Barographs? [Archive] - AviationBanter

Tim Taylor

May 24th 10, 08:59 PM

On May 24, 1:36*pm, Andy > wrote:
> On May 24, 11:06*am, jcarlyle > wrote:
>
> > I've got an old Replogle you can have. Contact me off line at jcarlyle
> > at interserv dot com.
>
> Now you're spoiling the whole "retro" experience with modern
> technology! *He should be made to smoke foils and learn how to seal
> them without blowing the trace away.
>
> Andy

I have an OK brand on the shelf that uses smoked foil. And yes my
first 500K was blown away when the official observer hit it too hard
with the hairspray. Had to go back and fly it again.

Tony[_5_]

May 24th 10, 09:00 PM

On May 24, 2:36*pm, Andy > wrote:
> On May 24, 11:06*am, jcarlyle > wrote:
>
> > I've got an old Replogle you can have. Contact me off line at jcarlyle
> > at interserv dot com.
>
> Now you're spoiling the whole "retro" experience with modern
> technology! *He should be made to smoke foils and learn how to seal
> them without blowing the trace away.
>
> Andy

i actually would really love to use a smoke barograph, i just don't
have one.

Maybe I should try to find one for use in my upcoming gold and diamond
attempts.

Club lore here is of one fellow who rummaged around in the trunk of
his car for the spray can of stuff to seal the barograph. turns out
he grabbed a can of carb cleaner in the dark. bye bye trace.

Tony[_5_]

May 24th 10, 09:01 PM

On May 24, 2:59*pm, Tim Taylor > wrote:
> On May 24, 1:36*pm, Andy > wrote:
>
> > On May 24, 11:06*am, jcarlyle > wrote:
>
> > > I've got an old Replogle you can have. Contact me off line at jcarlyle
> > > at interserv dot com.
>
> > Now you're spoiling the whole "retro" experience with modern
> > technology! *He should be made to smoke foils and learn how to seal
> > them without blowing the trace away.
>
> > Andy
>
> I have an OK brand on the shelf that uses smoked foil. *And yes my
> first 500K was blown away when the official observer hit it too hard
> with the hairspray. *Had to go back and fly it again.

ok maybe ill take the cambridge AND the barograph :)

kirk.stant

May 24th 10, 09:21 PM

Of course, you will have to bungee launch off a hill in a primary
glider attached to your barograph...with a Model T as a retrieve
vehicle.

In otherwords, why bother? We pay a lot of tax money to support the
GPS system, get some use out of it!

And be sure to check the SSA site for the recording requirements for
badge flights - barographs are only valid for badge altitude or time
claims, or badge distance without turnpoints.

Probably a lot easier to ask around and borrow a proper GPS logger -
you will definitely make the badge lady happier, and get to relive the
flight via SeeYou afterwards - and let us enjoy it on OLC!

Cheers,

Kirk (Save a tree, fly a plastic glider)
66

Tony[_5_]

May 24th 10, 09:39 PM

On May 24, 3:21*pm, "kirk.stant" > wrote:
> Of course, you will have to bungee launch off a hill in a primary
> glider attached to your barograph...with a Model T as a retrieve
> vehicle.
>
> In otherwords, why bother? *We pay a lot of tax money to support the
> GPS system, get some use out of it!
>
> And be sure to check the SSA site for the recording requirements for
> badge flights - barographs are only valid for badge altitude or time
> claims, or badge distance without turnpoints.
>
> Probably a lot easier to ask around and borrow a proper GPS logger -
> you will definitely make the badge lady happier, and get to relive the
> flight via SeeYou afterwards - and let us enjoy it on OLC!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Kirk (Save a tree, fly a plastic glider)
> 66

Kirk,

I've got a loaner Cambridge 25 in the Cherokee which I really love.
But Leah's cherokee has no such device and there are a few guys in the
club who are barograph free not to mention the club itself only has 1
barograph but 3 gliders. I just like the idea of having a few
barographs around in case one of my students or friends are going
flying on a day where a badge leg or state record could be claimed.

noel.wade

May 24th 10, 09:45 PM

On May 24, 1:39*pm, Tony > wrote:

> club who are barograph free not to mention the club itself only has 1
> barograph but 3 gliders. *I just like the idea of having a few
> barographs around in case one of my students or friends are going
> flying on a day where a badge leg or state record could be claimed.

Bah, save yourself a ton of trouble. Buy a self-contained unit like
the ewMicroRecorder. Its perfect for a club setting, has an internal
battery, a simple on-off switch (and no other complications), and
requires just a standard USB cable (or SD card reader) to download
your flight. If you want to get "fancy" you can hook it up to a PDA
for a moving-map navigation system; but if you just want to log
flights you only need what comes in the box!

