Bonanza V35B partnership opportunity

[Peter R.]

I have been contacted by the manager of our local flight school about the
opportunity to partner with an owner of a Bonanza V35B. Apparently, the
owner is looking to purchase a helicopter and would like to ensure the V35
sees regular flying as well as offset some of the costs of the aircraft.

His V35B sounds very nice. New paint and interior, all new avionics
including Garmin GPS/moving map, TKS weeping wing anti-ice, oxygen system,
and turbo-normalized engine that cruises around 195 kts at 16 gph up in the
flight levels, to name a few. With the amount of x/c flying I do, this
aircraft would fit my current mission much more closely than the 172.

I was curious about the flying characteristics of the aircraft from those
of you with experience in Bonanzas. Currently I have about 550 hours and
an instrument rating, all in a C172. Obviously this jump would require
several hours of instruction time to become proficient in its new-to-me
systems, such as landing gear, constant speed prop, turbo, etc.

Does the V-tail handle much differently (besides increased speed) than a
traditional tail configuration? How about loading? Easy to overload aft
of CG? I expect it to be a big jump, but several, including the flight
school manager, believe that I am ready. I would be lying if I didn't
admit to some anxiety about leaving the comfort of my C172. :)

I am currently reading AOPA's partnership guidelines to understand the
logistical and legal aspects of partnerships, so at this point I am more
interested in other's experiences with the aircraft itself.

--
Peter












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[EDR]

In article >, Peter
R. > wrote:

> I was curious about the flying characteristics of the aircraft from those
> of you with experience in Bonanzas. Currently I have about 550 hours and
> an instrument rating, all in a C172. Obviously this jump would require
> several hours of instruction time to become proficient in its new-to-me
> systems, such as landing gear, constant speed prop, turbo, etc.

Join the American Bonanza Society and take their classes

> Does the V-tail handle much differently (besides increased speed) than a
> traditional tail configuration? How about loading? Easy to overload aft
> of CG? I expect it to be a big jump, but several, including the flight
> school manager, believe that I am ready. I would be lying if I didn't
> admit to some anxiety about leaving the comfort of my C172. :)

They have a distinctive "wiggle" that some people find annoying. But,
as a friend of mine says, "If you don't like the way my airplane flies,
you don't have to ride in it."

CG MOVES AFT WITH FUEL BURN!!! Pay very close attention to your
loading. ALWAYS calculate takeoff and LANDING CGs!!!

The Bonanza is a slippery (read "clean") airframe. It will pick up
speed quickly if you are not paying attention, possibly getting you
high into the yellow or even the red arcs before you notice it.

A walk around will impress you with how well they are built, but that
is no excuse for a lax attitude.

> I am currently reading AOPA's partnership guidelines to understand the
> logistical and legal aspects of partnerships, so at this point I am more
> interested in other's experiences with the aircraft itself.

Be sure to download the Aviation Safety Foundation's Bonanza report
from the AOPA website. Lots of good information in it.

Bonanza's are great airplanes to fly. But you really have to respect
them. Have fun!

[Peter R.]

EDR ) wrote:

> Join the American Bonanza Society and take their classes

Will look into this.

> They have a distinctive "wiggle" that some people find annoying. But,
> as a friend of mine says, "If you don't like the way my airplane flies,
> you don't have to ride in it."

Interesting. Is this due to the lack of a true vertical stabilizer?

> CG MOVES AFT WITH FUEL BURN!!! Pay very close attention to your
> loading. ALWAYS calculate takeoff and LANDING CGs!!!

Good to know!

> The Bonanza is a slippery (read "clean") airframe. It will pick up
> speed quickly if you are not paying attention, possibly getting you
> high into the yellow or even the red arcs before you notice it.

Yes, the owner also mentioned this issue. This does concern me a bit,
given my low level of experience and once-in-a-while tendency to fixate
when I scan. I will certainly work with the instructor on hand flying in
IMC and I expect that I won't be on my own in IMC for several tens of
hours.

Is it even possible to practice downward unusual attitudes with this
aircraft?

> A walk around will impress you with how well they are built, but that
> is no excuse for a lax attitude.

No lax attitude here! :) I have a long road ahead, but it should be fun,
too.

> Be sure to download the Aviation Safety Foundation's Bonanza report
> from the AOPA website. Lots of good information in it.

I was unaware of this report. Thanks.

--
Peter












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[Peter R.]

Nomen Nescio ]) wrote:

<snip>
> You could really do those Angel Flights with style in a Bonanza.

