Hang Gliding Record Distance Flight Story

[John Carlyle]

Very good read about Dustin Martin beating Jonny Durand during a 475 mile hang gliding world distance record, with Gary Osoba providing the day's forecast.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/13/sports/two-men-one-sky-the-silent-realization-of-a-purer-form-of-flight.html?hp&_r=0&pagewanted=all

-John, Q3

[[email protected]]

On Saturday, January 12, 2013 4:51:46 PM UTC-5, John Carlyle wrote:
> Very good read about Dustin Martin beating Jonny Durand during a 475 mile hang gliding world distance record, with Gary Osoba providing the day's forecast.
>
> http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/13/sports/two-men-one-sky-the-silent-realization-of-a-purer-form-of-flight.html?hp&_r=0&pagewanted=all
>
>
>
> -John, Q3

Great story and a great writer. Why aren't we attracting sponsors like these guys? Good for them.

[Tony[_5_]]

I tried to get red bull to sponsor me in 2007 for the region 7 contest but they told me that they didn't do local sponsors his of pilots. Guess I should've tried to fly in a nationals!

[Sean F (F2)]

Sponsors? Because we don't try...

[Bob]

On Jan 12, 2:51*pm, John Carlyle > wrote:
> Very good read about Dustin Martin beating Jonny Durand during a 475 mile hang gliding world distance record, with Gary Osoba providing the day's forecast.http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/13/sports/two-men-one-sky-the-silent-r...
>
> -John, Q3

It was a rainy day in Durango, CO, where I was, and I happened to be
reading the RAS when a note was posted that Dustin and Johnny were on
the epic flight and could be watched on SPOT. I immediately clicked
on and was spellbound for the rest of the aftgernoon. Thankfully, no
lightning, so I could leave the computer on. It was a very exciting
afternoon for me, watching their progress, and Dustin's final glide
that was absolutely parallel to the wind (I was flipping back and
forth from the SPOT page to the wind page http://hint.fm/wind/ to
see how they were progressing). 25 years earlier, to the day, Hans
and I had a similar day, landing in Cortez, CO for 218 miles on our
Wills Wings from Mt. Elden in Flagstaff, AZ. Watching another Arizona
Hang Gliding Association (now also includes paragliding) pilot set the
world record was the highlight of my summer. It couldn't have
happened to a nicer guy / more incredible pilot. Atta boy, Dustin!
And, a VERY nice article for a non-gliding publication. Well done.
And, it brought back a lot of fond memories for me.
Bob
19

[John Carlyle]

Is Dustin's flight recorder trace for his world record flight available on the web? I checked on OLC-PHG under Best Flight, but Dustin's 475 mile flight is not there. Strange, because his 335 k flight on May 12, 2012 is listed.

-John, Q3

[Mike the Strike]

As an ex hang-glider pilot, I also thought that the story was well researched and nicely written, without the usual inaccuracies.

One interesting note - the article says that pilots had to land before half-an-hour after sunset for the record to be valid. Is this true and, if so, why do they get half-an-hour longer than glider pilots?

Mike

[Bob]

On Jan 13, 8:59*am, Mike the Strike > wrote:
> As an ex hang-glider pilot, I also thought that the story was well researched and nicely written, without the usual inaccuracies.
>
> One interesting note - the article says that pilots had to land before half-an-hour after sunset for the record to be valid. *Is this true and, if so, why do they get half-an-hour longer than glider pilots?
>
> Mike

They carried strobe lights for just that purpose. We need to look
into that to see if such an addition to gliders could give us the
extra 1/2 hour.

Bob

[Werner Schmidt]

Hello Bob, you wrote at 01 Jan 2013 17:26:

> On Jan 13, 8:59 am, Mike the Strike > wrote:
>> As an ex hang-glider pilot, I also thought that the story was well researched and nicely written, without the usual inaccuracies.
>>
>> One interesting note - the article says that pilots had to land before half-an-hour after sunset for the record to be valid. Is this true and, if so, why do they get half-an-hour longer than glider pilots?
>>
>> Mike
>
> They carried strobe lights for just that purpose. We need to look
> into that to see if such an addition to gliders could give us the
> extra 1/2 hour.

