TFR's another question

[Corky Scott]

Do TFR's affect only VFR traffic, or can you file IFR with a flight
plan and discrete transponder code and still fly through a TFR?

Corky Scott

[Ron Natalie]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message ...
> Do TFR's affect only VFR traffic, or can you file IFR with a flight
> plan and discrete transponder code and still fly through a TFR?
>
Depends on the TFR (and in some cases what part of the TFR) you
are transiting.

[Cub Driver]

>Do TFR's affect only VFR traffic, or can you file IFR with a flight
>plan and discrete transponder code and still fly through a TFR?

When the prezdint came to Portsmouth PSM and Manchester MHT last week,
the TFR had two components. There was a 30-mile zone in which all
aircraft had to be under the control of ATC and squawking a discrete
transponder code. That effectively grounded all the Piper Cubs in most
of the state.

In addition, there was a 10-mile no-fly zone around each airport,
which terminated earlier (and may have started later; I don't know).
Only military, scheduled airliners, and other important traffic could
fly with that zone. General aviation was held on the ground until Air
Force One was clear of Boston.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: www.danford.net/letters.htm#9

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

[John T]

"Ron Natalie" > wrote in message

>
> Depends on the TFR (and in some cases what part of the TFR) you
> are transiting.

....like the "expanded P-56" TFR whenever a VIP is in residence. :)

--
John T
http://tknowlogy.com/tknoFlyer
__________

[vincent p. norris]

>Do TFR's affect only VFR traffic, or can you file IFR with a flight
>plan and discrete transponder code and still fly through a TFR?

Corky, Penn State's football stadium is less than three miles from the
airport (UNV), so the TFR that is set up whenever there's a football
game there includes UNV.

As I understand it, planes flying in for the game within three hours
of kickoff time must arrive IFR. But we can depart VFR (and fly AWAY)
from the stadium) by contacting NY Center before take-off.

vince norris

[karl gruber]

I takeoff from Bremerton and fly IFR through the Bremerton TFR all the time.

Karl

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
>
> Do TFR's affect only VFR traffic, or can you file IFR with a flight
> plan and discrete transponder code and still fly through a TFR?
>

Not all TFRs are created equal. TFRs for sporting events allow aircraft
communicating with ATC, IFR or VFR, to penetrate for arrival or departure to
an affected airport.

[KayInPA]

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 21:34:29 -0400, vincent p. norris >
wrote:

>Corky, Penn State's football stadium is less than three miles from the
>airport (UNV), so the TFR that is set up whenever there's a football
>game there includes UNV.
>

Related (but slightly sidebar) question for Vincent. Please forgive
me if it should have been a new topic.

Vincent, in your experience, have there been TFRs established around
the time of the arts festival? I'm thinking that what you're referring
to is a result of the stadium being full, but I'm wondering now about
other busy public events in your area. Certainly, one of the things
I'd like to do with a certificate is to fly to the festival from the
Pittsburgh area.

--
Kay
Student Pilot
email: remove "ns" from "aviationns"









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[C J Campbell]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
| Do TFR's affect only VFR traffic, or can you file IFR with a flight
| plan and discrete transponder code and still fly through a TFR?
|
| Corky Scott

Most TFRs don't affect much of anything. You can fly through the stadium
TFRs when arriving or departing a field. You can fly through military TFRs
while IFR during terminal or approach operations. You can also fly through
these TFRs with a permit which you can usually get with just a phone call.
You can fly through the outer ring of Presidential TFRs with a discrete
transponder code and a flight plan.

You cannot fly through the inner ring of a Presidential TFR or through a
firefighting TFR, but you never could do that anyway. Mostly, the TFRs are
just a way of criminalizing American citizens who are going about their
rightful and legitimate business. The US government has for many decades
attempted to control the American public by making criminals of most
citizens, thus increasing their dependence on the mercy of the government.

[Corky Scott]

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 18:55:26 -0700, "karl gruber"
> wrote:

>I takeoff from Bremerton and fly IFR through the Bremerton TFR all the time.
>
>Karl

Karl, why does Bremerton rate/require a TFR?

Thanks, Corky Scott

[C J Campbell]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
| On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 18:55:26 -0700, "karl gruber"
| > wrote:
|
| >I takeoff from Bremerton and fly IFR through the Bremerton TFR all the
time.
| >
| >Karl
|
| Karl, why does Bremerton rate/require a TFR?
|

Puget Sound Naval Shipyard. The Puget Sound Navy (which apparently does not
think it is the United States Navy), has put up no-fly zones around several
of its bases and publicly threatened to shoot down any airplane that enters
the TFRs or even comes 'too close,' whatever that is.

