Favorite Smartphone Soaring Apps

[Whiskey Delta]

Or.... iPhone vs Android.
I am in need of replacing my blackberry and am trying to decide
between iPhone or Android. Since I have been using an old blackberry,
I know little of the App world and what might be available for use in
Soaring. Thought that if there is a difference in available useful
apps between the two operating systems, then that would help make the
decision.
In what ways are folks using their smart phones for soaring now and
how/where do you foresee using them in the near future?
Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?

Thanks!

WD

[JP Stewart]

On Nov 13, 10:08*pm, Whiskey Delta > wrote:
> Or.... iPhone vs Android.
> I am in need of replacing my blackberry and am trying to decide
> between iPhone or Android. Since I have been using an old blackberry,
> I know little of the App world and what might be available for use in
> Soaring. *Thought that if there is a difference in available useful
> apps between the two operating systems, then that would help make the
> decision.
> In what ways are folks using their smart phones for soaring now and
> how/where do you foresee using them in the near future?
> Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> Thanks!
>
> WD

For android there is a version of XC Soar.

JP

[SoaringXCellence]

Paulo Coolwind says that this winter he'll be porting LK8000 to Android.

[Max Kellermann]

Whiskey Delta > wrote:
> Or.... iPhone vs Android.

I strongly recommend Android: it runs XCSoar, Cumulus and Gaggle.
LK8000 is being ported to Android currently, and is expected to be
available soon. These four programs are "free as in free speech" (not
just "free of charge"; you are allowed to redistribute and modify
them).

There's just iGlide on the iPhone. It's commercial, and it's decades
behind other programs.

The iPhone screen sucks in direct sunlight. Most Android phones also
do, but there are gems like the Dell Streak Mini which are perfectly
readable thanks to the transflective screen. With Android, you have a
choice, and on the iPhone, you already know 100% of the choices are
unusable on a sunny day.

(Disclosure: I am a honorary XCSoar developer, and I may be biased)

Max

[Jim Kellett]

On Nov 13, 10:08*pm, Whiskey Delta > wrote:
> Or.... iPhone vs Android.
> I am in need of replacing my blackberry and am trying to decide
> between iPhone or Android. Since I have been using an old blackberry,
> I know little of the App world and what might be available for use in
> Soaring. *Thought that if there is a difference in available useful
> apps between the two operating systems, then that would help make the
> decision.
> In what ways are folks using their smart phones for soaring now and
> how/where do you foresee using them in the near future?
> Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> Thanks!
>
> WD

I can't speak with conficence for Android, but there I use several
nice iPhone apps, including GlidePath (a logger that produces a file
that can be uploaded to the OLC on the spot when you land), XC Skies,
and My Radar (real time doppler radar). I suspect, though, that there
are Android versions of these as well . . .
Jim Kellett

[vaughn[_3_]]

"Whiskey Delta" > wrote in message
...
> Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?

Also don't entirely neglect non-soaring aviation apps. For example, several
apps will give you in-cockpit weather radar. (Yes, connectivity in flight is
questionable, but at least you get a last-minute picture before launch.)

Vaughn

[RS]

On Nov 14, 9:45*am, "vaughn" > wrote:
> "Whiskey Delta" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
> > Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> Also don't entirely neglect non-soaring aviation apps. *For example, several
> apps will give you in-cockpit weather radar. *(Yes, connectivity in flight is
> questionable, but at least you get a last-minute picture before launch.)
>
> Vaughn

Definitely prefer android. In addition to the ones already named,
Google My Tracks and GPS logbooks are interesting.

[Ramy]

On Nov 14, 10:20*am, RS > wrote:
> On Nov 14, 9:45*am, "vaughn" > wrote:
>
> > "Whiskey Delta" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
> > > Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> > Also don't entirely neglect non-soaring aviation apps. *For example, several
> > apps will give you in-cockpit weather radar. *(Yes, connectivity in flight is
> > questionable, but at least you get a last-minute picture before launch.)
>
> > Vaughn
>
> Definitely prefer android. In addition to the ones already named,
> Google My Tracks and GPS logbooks are interesting.

