Pack guns in your little airplane

[pac plyer]

"Peter Duniho", who apparently can't navigate around a TFR wrote:
: (then hit view complete
thread)

Captain wubba correctly pointed out:
> screaming 'That's not
> fair! That's not fair! I want to be able to fly over the stadiums
> again!' doesn't help our cause. It makes us look like we are more
> concerned with our own toys than withe the security of the US

Pac sez:

Exactly, thank you Cap Wubba for saying this so I didn't have to.
Reading Peter's irrational moaning was giving me a migraine. All the
whining in the world about how "unfair" TFR's are will change nothing.
And No one is going to feel sorry for "you rich guys" and your
recreational flying woes.

So what will stop this GA witch hunt? I'd like like to call attention
to what the Air Line Pilot's Association is doing: arming themselves
to the teeth in federally approved programs. Instead of having
security officers everywhere, including the cockpit, like Aeroflot
used to do, they are assuming the role of deputized custodian of
FAR121 travel.

The same could be done for part 91 flight. We could all write Phil
Boyer at AOPA and Paul Jr. at EAA and suggest arming ourselves at
little airports across America. This would keep non-flying TSA drones
out of our hair while at the same time providing real protection for
the GA fleet.

I know, I know: Liberals like xxxxx, will start whining again about
how unfair it is that he should have to carry a gun... But no matter.
Either we start protecting these ramps ourselves, or after a few more
rag-head GA incidents, here comes the TSA at your airport to do it for
you:

"I'm sorry sir, this is a secure area… you'll have to leave that screw
driver with me, until you return from your aircraft."

Now just let me slip into my anti-gunner flak jacket here... O.K..

What do you guys think?


Pac "guns" plyer




Message 2 in thread
From: Rich S. )
Subject: Re: Pack guns in your little airplane


"pac plyer" > wrote
> The same could be done for part 91 flight. We could all write Phil
> Boyer at AOPA and Paul Jr. at EAA and suggest arming ourselves at
> little airports across America. This would keep non-flying TSA drones
> out of our hair while at the same time providing real protection for
> the GA fleet.

Buddy of mine had to add a bit of weight to the rear of his Emeraude. He
dropped in an O-290 and didn't move the battery back. I suggested he build
in a tail compartment for a Savage O/U .22 mag/20 ga.

No sense carrying a chuck of metal that won't shoot.

Rich "You never know when you're going to go down in the wilds of Missouri"
S.


Message 3 in thread
From: Del Rawlins )
Subject: Re: Pack guns in your little airplane

On 10 Jul 2003 03:36 PM, pac plyer posted the following:

> The same could be done for part 91 flight. We could all write Phil
> Boyer at AOPA and Paul Jr. at EAA and suggest arming ourselves at
> little airports across America. This would keep non-flying TSA drones
> out of our hair while at the same time providing real protection for
> the GA fleet.

Here in Alaska the pilot in command is required to carry a firearm (
except for airlines and flights passing through Canada) for survival
purposes. Buddy of mine who is a bush pilot had a client pressuring him
to make a flight in unsafe conditions. The guy started to get nasty and
in his face until he realized my friend was wearing his .45, at which
point his politeness returned to him. Now the gun was not mentioned nor
was a move made for it, but without a doubt had it not been there the
client would have continued, possibly getting physical, and a less
strong willed pilot than my friend might have given in and made the
flight.

----------------------------------------------------
Del Rawlins-
Remove _kills_spammers_ to reply via email.
Unofficial Bearhawk FAQ website:
http://www.rawlinsbrothers.org/bhfaq/

Message 4 in thread
From: Wooduuuward )
Subject: Re: Pack guns in your little airplane

This reminds me of the situation in Australia, where the police
figure now that the crooks know for sure there are no firearms
in people's homes, burglaries have risen dramatically in broad
daylight with people still in their homes. The crooks don't care
if anyone is home anymore.
You don't have to use a gun, the very thought that it might be
there can be a deterrent to criminals.
I know, I know, there's lots of good reasons to disarm regular
folks. But the fact remains, forcible house break-ins have risen
since the 'peasants' have been disarmed.

