AOPA Expo

[G.R. Patterson III]

Well, I decided to head down to Philadelphia Thursday. My wife knows the city
pretty well, so I've always counted on here for directions when we drive down.
Wednesday night, I started trying to pick her brains for the best way to get
there. After a half hour of futile exercise in that direction, I decided to fly.

Left the house about 8:30 and got in the air a bit before 10:00. It was already
clear that I'd miss the first seminar I wanted to attend. I reported over
Robinsville, just like the AOPA procedure sheet recommended, and PNE told me to
report over the Turnpike bridge. Well, I found the river, but wasn't real sure
which bridge was correct. PNE gave me vectors for that. I ran right base for
33, just like they wanted, and got set up on final. About 300' AGL, some cretin
took a fuel truck across the airport, and I was told to go around. Another pilot
later told me that the ground controller reamed the truck driver royally.

Then somebody stepped on the tower transmission while they were telling me what
to do next, so I'm left drifting out over the Philly suburbs while three planes
conduct business with the tower. Finally got turned around and down. I got the
last parking spot at Atlantic Aviation. The controllers were surprizingly cool
for such a hectic day.

Caught the bus to the convention center. Got there just as "my" first seminar
was adjourning. I then took in part of a spiel by JPI, decided to skip the next
seminar, and headed for the exhibits.

It's a pretty good deal. Unlike Osh and Sun'n Fun, everything is slanted towards
those of us who fly certificated aircraft. Even Lancair wasn't touting kits.
Almost every exhibitor had something to do with aircraft, too, although there
was one cookware vendor and another guy selling ladders.

Diamond had their four seat aircraft on display, and it's beautiful. One neat
design trick they've copied from cars is to use rear seats that fold completely
forward and a folding rear bulkhead that produces a huge cargo compartment.

Honda had their new engine there. It appears to be about the same size as my
O-320 but puts out 225 hp. Geared, injected, with FADEC. You do have to figure
out someplace to put the radiator, though. The rep said they haven't decided to
produce it yet, but the earliest deliver date would be 2005 if they do.

A Thielert 125 hp diesel was also on display. It reminds me of the slant six;
the whole engine is mounted at about a 45 degree angle, with the prop drive on
the side (which puts it on top).

Maule Air had a small booth in the last row, and I spoke with Rautgunde for a
while. She said that Ray was around someplace, so I made a note to come back
later.

The Mitre people had a very interesting exhibit. They're a research group, and
they were demonstrating a TFR alert item they're working on. They expect the
eventual implementation to result in a unit about 3" square with a built-in GPS
receiver that receives TFR coordinates over the GPS link or from the ground in
real time. They had two possible displays in mind; one of them had three lights,
two arrows, and two bars. Basically, if you get too close to a TFR, the green
light goes amber and an arrow lights up indicating which way to turn to avoid.
The other display idea was a primative moving map.

Seminar time. I caught the tail end of the one on future gasolines and then went
to "Destinations in the East". One that sounds interesting is a private strip
40 miles north of Atlanta which they claimed is the highest airport in Georgia.
Run by a former airline pilot, it has rental cabins and other nice features.
Then on to Machado, who was excellent as usual. The serious thread of his talk
on flying safely was the idea that pilots can minimize risk by deciding what to
do in various situations well before they come up. For example, when the weather
deteriorates to 600' and a mile is *not* the time to start figuring out whether
to make a precautionary off-airport landing or not. By the time you consider the
ramifications, you might be into a granite cloud.

Took one last run through the exhibits and spoke with Ray Maule for a while,
then hit the shuttle for the airport. Wow, am I glad I didn't drive! What was
about a 15 minute drive in the morning took about an hour for the return!
Judging by the packages, Lightspeed did a booming business.

Since I haven't flown at night in some time, my preflight was a bit slower than
usual, but the takeoff was uneventful. For me at least; as I began my roll, I
heard another pilot requesting permission to do a T&G. The tower asked if he'd
heard the ATIS, and he said "No, we're about to do that." Tower denied the T&G,
so he asked if he could do a full stop. "No, you can't do anything. We have a
lot of planes here for AOPA, and we're pretty busy."

Old Bridge has a "smart" radio that reports wind (not an AWOS, though). The
lights were on, but I clicked the mic to keep them up, and the radio reported
calm winds and (uhoh!) a "chance of fog." Any thoughts I had about bouncing the
plane a few times for night currency evaporated. The landing was uneventful, but
the tailplane was covered in dew by the time I got her tied down.

