Diamond DA40-180

[lance smith]

I've been flying a Diamond Star DA40-180 for a few months now and
wanted to post my thoughts on it. I transitioned from a 172 to the
DA40 and my FOB rents out both for about the same price. However the
DA40 is much nicer: faster, more room, standard fancy electronics, and
definitely sexier (sorry high wing people). If I'm up to take pictures
I'll take the 172 but otherwise it's the Diamond. However I do have a
few bones to pick, these could continue on with the new Diamond
TwinStar too.

based on using N138DS and N440JP (guestimating 800hrs and 400hrs
respectively)

Canopy scratching: problem. The canopy gets scratched ever so slightly
every time the standard sunshade is put into place. The edge of the
shade rubs the plastic and over time the scratches build up. If the
plane is only flown once a month no one will ever notice, but at the
FBO the plane is used daily and the constant removal/replacement of
the shade is noticeable.

Tail skid: minor. Note that these planes are used at a flight school
and take a beating. There is a nice chunk of aluminum to handle the
occasional scrape but the non-structural composite skid holder has
cracks.

Window hinge: minor. The plastic hinges are glued to the canopy and
after constant usage one of hinges came off last week.

Electronics: minor. Moving from a 172R w/ older King avionics to a
plane w/
a 10 inch MFD (garmin) I about died. However fancy toys comes with a
price: complexity. I think there are 4 or 5 adjustments possible for
volume control alone (incl squelch and my headset). My first flight
with 138DS I thought that the left seat mic jacks had gone bad and I
switched over to the passenger jacks(a pain w/ PTT). I just got the
settings wrong. Granted this was a user issue, but it does increase
workload. (Note I'm trying to not let the moving map let me get lazy
with navigation : )

Pedal adjustment: minor+. Every time you jump in you have to re-adjust
the pedals. That's because the control lock bar requires you to pull
the pedals all the way back. This is just annoying, but the pedals
stuck for many people. Of course for me the pedals moved in flight
once (and scared the bejeesus out of me). Note: when adjusting the
pedals don't push on the pedals, push on the crossbar at the bottom.

Ventilation: minor. there are lots of vents for everyone and fresh air
can rushing in (good). But it's kind of noisy and all the mics seem to
pick it up. So we usually close off all the vents : (

Tow bar: minor. It just doesn't stay on the nose gear.

Canopy: minor-. If you startup with the canopy locked but not fully
closed (for ventilation while taxiing) it will shake noisily and scare
the pants off your passengers.


This is all that I can think of now. These are just my nit picks, this
is a great plane and I would recommend it to anyone (w/ a ppl. Not for
students- too easy). I just hope that some these small issues can be
remedied in the not too distant future.

-lance smith

[Jim Baker]

"lance smith" > wrote in message
om...
> I've been flying a Diamond Star DA40-180 for a few months now and
> wanted to post my thoughts on it.
<snip>

Thanks Lance, great report. Much more user friendly than the standard
magazine review.

JB

[R. Hubbell]

On 1 Dec 2003 17:59:17 -0800 (lance smith) wrote:

> I've been flying a Diamond Star DA40-180 for a few months now and
> wanted to post my thoughts on it. I transitioned from a 172 to the
> DA40 and my FOB rents out both for about the same price. However the
> DA40 is much nicer: faster, more room, standard fancy electronics, and
> definitely sexier (sorry high wing people). If I'm up to take pictures

I've always been interested in these planes. Do they offer a diesel model
yet? How are they on rough field operations?


Thanks for the report, I hope you send a copy to Diamond and I hope they
are smart enought to listen.


R. Hubbell



> I'll take the 172 but otherwise it's the Diamond. However I do have a
> few bones to pick, these could continue on with the new Diamond
> TwinStar too.
>
> based on using N138DS and N440JP (guestimating 800hrs and 400hrs
> respectively)
>
> Canopy scratching: problem. The canopy gets scratched ever so slightly
> every time the standard sunshade is put into place. The edge of the
> shade rubs the plastic and over time the scratches build up. If the
> plane is only flown once a month no one will ever notice, but at the
> FBO the plane is used daily and the constant removal/replacement of
> the shade is noticeable.
>
> Tail skid: minor. Note that these planes are used at a flight school
> and take a beating. There is a nice chunk of aluminum to handle the
> occasional scrape but the non-structural composite skid holder has
> cracks.
>
> Window hinge: minor. The plastic hinges are glued to the canopy and
> after constant usage one of hinges came off last week.
>
> Electronics: minor. Moving from a 172R w/ older King avionics to a
> plane w/
> a 10 inch MFD (garmin) I about died. However fancy toys comes with a
> price: complexity. I think there are 4 or 5 adjustments possible for
> volume control alone (incl squelch and my headset). My first flight
> with 138DS I thought that the left seat mic jacks had gone bad and I
> switched over to the passenger jacks(a pain w/ PTT). I just got the
> settings wrong. Granted this was a user issue, but it does increase
> workload. (Note I'm trying to not let the moving map let me get lazy
> with navigation : )
>
> Pedal adjustment: minor+. Every time you jump in you have to re-adjust
> the pedals. That's because the control lock bar requires you to pull
> the pedals all the way back. This is just annoying, but the pedals
> stuck for many people. Of course for me the pedals moved in flight
> once (and scared the bejeesus out of me). Note: when adjusting the
> pedals don't push on the pedals, push on the crossbar at the bottom.
>
> Ventilation: minor. there are lots of vents for everyone and fresh air
> can rushing in (good). But it's kind of noisy and all the mics seem to
> pick it up. So we usually close off all the vents : (
>
> Tow bar: minor. It just doesn't stay on the nose gear.
>
> Canopy: minor-. If you startup with the canopy locked but not fully
> closed (for ventilation while taxiing) it will shake noisily and scare
> the pants off your passengers.
>
>
> This is all that I can think of now. These are just my nit picks, this
> is a great plane and I would recommend it to anyone (w/ a ppl. Not for
> students- too easy). I just hope that some these small issues can be
> remedied in the not too distant future.
>
> -lance smith