Thanks for the information. The AF missions would be a lot faster, that's
for sure. But, the downside is that I will log less hours per year if I
do make the jump! :)

--
Peter












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[EDR]

In article >, Peter
R. > wrote:

> > The Bonanza is a slippery (read "clean") airframe. It will pick up
> > speed quickly if you are not paying attention, possibly getting you
> > high into the yellow or even the red arcs before you notice it.
>
> Yes, the owner also mentioned this issue. This does concern me a bit,
> given my low level of experience and once-in-a-while tendency to fixate
> when I scan. I will certainly work with the instructor on hand flying in
> IMC and I expect that I won't be on my own in IMC for several tens of
> hours.
>
> Is it even possible to practice downward unusual attitudes with this
> aircraft?

Slow down before you begin the maneuver.
Putting the gear down is another method to keep the airspeed from
building quickly.
The Bonanza has a high Vge. Depending on the model, it can be as high
as high as 135 kts.

[Robert M. Gary]

Peter R. > wrote in message >...
> Is it even possible to practice downward unusual attitudes with this
> aircraft?

Yes. With the gear and flaps out a Bonanza flys like a barn door.
Flying into a busy class C airport I used to fly final fast and then
drop the gear and flaps. You almost hit the panel the plane slows down
so damn fast. Add to that the Bonanza has a VERY high gear speed.

Just don't try that in a Mooney. You'll end up floating into the next
state.

The first thing you'll notice in the Bonanza is when you're CFI says
to "climb to 2000 feet" you'll probably hit 3000 before you stop the
climb. A big part of transitioning to a high performance aircraft is
getting used to the fact that as you level off, the plane accelerates,
and wants to climb. Triming for cruise in a Mooney or Bonanza can take
up to 5 minutes as the plane continues to accelerate in the cruise.
After some dual in the plane it will all be automatic. You'll want to
memorize what MP/RPM to use for different speeds before flying IFR so
you have better control.

-Robert

[Goldenam]

A V35B is a great airplane. I fly an A36 but have some time in a V tail. First,
before you buy into this plane, check with the insurance people to see if they
will even insure you. You have plenty of hours, but no time in type, so that
may be an issue. There may be a requirement for some formal training from a
recognized organization (Bonanza Pilot Proficiency Program, Flight Safety etc.)
before they will insure you as well as some hours in type. Check out the
American Bonanza Society (they have a good web site) for additional information
and training programs.

Pick up a copy of "Flying the Beach Bonanza" by Eckalbar. It is a great book
with all sorts of information on what it is like to fly a bonanza and how to
fly one.

Unlike the C172 you normally fly, the Bonanza is a "fly by the numbers"
airplane. Someone in one of the replies mentioned tables of MP/RPM. That is the
way you fly a bonanza. I would add flap and gear configuration to the table
also. If you get good training from someone who really knows Bonanzas, that is
how they will show you how to fly it. Again, the Bonanza Pilot Proficiency
Program can recomend an instructor in your area.

I currently co own my airplane, so feel free to e-mail me and I would be glad
to give you any information you might want on the ups and downs of partnership.

Bonanzas are fantastic airplanes, but they do demand a bit more of the pilot
than a less complex aircraft. Good luck

Alan
Bonanza N5081E

[Peter R.]

Goldenam ) wrote:

<snip>
> I currently co own my airplane, so feel free to e-mail me and I would be
> glad to give you any information you might want on the ups and downs of
> partnership.

Alan, thank you for all of your advice. I might take you up on that email
exchange over the next few months, assuming I partner in this aircraft. :)

--
Peter












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[Peter R.]

Robert M. Gary ) wrote:

> Yes. With the gear and flaps out a Bonanza flys like a barn door.
> Flying into a busy class C airport I used to fly final fast and then
> drop the gear and flaps. You almost hit the panel the plane slows down
> so damn fast. Add to that the Bonanza has a VERY high gear speed.

I rode along with the owner of the V35 this past Saturday. Unfortunately
it was such a cold day (-29c aloft and at destination) that the owner had
to alter his normal operating procedures with cowl flaps and leaning
techniques.

Anyway, he also mentioned the same point you made; namely that he will fly
a fast approach and slow it right down on short final.

> Just don't try that in a Mooney. You'll end up floating into the next
> state.

LOL! The owner of the v35B also used to fly a Mooney and said the same
thing. Is your first name really Robert? :)

> The first thing you'll notice in the Bonanza is when you're CFI says
> to "climb to 2000 feet" you'll probably hit 3000 before you stop the
> climb.

As I indicated above, it was very cold so performance on Saturday's flight
was excellent. I glanced over at the VSI while we were climbing to our
cruise altitude and noted a slightly higher than 500 fpm climb rate. I
thought to myself that this rate seemed anemic for such a cold day and much
more powerful aircraft. I then looked back and realized my mistake.

In the C172, the needle indicating a 500 fpm climb rate on its VSI is in
the same position as the 1,000 fpm rate on the V35's VSI. I saw the
position of the needle and compared it to my mental image of the C172's
VSI. :)

We were actually climbing out around 1,100 fpm, although the owner was able
to squeeze even more climb rate out of the aircraft due to the cold.
Impressive.



--
Peter












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