If you only want to use one device for phone and flight computer than
yes, Android is your best bet. However I rather have a dedicated
device for flight computer and not use it for day to day as a phone
(less chance of loosing, damaging, forgetting, having to use your
flight computer for an important phone call or text message in flight
etc). In this case iphone is my preferred choice for anything else
than flight computer. Also you want a bigger screen for flight
computer (5" like the Dell Streak seem to be ideal) but it is too big
and bulky for a phone.

Ramy

[David Reitter]

I have an iPhone (and have had previous models) and wholeheartedly
recommend it as a smartphone for convenience and reliability. That
said, be aware of the total cost of ownership (phone plus expensive
plan for two years, or GSM-only contract-free phone plus cheap plan.)
A number of aviation-related apps are available, many of them very
cheaply. In-flight use isn't so great - no matter what software (and
XCSoar doesn't run), the battery drain is substantial when GPS is
running and data transfer takes place.

I also picked up a lightly used Dell Streak 5 Android PDA/tablet/phone
for use as glide computer. It cost me only US$200 and offers the best
screen among the portable, open-platform systems. It can easily be
powered and installing/updating XCSoar is a snap. At that price, I
don't see why one needs to compromise functionality. What Max
Kellermann says in this thread is true. (The Streak is too big for a
phone unless you carry a (man-)purse.)

Many Android smart phones will make a poor in-flight glide computer
due to their displays alone; do your research before you buy one.

PS.: there's an article in the current Soaring Magazine about PDAs,
but I find it fairly biased.

[Dan Marotta]

"...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
message in flight
etc...)

Pul-leeze, tell me that's a joke. Or to you text on tow? Or kill bikers
because you're to busy playing with the phone to look outside the car?


"Ramy" > wrote in message
...
On Nov 14, 10:20 am, RS > wrote:
> On Nov 14, 9:45 am, "vaughn" > wrote:
>
> > "Whiskey Delta" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
> > > Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> > Also don't entirely neglect non-soaring aviation apps. For example,
> > several
> > apps will give you in-cockpit weather radar. (Yes, connectivity in
> > flight is
> > questionable, but at least you get a last-minute picture before launch.)
>
> > Vaughn
>
> Definitely prefer android. In addition to the ones already named,
> Google My Tracks and GPS logbooks are interesting.

If you only want to use one device for phone and flight computer than
yes, Android is your best bet. However I rather have a dedicated
device for flight computer and not use it for day to day as a phone
(less chance of loosing, damaging, forgetting, having to use your
flight computer for an important phone call or text message in flight
etc). In this case iphone is my preferred choice for anything else
than flight computer. Also you want a bigger screen for flight
computer (5" like the Dell Streak seem to be ideal) but it is too big
and bulky for a phone.

Ramy

[Alex Potter]

Dan Marotta wrote:

> "...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
> message in flight
> etc...)
>

I was under the impression that mobile phone use was strictly forbidden
during any kind of flight because of the potential to saturate any cell in
line of sight?

--
Alex

[Ramy]

On Nov 15, 8:11*am, "Dan Marotta" > wrote:
> "...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
> message in flight
> etc...)
>
> Pul-leeze, tell me that's a joke. *Or to you text on tow? *Or kill bikers
> because you're to busy playing with the phone to look outside the car?
>
> "Ramy" > wrote in message
>
> ...
> On Nov 14, 10:20 am, RS > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Nov 14, 9:45 am, "vaughn" > wrote:
>
> > > "Whiskey Delta" > wrote in message
>
> > ....
>
> > > > Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> > > Also don't entirely neglect non-soaring aviation apps. For example,
> > > several
> > > apps will give you in-cockpit weather radar. (Yes, connectivity in
> > > flight is
> > > questionable, but at least you get a last-minute picture before launch.)
>
> > > Vaughn
>
> > Definitely prefer android. In addition to the ones already named,
> > Google My Tracks and GPS logbooks are interesting.
>
> If you only want to use one device for phone and flight computer than
> yes, Android is your best bet. However I rather have a dedicated
> device for flight computer and not use it for day to day as a phone
> (less chance of loosing, damaging, forgetting, having to use your
> flight computer for an important phone call or text message in flight
> etc). In this case iphone is my preferred choice for anything else
> than flight computer. Also you want a bigger screen for flight
> computer (5" like the Dell Streak seem to be ideal) but it is too big
> and bulky for a phone.
>
> Ramy- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