Take care,

--Noel

Tony[_5_]

May 24th 10, 09:52 PM

On May 24, 3:45*pm, "noel.wade" > wrote:
> On May 24, 1:39*pm, Tony > wrote:
>
> > club who are barograph free not to mention the club itself only has 1
> > barograph but 3 gliders. *I just like the idea of having a few
> > barographs around in case one of my students or friends are going
> > flying on a day where a badge leg or state record could be claimed.
>
> Bah, save yourself a ton of trouble. *Buy a self-contained unit like
> the ewMicroRecorder. *Its perfect for a club setting, has an internal
> battery, a simple on-off switch (and no other complications), and
> requires just a standard USB cable (or SD card reader) to download
> your flight. *If you want to get "fancy" you can hook it up to a PDA
> for a moving-map navigation system; but if you just want to log
> flights you only need what comes in the box!
>
> Take care,
>
> --Noel

i just saw one used on W&W. Based on what I paid for my last Replogle
we could have 8 barographs ready to go in club ships, privately owned
single seaters, whatever, for the price of one EW.

noel.wade

May 24th 10, 10:22 PM

On May 24, 1:52*pm, Tony > wrote:
>
> i just saw one used on W&W. *Based on what I paid for my last Replogle
> we could have 8 barographs ready to go in club ships, privately owned
> single seaters, whatever, for the price of one EW.

Yes, but you're not taking into account the maintenance hassles and
failure rates of the barograph; not to mention the fact that it cannot
be used for all badges (see Kirk's comments).

Don't focus on acquisition cost - focus on the "cost of ownership"
over the long run; not just in dollars but in man-hours and stress,
too. Having been through the Silver Badge rigmarole, in my opinion
NOTHING is more discouraging to a budding XC pilot than to go have a
good flight and then be told it won't be accepted because of a
technicality or instrumentation flaw. Be realistic about how many
people are going on badge flights, and how often they will be doing
so. Chances are that any modest-sized club doesn't really need more
than 1 or 2 logger devices. You're much better off getting a
reliable, simple, self-contained unit that is good for every type of
badge and contest.

If the newer club pilots really get into doing these kinds of flights,
they can go out and get their own logger so that they can post their
flights to the OLC and fly badges and contests whenever they want...
its still a lot cheaper to buy a logger than it is to buy your own
glider!

If you give them old equipment that causes them frustration or lost
flights, they'll give up on both the equipment AND on the flying.

My $0.02,

--Noel

Andy[_1_]

May 24th 10, 10:26 PM

On May 24, 1:52*pm, Tony > wrote:
> On May 24, 3:45*pm, "noel.wade" > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On May 24, 1:39*pm, Tony > wrote:
>
> > > club who are barograph free not to mention the club itself only has 1
> > > barograph but 3 gliders. *I just like the idea of having a few
> > > barographs around in case one of my students or friends are going
> > > flying on a day where a badge leg or state record could be claimed.
>
> > Bah, save yourself a ton of trouble. *Buy a self-contained unit like
> > the ewMicroRecorder. *Its perfect for a club setting, has an internal
> > battery, a simple on-off switch (and no other complications), and
> > requires just a standard USB cable (or SD card reader) to download
> > your flight. *If you want to get "fancy" you can hook it up to a PDA
> > for a moving-map navigation system; but if you just want to log
> > flights you only need what comes in the box!
>
> > Take care,
>
> > --Noel
>
> i just saw one used on W&W. *Based on what I paid for my last Replogle
> we could have 8 barographs ready to go in club ships, privately owned
> single seaters, whatever, for the price of one EW.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I'll donate my 35mm cameras if you really want to load up with useless
stuff. May even still have an Instamatic but no film available for
those any more. Also have 2 prayer wheels. The 1-26 one should be
about right for the Cherokee.

Andy

noel.wade

May 24th 10, 10:27 PM

P.S. I don't know what the price was on W&W, but I'm selling my spare
ewMicroRecorder for $425... They're not expensive when you consider
that's less than 10 aerotows or 2 annual inspections almost anywhere
in the USA!

