Tips for gluing new foam into wing dolly

[Whiskey Delta]

The foam inside my wing dolly has completely worn out and needs
replacement. I have the replacement foam and have removed all the old
foam and contact cement. The trick will be getting the new felt glued
into position. With contact cement, as soon as the two parts touch,
they are bonded.

Anyone have any pointers or suggestions as to how to best go about
getting the new foam glued into the dolly properly without making a
total mess of the thing?

Thanks for the help!

WD

[Tony[_5_]]

On Tuesday, April 10, 2012 2:29:10 PM UTC-5, Whiskey Delta wrote:
> The foam inside my wing dolly has completely worn out and needs
> replacement. I have the replacement foam and have removed all the old
> foam and contact cement. The trick will be getting the new felt glued
> into position. With contact cement, as soon as the two parts touch,
> they are bonded.
>
> Anyone have any pointers or suggestions as to how to best go about
> getting the new foam glued into the dolly properly without making a
> total mess of the thing?
>
> Thanks for the help!
>
> WD

use a plenty wide and long piece. start at one end and work slowly towards the other to keep any wrinkles from forming. trim the excess.

[Steve Koerner]

You mention both foam and felt. You also mention a wing dolly which
was Udo's trade name for his rigging tool that had felt glued to the
inside of his fiberglass saddle much as my Wing Rigger does. Assuming
that's what you are talking about, I can answer your question on how
to glue the felt in place. Could you first confirm that I would be
answering the right question though as I am confused about the mention
of foam -- I don't think there is foam on a Udo wing dolly.

[Whiskey Delta]

On Apr 10, 3:48*pm, Steve Koerner > wrote:
> You mention both foam and felt. *You also mention a wing dolly which
> was Udo's trade name for his rigging tool that had felt glued to the
> inside of his fiberglass saddle much as my Wing Rigger does. *Assuming
> that's what you are talking about, I can answer your question on how
> to glue the felt in place. * Could you first confirm that I would be
> answering the right question though as I am confused about the mention
> of foam -- I don't think there is foam on a Udo wing dolly.

My apologies. I am referring to the wing dolly used for tow out; the
wing cuff with the bicycle wheel attached. It is actually foam, not
felt.

Thanks,

WD

[Steve Koerner]

>
> My apologies. *I am referring to the wing dolly used for tow out; the
> wing cuff with the bicycle wheel attached. It is actually foam, not
> felt.
>
> Thanks,
>
> WD

OK, we usually call that item a 'wing wheel', but no big deal. I
don't have advise for gluing foam.

Anyway, its too bad that the maker's of wing wheels aren't smart
enough to use a material like wool felt that does not deteriorate
after a few years of service like foam does. I recently noticed that
a competitor in the wing assembly business also uses foam for his
saddle lining -- too bad for his customers I guess.

Steve Koerner
www.wingrigger.com

[Whiskey Delta]

On Apr 10, 4:45*pm, Steve Koerner > wrote:
> > My apologies. *I am referring to the wing dolly used for tow out; the
> > wing cuff with the bicycle wheel attached. It is actually foam, not
> > felt.
>
> > Thanks,
>
> > WD
>
> OK, we usually call that item a 'wing wheel', but no big deal. *I
> don't have advise for gluing foam.
>
> Anyway, its too bad that the maker's of wing wheels aren't smart
> enough to use a material like wool felt that does not deteriorate
> after a few years of service like foam does. *I recently noticed that
> a competitor in the wing assembly business also uses foam for his
> saddle lining -- too bad for his customers I guess.
>
> Steve Koernerwww.wingrigger.com

What advantage/disadvantage (other than durability as you mentioned
above) would felt have vs foam for the wing wheel? Does it retain
moisture longer than foam? How would you go about gluing the felt in
place? I am not opposed to putting in felt if that is preferable.

WD

[Guy Byars[_4_]]

>
> What advantage/disadvantage (other than durability as you mentioned
> above) would felt have vs foam for the wing wheel? *Does it retain
> moisture longer than foam? How would you go about gluing the felt in
> place? *I am not opposed to putting in felt if that is preferable.

Foam has a higher coeficient of friction than felt. Thus the wing
wheel is less likely to move around or slide off than with felt.

As for gluing, I would suggest gluing a small area first to set the
position, then glue another small area, then another...

[shkdriver]

You mention both foam and felt. You also mention a wing dolly which
was Udo's trade name for his rigging tool that had felt glued to the
inside of his fiberglass saddle much as my Wing Rigger does. Assuming
that's what you are talking about, I can answer your question on how
to glue the felt in place. Could you first confirm that I would be
answering the right question though as I am confused about the mention
of foam -- I don't think there is foam on a Udo wing dolly.

I have used outdoor carpet adhesive with good results on thick felt, however, F1 hard white felt is expensive and so makes mistakes pricey. the carpet adhesive is not a contact style glue and lets you do a little position adjustment. Of course a compatibility test is in order.

Good Luck.
Scott W.

