Did it -- bought the Cheetah

[Duane MacInnis]

Alas...

I am now the proud owner of a 1978 Cheetah with 868 hours total time.
AA5A-0660. Starting the annual tomorrow. Maybe new cam & lifters. A
little XC & TLC this fall & winter, then next summer -- gone.

Jay -- save me a room (the Connie), and a beer. Maybe two.

Too cool.

Duane

--
++++++++++++++
Duane MacInnis
Flight Instructor
Cell (604) 454-7415
www.macinnisaviation.com

[The Flynns]

Welcome to the Grumman ownership!

--
Patrick Flynn
Sammamish, WA
79 Tiger N4543A KRNT
"Duane MacInnis" > wrote in message
news:b8D_a.8634$zE1.7104@edtnps84...
> Alas...
>
> I am now the proud owner of a 1978 Cheetah with 868 hours total time.
> AA5A-0660. Starting the annual tomorrow. Maybe new cam & lifters. A
> little XC & TLC this fall & winter, then next summer -- gone.
>
> Jay -- save me a room (the Connie), and a beer. Maybe two.
>
> Too cool.
>
> Duane
>
> --
> ++++++++++++++
> Duane MacInnis
> Flight Instructor
> Cell (604) 454-7415
> www.macinnisaviation.com
>
>
>

[Kyle Boatright]

"Michael Nouak" > wrote in message
...
> "Duane MacInnis" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:b8D_a.8634$zE1.7104@edtnps84...
> > Alas...
>
> Alas? If I could afford my own plane, I'd be a happy camper.
>
> Mike

Anyone with a middle class income (even low middle class) can afford an
airplane. The key issue is what other things are you willing to give up?
Are you willing to drive an older car? Live in a smaller home in a
not-quite-as desirable neighborhood? Eat in (as opposed to going out to a
restaurant) a few more times a month? Set the A/C on 80F instead of 72?

That's what it takes. We all make sacrifices to some extent in the pursuit
of our interests.

KB

[John Galban]

(Snowbird) wrote in message >...
>
> Duane, if you're that far into the engine, seriously -- do the
> 160 hp mod. You will never regret it.

That's the second time I've seen a reference to the 160 hp mod. I
thought that Cheetahs came with 160 hp from the factory. Every one
I've seen was 160 hp (thought it was part of the LoPresti magic speed
upgrade). I recall that the Traveller was 150 hp. What year did
they change the Cheetah to 160 hp from the factory?

Just Curious,

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

[Rick Durden]

John,

All Cheetahs were 150 hp aircraft, competing directly with the 150 hp
172 and Cherokee 140/Warrior. 80/87 octane O-320 Lycoming engine.

160 hp is a mod.

All the best,
Rick

(John Galban) wrote in message >...
> (Snowbird) wrote in message >...
> >
> > Duane, if you're that far into the engine, seriously -- do the
> > 160 hp mod. You will never regret it.
>
> That's the second time I've seen a reference to the 160 hp mod. I
> thought that Cheetahs came with 160 hp from the factory. Every one
> I've seen was 160 hp (thought it was part of the LoPresti magic speed
> upgrade). I recall that the Traveller was 150 hp. What year did
> they change the Cheetah to 160 hp from the factory?
>
> Just Curious,
>
> John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

[Snowbird]

(John Galban) wrote in message >...
> That's the second time I've seen a reference to the 160 hp mod. I
> thought that Cheetahs came with 160 hp from the factory.

Negative.

> Every one I've seen was 160 hp (thought it was part of the LoPresti
> magic speed upgrade).

Negative. It's an STC. A very common STC, just like the
Sensenitch prop on the '75-79 Tiger.

> I recall that the Traveller was 150 hp. What year did
> they change the Cheetah to 160 hp from the factory?

Never did, AFAIK. See:
http://www.grumman.net/cgrcc/specs.html

Cheers,
Sydney

[Snowbird]

(Rick Durden) wrote in message >...

> I sure liked the time I spent in the Cheetah, so I'm sitting here
> being a little envious of you. It was comfortable for long trips,
> about as fast as an Archer/Cardinal on 30 fewer horses and the
> visibility was outstanding. Only downsides that stick in my mind are
> that despite juggling umbrellas, the inside gets wet when you have to
> deal with rain as you get in or out, and it doesn't carry ice well.