Del Rawlins wrote:
> snip . . . The guy started to get nasty and
> in his face until he realized my friend was wearing his .45, at which
> point his politeness returned to him. Now the gun was not mentioned nor
> was a move made for it, but without a doubt had it not been there the
> client would have continued, possibly getting physical, /snip.

[Grumman-581]

"pac plyer" wrote ...
> The same could be done for part 91 flight. We could all write Phil
> Boyer at AOPA and Paul Jr. at EAA and suggest arming ourselves at
> little airports across America. This would keep non-flying TSA drones
> out of our hair while at the same time providing real protection for
> the GA fleet.
>
> What do you guys think?

I'm already always armed at my airport... What's the difference?

[Tim Bengtson]

Sydney Hoeltzli wrote:

> As far as I know, I can carry a gun in my small airplane right
> here and now and on the ground, as permitted by local and state
> law, am I mistaken?
>
> How do local and state laws impact pilots bearing arms, out of
> curiousity?

You just have to check your state and local laws. They're all
different. Here is a site that may help:

http://www.nra-ila.org/library.asp

Otherwise, you can call your local police agency and ask them. If
you're in the People's Republic of California, they may faint if you
tell them you want to carry a gun on an airplane.

Tim

[Checkerbird]

My local airport is privately owned / public use, and the owner (with whom I
share a hangar) has given explicit permission for us pilots and aircraft owners
to carry while on the premises... that is as long as the firearm is of
sufficient caliber and not a wimpy little pea-shooter... after all this is rural
Texas and we've got a reputation to uphold. We even have a couple private
residences on the field, and the occupants of both are... umm, shall we say,
strong supporters of the 2nd Amendment. Also many members of our airport
community are either active or retired members of law enforcement. You never
know who might be carrying at this airport. Some may even carry openly a sidearm
in a holster and nobody even thinks twice when seeing this... usually the first
thought to occur is that someone probably found a rattlesnake or suspected rabid
varmint on the premises, and these days shooting the rattlesnakes is a last
resort, we try to capture them alive instead to be milked.

[Jim Vadek]

If find it incredible that supposedly grown men still jerk off to carrying a
gun. Give me a break.

"Checkerbird" > wrote in message
...
> My local airport is privately owned / public use, and the owner (with whom
I
> share a hangar) has given explicit permission for us pilots and aircraft
owners
> to carry while on the premises... that is as long as the firearm is of
> sufficient caliber and not a wimpy little pea-shooter... after all this is
rural
> Texas and we've got a reputation to uphold. We even have a couple private
> residences on the field, and the occupants of both are... umm, shall we
say,
> strong supporters of the 2nd Amendment. Also many members of our airport
> community are either active or retired members of law enforcement. You
never
> know who might be carrying at this airport. Some may even carry openly a
sidearm
> in a holster and nobody even thinks twice when seeing this... usually the
first
> thought to occur is that someone probably found a rattlesnake or suspected
rabid
> varmint on the premises, and these days shooting the rattlesnakes is a
last
> resort, we try to capture them alive instead to be milked.

[Newps]

RT wrote:


> (Ackshully speaking, carrying is a PITA and not undertaken by anyone with 2
> brain cells to rub together unless they think they need to)

Huh? Guns are everywhere out here in the West. Can't speak for the
other states but here in Montana your car is considered your house for
carrying purposes. By definition you can not conceal a gun in a car,
unlike most of the pathetic states east of the Mississippi.

[Capt. Doug]

>pac plyer wrote in message > The same could be done for part 91 flight.
We could >all write Phil Boyer at AOPA and Paul Jr. at EAA and suggest
arming ourselves at
> little airports across America. This would keep non-flying TSA drones
> out of our hair while at the same time providing real protection for
> the GA fleet.

