Standard Cirrus

[Walt Connelly]

Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? Pros? Cons? Indifferences? I am looking for my first ship.

Walt

[C2]

On Dec 28, 2:38*pm, Walt Connelly <Walt.Connelly.
> wrote:
> Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask
> your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? *Pros? *Cons? *Indifferences? *I am
> looking for my first ship.
>
> Walt
>
> --
> Walt Connelly

It was my first glass ship after 120 hours in a Ka6CR. Due to others
reports, my biggest concern was the all flying tail and it's
sensitivity. As soon as I started rolling and got into the air behind
the tug, I realized it was an overblown issue. Above 90-100 knots have
two hands on the stick. If you set the glider up each time, installing
the tail can be a bit of a pain the first few times. With a little
practice It will be easy. It's fairly obvious when it's installed
improperly.
It has a huge cockpit. It climbs great and runs just fine. And, the
Standard Cirrus will be easy to resell.

[[email protected]]

I have very good memories of flying the Standard Cirrus having made 18
flights totalling 55 hours in one . It's a very good performer and I
think easy to fly. If I recall the airbrakes were not as effective as
with some other single seaters of that era , but never created a
problem for me. The only notation in my logbook after making the first
flight in it was that "it was more sensitive than the Elfe S-4A "
that I was a part-owner of. A consideration I'd offer is that it
would be advisable to have some reasonable experience in several
different single seaters before jumping into one. I had around 100
solo hours by the time I first flew the Cirrus.

Ron.

[olddogcirrus]

On Dec 28, 3:38*pm, Walt Connelly <Walt.Connelly.
> wrote:
> Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask
> your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? *Pros? *Cons? *Indifferences? *I am
> looking for my first ship.
>
> Walt
>
> --
> Walt Connelly

Very good opinion of the Cirrus. Was my first glider and earned all
badges in it. Flying tail is pretty much a non issue, but as others
have said, need to have a firm grip on the stick at higher speeds.
Just be very careful and sure of what you are doing when installing
the tail, it will have limited movement and kill you improperly
installed, so do pay very close attention and double and triple check
the install. Other than that, a great bird, probably underrated on
handicaps. Climbs with anything and outdoes many. Straight forward.
Spoilers about average for its generation, no problem coming down.
Wheel brake generally weak, as are most Tost types of that era. Good
handling, good performing. Large enough inside for most larger
pilots. Wings not that heavy, but control hookup done by Braille, as
you have to reach over the spars and then down to get to them, unless
you have an added door over the hookups on the fuselage. Most don't.
Those early gel coats seemed to outlast a lot of the newer stuff. A
good honest bird you can actually go someplace in!

Steve

[David Salmon[_2_]]

At 20:38 28 December 2011, Walt Connelly wrote:
>
>Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask
>your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? Pros? Cons? Indifferences? I am
>looking for my first ship.
>
>Walt
>
>
>
>
>--
>Walt Connelly
>

The brakes have been mentioned, most of those I've seen have had the
approved mod to make them double paddle. Not a bank breaker.
There is an excellent web site for the Std Cirrus, with all the information
you could want.
Dave

[David Salmon[_2_]]

At 20:38 28 December 2011, Walt Connelly wrote:
>
>Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask
>your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? Pros? Cons? Indifferences? I am
>looking for my first ship.
>
>Walt
>
>
>
>
>--
>Walt Connelly
>

The brakes have been mentioned, most of those I've seen have had the
approved mod to make them double paddle. Not a bank breaker.
There is an excellent web site for the Std Cirrus, with all the information
you could want.
Dave

[JJ Sinclair[_2_]]

On Dec 29, 3:07*am, David Salmon > wrote:
> At 20:38 28 December 2011, Walt Connelly wrote:
>
>
>
> >Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask
> >your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? *Pros? *Cons? *Indifferences? *I am
> >looking for my first ship.
>
> >Walt
>
> >--
> >Walt Connelly
>
> The brakes have been mentioned, most of those I've seen have had the
> approved mod to make them double paddle. Not a bank breaker.
> There is an excellent web site for the Std Cirrus, with all the information
> you could want.
> Dave

Check the stab for lateral slop, as I remember the tip can move up and
down a good half inch and still be within tolerance! Can be re-bushed
when too much slop shows up. I kept a firm grip on the stick with my
right hand and tucked my elbow in tight against my side when going
over 70 knots. Good machine with a favorable handicap in the US. An
Eberly trailer is a +.
Have fun,
JJ

[John Galloway[_1_]]

At 13:50 29 December 2011, JJ Sinclair wrote:
>On Dec 29, 3:07=A0am, David Salmon wrote:
>> At 20:38 28 December 2011, Walt Connelly wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> >Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask
>> >your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? =A0Pros? =A0Cons?
>=A0Indifferences?=
> =A0I am
>> >looking for my first ship.
>>
>> >Walt
>>
>> >--
>> >Walt Connelly
>>
>> The brakes have been mentioned, most of those I've seen have had the
>> approved mod to make them double paddle. Not a bank breaker.
>> There is an excellent web site for the Std Cirrus, with all the
>informati=
>on
>> you could want.
>> Dave
>
>Check the stab for lateral slop, as I remember the tip can move up and
>down a good half inch and still be within tolerance! Can be re-bushed
>when too much slop shows up. I kept a firm grip on the stick with my
>right hand and tucked my elbow in tight against my side when going
>over 70 knots. Good machine with a favorable handicap in the US. An
>Eberly trailer is a +.
>Have fun,
>JJ


I agree with JJ - it is a firmly located stick holding arm rather than a
tightly gripped stick that is important at high speed in the Std Cirrus.