Tony[_5_]

May 24th 10, 10:32 PM

On May 24, 4:22*pm, "noel.wade" > wrote:
> On May 24, 1:52*pm, Tony > wrote:
>
>
>
> > i just saw one used on W&W. *Based on what I paid for my last Replogle
> > we could have 8 barographs ready to go in club ships, privately owned
> > single seaters, whatever, for the price of one EW.
>
> Yes, but you're not taking into account the maintenance hassles and
> failure rates of the barograph; not to mention the fact that it cannot
> be used for all badges (see Kirk's comments).
>
> Don't focus on acquisition cost - focus on the "cost of ownership"
> over the long run; not just in dollars but in man-hours and stress,
> too. *Having been through the Silver Badge rigmarole, in my opinion
> NOTHING is more discouraging to a budding XC pilot than to go have a
> good flight and then be told it won't be accepted because of a
> technicality or instrumentation flaw. *Be realistic about how many
> people are going on badge flights, and how often they will be doing
> so. *Chances are that any modest-sized club doesn't really need more
> than 1 or 2 logger devices. *You're much better off getting a
> reliable, simple, self-contained unit that is good for every type of
> badge and contest.
>
> If the newer club pilots really get into doing these kinds of flights,
> they can go out and get their own logger so that they can post their
> flights to the OLC and fly badges and contests whenever they want...
> its still a lot cheaper to buy a logger than it is to buy your own
> glider!
>
> If you give them old equipment that causes them frustration or lost
> flights, they'll give up on both the equipment AND on the flying.
>
> My $0.02,
>
> --Noel

oh i know all about barograph failures. I had about 3 or 4 before my
Silver Badge 'stuck'

My first Silver distance and altitude claim as an OO just got approved
yesterday for a club member who was borrowing my barograph. It worked
flawlessly.

In a lot of ways its 6 one way and half dozen another. Another club
member has had 2 diamond altitude flights that he didnt submit because
thanks to the GPS they would've been rejected. Both flights would've
been fine if a Barograph had been used.

Tony[_5_]

May 24th 10, 10:33 PM

On May 24, 4:26*pm, Andy > wrote:
> On May 24, 1:52*pm, Tony > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On May 24, 3:45*pm, "noel.wade" > wrote:
>
> > > On May 24, 1:39*pm, Tony > wrote:
>
> > > > club who are barograph free not to mention the club itself only has 1
> > > > barograph but 3 gliders. *I just like the idea of having a few
> > > > barographs around in case one of my students or friends are going
> > > > flying on a day where a badge leg or state record could be claimed.
>
> > > Bah, save yourself a ton of trouble. *Buy a self-contained unit like
> > > the ewMicroRecorder. *Its perfect for a club setting, has an internal
> > > battery, a simple on-off switch (and no other complications), and
> > > requires just a standard USB cable (or SD card reader) to download
> > > your flight. *If you want to get "fancy" you can hook it up to a PDA
> > > for a moving-map navigation system; but if you just want to log
> > > flights you only need what comes in the box!
>
> > > Take care,
>
> > > --Noel
>
> > i just saw one used on W&W. *Based on what I paid for my last Replogle
> > we could have 8 barographs ready to go in club ships, privately owned
> > single seaters, whatever, for the price of one EW.- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> I'll donate my 35mm cameras if you really want to load up with useless
> stuff. May even still have an Instamatic but no film available for
> those any more. *Also have 2 prayer wheels. *The 1-26 one should be
> about right for the Cherokee.
>
> Andy- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Andy -

Turnpoint photos are no longer part of the Sporting Code. Makes life
simpler but forces you to use a flight recorder for Diamond Goal which
is a bummer.

BT[_3_]

May 25th 10, 12:11 AM

Tony.. check with "The Badge Lady".. a couple of years ago we were the only
ones to submit a badge claim with a barograph. I think there are two left in
the club. There were some FAI rules changes that may not allow a mechanical
barograph any more.

Calibration requirements with mechanical barographs are a lot more stringent
than with an approved logger.
And turn point photo's are still required for out and back flights.

Bill

"Tony" > wrote in message
...
> Anyone have a Barograph or two sitting on a shelf collecting dust? I
> would like to put one or two of these relics back into service
> generating FAI Badges. Replogle preferred as that is what I have
> experience with, however I'll consider any other model. Thanks!
>
> Tony

Tony[_5_]

May 25th 10, 12:17 AM

On May 24, 6:11*pm, "BT" > wrote:
> Tony.. check with "The Badge Lady".. a couple of years ago we were the only
> ones to submit a badge claim with a barograph. I think there are two left in
> the club. There were some FAI rules changes that may not allow a mechanical
> barograph any more.
>
> Calibration requirements with mechanical barographs are a lot more stringent
> than with an approved logger.
> And turn point photo's are still required for out and back flights.
>
> Bill
>

Bill,

read the sporting code. It was updated last October.

Barographs are still perfectly acceptable for all badge flights except
Diamond Goal. Turn Point photos no longer exist as far as the FAI is
concerned. The only way to fly a pre declared task any more is with a
gps logger.

