Death of the newsgroup.

[gorgon]

I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. It is now officially dead in
my opinion. RIP Bob Hoover..may you not turn over in your grave. With
the last infiltration post ..rant. or whatever you call it, I am done
with this group. There hasn't been a decent topic thread in months.
Maybe it is time. When one looks at all the Yahoo groups that still
have an interest in aviation AND courteous, helpful members that stay
on topic (Tailwind, Buttercup, Aeronca, etc) this group is a dinosaur.

Bye

[[email protected]]

On Nov 25, 9:39*am, gorgon > wrote:
> I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. *It is now officially dead in
> my opinion.

I wish you were wrong, but you are not. I see the same thing in the
other groups I inhabit. The day of the Internet may be over, and now
Facebook and the like are in the ascendant. That's very sad.


Mike

[Scott[_7_]]

On 11-26-2010 15:53, Peter wrote:

>
> Facebook is for kids and brainless people... not a replacement for
> this kind of stuff.

Can I send you a friend invitation on Facebook? :O

[gpabruce]

On Nov 26, 5:49*am, " > wrote:
> On Nov 25, 9:39*am, gorgon > wrote:
>
> > I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. *It is now officially dead in
> > my opinion.
>
> I wish you were wrong, but you are not. *I see the same thing in the
> other groups I inhabit. *The day of the Internet may be over, and now
> Facebook and the like are in the ascendant. *That's very sad.
>
> Mike

I couldn't help but notice the similarities between thw groups and the
old CB radios. Remember how the old CB's started out being polite and
helpful and a nice tool for truckers and travelers? Then they got so
abusive a person couldn't turn one on around children they were so
nasty. Seems the groups are going through the same thing. Why? I have
no clue, maybe someone else does.

Bruce

[[email protected]]

On Nov 25, 7:39*am, gorgon > wrote:
> I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. *It is now officially dead in
> my opinion. *RIP Bob Hoover..may you not turn over in your grave. With
> the last infiltration post ..rant. or whatever you call it, I am done
> with this group. *There hasn't been a decent topic thread in months.
> Maybe it is time. *When one looks at all the Yahoo groups that still
> have an interest in aviation AND courteous, helpful members that stay
> on topic (Tailwind, Buttercup, Aeronca, etc) this group is a dinosaur.
>
> Bye

Go to homebuiltairplanes.com and register. We're all over
there now. It's moderated, as it needs to be, no foolishness is
tolerated and we have some good discussions.

Dan

[CaveLamb]

wrote:
> On Nov 25, 7:39 am, gorgon > wrote:
>> I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. It is now officially dead in
>> my opinion. RIP Bob Hoover..may you not turn over in your grave. With
>> the last infiltration post ..rant. or whatever you call it, I am done
>> with this group. There hasn't been a decent topic thread in months.
>> Maybe it is time. When one looks at all the Yahoo groups that still
>> have an interest in aviation AND courteous, helpful members that stay
>> on topic (Tailwind, Buttercup, Aeronca, etc) this group is a dinosaur.
>>
>> Bye
>
> Go to homebuiltairplanes.com and register. We're all over
> there now. It's moderated, as it needs to be, no foolishness is
> tolerated and we have some good discussions.
>
> Dan


I went and looked in again.
I dunno, Dan.
The forum format doesn't work for me.
TOO many topics, and too little traffic.




--

Richard Lamb
email me:
web site: www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb

[Ron Wanttaja[_2_]]

On 11/26/2010 6:59 PM, gpabruce wrote:

> I couldn't help but notice the similarities between thw groups and the
> old CB radios. Remember how the old CB's started out being polite and
> helpful and a nice tool for truckers and travelers? Then they got so
> abusive a person couldn't turn one on around children they were so
> nasty. Seems the groups are going through the same thing. Why? I have
> no clue, maybe someone else does.

Lack of personal consequences. Say those things face-to-face, and
you're likely to get punched. Same them over the air on a CB or on
USENET using a "handle," and you're untouchable. Look at how much the
garbage level rises when the participants start claiming to have
identified their opponents.