The only thing comparable that I can think of is in the Middle East, when
the Saudi Army got new Patriot missiles they threatened to shoot down any
Saudi Air Force plane that overflew one of their installations.

[Ron Natalie]

"C J Campbell" > wrote in message ...

>
> You cannot fly through the inner ring of a Presidential TFR or through a
> firefighting TFR, but you never could do that anyway.

Yes, but they were smaller and more infrequent.

[HankPilot2002]

The Kennebunk,ME TFR has a 10 mile radius prohibited " no fly zone" and a 30
mile restricted radius as well. Within the restricted radius there are
provisions to fly on a VFR or IFR flight plan to or from an airport withn the
30 NM zone.

No flight training is allowed in the TFR. The stipulations of the TFR are
spelled out in the NOTAM.

Hank

[David Brooks]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 18:55:26 -0700, "karl gruber"
> > wrote:
>
> >I takeoff from Bremerton and fly IFR through the Bremerton TFR all the
time.
> >
> >Karl
>
> Karl, why does Bremerton rate/require a TFR?

Lots of expensive aircraft carriers that they don't want you to dent with a
172.

-- David Brooks

[vincent p. norris]

> have there been TFRs established around
>the time of the arts festival? I'm thinking that what you're referring
>to is a result of the stadium being full, but I'm wondering now about
>other busy public events in your area.

Not to my knowledge. I'll ask the airport manager and if he can add
further informaiton, I'll email you or post again.

I don't think there's any doubt that it's the fact that if the stadium
is full, 110,000 people are there, within about a 150-yard circle.
It's possibly, if not probably, the largest number of people in such a
small space anywhere along the East coast. A tempting target, I
suppose.

(Of course, it's possible that it's because Joe Paterno, a national
treasure, is there.) ((:-))

And btw, a woman I know has stopped attending football games, out of
fear of terrorism.

How many people attend the arts festival at any given moment, I don't
know, but I doubt it's that many, and they are spread out over half a
dozen blocks.

> Certainly, one of the things I'd like to do with a certificate is to fly to the festival from the
>Pittsburgh area.

Good idea! You'll enjoy it.

vince norris

[Happy Dog]

"vincent p. norris" > wrote in message

> And btw, a woman I know has stopped attending football games, out of
> fear of terrorism.

That's irrational unless she never leaves her house.

le moo

[Bob Noel]

In article >, "Happy Dog"
> wrote:

> "vincent p. norris" > wrote in message
>
> > And btw, a woman I know has stopped attending football games, out of
> > fear of terrorism.
>
> That's irrational unless she never leaves her house.

don't tell her that a terrorist could attack her house.

--
Bob Noel

[KayInPA]

Thanks very much.


On Thu, 16 Oct 2003 23:04:01 -0400, vincent p. norris >
wrote:

>> have there been TFRs established around
>>the time of the arts festival? I'm thinking that what you're referring
>>to is a result of the stadium being full, but I'm wondering now about
>>other busy public events in your area.
>
>Not to my knowledge. I'll ask the airport manager and if he can add
>further informaiton, I'll email you or post again.
>
>I don't think there's any doubt that it's the fact that if the stadium
>is full, 110,000 people are there, within about a 150-yard circle.
>It's possibly, if not probably, the largest number of people in such a
>small space anywhere along the East coast. A tempting target, I
>suppose.
>
>(Of course, it's possible that it's because Joe Paterno, a national
>treasure, is there.) ((:-))
>
>And btw, a woman I know has stopped attending football games, out of
>fear of terrorism.
>
>How many people attend the arts festival at any given moment, I don't
>know, but I doubt it's that many, and they are spread out over half a
>dozen blocks.
>
>> Certainly, one of the things I'd like to do with a certificate is to fly to the festival from the
>>Pittsburgh area.
>
>Good idea! You'll enjoy it.
>
>vince norris

--
Kay
Student Pilot
email: remove "ns" from "aviationns"









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[Ron Natalie]

"vincent p. norris" > wrote in message ...

> And btw, a woman I know has stopped attending football games, out of
> fear of terrorism.

I thought it was because the she got tired of watching the Lions get
trounced (what are they, like 2-5 this year?)