I recently OO'd a Silver Distance/Altitude flight using a barograph
and it was approved yesterday.

Martin Gregorie[_5_]

May 25th 10, 11:30 AM

On Mon, 24 May 2010 13:52:04 -0700, Tony wrote:

> On May 24, 3:45Â*pm, "noel.wade" > wrote:
>> On May 24, 1:39Â*pm, Tony > wrote:
>>
>> > club who are barograph free not to mention the club itself only has 1
>> > barograph but 3 gliders. Â*I just like the idea of having a few
>> > barographs around in case one of my students or friends are going
>> > flying on a day where a badge leg or state record could be claimed.
>>
>> Bah, save yourself a ton of trouble. Â*Buy a self-contained unit like
>> the ewMicroRecorder. Â*Its perfect for a club setting, has an internal
>> battery, a simple on-off switch (and no other complications), and
>> requires just a standard USB cable (or SD card reader) to download your
>> flight. Â*If you want to get "fancy" you can hook it up to a PDA for a
>> moving-map navigation system; but if you just want to log flights you
>> only need what comes in the box!
>>
>> Take care,
>>
>> --Noel
>
> i just saw one used on W&W. Based on what I paid for my last Replogle
> we could have 8 barographs ready to go in club ships, privately owned
> single seaters, whatever, for the price of one EW.
>
Keep your eyes open for a used EW model D and a Garmin 12XL[1] or GPS II+
to drive it. The combo should be rather cheaper. The model D is rugged
and simple to use (only one button) and runs off 12v or its one internal
9v battery.

[1] if you go for a Garmin 12, make sure its the 12XL, which takes 6-40v
input just like the GPS II+ and III+ do. The earlier 12 requires 6v and
is destroyed if you connect it to 12v. How I know: a club mate found this
out the hard way.

--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

Andy[_1_]

May 25th 10, 01:57 PM

On May 24, 2:33*pm, Tony > wrote:

> Turnpoint photos are no longer part of the Sporting Code. *

Hence the offer of *useless* equipment.

Burt Compton - Marfa

May 25th 10, 02:04 PM

Ed Replogle's Barographs are wonderful. They tick, they look cool,
feel good . . . the smooth machined drum for the trace paper . . .
the little fingertip handle as you carry it to the sailplane. I keep
two Replogle barographs ready for altitude flights at Marfa in
southwest Texas. Visiting pilots may borrow one as a backup to their
logger.

Preparing the barograph follows a time-honored and traditional
protocol that is deliberate and in sequence. For luck, we always wind
the clock spring (very slowly and gently) with a US quarter coin from
North Carolina, the issue with the 1903 Wright airplane (motorglider)
on it. The increasing tension of the spring as you wind it and the
sound of the clockworks ticking matches your anticipation of a
"personal-best" soaring flight. The barograph comes to life, and it
has a heartbeat.

On my shelf in my hangar I display a vintage smoke foil mechanical
barograph given to my father Fritz Compton by Wolf Hirth (the German
soaring pioneer) after WWII. Dad used it for his soaring badges and
his Bendix trophy flights beginning in 1948. I used it for my Silver
Badge flights decades ago. Tradition.

You can still have your barograph calibrated in the USA. I use Joe
Trinkwalder in Tonawanda, NY, who calibrates each Ed Replogle
barograph with great care and reverence for his late friend "Rep".
Contact info is in "Soaring" magazine classified ad section under
Instruments, along with other calibration labs.

Here is Ed's Obit: Ed ("Rep") Replogle, an engineer and inventor
whose career as a pilot spanned nearly seven decades, died on February
17, 2002 in Buffalo, NY.

Born in 1916 in Columbus, OH, Rep soloed in 1932 in a Gypsy Moth
biplane. His soaring career began in a Franklin Utility at a glider
club at the University of Michigan, where he graduated with a degree
in Aeronautical Engineering in 1938. His distinguished engineering
career included stints with Budd, Kaiser Fleetwing, Bellanca and Bell
Aircraft; finishing up as an independent inventor with over 20 patents
to his credit.

Rep's record as a competitive soaring pilot included wins the 1-26
(Region 1 1968, 21st Wright Memorial), standard (Region 1 1974, Region
6 South 1988) and 15 meter (Region 4 1983, Region 6 1983) classes.
Nonetheless, he is probably best known in soaring circles for his
Replogle Barograph, which has sold over 3000 units since its
introduction in 1965. Rep is survived by his wife June, and sons
Doug and Ron.

Ed Replogle's heartbeat continues as clockwork ticks in his
barographs . . .