John Galloway

[Roger Fowler[_2_]]

At 20:38 28 December 2011, Walt Connelly wrote:
>
>Could I impose upon those of you more experience soaring types and ask
>your opinion of the Standard Cirrus? Pros? Cons? Indifferences? I am
>looking for my first ship.
>
>Walt
>
>
>
>
>--
>Walt Connelly
>

Do a weight and balance with you in the cockpit before flying it. With an
aft CG it can be a handful. If the CG is in the front 75% of the range, it
is fine. A wonderful sailplane if the CG is correct. I loved mine and
nobody outclimbed me!

Roger

[Burt Compton - Marfa]

It is an excellent sailplane. Reasonable factory support from Schempp-
Hirth.
An excellent trailer is essential. That's true for any sailplane.
FInd someone who knows, to show you how to hook up the controls in the
blind fuselage and how to install the tailplane.
Looking at it, the tailplane can appear somewhat normal when it is
not!
Practice these critical assembly tasks several times to teach your
fingers to "see" the fuselage control connectors.
Swear that you will always do a critical assembly and a positive
control check before every flight.
Most have a CG hook back by the gear. Be ready to release on early
takeoff roll if you lose directional control.
Trying to correct any deviation on roll will usually not work. Just
release and try again.
Consider adding a rope lanyard to the release lever, like a ski-boot
carrier.
The release is difficult to reach and activate without some sort of
extension.
Know the difference in the release lever and the rudder adjustment
handle. They are close together.
Rumor is that this is not a good sailplane for winch launch due to the
all flying tailplane.
Talk to an instructor who winch launches in the type.
Airbrakes are OK if you don't let the speed get too fast on final,
which it will, as this is a slick sailplane.
Slow it down on a wide downwind but make coordinated turns to base and
final.
Like any aircraft, it may spin if you rudder it around in a skidding
turn.
It takes very little rudder to coordinate the turn.
Besides, rudder doesn't turn an aircraft, the action of the ailerons
make it turn. Bank it.
Rain drops on the wings may increase the stall speed significantly.
Serial numbers after about #180 fly a bit better due to a factory
change to the wing -- see the Standard Cirrus website.
The bicycle lever on the stick wheel brake is usually poor. Don't
depend on it on rollout. True for any sailplane.
Give a thorough briefing to whoever you loan it to -- ask me how I
know.
Don't forget to put the gear down. Haven't done this -- yet -- in 40+
years.

Rig it right. Use checklists. Have fun.

Burt
Owner, Standard Cirrus # 187
Marfa, Texas USA

[RS]

On Dec 29, 6:24*pm, Burt Compton - Marfa > wrote:
> It is an excellent sailplane. Reasonable factory support from Schempp-
> Hirth.
> An excellent trailer is essential. *That's true for any sailplane.
> FInd someone who knows, to show you how to hook up the controls in the
> blind fuselage and how to install the tailplane.
> Looking at it, the tailplane can appear somewhat normal when it is
> not!
> Practice these critical assembly tasks several times to teach your
> fingers to "see" the fuselage control connectors.
> Swear that you will always do a critical assembly and a positive
> control check before every flight.
> Most have a CG hook back by the gear. *Be ready to release on early
> takeoff roll if you lose directional control.
> Trying to correct any deviation on roll will usually not work. *Just
> release and try again.
> Consider adding a rope lanyard to the release lever, like a ski-boot
> carrier.
> The release is difficult to reach and activate without some sort of
> extension.
> Know the difference in the release lever and the rudder adjustment
> handle. They are close together.
> Rumor is that this is not a good sailplane for winch launch due to the
> all flying tailplane.
> Talk to an instructor who winch launches in the type.
> Airbrakes are OK if you don't let the speed get too fast on final,
> which it will, as this is a slick sailplane.
> Slow it down on a wide downwind but make coordinated turns to base and
> final.
> Like any aircraft, it may spin if you rudder it around in a skidding
> turn.
> It takes very little rudder to coordinate the turn.
> Besides, rudder doesn't turn an aircraft, the action of the ailerons
> make it turn. *Bank it.
> Rain drops on the wings may increase the stall speed significantly.
> Serial numbers after about #180 fly a bit better due to a factory
> change to the wing -- see the Standard Cirrus website.
> The bicycle lever on the stick wheel brake is usually poor. *Don't
> depend on it on rollout. *True for any sailplane.
> Give a thorough briefing to whoever you loan it to -- ask me how I
> know.
> Don't forget to put the gear down. *Haven't done this -- yet -- in 40+
> years.
>
> Rig it right. *Use checklists. *Have fun.
>
> Burt
> Owner, Standard Cirrus # 187
> Marfa, Texas *USA

Very nice plane to fly and transition into. I've had mine, a G/81,
for three years now and love it. Transitioned into it after about 100
hours in L-13's, 233's and a few flights in a Duo Discus. Main
difference between a G/81 and other cirrus is the G/81 has a fixed
horizontal stabilizer versus the all flying tailplane; mine also has
both a nose and CG hook and also a tail wheel vs a skid.
I've never flown it but someone else at the airport has a Std Cirrus
with a tail skid, cg hook and all flying tailplane; he reports these
require a bit more attention but certainly were not deal makers or
breakers for him when he decided to buy his and he quickly adapted to
them. Essentially, he describes it as being slightly more sensitive
to pitch and yaw at low speeds in the initial stages of the launch.
Hence, plan accordingly for current conditions, especially cross
winds.
The yahoo website/group is very knowledgable and a very helpful
resource.
http://www.standardcirrus.org/
Fly's and climbs very nice, also a very sturdy and strong framed
plane.
As with any plane, it takes time and experience to master and fine
tune the skills to rig and fly it, just adjust your flying decisions
to the conditions and your abilities to fly safely in them.

Enjoy!