Pilots are not neccessarily smart. There have been some that I have met who
I have had serious doubts about their common sense even without a firearm.
An unsubstantiated shooting of an innocent person by a GA pilot would have
bad repercussions for all of us.

Here's how we handle it. Add a regulation to Part 61 that requires private
pilot candidates to obtain a permit to carry a firearm. This involves a
criminal background check and fingerprinting along with a gun safety course
(which should please the public naysayers who want background checks for
pilots). These are the same requirements
for a concealed firearm permit that many right-to-carry states already have.
The difference is that the permit will be honored in all 50 states if you
have the aviation endorsement.

D.

[RT]

Newps wrote in message >...
>
>
>RT wrote:
>
>
>> (Ackshully speaking, carrying is a PITA and not undertaken by anyone with
2
>> brain cells to rub together unless they think they need to)
>
>Huh? Guns are everywhere out here in the West. Can't speak for the
>other states but here in Montana your car is considered your house for
>carrying purposes. By definition you can not conceal a gun in a car,
>unlike most of the pathetic states east of the Mississippi.

What I was on about is that it is just downright inconvenient to carry
unless you have to - and by carry I did NOT mean "have in your
car/house/aircraft" - I meant exactly what I said: "carry".

[RT]

starwars wrote in message ...
>"RT" >
>>(Ackshully speaking, carrying is a PITA and not undertaken by anyone
>>with 2 brain cells to rub together unless they think they need to)
>
>Isn't Australia going through a handgun confiscation program as we speak?

Yes.

>Didn't the Australian gov use the massacre at Dunblane as an excuse to
>confiscate nearly every semi-auto rifle and shotgun in the country?

Erm... no.
Erm.. Dunblane is in Scotland which is part of UK which is ...erm... quite
some distance from Oz.
As in 13,000 miles away.


> What a
>long way the proud Aussies have fallen. Your liberal gov is trying to turn
>the human inhabitants of your grand land into sheep. Isn't armed robbery
>and murder by firearm skyrocketed since the general disarmament? Isn't
>there a lesson in that? The bad guys are more scared of armed citizens
>than they are of armed police. I loved the land and the people when I was
>there and I am shocked and dismayed that the Australians have allowed their
>gov to disarm them. Perhaps y'all will come to your senses.

I doubt it - too many people live in cities these days.


>Carrying a gun is an insurance policy, no more, no less. You have auto
>insurance, airplane insurance, home insurance, title insurance, etc., and
>you hope you never need to use it. The thing about insurance is that you
>never know when or where you will need it.
>
>I am armed everywhere I go, where it is legal to carry concealed. Check,
>http://www.packing.org.
>
>Many US states have reciprocity agreements with other states so if you have
>a concealed handgun permit in one state you may carry in others, not
>necessarily adjacent. Most states allow for out-of-state residents to
>apply for concealed handgun licenses.
>
>Don't start me on whether begging state gov for my right to carry is
>constitutional - it's not.
>
>Want a truely pro-gun site? Try Jews for the Preservation of Firearms
>Ownership, http://www.jpfo.org Who better learned the lesson of "gun
>control"? than the Jews? Or the Russians? Or the Chinese? Or the
>Rwandans? Or the Cambodians? Or the Congolese? Or the Bosnians? Or ...
>
>Kingfisher
>AOPA, NRA-ILA, GOA, JPFO, SAF, CCRKBA, COA, LSAS, LEAA. Money is a weapon.

Now, if you'll just wipe your chin, what I said and stand by is: "Ackshully
speaking, carrying is a PITA and not undertaken by anyone with 2 brain cells
to rub together unless they think they need to."


>When guns and GA planes are outlawed, politicians will still fly and have
>armed bodyguards.


You got that right.

[Mike Rapoport]

> >Erm.. Dunblane is in Scotland which is part of UK which is ...erm...
quite
> >some distance from Oz. As in 13,000 miles away.
>

Its only 8400nm away.