No, this is not a joke. Occasionaly when flying XC you may need to
tell your crew who chase you were to go. A 3 word text message have
much better chance to go through than a phone call, and take no longer
than changing your MC or ballast setting on a flight computer. If your
crew can follow your spot this may no longer be needed.
But of course no one will ever use a phone in the cockpit since it is
forbidden so I guess this is theoratical only....

Ramy

[vaughn[_3_]]

"Alex Potter" > wrote in message
...
> Dan Marotta wrote:
>
>> "...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
>> message in flight
>> etc...)
>
> I was under the impression that mobile phone use was strictly forbidden
> during any kind of flight because of the potential to saturate any cell in
> line of sight?

That depends!.I believe the FCC ban only applies to the original 800 Mhz cell
phone band.

According to Wiki:
"The use of cell phones aboard airborne planes is banned by the FCC in 47 C.F.R.
§ 22.925: "The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft is airborne is
prohibited by FCC rules.... The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft
is on the ground is subject to FAA regulations." This ban applies to phones that
use the 800 MHz spectrum. Personal Communications Services (PCS) phones that use
the 1900 MHz spectrum are governed under FCC 47CFR24 and their use in aircraft
is not restricted by the FCC whether on the ground or in flight."



Actually, current cell sites have antenna technology that gives almost no signal
above the horizon. Often (perhaps generally), you will find very little signal
above 2000 feet or so. YMMV.

Vaughn

[kammeyer]

On Nov 14, 8:20*am, Max Kellermann > wrote:
> Whiskey Delta > wrote:

> There's just iGlide on the iPhone. *It's commercial, and it's decades
> behind other programs.
>

There is also GlidePath. It is pretty much strictly a logger, but it
provides a very easy way to log and submit a flight to OLC.

http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/glidepath/id383714417

(I am the author of GlidePath)

[Mike Schumann]

On 11/15/2011 5:37 PM, vaughn wrote:
> "Alex > wrote in message
> ...
>> Dan Marotta wrote:
>>
>>> "...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
>>> message in flight
>>> etc...)
>>
>> I was under the impression that mobile phone use was strictly forbidden
>> during any kind of flight because of the potential to saturate any cell in
>> line of sight?
>
> That depends!.I believe the FCC ban only applies to the original 800 Mhz cell
> phone band.
>
> According to Wiki:
> "The use of cell phones aboard airborne planes is banned by the FCC in 47 C.F.R.
> § 22.925: "The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft is airborne is
> prohibited by FCC rules.... The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft
> is on the ground is subject to FAA regulations." This ban applies to phones that
> use the 800 MHz spectrum. Personal Communications Services (PCS) phones that use
> the 1900 MHz spectrum are governed under FCC 47CFR24 and their use in aircraft
> is not restricted by the FCC whether on the ground or in flight."
>
>
>
> Actually, current cell sites have antenna technology that gives almost no signal
> above the horizon. Often (perhaps generally), you will find very little signal
> above 2000 feet or so. YMMV.
>
> Vaughn
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
I have had trouble getting cell phone service at the top of the Empire
State building in NYC.

--
Mike Schumann

[Dan Marotta]

I can see that, though flying out west, the cell towers can be few and far
between.

I haven't done a crewed cross country in a long time and, back then, I just
relied on the radio and prior planning.

I thought you were talking about receiving calls from the girl friend or
co-workers.