Ron Wanttaja

[Bug Dout]

writes:

> Go to homebuiltairplanes.com and register. We're all over
> there now. It's moderated, as it needs to be, no foolishness is
> tolerated and we have some good discussions.

Or google for the matronics lists (there are a number of different ones)
and get on board. Very, very high signal-to-noise ratio, it's 98% tech
stuff. That would screen out Jay Honeck and the rest of the yakkers, and
of course the pure nimrods.
--
"Normally, change happens only when the pain of continuing exceeds
the pain of making the change. The leaders will be those who dare to
change sooner."

[Bug Dout]

writes:

> Go to homebuiltairplanes.com and register. We're all over
> there now. It's moderated, as it needs to be, no foolishness is
> tolerated and we have some good discussions.

Or google for the matronics lists (there are a number of different ones)
and get on board. Very, very high signal-to-noise ratio, it's 98% tech
stuff. That would screen out Jay Honeck and the rest of the yakkers, and
of course the pure nimrods.
--
"Normally, change happens only when the pain of continuing exceeds
the pain of making the change. The leaders will be those who dare to
change sooner."

[Bug Dout]

writes:

> Go to homebuiltairplanes.com and register. We're all over
> there now. It's moderated, as it needs to be, no foolishness is
> tolerated and we have some good discussions.

Or google for the matronics lists (there are a number of different ones)
and get on board. Very, very high signal-to-noise ratio, it's 98% tech
stuff. That would screen out Jay Honeck and the rest of the yakkers, and
of course the pure nimrods.
--
"Normally, change happens only when the pain of continuing exceeds
the pain of making the change. The leaders will be those who dare to
change sooner."

[Dancing Fingers[_2_]]

May be we're just old farts holding on to antiquated technology?
Isn't everyone blogging now? What is a blog anyway and how do you
blog about airplanes?

Yeah I'm old.

Blogging off.

Chris

[stol]

On Nov 27, 12:54*am, Ron Wanttaja > wrote:
> On 11/26/2010 6:59 PM, gpabruce wrote:
>
> > I couldn't help but notice the similarities between thw groups and the
> > old CB radios. Remember how the old CB's started out being polite and
> > helpful and a nice tool for truckers and travelers? Then they got so
> > abusive a person couldn't turn one on around children they were so
> > nasty. Seems the groups are going through the same thing. Why? I have
> > no clue, maybe someone else does.
>
> Lack of personal consequences. *Say those things face-to-face, and
> you're likely to get punched. *Same them over the air on a CB or on
> USENET using a "handle," and you're untouchable. *Look at how much the
> garbage level rises when the participants start claiming to have
> identified their opponents.
>
> Ron Wanttaja

Ron is right on with his thoughts...

Anyone can hide behind screen names and throw BS every which way.

Ron, me, Jay and a very few others actually use our REAL names and can
and will defend ourselves. The spineless others hide the shadows of
stealth names....... Ya wanna be taken seriously............ Step up
to the plate and identify yourselves.


Rant off.

Ben Haas.
www.haaspowerair.com

[Peter Dohm]

"CaveLamb" > wrote in message
m...
>
> I went and looked in again.
> I dunno, Dan.
> The forum format doesn't work for me.
> TOO many topics, and too little traffic.
>
> Richard Lamb
> email me:
> web site: www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb
>
That's the same way that it looked to me.

Unless I have a specific issue to search, probably related to a current
project, the forum format is simply too tedious for normal reading and
exchange of ideas. Perhaps someone will find a way to implement an HTTP
based format that can work like NNTP; but, so far, I haven't seen it
Regrettably, I am not presently able to provide a news server that could
host a moderated group until the related service could gain general
acceptance--so I will just have to put up with the situation as it exists
and hope that the condition proves temporary.

Peter Dohm

[[email protected]]

On Nov 26, 10:03 pm, CaveLamb > wrote:

> > Go to homebuiltairplanes.com and register. We're all over
> > there now. It's moderated, as it needs to be, no foolishness is
> > tolerated and we have some good discussions.
>
> > Dan
>
> I went and looked in again.
> I dunno, Dan.
> The forum format doesn't work for me.
> TOO many topics, and too little traffic.