[sdfg]

The tow bar comes out if it was never properly installed. Make sure you
have the end of the tow bar handle lower than the part of the tow bar
that attaches to the plane, this enables you to fully insert the tow bar
into the nosegear holes.


(lance smith) wrote in
om:

> I've been flying a Diamond Star DA40-180 for a few months now and
> wanted to post my thoughts on it. I transitioned from a 172 to the
> DA40 and my FOB rents out both for about the same price. However the
> DA40 is much nicer: faster, more room, standard fancy electronics, and
> definitely sexier (sorry high wing people). If I'm up to take pictures
> I'll take the 172 but otherwise it's the Diamond. However I do have a
> few bones to pick, these could continue on with the new Diamond
> TwinStar too.
>
> based on using N138DS and N440JP (guestimating 800hrs and 400hrs
> respectively)
>
> Canopy scratching: problem. The canopy gets scratched ever so slightly
> every time the standard sunshade is put into place. The edge of the
> shade rubs the plastic and over time the scratches build up. If the
> plane is only flown once a month no one will ever notice, but at the
> FBO the plane is used daily and the constant removal/replacement of
> the shade is noticeable.
>
> Tail skid: minor. Note that these planes are used at a flight school
> and take a beating. There is a nice chunk of aluminum to handle the
> occasional scrape but the non-structural composite skid holder has
> cracks.
>
> Window hinge: minor. The plastic hinges are glued to the canopy and
> after constant usage one of hinges came off last week.
>
> Electronics: minor. Moving from a 172R w/ older King avionics to a
> plane w/
> a 10 inch MFD (garmin) I about died. However fancy toys comes with a
> price: complexity. I think there are 4 or 5 adjustments possible for
> volume control alone (incl squelch and my headset). My first flight
> with 138DS I thought that the left seat mic jacks had gone bad and I
> switched over to the passenger jacks(a pain w/ PTT). I just got the
> settings wrong. Granted this was a user issue, but it does increase
> workload. (Note I'm trying to not let the moving map let me get lazy
> with navigation : )
>
> Pedal adjustment: minor+. Every time you jump in you have to re-adjust
> the pedals. That's because the control lock bar requires you to pull
> the pedals all the way back. This is just annoying, but the pedals
> stuck for many people. Of course for me the pedals moved in flight
> once (and scared the bejeesus out of me). Note: when adjusting the
> pedals don't push on the pedals, push on the crossbar at the bottom.
>
> Ventilation: minor. there are lots of vents for everyone and fresh air
> can rushing in (good). But it's kind of noisy and all the mics seem to
> pick it up. So we usually close off all the vents : (
>
> Tow bar: minor. It just doesn't stay on the nose gear.
>
> Canopy: minor-. If you startup with the canopy locked but not fully
> closed (for ventilation while taxiing) it will shake noisily and scare
> the pants off your passengers.
>
>
> This is all that I can think of now. These are just my nit picks, this
> is a great plane and I would recommend it to anyone (w/ a ppl. Not for
> students- too easy). I just hope that some these small issues can be
> remedied in the not too distant future.
>
> -lance smith

[Thomas Borchert]

R.,

> Do they offer a diesel model
> yet? How are they on rough field operations?
>

In Europe, the Diesel is available. They want the engine tested here
before going to the US. Grass fields here don't seem to be much of a
problem.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[R. Hubbell]

On Wed, 03 Dec 2003 09:42:04 +0100 Thomas Borchert > wrote:

> R.,
>
> > Do they offer a diesel model
> > yet? How are they on rough field operations?
> >
>
> In Europe, the Diesel is available. They want the engine tested here
> before going to the US. Grass fields here don't seem to be much of a
> problem.


Good to know. Looking forward to trying one of these out.

R. Hubbell

>
> --
> Thomas Borchert (EDDH)
>

[Mike Schumann]

I sent Diamond an e-mail about this a month or so ago. They told me that
they are focusing on getting the Twin-Star out first, and will then evaluate
whether or not to move ahead with the introduction of the diesel on the
DA-40 in North America.