Burt
Marfa, west Texas
USA

Westbender

May 25th 10, 02:42 PM

A word of caution. Go with someone who has a known reputation for
calibrating baragraphs used for soaring badges.

I sent mine to a company that was very responsive and provided a quick
turn-around. However, the calibration documentation was not accepted
when I submitted it with my flight. The beginning and ending altitude
(sea-level) was not labeled next to the bottom "steps" on the lab
trace. So, if you don't use someone like Joe Trinkwalder, you might
think about asking Judy to verify the calibration before bothering to
use it. She will reject on the slightest technicality. Although that's
no fault of hers. She's just going by the book.

Grider Pirate

May 25th 10, 02:50 PM

On May 25, 6:42*am, Westbender > wrote:
> A word of caution. Go with someone who has a known reputation for
> calibrating baragraphs used for soaring badges.
>
> I sent mine to a company that was very responsive and provided a quick
> turn-around. However, the calibration documentation was not accepted
> when I submitted it with my flight. The beginning and ending altitude
> (sea-level) was not labeled next to the bottom "steps" on the lab
> trace. So, if you don't use someone like Joe Trinkwalder, you might
> think about asking Judy to verify the calibration before bothering to
> use it. She will reject on the slightest technicality. Although that's
> no fault of hers. She's just going by the book.

I also had a badge claim rejected due to mistakes on the calibration.
If you have a previous calibration trace, compare it to the new one to
see if anything is amiss!

Tony[_5_]

May 25th 10, 05:27 PM

> Approval for position recorders is up to each national organization.
> Currently there's a few of us working on approving some units for
> US badge claims. *The FlyWithCE recorder that Wings & Wheels
> carries should be approved any time now, based on the approval
> that Australia already did for the unit. *Tim carries that unit for
> a very reasonable price. *You can use that (if you also carry
> a barograph) for badge claims up through Gold.

The position recorder/barograph combo that was added to the Sporting
Code last October is definitely an exciting step in the right
direction but I'm not sure what problem it really solves. Any badge
flight you can claim with the position recorder/barograph combo can be
done with the barograph alone.

The only badge leg that cannot be accomplished with a Barograph only
is Diamond Goal and the position recorder cannot be used for Diamond
claims.

I suppose it will be handy for people who dont want to land away from
home. But my feelings on free distance are pretty well documented
here :) I'd rather spend the 100 bucks on 5 more tows or some gas for
the crew car so I get to explore new places.

quietpilot

May 25th 10, 10:19 PM

On May 24, 2:36*pm, Andy > wrote:
> On May 24, 11:06*am, jcarlyle > wrote:
>
> > I've got an old Replogle you can have. Contact me off line at jcarlyle
> > at interserv dot com.
>
> Now you're spoiling the whole "retro" experience with modern
> technology! *He should be made to smoke foils and learn how to seal
> them without blowing the trace away.
>
> Andy

I have had been gifted a barograph long ago. and may start having a
use for it. where can I learn this art? and get foils/tracepaper. I
have looked and come up empty

[email protected]

May 25th 10, 11:07 PM

On May 25, 9:04*am, Burt Compton - Marfa > wrote:
> Ed Replogle's Barographs are wonderful. *They tick, they look cool,
> feel good . . . *the smooth machined drum for the trace paper . . .
> the little fingertip handle as you carry it to the sailplane. *I keep
> two Replogle barographs ready for altitude flights at Marfa in
> southwest Texas. *Visiting pilots may borrow one as a backup to their
> logger.
>
> Preparing the barograph follows a time-honored and traditional
> protocol that is deliberate and in sequence. *For luck, we always wind
> the clock spring (very slowly and gently) with a US quarter coin from
> North Carolina, the issue with the 1903 Wright airplane (motorglider)
> on it. *The increasing tension of the spring as you wind it and the
> sound of the clockworks ticking matches your anticipation of a
> "personal-best" soaring flight. *The barograph comes to life, and it
> has a heartbeat.
>
> On my shelf in my hangar I display a vintage smoke foil mechanical
> barograph given to my father Fritz Compton by Wolf Hirth (the German
> soaring pioneer) after WWII. *Dad used it for his soaring badges and
> his Bendix trophy flights beginning in 1948. *I used it for my Silver
> Badge flights decades ago. *Tradition.
>
> You can still have your barograph calibrated in the USA. *I use Joe
> Trinkwalder in Tonawanda, NY, who calibrates each Ed Replogle
> barograph with great care and reverence for his late friend "Rep".
> Contact info is in "Soaring" magazine classified ad section under
> Instruments, along with other calibration labs.
>
> Here is Ed's Obit: * Ed ("Rep") Replogle, an engineer and inventor
> whose career as a pilot spanned nearly seven decades, died on February
> 17, 2002 in Buffalo, NY.
>
> Born in 1916 in Columbus, OH, Rep soloed in 1932 in a Gypsy Moth
> biplane. His soaring career began in a Franklin Utility at a glider
> club at the University of Michigan, where he graduated with a degree
> in Aeronautical Engineering in 1938. His distinguished engineering
> career included stints with Budd, Kaiser Fleetwing, Bellanca and Bell
> Aircraft; finishing up as an independent inventor with over 20 patents
> to his credit.
>
> Rep's record as a competitive soaring pilot included wins the 1-26
> (Region 1 1968, 21st Wright Memorial), standard (Region 1 1974, Region
> 6 South 1988) and 15 meter (Region 4 1983, Region 6 1983) classes.
> Nonetheless, he is probably best known in soaring circles for his
> Replogle Barograph, which has sold over 3000 units since its
> introduction in 1965. * * Rep is survived by his wife June, and sons
> Doug and Ron.
>
> Ed Replogle's heartbeat continues as clockwork ticks in his
> barographs . . .
>
> Burt
> Marfa, west Texas
> USA

