUMPS and FUSTALL were taught to me when getting my PPL-SEL ticket
(which I got before finding joy in gliders)...

But the landing checklist I learned at Warner Springs (Sky Sailing)
has stuck with me best:

G ear
F laps
W ind
A ltimeter
T rim
T raffic
S poilers

I got into the habit of announcing it prior to (or just entering)
downwind, even if the aircraft I was in didn't have retractable gear
or flaps. Each step in the mnemonic is a single word, and each word
is short and succinct (unlike words such as "undercarriage"). And at
the end you're looking outside for both your spoiler check and while
looking for traffic - that "head outside the cockpit" is something
that I think other checklists don't necessarily cover well.

But the bottom line is: Does the checklist work well for you, and
does it help you get on the ground reliably and safely (for both you
and the others around you)? Any checklist that does these things is a
good one in my book!

--Noel

[vaughn[_3_]]

"None" > wrote in message
...
> Our club has adopted this landing checklist
>
> U undercarriage
> S speed
> T trim
> A airbrakes
> R radio intention
> E enter pattern
>
> Plug in water, flaps, etc. if you need it. The emphasis is to have it
> done and not be doing it along the downwind legl.

My personal feeling is that a landing checklist should be specific to the glider
and therefore not include items that make no sense for that particular glider.
My reason: Training a new student in a fixed-gear trainer to recite
"undercarriage" on each landing AND THEN DO NOTHING is to set them up for future
wheels-up landings when they do finally fly retractables.

We can expect them to fly the way they have been trained. If they are trained
to recite and then ignore certain checklist items, that habit will carry over to
future flying.

Vaughn

[Andy[_1_]]

On Mar 24, 1:55*pm, "vaughn" > wrote:

>My reason: Training a new student in a fixed-gear trainer to recite
>"undercarriage" on each landing AND THEN DO NOTHING is to set them up for future
>wheels-up landings when they do finally fly retractables.

Don't agree. My glider takeoff checklist includes flaps and I seldom
fly flapped gliders. I don't do nothing when I get to FLAPS. I
respond None.

I do most of my power flying in fixed gear singles but the memorized
landing check list still includes GEAR and the response "Down" (and
sometimes down and welded).

Each checklist item should require a response. In my opinion the
response "None" is as valid as "Set" or "Down".

I realize this is personal preference and it's been done to death here
before.

Andy (GY)

[kirk.stant]

On Mar 24, 3:48*pm, "noel.wade" > wrote:
> GUMPS and FUSTALL were taught to me when getting my PPL-SEL ticket
> (which I got before finding joy in gliders)...
>
> But the landing checklist I learned at Warner Springs (Sky Sailing)
> has stuck with me best:
>
> G ear
> F laps
> W ind
> A ltimeter
> T rim
> T raffic
> S poilers
>
>
> But the bottom line is: *Does the checklist work well for you, and
> does it help you get on the ground reliably and safely (for both you
> and the others around you)? *Any checklist that does these things is a
> good one in my book!
>
> --Noel

Too long for me: who cares about the altimeter once in the pattern,
you should always be looking for traffic and announcing on the radio,
and items such as speed, trim, flaps, and spoilers are aircraft and
pattern specific/airmanship issues, IMHO. I've trimmed mine down to
"Wind Water Wheels" (once prior to the pattern, as a reminder to start
thinking about how these decision items need to be taken care of) and
once again before turning base (to make sure everything is considered
and configured) and then concentrate on flying the glider without
hitting anybody or breaking anything.

This is my equivalent of the classic GUMP check, beloved of all power
pilots.

The key (for me at least) is to then continually analyse how the
pattern is going, and if something isn't right, fix it (i.e. if you
are not coming down fast enough, maybe you need to pull the correct
handle to get the spoilers out, doofus!) But first of all, fly the
glider...

The trouble with long checklists is that since many of the items are
not done simultaneously, you either have to repeat the checklist
multiple times, or interrupt it and continue, etc.. Which takes away
brain bytes that better used flying the glider...

And I really believe the pattern is absolutely no place for a long
written checklist!

Anyway, it has worked for me so far....

Kirk
66

[Mike the Strike]

After using the USTALL checklist for thirty years, I managed to land a
couple of times without first dumping my water ballast - one of the
landings was interesting as the water had leaked out of one wing
through a leaky valve during flight and the other was still full
(ground loop anyone?). I now use BUSTALL (which is what is likely to
happen if you land with one wing full of water and one empty).

I also disagree about leaving out the undercarriage check on fixed
gear aircraft. When I was training for my single-engine rating years
ago in South Africa, the fixed-gear aircraft had a dummy gear switch
on the panel with a red and green light. My instructor thought that
it was always good practice to check gear and so far his training has
worked on me.

Mike

[Eric Greenwell]

Mike the Strike wrote:
> I also disagree about leaving out the undercarriage check on fixed
> gear aircraft. When I was training for my single-engine rating years
> ago in South Africa, the fixed-gear aircraft had a dummy gear switch
> on the panel with a red and green light. My instructor thought that
> it was always good practice to check gear and so far his training has
> worked on me.
>
I used a clothespin in my Ka6E, which I transferred from the spoiler
handle to the lip of the cowling. It didn't work perfectly for me, as I
forgot my gear once in the Std Cirrus, and twice in the ASW 20 C;
fortunately, both gliders had a gear warning horn, so I never landed
gear up. I've never forgotten it in the ASH 26 e (2900 hours), so I did
learn it eventually. I do have a warning system, just the same.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (netto to net to email me)

[vaughn[_3_]]

"kirk.stant" > wrote in message
...
>This is my equivalent of the classic GUMP check, beloved of all power
>pilots.

Well, perhaps not "beloved" everywhere, or even universlly taught any more.
I converted to SEL about 5 years ago, and no mention was ever made of any
standard or pneumonic memorized checklist for anything except emergencies.
Never once did I check the wheels of my Cessna on downwind. Instead, we used
model-specific checklists. In my experience, these laminated checklists are
commonly found in most rental aircraft. Model-specific checklists are available
for common aircraft at most any pilot's store. www.checkmateaviation.com

This is what got me thinking about why that might be, and how it might apply
to glider training.

Vaughn

[Alan Larson]

In article > "vaughn" > writes:
>
>"kirk.stant" > wrote in message
...
>>This is my equivalent of the classic GUMP check, beloved of all power
>>pilots.
>
> Well, perhaps not "beloved" everywhere, or even universlly taught any more.
>I converted to SEL about 5 years ago, and no mention was ever made of any
>standard or pneumonic memorized checklist for anything except emergencies.
>Never once did I check the wheels of my Cessna on downwind. Instead, we used
>model-specific checklists. In my experience, these laminated checklists are
>commonly found in most rental aircraft. Model-specific checklists are available
>for common aircraft at most any pilot's store. www.checkmateaviation.com

When I learned in 1976, the instructors were fairly clear about using the
standard checklist for the aircraft model, from the book. Anything else
was considered suspect, and possibly illegal. GUMP seemed obsolete then,
and was never taught by anyone I have encountered.


> This is what got me thinking about why that might be, and how it might apply
>to glider training.

It amazed me when I encountered strings of letters when I started in gliders a
couple of years ago.

Alan