Sailplane equipment: transponder, transciver 8.33 kHz.

[asdowski]

Hi.
I'm searching for the cheapest SSR transponder and transciver with
8.33 channel separation that could be mounted on a sailplane. I
actually don't know if this must be brand new, its just have to work
properly in Europe.

I've found some products of MicroAir but the price for new stuff is
quite big... Around 10 000$ for both.

Could group-mates tell me how much this equipment must cost, and meaby
some examples/models of stuff?

Sorry for my broken english. I hope You've got the point of this
message.

--
Greet,
asdowski

Lublin, Poland.

[John Smith]

> I'm searching for the cheapest SSR transponder and transciver with
> 8.33 channel separation that could be mounted on a sailplane.

Mode S transponders cost in the range of about $2500 to $2700. There are
several manufactorers, all more or less in the same price range
(Garrecht, MicroAir, Funkwerk, Becker...). You need a level 2, class 1
transponder, be sure not to confuse level and class!

As far as I know, there's no need for a glider to have a 8.33kHz radio
anywhere in Europe. 25kHz radios cost in the range of around $1300 to $1700.

Of course prices may vary and depend on exchange rates.

[asdowski]

On 8 Cze, 21:30, John Smith > wrote:
> > I'm searching for the cheapest SSR transponder and transciver with
> > 8.33 channel separation that could be mounted on a sailplane.
>
> Mode S transponders cost in the range of about $2500 to $2700. There are
> several manufactorers, all more or less in the same price range
> (Garrecht, MicroAir, Funkwerk, Becker...). You need a level 2, class 1
> transponder, be sure not to confuse level and class!
>
> As far as I know, there's no need for a glider to have a 8.33kHz radio
> anywhere in Europe. 25kHz radios cost in the range of around $1300 to $1700.

Yes, but flying on the same attitude as airliners requires from
sailplane similar comm. properties.

So I guess... that 8.33kHz radios are in the range of 4-7k USD?

Any chance of buying working stuff from second-hand? Don't You know
any reliable firms/companies?

--
Greet,
asdowski

[John Smith]

> Yes, but flying on the same attitude as airliners requires from
> sailplane similar comm. properties.
>
> So I guess... that 8.33kHz radios are in the range of 4-7k USD?

I'm not convinced, I've been given pretty high clearances.

Anyway, prices seem to have come down. Funkwerk e.g. sells the ATR833
for 1700 Euros (ca. $2050): http://tinyurl.com/2wu78ps

[Eric Greenwell]

On 6/8/2010 12:30 PM, John Smith wrote:
>> I'm searching for the cheapest SSR transponder and transciver with
>> 8.33 channel separation that could be mounted on a sailplane.
>
> Mode S transponders cost in the range of about $2500 to $2700. There
> are several manufactorers, all more or less in the same price range
> (Garrecht, MicroAir, Funkwerk, Becker...). You need a level 2, class 1
> transponder, be sure not to confuse level and class!
>
> As far as I know, there's no need for a glider to have a 8.33kHz radio
> anywhere in Europe. 25kHz radios cost in the range of around $1300 to
> $1700.
>
> Of course prices may vary and depend on exchange rates.
Be sure to look at the Trig TT21 Mode S transponder - more like $2000 -
and with some ADS-B out capability.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (netto to net to email me)

- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation Mar/2004" Much of what you need to know tinyurl.com/yfs7tnz

[John Smith]

Eric Greenwell wrote:
>> (Garrecht, MicroAir, Funkwerk, Becker...). You need a level 2, class 1
>> transponder, be sure not to confuse level and class!

> Be sure to look at the Trig TT21 Mode S transponder - more like $2000 -
> and with some ADS-B out capability.

Again: Make sure the transponder is class 1! The TT21 is class 2.

BTW: Most transponders are "ADB ready". Whatever this means.

[asdowski]

Ok, thanks for Your help.

--
Greet,
asdowski

[jcarlyle]

True, but you can get the Trig TT22 which is class 1.

-John


On Jun 9, 4:37 am, John Smith > wrote:
> Eric Greenwell wrote:
> >> (Garrecht, MicroAir, Funkwerk, Becker...). You need a level 2, class 1
> >> transponder, be sure not to confuse level and class!
> > Be sure to look at the Trig TT21 Mode S transponder - more like $2000 -
> > and with some ADS-B out capability.
>
> Again: Make sure the transponder is class 1! The TT21 is class 2.
>
> BTW: Most transponders are "ADB ready". Whatever this means.

[John Smith]

Am 09.06.10 13:26, schrieb jcarlyle:
>>> Be sure to look at the Trig TT21 Mode S transponder - more like $2000 -

>> The TT21 is class 2.

> True, but you can get the Trig TT22 which is class 1.

And which, incidentally, seems to cost around $2400.

[jcarlyle]

Gasp - something that has more performance costs more? Who could have
guessed? Anyway, it's still below the range of $2500 to $2700 that you
quoted above...