"Ramy" > wrote in message
...
On Nov 15, 8:11 am, "Dan Marotta" > wrote:
> "...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
> message in flight
> etc...)
>
> Pul-leeze, tell me that's a joke. Or to you text on tow? Or kill bikers
> because you're to busy playing with the phone to look outside the car?
>
> "Ramy" > wrote in message
>
> ...
> On Nov 14, 10:20 am, RS > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Nov 14, 9:45 am, "vaughn" > wrote:
>
> > > "Whiskey Delta" > wrote in message
>
> > ...
>
> > > > Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> > > Also don't entirely neglect non-soaring aviation apps. For example,
> > > several
> > > apps will give you in-cockpit weather radar. (Yes, connectivity in
> > > flight is
> > > questionable, but at least you get a last-minute picture before
> > > launch.)
>
> > > Vaughn
>
> > Definitely prefer android. In addition to the ones already named,
> > Google My Tracks and GPS logbooks are interesting.
>
> If you only want to use one device for phone and flight computer than
> yes, Android is your best bet. However I rather have a dedicated
> device for flight computer and not use it for day to day as a phone
> (less chance of loosing, damaging, forgetting, having to use your
> flight computer for an important phone call or text message in flight
> etc). In this case iphone is my preferred choice for anything else
> than flight computer. Also you want a bigger screen for flight
> computer (5" like the Dell Streak seem to be ideal) but it is too big
> and bulky for a phone.
>
> Ramy- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

No, this is not a joke. Occasionaly when flying XC you may need to
tell your crew who chase you were to go. A 3 word text message have
much better chance to go through than a phone call, and take no longer
than changing your MC or ballast setting on a flight computer. If your
crew can follow your spot this may no longer be needed.
But of course no one will ever use a phone in the cockpit since it is
forbidden so I guess this is theoratical only....

Ramy

[Dave Nadler]

Yeah, I have AT&T too...

[Tony[_5_]]

On Nov 16, 9:02*am, "Dan Marotta" > wrote:
> I can see that, though flying out west, the cell towers can be few and far
> between.
>
> I haven't done a crewed cross country in a long time and, back then, I just
> relied on the radio and prior planning.
>
> I thought you were talking about receiving calls from the girl friend or
> co-workers.
>
> "Ramy" > wrote in message
>
> ...
> On Nov 15, 8:11 am, "Dan Marotta" > wrote:
>
>
>
> > "...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
> > message in flight
> > etc...)
>
> > Pul-leeze, tell me that's a joke. Or to you text on tow? Or kill bikers
> > because you're to busy playing with the phone to look outside the car?
>
> > "Ramy" > wrote in message
>
> ...
> > On Nov 14, 10:20 am, RS > wrote:
>
> > > On Nov 14, 9:45 am, "vaughn" > wrote:
>
> > > > "Whiskey Delta" > wrote in message
>
> > > ...
>
> > > > > Any other thoughts that may help differentiate between the two?
>
> > > > Also don't entirely neglect non-soaring aviation apps. For example,
> > > > several
> > > > apps will give you in-cockpit weather radar. (Yes, connectivity in
> > > > flight is
> > > > questionable, but at least you get a last-minute picture before
> > > > launch.)
>
> > > > Vaughn
>
> > > Definitely prefer android. In addition to the ones already named,
> > > Google My Tracks and GPS logbooks are interesting.
>
> > If you only want to use one device for phone and flight computer than
> > yes, Android is your best bet. However I rather have a dedicated
> > device for flight computer and not use it for day to day as a phone
> > (less chance of loosing, damaging, forgetting, having to use your
> > flight computer for an important phone call or text message in flight
> > etc). In this case iphone is my preferred choice for anything else
> > than flight computer. Also you want a bigger screen for flight
> > computer (5" like the Dell Streak seem to be ideal) but it is too big
> > and bulky for a phone.
>
> > Ramy- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> No, this is not a joke. Occasionaly when flying XC you may need to
> tell your crew who chase you were to go. A 3 word text message have
> much better chance to go through than a phone call, and take no longer
> than changing your MC or ballast setting on a flight computer. If your
> crew can follow your spot this may no longer be needed.
> But of course no one will ever use a phone in the cockpit since it is
> forbidden so I guess this is theoratical only....
>
> Ramy

Leah and I have had good luck with in flight radio and post flight
cell phone. Although there was this one time in a dust field in NW
Kansas where reception was not so hot. Now I have a SPOT.