The ice thing is for-real. The wing will lose noticable airspeed
just in heavy rain. (Although, I think perhaps pilots over-estimate
the amount of ice other airframes will carry, and the proper conclusion
isn't "take another plane" it's "don't go" if the "ice risk" is there.
Unless the other plane is known-icing certified. Just my opinion.)

If the inside got significantly more wet than a Piper, you didn't
have a big enough umbrella. You can tell a Grumman pilot by the
size of her umbrella *g*. We have 3 that size. I do experience
"Cessna envy" when it's pouring rain and I have to load the plane
on the ramp, but only then. When I flew Tigger home, my checkout
CFI referred to me as "Cessna-handed". It wasn't a compliment *g*.

Cheers,
Sydney

[Duane MacInnis]

"Snowbird" > wrote in message
om...
> "Duane MacInnis" > wrote in message
news:<b8D_a.8634$zE1.7104@edtnps84>...
> > Alas...
> >
> > I am now the proud owner of a 1978 Cheetah with 868 hours total time.
> > AA5A-0660. Starting the annual tomorrow. Maybe new cam & lifters.
>
> Duane, if you're that far into the engine, seriously -- do the
> 160 hp mod. You will never regret it.

I am wary of the condition of the cam. The airplane has been flown ~50
hours this year past, mostly me before I bought it, but in the 5 years prior
it flew less than 50 hours total. There is more than a little potential for
rust and pitting. Then again -- it may be perfect as the owner declared.
(I insisted in pulling two cylinders. He refused, but reduced the price by
half the cost of the cam. I accepted that. There is a much longer story.)

With this annual, presently underway, I will have two different labs do the
oil analysis plus "ferrography", to see if they can detect any rust or
pitting of the cam shaft & lifters. If their analysis is good, and the
compression holds, I will not pull two cylinders to inspect, and "fly it
till I fry it", waiting for metal to appear. When that happens, then out
she comes, and yes -- a zero time engine and the 160 STC.

If the engine holds together, I will likely paint the old sweetie soon. I
am aware that painting Grummans is another subject entirely.

Thanks for your help. I'm off to the airport to tear the old sweetie apart.

> Congratulations, good luck, and don't forget to join AYA if
> you haven't. Next July in Wisconsin Dells

Yes -- Gino Dimenna our local AYA guy is on my case too. You will see me on
the list soon. I thought the next convention might be in Qualicum here in
British Columbia?

See ya !

Duane

> Cheer,
> Sydney

[Duane MacInnis]

"Rick Durden" > wrote in message
m...

snip

> Only downsides that stick in my mind are
> that despite juggling umbrellas, the inside gets wet when you have to
> deal with rain as you get in or out,

Yes, I'm in Vancouver (150 NM north of Seattle), so we know a thing or two
about rain. Oh yes. We all have umbrellas in our car, in the front foyer,
at the office -- and in the Grumman.

To offset that is the comfort in the summer. An aircraft cockpit is like a
solar oven, and in this regard the Grumman is a real sweetie. Open the
canopy, and we are coooool. Pipers, which I use for training, are just
awful. I can't understand why people who design and build airplanes in a
hot place like Wichita, would build one without cross ventilation -- like
TWO DOORS.

> and it doesn't carry ice well.

Ice -- there will be no flying anywhere near ice for this boy. The winter
here is +2C and 100% humidity on the ground, for about 4 months a year. We
routinely get carb ice while taxiing. I'll be in the coffee shop before I
risk wing ice. But thanks for the caution. The wing seems to be very
sensitive, I did notice that it flies different in heavy rains. Better get
out the wax, and make the old sweetie slippery again.

> Best of luck with it. May you have many enjoyable years of flying it.

Thak you !

Duane

> All the best,
> Rick
>
> "Duane MacInnis" > wrote in message
news:<b8D_a.8634$zE1.7104@edtnps84>...
> > Alas...
> >
> > I am now the proud owner of a 1978 Cheetah with 868 hours total time.
> > AA5A-0660. Starting the annual tomorrow. Maybe new cam & lifters. A
> > little XC & TLC this fall & winter, then next summer -- gone.
> >
> > Jay -- save me a room (the Connie), and a beer. Maybe two.
> >
> > Too cool.
> >
> > Duane

[John Galban]

(Snowbird) wrote in message >...
> (John Galban) wrote in message >...