He also invented the inertia reel seatbelt.
An Amazing guy I was lucky enough to know.
UH

Jim S

October 18th 20, 08:09 PM

10 year old thread but anybody know where to find a mechanical barograph? Thanks.

Tim Taylor

October 18th 20, 08:44 PM

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 1:09:55 PM UTC-6, Jim S wrote:
> 10 year old thread but anybody know where to find a mechanical barograph? Thanks.
Just post a wanted ad like you did. There are about a thousand of them sitting on shelves collecting dust. Do you want smoke or pressure sensitive paper? What size? Metal or plastic case.

James Metcalfe

October 18th 20, 08:56 PM

At 19:09 18 October 2020, Jim S wrote:
>10 year old thread but anybody know where to find a mechanical
barograph?
>Thanks.

I have a Winter barograph, last used in anger in 1997 but still ticks!
Also a packet of foils (it'll work with smoked paper, but foil is better).

But ... it's in the UK, and I have no idea how well it would travel, nor
what the authorities would make of chunks of metal for shipping!

J. (MetcalfeIJ {at} gmail.com)

Dan Daly[_2_]

October 18th 20, 09:03 PM

On Sunday, October 18, 2020 at 3:09:55 PM UTC-4, Jim S wrote:
> 10 year old thread but anybody know where to find a mechanical barograph? Thanks.

They're not accepted for badge flying according to the 2020 Sporting Code, by my reading of it (from the 2020 Edition, effective 1 Oct 2020):

1.4 BADGE and RECORD REQUIREMENTS
1.4.1 General
Electronic flight data and a DECLARATION are required except where specifically exempt.

3.3.3 Altitude evidence
a. Up to 15,000 metres, pressure data recorded by an FR shall be used.

NAC (read SSA)-approved position recorders can be used, with GPS altitude, with an altitude penalty, up to the end of the Gold Badge.

To read the Sporting Code, go to https://www.fai.org/igc-documents . Then scroll down and select 'Gliding'. Then select 'Sporting Code - Section 3 Gliding'. Then select 'Current Sporting Code for Gliding'. Then there's a drop-down list. You want the 'Sporting Code Section 3' - which has the definitions; and Annex C, which is the 'how-to'.

Eric Greenwell[_4_]

October 18th 20, 09:38 PM

Jim S wrote on 10/18/2020 12:09 PM:
> 10 year old thread but anybody know where to find a mechanical barograph? Thanks.
>
Well, I just look up at my "shelf museum" when I want to find one. It's a Replogle - still
ticks after winding - that served me well during my badge hunts in the 70's. It's sitting next
to a Bayside 2 channel, crystal controlled radio, a 121.5 ELT bought when contests required
them, and a $700 moving "map" GPS that took 10 minutes to acquire 5 or 6 satellites, then
display a few airports on the 2.4" B&W screen. Oh, and an Instamatic camera.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

Jim S

October 24th 20, 04:02 PM

I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
Iâ€™m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I donâ€™t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.

Eric Greenwell[_4_]

October 24th 20, 04:48 PM

Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
> I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
> I’m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I don’t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
> Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
>
The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace. So, smoked foil to GPS
traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

Jim S

October 24th 20, 06:28 PM

Thanks Eric, Will see if I can find one of those. Having a manufacturer name will help.