All in all, not a bad way to spend a day.

George Patterson
You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the mud.

[Peter R.]

G.R. Patterson III ) wrote:

<snip excellent report>
> All in all, not a bad way to spend a day.

Thanks, George, for the report. I had wanted to attend but due to
Halloween and my family, I opted out. You're report gave me a small taste
of the event.

--
Peter












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[dave]

Great write up George. I went today, friday, for about two hours. I live
just outside Philly so it was only a twenty minute train ride (I rode that
train for almost twenty years when I worked in Philly). I bought a case of
Elite 20/50 for $42.00 delivered. They even threw in a free funnal
attachment. The FBO charges about 6.25/quart. Since I own a citabria, I
was hoping ACA would be there but they weren't. I did pick up a pop open
sun shield from Rosen for $10.00. I'm hoping it will work for the
greenhouse on the citabria.

I wish I had time for some seminars but I had to get back to work. I was
out of town yesterday and tomorrow is soccerday, also known as Saturday.

Did anyone get to the aircraft exhibits at PHL?

Dave
"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
> Well, I decided to head down to Philadelphia Thursday. My wife knows the
city
> pretty well, so I've always counted on here for directions when we drive
down.
> Wednesday night, I started trying to pick her brains for the best way to
get
> there. After a half hour of futile exercise in that direction, I decided
to fly.
>
> Left the house about 8:30 and got in the air a bit before 10:00. It was
already
> clear that I'd miss the first seminar I wanted to attend. I reported over
> Robinsville, just like the AOPA procedure sheet recommended, and PNE told
me to
> report over the Turnpike bridge. Well, I found the river, but wasn't real
sure
> which bridge was correct. PNE gave me vectors for that. I ran right base
for
> 33, just like they wanted, and got set up on final. About 300' AGL, some
cretin
> took a fuel truck across the airport, and I was told to go around. Another
pilot
> later told me that the ground controller reamed the truck driver royally.
>
> Then somebody stepped on the tower transmission while they were telling me
what
> to do next, so I'm left drifting out over the Philly suburbs while three
planes
> conduct business with the tower. Finally got turned around and down. I got
the
> last parking spot at Atlantic Aviation. The controllers were surprizingly
cool
> for such a hectic day.
>
> Caught the bus to the convention center. Got there just as "my" first
seminar
> was adjourning. I then took in part of a spiel by JPI, decided to skip the
next
> seminar, and headed for the exhibits.
>
> It's a pretty good deal. Unlike Osh and Sun'n Fun, everything is slanted
towards
> those of us who fly certificated aircraft. Even Lancair wasn't touting
kits.
> Almost every exhibitor had something to do with aircraft, too, although
there
> was one cookware vendor and another guy selling ladders.
>
> Diamond had their four seat aircraft on display, and it's beautiful. One
neat
> design trick they've copied from cars is to use rear seats that fold
completely
> forward and a folding rear bulkhead that produces a huge cargo
compartment.
>
> Honda had their new engine there. It appears to be about the same size as
my
> O-320 but puts out 225 hp. Geared, injected, with FADEC. You do have to
figure
> out someplace to put the radiator, though. The rep said they haven't
decided to
> produce it yet, but the earliest deliver date would be 2005 if they do.
>
> A Thielert 125 hp diesel was also on display. It reminds me of the slant
six;
> the whole engine is mounted at about a 45 degree angle, with the prop
drive on
> the side (which puts it on top).
>
> Maule Air had a small booth in the last row, and I spoke with Rautgunde
for a
> while. She said that Ray was around someplace, so I made a note to come
back
> later.
>
> The Mitre people had a very interesting exhibit. They're a research group,
and
> they were demonstrating a TFR alert item they're working on. They expect
the
> eventual implementation to result in a unit about 3" square with a
built-in GPS
> receiver that receives TFR coordinates over the GPS link or from the
ground in
> real time. They had two possible displays in mind; one of them had three
lights,
> two arrows, and two bars. Basically, if you get too close to a TFR, the
green
> light goes amber and an arrow lights up indicating which way to turn to
avoid.
> The other display idea was a primative moving map.
>
> Seminar time. I caught the tail end of the one on future gasolines and
then went
> to "Destinations in the East". One that sounds interesting is a private
strip
> 40 miles north of Atlanta which they claimed is the highest airport in
Georgia.
> Run by a former airline pilot, it has rental cabins and other nice
features.
> Then on to Machado, who was excellent as usual. The serious thread of his
talk
> on flying safely was the idea that pilots can minimize risk by deciding
what to
> do in various situations well before they come up. For example, when the
weather
> deteriorates to 600' and a mile is *not* the time to start figuring out
whether
> to make a precautionary off-airport landing or not. By the time you
consider the
> ramifications, you might be into a granite cloud.
>
> Took one last run through the exhibits and spoke with Ray Maule for a
while,
> then hit the shuttle for the airport. Wow, am I glad I didn't drive! What
was
> about a 15 minute drive in the morning took about an hour for the return!
> Judging by the packages, Lightspeed did a booming business.
>
> Since I haven't flown at night in some time, my preflight was a bit slower
than
> usual, but the takeoff was uneventful. For me at least; as I began my
roll, I
> heard another pilot requesting permission to do a T&G. The tower asked if
he'd
> heard the ATIS, and he said "No, we're about to do that." Tower denied the
T&G,
> so he asked if he could do a full stop. "No, you can't do anything. We
have a
> lot of planes here for AOPA, and we're pretty busy."
>
> Old Bridge has a "smart" radio that reports wind (not an AWOS, though).
The
> lights were on, but I clicked the mic to keep them up, and the radio
reported
> calm winds and (uhoh!) a "chance of fog." Any thoughts I had about
bouncing the
> plane a few times for night currency evaporated. The landing was
uneventful, but
> the tailplane was covered in dew by the time I got her tied down.
>
> All in all, not a bad way to spend a day.
>
> George Patterson
> You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the
mud.