Just go there and click on "What's New" and the entire list of new
posts comes up, sorta like it does with this and the other usenet
groups. You don't have to weed through the various forums. If there's
less activity there it's due to the lack of flaming and other
nonsense. It's not missed.

Dan

[rich[_2_]]

With the abundance of yahoo specific groups, where just about every
popular homebuilt has a builders group, and the matronics groups,
there is so much good info out there in these and similar sites which
didn't exist years ago. So the need for the all-encompassing
newsgroup like this one is lessend. And over time the number of users
has dropped off due to various reasons. Plus, usenet is being used by
fewer people. Most computer users I've talked to have no clue about
usenet. And once users see there's not much going on in a group like
this, they check it less and less often. And so many usenet groups,
including this one, keep getting inundated with spam. But I see that
in the yahoo groups also. A scourge of the interent. And the ones who
target usenet have many reasons to hate them. Such as using a
different email address for every one of their worthless posts. So the
filters in our usenet readers don't work. The only way to really keep
them out would be to have a password access system. But usenet isn't
setup for that. The one part of usenet that seems to keep alive are
the binary groups. And that's another reason I think this group is
less popular, is the fact we can't post pictures. It would be so much
better if we could. To be able to show a picture of a part we we were
working on, or a homebuilt we owned or were buiding, would add so much
more. The old saying a picture is worth a thousand words is never more
true. So why put up with this limitation? It gets old. This group is
a victim of it's ancient limitations.
Rich



On Thu, 25 Nov 2010 06:39:32 -0800 (PST), gorgon
> wrote:

>I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. It is now officially dead in
>my opinion. RIP Bob Hoover..may you not turn over in your grave. With
>the last infiltration post ..rant. or whatever you call it, I am done
>with this group. There hasn't been a decent topic thread in months.
>Maybe it is time. When one looks at all the Yahoo groups that still
>have an interest in aviation AND courteous, helpful members that stay
>on topic (Tailwind, Buttercup, Aeronca, etc) this group is a dinosaur.
>
>Bye

[[email protected]]

On Nov 25, 7:39*am, gorgon > wrote:
> I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. *It is now officially dead .......... *When one looks at all the Yahoo groups that still
> have an interest in aviation AND courteous, helpful members that stay
> on topic (Tailwind, Buttercup, Aeronca, etc) this group is a dinosaur.
>
> Bye

I left quite a while ago. Just checking in with a morbid kind of
curiosity to see what the body looked like.

Too bad that this all came to pass as this was at one time a vibrant
and useful site. The Yahoo type groups are good but we need a way to
keep the cross pollination of ideas active.

Homebuiltairplanes.com, as mentioned above, seems to be the best
replacement I've found. It has one very noticeable and positive
attribute that this site has lacked for a long time:

Young skulls full of mush that want to build and fly.

It can get kind of frustrating dealing with the same old beginner
questions and the "new" ideas, that aren't, but these enthusiastic
apprentices are the future of our sport/hobby. This bunch of old
foggies just never seemed to be accommodating of this group and, IMHO,
is one of the reasons it has atrophied and died.

HBA has some pretty knowledgeable members, many of whom were members
here in the past. It's worth checking out.
=========
Leon

[[email protected]]

On Nov 25, 2:39*pm, gorgon > wrote:
> I am pulling the plug on this newsgroup. *It is now officially dead in
> my opinion. *RIP Bob Hoover..may you not turn over in your grave. With
> the last infiltration post ..rant. or whatever you call it, I am done
> with this group. *There hasn't been a decent topic thread in months.
> Maybe it is time. *When one looks at all the Yahoo groups that still
> have an interest in aviation AND courteous, helpful members that stay
> on topic (Tailwind, Buttercup, Aeronca, etc) this group is a dinosaur.
>
> Bye

Usenet in general is dead. It was designed in the days of the BBS's,
and there are serious flaws in it's architecture. It is a fair guess
that pretty much everyone who was involved in it when it was cool, has
since moved on the bigger and better technologies, and the only thing
left (administratively speaking) is some narcisistic blatherers who
make up the heriarchy board, and the smut addicts that use the relay
oriented nature of it to hide their surfing habits. (much like IRC)

I also hold little stock in facebook, twitter and their ilk. There
are better ways, both socially and technologically, and they are
fairly trivial to impliment. Unfortunately, there are very few people
who possess the skillset, the vision, and the freedom to make positive
change all at the same time.