[SP]

On Apr 10, 2:30*pm, Whiskey Delta > wrote:
> On Apr 10, 4:45*pm, Steve Koerner > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > > My apologies. *I am referring to the wing dolly used for tow out; the
> > > wing cuff with the bicycle wheel attached. It is actually foam, not
> > > felt.
>
> > > Thanks,
>
> > > WD
>
> > OK, we usually call that item a 'wing wheel', but no big deal. *I
> > don't have advise for gluing foam.
>
> > Anyway, its too bad that the maker's of wing wheels aren't smart
> > enough to use a material like wool felt that does not deteriorate
> > after a few years of service like foam does. *I recently noticed that
> > a competitor in the wing assembly business also uses foam for his
> > saddle lining -- too bad for his customers I guess.
>
> > Steve Koernerwww.wingrigger.com
>
> What advantage/disadvantage (other than durability as you mentioned
> above) would felt have vs foam for the wing wheel? *Does it retain
> moisture longer than foam? How would you go about gluing the felt in
> place? *I am not opposed to putting in felt if that is preferable.
>
> WD

My fuselage dolly used to have foam and moisture retention caused
brown orange peel on the gel coat. It now has felt so the moisture
issue should be resolved but the fuselage sure slips around more in
the dolly. I doubt you'll have moisture problems with a wing wheel
unless you leave it on the wing for a while. For what it's worth, my
wing wheel has indoor/outdoor carpeting on it. For gluing, Guy's
advice sounds good. Use a cheap throw away brush for the contact
cement. You can get a box of 36 1" brushes at Harbor Freight for
$7.99! Box of 36 2" brushes is $10.99.

Steve

[aerodyne]

Surprised no-one on this erudite board offered up the caulk or your
choice as an adhesive - silicoln, acrylic, poly, all will work fine
for years, better than contact cement for outdoors use. Can be
repostioned for many minutes after application, and loose areas
rebonded, as needed.

aerodyne

[Bill D]

On Apr 10, 7:47*pm, shkdriver >
wrote:
> Steve Koerner;813131 Wrote:
>
> > You mention both foam and felt. *You also mention a wing dolly which
> > was Udo's trade name for his rigging tool that had felt glued to the
> > inside of his fiberglass saddle much as my Wing Rigger does. *Assuming
> > that's what you are talking about, I can answer your question on how
> > to glue the felt in place. * Could you first confirm that I would be
> > answering the right question though as I am confused about the mention
> > of foam -- I don't think there is foam on a Udo wing dolly.
>
> I have used outdoor carpet adhesive with good results on thick felt,
> however, F1 hard white felt is expensive and so makes mistakes pricey.
> the carpet adhesive is not a contact style glue and lets you do a little
> position adjustment. Of course a compatibility test is in order.
>
> Good Luck.
> Scott W.
>
> --
> shkdriver

If you have a local industrial supplier of gasket material, "boiler
felt" or "gasket felt" is a very cheap option. I picked up more than
enough 1/4" grey felt for a trailer and rigging gadgets from the
shop's scrap barrel for about $5. The new stuff was on 10' wide rolls
like carpet.

Carpet glue, carpet tape (2-sided adhesive) or silicone caulking work
fine as glue. I chose tape just because it is less messy and allows
easier replacement in the future.

That said, the McMaster Carr felt with peel-n-stick adhesive looks to
be the best stuff if cost is no object but I wish it were available in
red to match Cobra trailers.

[Mark Mocho]

I've been manufacturing wing wheels for over ten years
(www.mmfabrication.com) and I have to say that I really don't
recommend foam at all. It dries out and crumbles as well as gathers
really abrasive grit. Felt is better but retains moistgure and takes a
long time to dry out. I prefer a good grade of marine carpet with a
rubber backing. For adhesive, I have found that construction adhesive
like Liquid Nails or DAP Beats the Nail in a caulking type tube is
cheap, easy to apply and sticks great.It also has a decent working
time so you aren't "stuck" with any mistakes.

Mark Mocho

[Chip Bearden[_2_]]

As with most "critical" decisions, there's no easy answer to the
questions raised. I've built a bunch of solo wing riggers and decided
on high-density closed-cell foam because of the higher friction: it
grips the wingtip and doesn't slide around as much...until it dries
out, that is. I discovered that leaving it out in the sun hastens this
process so now I put the device back in the trailer after I rig. The
closed cell foam doesn't seem to absorb or hold much moisture although
any moisture does reduce the coefficient of friction. The high-density
stuff compresses just enough to allow clamping the wingtip firmly
without risking dimpling the skin. With felt, you need a much closer
fit or some other way of allowing for positioning the gripping part of
the saddle in different places (inboard/outbaord on left or right
wingtips, for example). The open cell foam that came with my wing
wheel was the worst. It holds moisture, degrades, and stained the gel
coat, although it will happily install nearly anywhere in the first
few meters of either left or right wing.

Felt doesn't degrade nearly as much as foam but it doesn't compress
and absorb shock as well and it does hold moisture. It also packs down
over time under constant load (e.g., in the leading edge of a wing
support cradle).

I tried indoor/outdoor carpeting and traditional indoor carpet as
well. The indoor/outdoor stuff tended to separate from the foam
backing after a few years. And it seemed more difficult to fix all
types of carpeting in place with adhesive; the edges kept coming loose
and flopping up. My sense is that carpet is probably the worst in
terms of holding grit although I have no way of proving it. Marine
carpet might be better.

Contact cement is quick when you have easy access; when it touches,
it's done. Caulk or adhesive of various types gives you some time to
move things around but, of course, you have to keep things fixed
during set up. One suggestion: give some thought to how difficult it
will be to remove the old adhesive when it comes time to replace the
padding.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"
USA

[bumper[_4_]]

Contact cements I've used suggest both surfaces be coated and then be
allowed to dry prior to bonding. A sheet of butcher paper can be used
to separate the surfaces to be bonded. The paper is then slid out a
little at a time as the surfaces come together. If done with care,
this should make it fairly easy to avoid mistakes - - maybe.

There are weather resistant foams such as EPDM or Neoprene.

bumper