[G.R. Patterson III]

dave wrote:
>
> Did anyone get to the aircraft exhibits at PHL?

Aircraft parking at PHL filled up about 9:45 on Thursday, so go early if you
plan to fly in. Of course, they have free shuttle buses running to the airport,
so you can get there from the convention center even if you drive. You want the
#1 shuttle.

George Patterson
You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the mud.

[EDR]

In article >, dave
<davesjunkmail@comcast> wrote:

> Great write up George. I went today, friday, for about two hours. I live
> just outside Philly so it was only a twenty minute train ride (I rode that
> train for almost twenty years when I worked in Philly). I bought a case of
> Elite 20/50 for $42.00 delivered. They even threw in a free funnal
> attachment. The FBO charges about 6.25/quart. Since I own a citabria, I
> was hoping ACA would be there but they weren't. I did pick up a pop open
> sun shield from Rosen for $10.00. I'm hoping it will work for the
> greenhouse on the citabria.
> Did anyone get to the aircraft exhibits at PHL?

ACA was at the airport with a 7GCBC.

[Bob Chilcoat]

Good writeup, George. I though about trying to contact you Thursday
morning, but didn't have a #. I, too, decided to fly at the last minute.
We couldn't have been very far apart at PNE. I may have been just ahead of
you. Two interesting occurances. As I changed tanks (Archer) near
Robinsville, I suddenly smelled raw gasoline! The smell went away pretty
quickly, and I couldn't find any wetness around the selector valve, so
decided to press on figuring that it was probably a seal that leaked only
during movement. That had never happened before, but I did think of my Dad
(http://users.erols.com/viewptmd/Dad7.html). No further problem, but we'll
get that looked at.

A Cessna was cleared for a straight-in approach over the river to 33, and I
was told that I should watch for him, but was never cleared to land or given
any further instructions. As I crossed the runway centerline over the river
at 2,000' I finally asked if I could turn final. "Oh yeah, sure," replied
the tower, " Thanks for reminding me. Cleared to land, 33." Now I was at
2,000 feet, fast and close to the runway. Slipped it all the way down the
approach, but still made the first turnoff. Not pretty, but the Cessna in
front had to go around because he was too high. Probably doesn't slip with
flaps :-)

My first AOPA Expo. Saw a lot of toys for me and the airplane, but nothing
I could afford except a hat and a Montreal sectional. Some of the new
aircraft are really sexy, but way out of my reach (and skill level, some of
them). Had to leave at 2:30 because I wanted to check the fuel valve and
still get back before dark. Didn't change tanks on the way back, just in
case. What a great day for flying. Smooth as glass both ways.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)