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
> Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
> > I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
> > Iâ€™m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I donâ€™t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
> > Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
> >
> The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
> sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
> barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
> was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace. So, smoked foil to GPS
> traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
> --
> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
> - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
> https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

Eric Greenwell[_4_]

October 24th 20, 06:36 PM

Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 10:28 AM:
> Thanks Eric, Will see if I can find one of those. Having a manufacturer name will help.
>
> On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
>> Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
>>> I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
>>> I’m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I don’t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
>>> Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
>>>
>> The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
>> sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
>> barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
>> was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace. So, smoked foil to GPS
>> traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
>> --
>> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
>> - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
>> https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

Winter is another manufacturer that made mechanical, windup barograph. They were bigger,
heavier, and more expensive, as I recall.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

Papa3[_2_]

October 24th 20, 10:03 PM

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 1:28:29 PM UTC-4, Jim S wrote:
> Thanks Eric, Will see if I can find one of those. Having a manufacturer name will help.
> On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
> > Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
> > > I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
> > > Iâ€™m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I donâ€™t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
> > > Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
> > >
> > The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
> > sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
> > barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
> > was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace.. So, smoked foil to GPS
> > traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
> > --
> > Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
> > - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
> > https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

Hi Jim,

We're having a club Maintenance Day tomorrow, so we'll be going through the shed and the shop. I'm pretty sure we have at least one of each of the common models. I can't believe our BOD would want to hang on to them at this point.

Where are you located?
Erik Mann (P3)

October 25th 20, 12:51 AM

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
> Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
> > I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
> > Iâ€™m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I donâ€™t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
> > Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
> >
> The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
> sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
> barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
> was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace. So, smoked foil to GPS
> traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
>
> --
> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
> - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
> https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

>>> .... but it was messy to smoke the foil <<<
And I bet you it was/is pretty unhealthy to do so as well! I hope you did that in the confines of you own home with no impressionable youngsters around. ;-)

Uli
'AS'

Eric Greenwell[_4_]

October 25th 20, 01:29 AM

AS wrote on 10/24/2020 4:51 PM:
> On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
>> Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
>>> I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
>>> I’m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I don’t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
>>> Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
>>>
>> The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
>> sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
>> barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
>> was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace. So, smoked foil to GPS
>> traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
>>
>> --
>> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
>> - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
>> https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1
>
>>>> .... but it was messy to smoke the foil <<<
> And I bet you it was/is pretty unhealthy to do so as well! I hope you did that in the confines of you own home with no impressionable youngsters around. ;-)
>
> Uli
> 'AS'
>
Smoking generally occurred in the back of my trailer, which was probably a bit unhealthy, what
with all the black smoke particles floating around. Pretty sure coming out of the trailer
hacking and coughing made any impressionables think they'd stick to skateboards :^)

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

Roy B.

October 25th 20, 01:02 PM

I've two old Peravia barographs - with a couple rolls of paper. These were very elegant mechanisms that punched a tiny perforation in a continuous roll of waxed paper every 6 seconds. The drums marked the paper for time so that it was possible with a Peravia to record both altitude and the exact time of the altitude. The paper became quite scarce but it could be made out of household wax paper. Free to a good home. You pay for shipping.
ROY

Guy Acheson[_2_]

October 25th 20, 03:01 PM

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 6:02:47 AM UTC-7, Roy B. wrote:
> I've two old Peravia barographs - with a couple rolls of paper. These were very elegant mechanisms that punched a tiny perforation in a continuous roll of waxed paper every 6 seconds. The drums marked the paper for time so that it was possible with a Peravia to record both altitude and the exact time of the altitude. The paper became quite scarce but it could be made out of household wax paper. Free to a good home. You pay for shipping.
> ROY
I need some nick-nacks for my soaring wall. I would love to have at least one barograph with a roll of paper.
give me you e-mail and or phone and we can make a deal?

Jim S

October 25th 20, 03:16 PM

Hi Eric, I am in Louisville KY
>
> Where are you located?
> Erik Mann (P3)

Jim S

October 25th 20, 03:18 PM

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 9:02:47 AM UTC-4, Roy B. wrote:
> I've two old Peravia barographs - with a couple rolls of paper. These were very elegant mechanisms that punched a tiny perforation in a continuous roll of waxed paper every 6 seconds. The drums marked the paper for time so that it was possible with a Peravia to record both altitude and the exact time of the altitude. The paper became quite scarce but it could be made out of household wax paper. Free to a good home. You pay for shipping.
> ROY
Hi Roy,
Can you message me? I would love to have one and get it working.
Jim

Jim S

October 25th 20, 03:20 PM

Roy B.