Mike Schumann

"R. Hubbell" > wrote in message
news:8m3zb.17496$ZE1.11368@fed1read04...
> On 1 Dec 2003 17:59:17 -0800 (lance smith) wrote:
>
> > I've been flying a Diamond Star DA40-180 for a few months now and
> > wanted to post my thoughts on it. I transitioned from a 172 to the
> > DA40 and my FOB rents out both for about the same price. However the
> > DA40 is much nicer: faster, more room, standard fancy electronics, and
> > definitely sexier (sorry high wing people). If I'm up to take pictures
>
> I've always been interested in these planes. Do they offer a diesel model
> yet? How are they on rough field operations?
>
>
> Thanks for the report, I hope you send a copy to Diamond and I hope they
> are smart enought to listen.
>
>
> R. Hubbell
>
>
>
> > I'll take the 172 but otherwise it's the Diamond. However I do have a
> > few bones to pick, these could continue on with the new Diamond
> > TwinStar too.
> >
> > based on using N138DS and N440JP (guestimating 800hrs and 400hrs
> > respectively)
> >
> > Canopy scratching: problem. The canopy gets scratched ever so slightly
> > every time the standard sunshade is put into place. The edge of the
> > shade rubs the plastic and over time the scratches build up. If the
> > plane is only flown once a month no one will ever notice, but at the
> > FBO the plane is used daily and the constant removal/replacement of
> > the shade is noticeable.
> >
> > Tail skid: minor. Note that these planes are used at a flight school
> > and take a beating. There is a nice chunk of aluminum to handle the
> > occasional scrape but the non-structural composite skid holder has
> > cracks.
> >
> > Window hinge: minor. The plastic hinges are glued to the canopy and
> > after constant usage one of hinges came off last week.
> >
> > Electronics: minor. Moving from a 172R w/ older King avionics to a
> > plane w/
> > a 10 inch MFD (garmin) I about died. However fancy toys comes with a
> > price: complexity. I think there are 4 or 5 adjustments possible for
> > volume control alone (incl squelch and my headset). My first flight
> > with 138DS I thought that the left seat mic jacks had gone bad and I
> > switched over to the passenger jacks(a pain w/ PTT). I just got the
> > settings wrong. Granted this was a user issue, but it does increase
> > workload. (Note I'm trying to not let the moving map let me get lazy
> > with navigation : )
> >
> > Pedal adjustment: minor+. Every time you jump in you have to re-adjust
> > the pedals. That's because the control lock bar requires you to pull
> > the pedals all the way back. This is just annoying, but the pedals
> > stuck for many people. Of course for me the pedals moved in flight
> > once (and scared the bejeesus out of me). Note: when adjusting the
> > pedals don't push on the pedals, push on the crossbar at the bottom.
> >
> > Ventilation: minor. there are lots of vents for everyone and fresh air
> > can rushing in (good). But it's kind of noisy and all the mics seem to
> > pick it up. So we usually close off all the vents : (
> >
> > Tow bar: minor. It just doesn't stay on the nose gear.
> >
> > Canopy: minor-. If you startup with the canopy locked but not fully
> > closed (for ventilation while taxiing) it will shake noisily and scare
> > the pants off your passengers.
> >
> >
> > This is all that I can think of now. These are just my nit picks, this
> > is a great plane and I would recommend it to anyone (w/ a ppl. Not for
> > students- too easy). I just hope that some these small issues can be
> > remedied in the not too distant future.
> >
> > -lance smith

[Thomas Borchert]

Mike,

> and will then evaluate
> whether or not to move ahead with the introduction of the diesel on the
> DA-40 in North America.
>

and consider the "success" they had with introducing a new engine in the
US on the Katana. They've definitely been bitten before.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

[Dylan Smith]

In article >, Thomas Borchert wrote:
> and consider the "success" they had with introducing a new engine in the
> US on the Katana. They've definitely been bitten before.

You can also understand their push for the diesel models in Europe
but without the strong push for diesels in the US. Jet-A is dramatically
cheaper in Europe compared to avgas (at my local airport, less than
1/3rd of the price of avgas), but in the US, Jet-A and avgas are around
the same price. Of course, the diesel DA-40 is a bit more economical in
fuel burn, but it just doesn't have the dramatic effect on operating
costs like it does in Europe, so a better business strategy in a very
conservative market is to start out with what the market will be
comfortable with and buy (you only have to look at some of the threads
around here to realise that many are uncomfortable with the 'innovation'
of composite construction - add diesel to it and they'll definitely run
screaming). Of course, over time, attitudes will change.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

[Thomas Borchert]

Dylan,

> you only have to look at some of the threads
> around here to realise that many are uncomfortable with the 'innovation'
> of composite construction - add diesel to it and they'll definitely run
> screaming). Of course, over time, attitudes will change.
>

I fully agree. I find it very amusing that people report on all those
expensive top overhauls for their Lycs and TCMs, but then they also
badmouth the new diesels with their until-TBO-warranties and such.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)