"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
> After a half hour of futile exercise in that direction, I decided to fly.
>
> Left the house about 8:30 and got in the air a bit before 10:00. It was
already
> clear that I'd miss the first seminar I wanted to attend. I reported over
> Robinsville, just like the AOPA procedure sheet recommended, and PNE told
me to
> report over the Turnpike bridge. Well, I found the river, but wasn't real
sure
> which bridge was correct. PNE gave me vectors for that. I ran right base
for
> 33, just like they wanted, and got set up on final. About 300' AGL, some
cretin
> took a fuel truck across the airport, and I was told to go around. Another
pilot
> later told me that the ground controller reamed the truck driver royally.
>
> Then somebody stepped on the tower transmission while they were telling me
what
> to do next, so I'm left drifting out over the Philly suburbs while three
planes
> conduct business with the tower. Finally got turned around and down. I got
the
> last parking spot at Atlantic Aviation. The controllers were surprizingly
cool
> for such a hectic day.
>

[Andrew Gideon]

Peter R. wrote:

> Thanks, George, for the report. I had wanted to attend but due to
> Halloween and my family, I opted out. You're report gave me a small taste
> of the event.

My family came with me. We missed Halloween - a big deal in our
neighborhood - but made up for it with the party at the Expo on Friday. In
a way, that was a little disappointing. I expected something a little more
kid-friendly.

On the other hand, my 14 month old - Alex - had a terrific time anyway. He
danced with both my wife and myself, got to run around teasing clowns, and
even has his photo taken with a Wright brother dressed as Phil Boyer. Mrs.
Boyer also took the opportunuty to chat with Alex.

Of course, I had to explain who they were to my wife afterwards.

- Andrew

[EDR]

I arrived at the Expo at Noon on Thursday after a 2+20 flight from
Columbus OH (KOSU) to West Chester (N99). 340 nm with 30-35 kt
tailwind. Excellent!!!
I attended seminars each afternoon and did the exhibit hall in the
half-hour between seminars.
Friday morning, after the General Session, I took the shuttle to the
airport to see the aircraft. I saw what I went to see... the glass
panel 182 and was given a demo on operation of the Garmin 1000's.
VERY simple operation! The only negative I noticed and asked about was
if they were going to add a "shelf" to rest your hand on so you can
press the button you intend to while bouncing around in turbulence? I
was told they had not considered it, and I was given no indication that
were concerned about it. If the picture I took turns out, I will post
it.

[David B. Cole]

Nice writeup George. My plan was to attend on Friday and Saturday.
But on my way down to South Jersey on Friday to meet some friends so
that we could drive over together, I was struck from behind by an 18
wheeler about two miles from the airport where we were to meet. After
that I spent several hours in the hospital getting x-rays and examined
before checking out. I was told that I would probably feel worse the
next morning, but I actually felt ok on Saturday and figured with
everything I'd gone through I may as well attend the last day of the
Expo. While I didn't have a chance to make it to the static display,
I did attend a few good seminars, hung out with Mr. Gideon for a
minute, and constantly battled the temptation to purchase an ANR
headset.