October 25th 20, 10:38 PM

Well, the barographs got snapped up and I am happy about that. While looking for them I also found (from the same era) 2 Kodak Instamatic 126 cameras fitted to a turn point mount and 8 boxes of unused Verichome Pan B&W film for them. State of the art . . . 45 years ago. Free for shipping. Any takers?
ROY

Jim S

October 25th 20, 10:49 PM

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 6:39:01 PM UTC-4, Roy B. wrote:
> Well, the barographs got snapped up and I am happy about that. While looking for them I also found (from the same era) 2 Kodak Instamatic 126 cameras fitted to a turn point mount and 8 boxes of unused Verichome Pan B&W film for them. State of the art . . . 45 years ago. Free for shipping. Any takers?
> ROY

Hi Roy, Not to be crazy, but those would be perfect to have with the graphs.. I will respectfully decline if anyone else is interested. Thanks.

Roy B.

October 25th 20, 11:48 PM

You've got them Jim.
ROY
> Hi Roy, Not to be crazy, but those would be perfect to have with the graphs. I will respectfully decline if anyone else is interested. Thanks.

Jim S

October 26th 20, 12:29 AM

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 7:48:20 PM UTC-4, Roy B. wrote:
> You've got them Jim.
> ROY
> > Hi Roy, Not to be crazy, but those would be perfect to have with the graphs. I will respectfully decline if anyone else is interested. Thanks.

Thanks Roy!

Frank Whiteley

October 26th 20, 01:04 AM

On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:28:29 AM UTC-6, Jim S wrote:
> Thanks Eric, Will see if I can find one of those. Having a manufacturer name will help.
>
> On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
> > Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
> > > I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
> > > Iâ€™m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I donâ€™t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
> > > Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
> > >
> > The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
> > sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
> > barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
> > was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace.. So, smoked foil to GPS
> > traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
> > --
> > Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
> > - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
> > https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1

https://sites.google.com/site/weersch/basa/basa-barographs if still available.

Frank Whiteley

October 26th 20, 01:06 AM

Dan Marotta

October 26th 20, 03:23 PM

I wonder...Â* Will the SSA or IGC still accept a barograph trace?

I got all my Diamonds with a Replogle and an Instamatic.Â* Great fun!

On 10/25/2020 7:06 PM, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:28:29 AM UTC-6, Jim S wrote:
>> Thanks Eric, Will see if I can find one of those. Having a manufacturer name will help.
>>
>> On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
>>> Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
>>>> I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
>>>> Iâ€™m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I donâ€™t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
>>>> Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
>>>>
>>> The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
>>> sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
>>> barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
>>> was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace. So, smoked foil to GPS
>>> traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
>>> --
>>> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
>>> - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
>>> https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/Replogle-Barograph-/323754532912

--
Dan, 5J

Dan Daly[_2_]

October 26th 20, 03:56 PM

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 11:23:40 AM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
> I wonder...Â* Will the SSA or IGC still accept a barograph trace?
>
> I got all my Diamonds with a Replogle and an Instamatic.Â* Great fun!
>
> On 10/25/2020 7:06 PM, Frank Whiteley wrote:
> > On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:28:29 AM UTC-6, Jim S wrote:
> >> Thanks Eric, Will see if I can find one of those. Having a manufacturer name will help.
> >>
> >> On Saturday, October 24, 2020 at 11:48:09 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
> >>> Jim S wrote on 10/24/2020 8:02 AM:
> >>>> I was mainly interested in the mechanical, smoke type. Was not interested in one for competition but mainly to use for historical interests.
> >>>> Iâ€™m not a collector necessarily in aviation items but I do have two aviation sextants (A-10) and a drift meter. Although I donâ€™t shoot stars, the sun and the moon from the cockpit, I have spent a fair amount of time shooting the sun in my backyard.
> >>>> Wanting a workable barograph is in line with these interests.
> >>>>
> >>> The Replogle is a mechanical, wind-up barograph that can use smoked foil, but the pressure
> >>> sensitive chart paper was much easier to use. I did use smoked foil a few times on a ???
> >>> barograph, but it was messy to smoke the foil, and misting some lacquer on it after the flight
> >>> was tricky - so easy to smudge the smoke on the foil and lose the trace. So, smoked foil to GPS
> >>> traces - I prefer the GPS traces for flying, but the Replogle is prominent on my "shelf museum".
> >>> --
> >>> Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
> >>> - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
> >>> https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1
> > https://www.ebay.com/itm/Replogle-Barograph-/323754532912
>
> --
> Dan, 5J

According to the Sporting Code, no. see my post of Oct 18.