[Bug Dout]

Dancing Fingers > writes:

> May be we're just old farts holding on to antiquated technology?
Maybe. But this antiquated technology--Usenet--is still the best way to
exchange ideas, nimrods and trolls aside:

- One place to get every topic you're interested in. In contrast, with
forums you have to create a login for each one, even in the same
topic!
- Newsreaders (I use gnus within Emacs) can efficiently display messages
and allow the user to rapidly page through posts.
- Very efficient use of bandwidth, both Internet and mine. No stupid
cutesy images, avatars, blah blah.
- Newsreaders can be setup to screen out the idiots. In this case gnus
is probably the most powerful but also the most difficult to learn.
--
Science is organized knowledge. Wisdom is organized life.
- I. Kant

[Bug Dout]

stol > writes:

> Ron, me, Jay and a very few others actually use our REAL names and can
> and will defend ourselves.

True enough. The single best thing to add to the Internet might be a
voluntary, certified non-anonymous ID, to be used for purchases and
groups where the participants don't want the nimrods. Well, you'd still
have nimrods, but you could screen them out a lot easier.
--
We took pictures of the native girls, but they weren't
developed. . . But we're going back next week.
Groucho Marx

[Jim Logajan]

Bug Dout > wrote:

> stol > writes:
>
>> Ron, me, Jay and a very few others actually use our REAL names and can
>> and will defend ourselves.
>
> True enough. The single best thing to add to the Internet might be a
> voluntary, certified non-anonymous ID, to be used for purchases and
> groups where the participants don't want the nimrods. Well, you'd still
> have nimrods, but you could screen them out a lot easier.

Microsoft Passport (now "Windows Live ID") attempts (or attempted) to do
just that:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Live_ID

The service might have gained more traction if it had been done by a firm
with few or no conflicts of interest with other Internet entities (i.e. a
firm that did nothing but single-sign-on and user authentication.)

[Dan[_12_]]

On 11/28/2010 4:47 AM, Dancing Fingers wrote:
> May be we're just old farts holding on to antiquated technology?
> Isn't everyone blogging now? What is a blog anyway and how do you
> blog about airplanes?
>
> Yeah I'm old.
>
> Blogging off.
>
> Chris


OK, I can't resist: Steve McQueen starred in "The Blog."

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

[Peter Dohm]

"Bug Dout" > wrote in message
...
> Dancing Fingers > writes:
>
>> May be we're just old farts holding on to antiquated technology?
> Maybe. But this antiquated technology--Usenet--is still the best way to
> exchange ideas, nimrods and trolls aside:
>
> - One place to get every topic you're interested in. In contrast, with
> forums you have to create a login for each one, even in the same
> topic!
> - Newsreaders (I use gnus within Emacs) can efficiently display messages
> and allow the user to rapidly page through posts.
> - Very efficient use of bandwidth, both Internet and mine. No stupid
> cutesy images, avatars, blah blah.
> - Newsreaders can be setup to screen out the idiots. In this case gnus
> is probably the most powerful but also the most difficult to learn.
> --
> Science is organized knowledge. Wisdom is organized life.
> - I. Kant

Basically, the big problem of the past year or so has been the departure of
the ISPs, especially those that were part of the telephone companies. That
has left us all with fewer contributors, amounting to less "signal", and the
same amount of "noise" so that the ratio looks much poorer.

For the moment, I am prepared to stick around and see what happens. I don't
get to read every day; but this is still the best format for exactly the
reasons just stated, and therefore it is worth preserving.

Peter

[Elvise]

This newsgroup has become clogged by a couple of write-only posters. I have seen newsgroups die before. When a critical mass of uresponsive or posters is reached, real discussion dies of starvation. It seems Usenet does have a lot of competition now, too, of course. Twitter, in particular, covers some of the same market. In some ways, the 140 character limit is a good thing, and there are ways around it.