Dave

"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message >...
> Well, I decided to head down to Philadelphia Thursday. My wife knows the city
> pretty well, so I've always counted on here for directions when we drive down.
> Wednesday night, I started trying to pick her brains for the best way to get
> there. After a half hour of futile exercise in that direction, I decided to fly.
>
> Left the house about 8:30 and got in the air a bit before 10:00. It was already
> clear that I'd miss the first seminar I wanted to attend. I reported over
> Robinsville, just like the AOPA procedure sheet recommended, and PNE told me to
> report over the Turnpike bridge. Well, I found the river, but wasn't real sure
> which bridge was correct. PNE gave me vectors for that. I ran right base for
> 33, just like they wanted, and got set up on final. About 300' AGL, some cretin
> took a fuel truck across the airport, and I was told to go around. Another pilot
> later told me that the ground controller reamed the truck driver royally.
>
> Then somebody stepped on the tower transmission while they were telling me what
> to do next, so I'm left drifting out over the Philly suburbs while three planes
> conduct business with the tower. Finally got turned around and down. I got the
> last parking spot at Atlantic Aviation. The controllers were surprizingly cool
> for such a hectic day.
>
> Caught the bus to the convention center. Got there just as "my" first seminar
> was adjourning. I then took in part of a spiel by JPI, decided to skip the next
> seminar, and headed for the exhibits.
>
> It's a pretty good deal. Unlike Osh and Sun'n Fun, everything is slanted towards
> those of us who fly certificated aircraft. Even Lancair wasn't touting kits.
> Almost every exhibitor had something to do with aircraft, too, although there
> was one cookware vendor and another guy selling ladders.
>
> Diamond had their four seat aircraft on display, and it's beautiful. One neat
> design trick they've copied from cars is to use rear seats that fold completely
> forward and a folding rear bulkhead that produces a huge cargo compartment.
>
> Honda had their new engine there. It appears to be about the same size as my
> O-320 but puts out 225 hp. Geared, injected, with FADEC. You do have to figure
> out someplace to put the radiator, though. The rep said they haven't decided to
> produce it yet, but the earliest deliver date would be 2005 if they do.
>
> A Thielert 125 hp diesel was also on display. It reminds me of the slant six;
> the whole engine is mounted at about a 45 degree angle, with the prop drive on
> the side (which puts it on top).
>
> Maule Air had a small booth in the last row, and I spoke with Rautgunde for a
> while. She said that Ray was around someplace, so I made a note to come back
> later.
>
> The Mitre people had a very interesting exhibit. They're a research group, and
> they were demonstrating a TFR alert item they're working on. They expect the
> eventual implementation to result in a unit about 3" square with a built-in GPS
> receiver that receives TFR coordinates over the GPS link or from the ground in
> real time. They had two possible displays in mind; one of them had three lights,
> two arrows, and two bars. Basically, if you get too close to a TFR, the green
> light goes amber and an arrow lights up indicating which way to turn to avoid.
> The other display idea was a primative moving map.
>
> Seminar time. I caught the tail end of the one on future gasolines and then went
> to "Destinations in the East". One that sounds interesting is a private strip
> 40 miles north of Atlanta which they claimed is the highest airport in Georgia.
> Run by a former airline pilot, it has rental cabins and other nice features.
> Then on to Machado, who was excellent as usual. The serious thread of his talk
> on flying safely was the idea that pilots can minimize risk by deciding what to
> do in various situations well before they come up. For example, when the weather
> deteriorates to 600' and a mile is *not* the time to start figuring out whether
> to make a precautionary off-airport landing or not. By the time you consider the
> ramifications, you might be into a granite cloud.
>
> Took one last run through the exhibits and spoke with Ray Maule for a while,
> then hit the shuttle for the airport. Wow, am I glad I didn't drive! What was
> about a 15 minute drive in the morning took about an hour for the return!
> Judging by the packages, Lightspeed did a booming business.
>
> Since I haven't flown at night in some time, my preflight was a bit slower than
> usual, but the takeoff was uneventful. For me at least; as I began my roll, I
> heard another pilot requesting permission to do a T&G. The tower asked if he'd
> heard the ATIS, and he said "No, we're about to do that." Tower denied the T&G,
> so he asked if he could do a full stop. "No, you can't do anything. We have a
> lot of planes here for AOPA, and we're pretty busy."
>
> Old Bridge has a "smart" radio that reports wind (not an AWOS, though). The
> lights were on, but I clicked the mic to keep them up, and the radio reported
> calm winds and (uhoh!) a "chance of fog." Any thoughts I had about bouncing the
> plane a few times for night currency evaporated. The landing was uneventful, but
> the tailplane was covered in dew by the time I got her tied down.
>
> All in all, not a bad way to spend a day.
>
> George Patterson
> You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the mud.

[G.R. Patterson III]

"David B. Cole" wrote:
>
> I did attend a few good seminars, hung out with Mr. Gideon for a
> minute, and constantly battled the temptation to purchase an ANR
> headset.

My "get thee behind me" was a Sky-High Flight bag. One of their designs had
everything perfect for me. At $95, I was able to resist.

George Patterson
You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the mud.