On Jun 9, 8:03 am, John Smith > wrote:
> Am 09.06.10 13:26, schrieb jcarlyle:
>
> >>> Be sure to look at the Trig TT21 Mode S transponder - more like $2000 -
> >> The TT21 is class 2.
>
> > True, but you can get the Trig TT22 which is class 1.
>
> And which, incidentally, seems to cost around $2400.

[sisu1a]

> >>> Be sure to look at the Trig TT21 Mode S transponder - more like $2000 -
> >> The TT21 is class 2.
>
> *> True, but you can get the Trig TT22 which is class 1.
>
> And which, incidentally, seems to cost around $2400.

Which seems to be a smokin deal when compared to any other mode s
class 1 units... most of which seem closer to $5000. Add to that it is
lighter, easier to install and draws less power and it becomes a no-
brainer for a glider pilot wanting to *reasonably add this capability.

-Paul

[John Smith]

Am 09.06.10 17:15, schrieb jcarlyle:
> Gasp - something that has more performance costs more? Who could have
> guessed? Anyway, it's still below the range of $2500 to $2700 that you
> quoted above...

Actually, I just did a very quick and very dirty net search. Everybody
knows that prices vary, that comparisons between European and US prices
are difficult and that there are also such things as sales tax, shipping
cost etc.

That said, I don't doubt a moment that the TT22 is a nice instrument.
Just compare before you decide. E.g. when I find two instruments with
the exactly same capabilities but one has a better user interface than
the other, this alone may be well worth $300 to me. As always YMMV. (Of
course I don't say that the TT22 has a bad interface, as I've never seen
one.)

[John Smith]

Am 09.06.10 17:43, schrieb sisu1a:
>> And which, incidentally, seems to cost around $2400.

> Which seems to be a smokin deal when compared to any other mode s
> class 1 units... most of which seem closer to $5000.

Check your facts. E.g. Funkwerk sells its TRT800H for 1931 Euros (tax
not included), which translates to $2324 at the actual exchange rate.
I'm too lazy to look up all the other brands which I mentioned earlier.

Source:
http://onlineshop.funkwerk-avionics.com/product_info.php?cPath=169&products_id=2osCsid=5835c29f41a86d789aa0a147becbd2 76

[Eric Greenwell]

On 6/9/2010 10:15 AM, John Smith wrote:
> Am 09.06.10 17:43, schrieb sisu1a:
>>> And which, incidentally, seems to cost around $2400.
>
>> Which seems to be a smokin deal when compared to any other mode s
>> class 1 units... most of which seem closer to $5000.
>
> Check your facts. E.g. Funkwerk sells its TRT800H for 1931 Euros (tax
> not included), which translates to $2324 at the actual exchange rate.
> I'm too lazy to look up all the other brands which I mentioned earlier.
>
> Source:
> http://onlineshop.funkwerk-avionics.com/product_info.php?cPath=169&products_id=2osCsid=5835c29f41a86d789aa0a147becbd2 76
>
I'm pretty sure the TRT800H isn't available in the USA; here, the Trig
is the best price for a Mode S.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (netto to net to email me)

- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation Mar/2004" Much of what you need to know tinyurl.com/yfs7tnz

[Peter Murray]

Eric Greenwell wrote:
> I'm pretty sure the TRT800H isn't available in the USA; here, the Trig
> is the best price for a Mode S.

The OP lives in Poland...

[Eric Greenwell]

On 6/10/2010 3:48 AM, Peter Murray wrote:
> Eric Greenwell wrote:
>> I'm pretty sure the TRT800H isn't available in the USA; here, the Trig
>> is the best price for a Mode S.
>
> The OP lives in Poland...
My reply was to John Smith, who was quoting prices in dollars; also, the
OP did not specify a "point of purchase" preference, so it seemed
pertinent. Sometimes, Europeans like to buy electronics in the USA,
because they are much cheaper. I remember seeing several of them carting
off armloads at Oshkosh.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (netto to net to email me)

- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation Mar/2004" Much of what you need to know tinyurl.com/yfs7tnz

[jsbrake[_2_]]

One advantage of the Trig (both TT21 and TT22) is that the altitude
encoder is built in. You need to add the expense -- and power usage
-- of an encoder to any other transponer that is purchased.

(I don't own a transponder, but have been considering the purchase
"down the road").

[John Smith]

Am 14.06.10 02:39, schrieb jsbrake:
> One advantage of the Trig (both TT21 and TT22) is that the altitude
> encoder is built in. You need to add the expense -- and power usage
> -- of an encoder to any other transponer that is purchased.

Update your facts. Most if not all of the transponders I mentioned in a
earlier post have a built-in altitude encoder.

[jsbrake[_2_]]

> Update your facts. Most if not all of the transponders I mentioned in a
> earlier post have a built-in altitude encoder.

Mea culpa. Yes, the Garrecht and Funkwerk models have built-in
encoders.
Still, a valid point: check the "complete" cost of the system to get
it operational, as encoders, address modules, wiring, etc add up.