I did one Downwind Dash this year with a non-cellphone equipped crew.
That was fun in a vintage experience sort of way. Adds another layer
of thought processes when you know you need to have reasonable access
to a phone after you land.

[Ramy]

On Nov 15, 2:37*pm, "vaughn" > wrote:
> "Alex Potter" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
> > Dan Marotta wrote:
>
> >> "...having to use your flight computer for an important phone call or text
> >> message in flight
> >> etc...)
>
> > I was under the impression that mobile phone use was strictly forbidden
> > during any kind of flight because of the potential to saturate any cell in
> > line of sight?
>
> That depends!.I believe the FCC ban only applies to the original 800 Mhz cell
> phone band.
>
> According to Wiki:
> "The use of cell phones aboard airborne planes is banned by the FCC in 47 C.F.R.
> § 22.925: "The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft is airborne is
> prohibited by FCC rules.... The use of cellular telephones while this aircraft
> is on the ground is subject to FAA regulations." This ban applies to phones that
> use the 800 MHz spectrum. Personal Communications Services (PCS) phones that use
> the 1900 MHz spectrum are governed under FCC 47CFR24 and their use in aircraft
> is not restricted by the FCC whether on the ground or in flight."
>
> Actually, current cell sites have antenna technology that gives almost no signal
> above the horizon. *Often (perhaps generally), you will find very little signal
> above 2000 feet or so. *YMMV.
>
> Vaughn

Regardless if it is legal or not, if you use your phone as flight
computer you need to remember to switch to airplane mode before every
flight to make sure the flight computer will not get interrupted by
phone calls, text messages, notifications etc. One more reason to have
a dedicated tablet for flight computer than using your regular
smartphone.

Ramy

[Jim[_18_]]

> Regardless if it is legal or not, if you use your phone as flight
> computer you need to remember to switch to airplane mode before every
> flight to make sure the flight computer will not get interrupted by
> phone calls, text messages, notifications etc. One more reason to have
> a dedicated tablet for flight computer than using your regular
> smartphone.
>
> Ramy

All the phones are too small for my 50 year old eyes, I'm with Ramy
and prefer a dedicated glide computer. My 302 with the simple 303
display is all I ever use and I don't feel held back by lack of info.
Eventually would like to have a clear nav.

My phone is an iPhone as I'm very busy and want my devices to work
with minimum fuss.

Jim

[Cliff Hilty[_2_]]

I do 2 or 3 dashes (downwind, upwind ect.) with crew a year, and have found
that the cell phone is just about useless until I am extremely low (in
which case I don't want to be fussing about with it) or on the ground.
Having landed in some of the most remote locations in the west, I have had
very good luck with cell coverage (was Alltel now Verizon). If it doesn't
connect for a voice call I can usually send a text msg with info. That
being said my 1st back up is the spot 1 and is set up to send the GPS
coord's and brief message to my Crew and a back up in Phoenix and of course
is open shared page on SSA and ASA web pages. 2nd is the Radio and the crew
vehicle has a 1/4 wave antenna with a Terra panel mount. I can usually
only talk on the radio to crew when very high or within 50-100 miles of
her. I have yet not to be found or retrieved within a few hours. Of course
there was the one time in Ely that I had to come back the next day to get
the glider, but that is another story :)

CH

PS: I usually try and land where there might be liquid refreshment for the
wait. That usually doesn't go over well with the crew after driving for 8
hours :)


>Leah and I have had good luck with in flight radio and post flight
>cell phone. Although there was this one time in a dust field in NW
>Kansas where reception was not so hot. Now I have a SPOT.
>
>I did one Downwind Dash this year with a non-cellphone equipped crew.
>That was fun in a vintage experience sort of way. Adds another layer
>of thought processes when you know you need to have reasonable access
>to a phone after you land.
>
CH Ventus B

"If we are all "just dust in the wind", then I want to be at the top of a Huge Dust Devil!"