[Richard Russell]

On Fri, 31 Oct 2003 16:58:06 -0500, "dave" <davesjunkmail@comcast>
wrote:

>Great write up George. I went today, friday, for about two hours. I live
>just outside Philly so it was only a twenty minute train ride (I rode that
>train for almost twenty years when I worked in Philly). I bought a case of
>Elite 20/50 for $42.00 delivered. They even threw in a free funnal
>attachment. The FBO charges about 6.25/quart. Since I own a citabria, I
>was hoping ACA would be there but they weren't. I did pick up a pop open
>sun shield from Rosen for $10.00. I'm hoping it will work for the
>greenhouse on the citabria.
>
>I wish I had time for some seminars but I had to get back to work. I was
>out of town yesterday and tomorrow is soccerday, also known as Saturday.
>
>Did anyone get to the aircraft exhibits at PHL?
>

This was my first Expo and I attented all three days, primarily for
the seminars. More on that later.

I did visit the static display at PHL and this was the only downside
of the entire three days. Actually, the display was very nice but I
found and unexpected and unappreciated level of arrogance from the
exhibitors. I felt a little like when I was a kid and wanted to check
out the new cars at a dealer and had to put up with dirty looks and
salesmen telling me that I didn't belong there. They intimidated me
enough that I only viewed most of them from afar.

I spent most of three days attending seminars, of which all but one
were very good. Most of the ones that I chose were safety and/or
airspace related. The one that was not great was an analysis of a
mid-air over Jersey involving two Piper twins. I was looking forward
to this one but the presentation was way too dry and disjointed. It
also involved a lot of reading what was on the screen. I don't need
much help with that; I've been able to read for some time now.

I snuck into the exhibit area in between seminars and had a great time
in there also, even though I didn't know what half of the stuff was.
All in all, a great time.

Rich Russell
P.S. Did anyone see that Javelin "business" jet? You don't think
they're really going to build that, do ya?

[Andrew Gideon]

G.R. Patterson III wrote:

> My "get thee behind me" was a Sky-High Flight bag. One of their designs
> had everything perfect for me. At $95, I was able to resist.

My wife bought one of those for me (although I was still hoping for an
airplane {8^). My only complaint about the bag is that the "kneeboard
slot" doesn't hold my kneeboard. But that's probably because I've a large
lap, and have a board to match <grin>.

I'm still trying to determine the best places for plotter, fuel tester, and
E6B. The latter seems to work well in what was the "kneeboard slot".

It is certainly nice, though, to be able to carry my headset safely
protected from the Jepp books etc. I also like how the VFR charts are
organized. So simple an idea...it makes me ponder why all bags aren't like
this.

- Andrew

[Andrew Gideon]

Richard Russell wrote:

> they're really going to build that, do ya?

Is that the one where I was looking to find the hardpoints for mounting
weapons? I liked it, but wondered at what type of business was intended.

- Andrew

[EDR]

In article >, Richard
Russell > wrote:


> I did visit the static display at PHL and this was the only downside
> of the entire three days. Actually, the display was very nice but I
> found and unexpected and unappreciated level of arrogance from the
> exhibitors. I felt a little like when I was a kid and wanted to check
> out the new cars at a dealer and had to put up with dirty looks and
> salesmen telling me that I didn't belong there. They intimidated me
> enough that I only viewed most of them from afar.

Wow!? That sure wasn't my experience. I tried out several aircraft for
fit, ask for and received instruction on glass cockpit avionics, even
have a demo flight in a DA40 coming up.

> I spent most of three days attending seminars, of which all but one
> were very good. Most of the ones that I chose were safety and/or
> airspace related. The one that was not great was an analysis of a
> mid-air over Jersey involving two Piper twins. I was looking forward
> to this one but the presentation was way too dry and disjointed. It
> also involved a lot of reading what was on the screen. I don't need
> much help with that; I've been able to read for some time now.

The most interesting seminar I attended was one on night vision
adaptation. It was one of the last ones on Thursday. No entry or exit
after the door was closed at 4:30. After the introduction it was lights
out for the remainder of the program.

> P.S. Did anyone see that Javelin "business" jet? You don't think
> they're really going to build that, do ya?

The Javelin looks like a BD-10 on tall landing gear.

[David Reinhart]

They're out after high-end executives, actors, etc., who fly their own jets
and often do so solo or with just one passenger.

Dave Reinhart


Andrew Gideon wrote:

> Richard Russell wrote:
>
> > they're really going to build that, do ya?
>
> Is that the one where I was looking to find the hardpoints for mounting
> weapons? I liked it, but wondered at what type of business was intended.
>
> - Andrew