>
> > I recall that the Traveller was 150 hp. What year did
> > they change the Cheetah to 160 hp from the factory?
>
> Never did, AFAIK. See:
> http://www.grumman.net/cgrcc/specs.html

Thanks (Sydney and Rick) for the info. I guess the mod is very
popular. I'd seen so many 160 hp Cheetahs that I thought they were
stock. I'm always learning something new around here!

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

[David Megginson]

"Duane MacInnis" > writes:

> To offset that is the comfort in the summer. An aircraft cockpit is
> like a solar oven, and in this regard the Grumman is a real sweetie.
> Open the canopy, and we are coooool. Pipers, which I use for
> training, are just awful. I can't understand why people who design
> and build airplanes in a hot place like Wichita, would build one
> without cross ventilation -- like TWO DOORS.

Fair enough, but my Warrior is comfortable on a hot day as soon as I
start the big fan on the front then stick my little plastic scoop out
the pilot-side window to channel the wind inside. A sliding canopy
would be great, of course, but there are easy ways to cope -- if you
don't have the air scoops on the training Pipers, you might suggest
that the owners install them.


All the best,


David

--
David Megginson, , http://www.megginson.com/

[Duane MacInnis]

Hi David !

Yes, yes, the Piper is OK with the fan going. Never seen the scoop for the
left side you speak of, is that a portable device?

Incidentally, with your recommendation I called Bruce Musgrave of Apex at
Buttonville, 905-477-7900. He was very helpful to me as you suggested he
might, with lots of hints and ideas. I would turn to him again in a second
if I was selling or buying again soon. He actually sold one of the
airplanes I was looking at in Burlington, at my recommendation.

Cheers

Duane



"David Megginson" > wrote in message
...
> "Duane MacInnis" > writes:
>
> > To offset that is the comfort in the summer. An aircraft cockpit is
> > like a solar oven, and in this regard the Grumman is a real sweetie.
> > Open the canopy, and we are coooool. Pipers, which I use for
> > training, are just awful. I can't understand why people who design
> > and build airplanes in a hot place like Wichita, would build one
> > without cross ventilation -- like TWO DOORS.
>
> Fair enough, but my Warrior is comfortable on a hot day as soon as I
> start the big fan on the front then stick my little plastic scoop out
> the pilot-side window to channel the wind inside. A sliding canopy
> would be great, of course, but there are easy ways to cope -- if you
> don't have the air scoops on the training Pipers, you might suggest
> that the owners install them.
>
>
> All the best,
>
>
> David
>
> --
> David Megginson, , http://www.megginson.com/

[David Megginson]

"Duane MacInnis" > writes:

> Yes, yes, the Piper is OK with the fan going. Never seen the scoop
> for the left side you speak of, is that a portable device?

It's a small, hinged plastic scoop glued to the pilot-side window.
When the storm window is open, you spin the scoop around so that it
pokes outside and channels the prop blast into the cabin. From what
I've heard, lots of Cherokee owners use them -- it works great for me,
even at 35 degC +, but all the wind sometimes causes mic noise (a mic
muff helped a lot).

One of the brand names for this is "kool scoop" (I have a different
brand). Here's more info:

http://www.chiefaircraft.com/cgi-bin/frame-aircraft.cgi?URL=/Aircraft/Accessories/WindowVent.html

> Incidentally, with your recommendation I called Bruce Musgrave of
> Apex at Buttonville, 905-477-7900. He was very helpful to me as you
> suggested he might, with lots of hints and ideas. I would turn to
> him again in a second if I was selling or buying again soon. He
> actually sold one of the airplanes I was looking at in Burlington,
> at my recommendation.

I'll be going back to Bruce in a few years if my family gets heavy
enough that I have to sell my Warrior and buy a Six.


All the best,


David

--
David Megginson, , http://www.megginson.com/

[David Megginson]

(Snowbird) writes:

> Actually, David, the Pipers I've flown turned from "unbearable" to
> merely "stifling" with the little plastic scoop.
>
> Could it be we inhabit a hotter clime than you "Canajiens"?

Probably. A summer afternoon here is unlikely to get much hotter than
40 degC, and 30 degC is more typical. I haven't flown above about 37
degC myself.


All the best,


David

--
David Megginson, , http://www.megginson.com/