AFAIK, use of position lights allows this (at least over here in Germany).

regards
Werner

[Martin Gregorie[_5_]]

On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 07:59:41 -0800, Mike the Strike wrote:

> As an ex hang-glider pilot, I also thought that the story was well
> researched and nicely written, without the usual inaccuracies.
>
> One interesting note - the article says that pilots had to land before
> half-an-hour after sunset for the record to be valid. Is this true and,
> if so, why do they get half-an-hour longer than glider pilots?
>

In the UK, anyway, a glider flight must take place during the day, i.e.
may not start or finish at night. The following definitions apply:

night ends 1/2 hour before astronomical sunrise
night starts 1/2 hour after astronomical sunset

....where astronomical sunrise and sunset must be calculated for a
specific lat/lon and day of the year. IIRC for the purposes of this
calculation the world is assumed to be a perfect ovoid, i.e. the effect
of nearby mountains between the sun and the required location is not
taken into account.

As this is an aviation definition of the start and end of night time, I'd
assume the same calculation is used in the USA.

This is why the article talked about the need to land before sunset + 30
minutes.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[Mike the Strike]

On Sunday, January 13, 2013 11:04:43 AM UTC-7, Martin Gregorie wrote:
> On Sun, 13 Jan 2013 07:59:41 -0800, Mike the Strike wrote:
>
>
>
> > As an ex hang-glider pilot, I also thought that the story was well
>
> > researched and nicely written, without the usual inaccuracies.
>
> >
>
> > One interesting note - the article says that pilots had to land before
>
> > half-an-hour after sunset for the record to be valid. Is this true and,
>
> > if so, why do they get half-an-hour longer than glider pilots?
>
> >
>
>
>
> In the UK, anyway, a glider flight must take place during the day, i.e.
>
> may not start or finish at night. The following definitions apply:
>
>
>
> night ends 1/2 hour before astronomical sunrise
>
> night starts 1/2 hour after astronomical sunset
>
>
>
> ...where astronomical sunrise and sunset must be calculated for a
>
> specific lat/lon and day of the year. IIRC for the purposes of this
>
> calculation the world is assumed to be a perfect ovoid, i.e. the effect
>
> of nearby mountains between the sun and the required location is not
>
> taken into account.
>
>
>
> As this is an aviation definition of the start and end of night time, I'd
>
> assume the same calculation is used in the USA.
>
>
>
> This is why the article talked about the need to land before sunset + 30
>
> minutes.
>

Out here in the US west, we are limited by the available daylight in summer and are very annoyed by the requirement to terminate flights by sunset - a typical requirement in sanctioned contests and also used by OLC.

We have attempted several times to address this issue, but no success so far. The problem appears to be several inconsistent regulations pertaining to definitions of night in the Federal Aviation Regulations.

I believe that the main problem is that aircraft are required to carry lights after sunset and, since most gliders don't have lights, flight after sunset is considered illegal. I assume that carrying a strobe permits hang-gliders to circumnavigate this requirement?

Mike

[[email protected]]

On Saturday, January 12, 2013 8:02:54 PM UTC-8, Sean F (F2) wrote:
> Sponsors? Because we don't try...

Sean,

Many of us have done lots of trying. BHP shipped 8 US gliders to New Zealand and back for no charge for the 1995 WGC. I now use BHP steel products in my building projects. Network General ( now McAfee) wrote a check for $2500 for my expenses the same year. Peter Deane received a very large donation for his participation in Slovakia in 2010.

Richard Walters
US Team Committee

[[email protected]]

On Monday, January 14, 2013 12:31:29 AM UTC-5, wrote:
> On Saturday, January 12, 2013 8:02:54 PM UTC-8, Sean F (F2) wrote: > Sponsors? Because we don't try... Sean, Many of us have done lots of trying. BHP shipped 8 US gliders to New Zealand and back for no charge for the 1995 WGC. I now use BHP steel products in my building projects. Network General ( now McAfee) wrote a check for $2500 for my expenses the same year. Peter Deane received a very large donation for his participation in Slovakia in 2010. Richard Walters US Team Committee

And a few others:
The 2001 Club class team was completely sponsored and had a surplus of a few thousand dollars.
The over spending at the Last French WGC was paid off by a sponsor.
One sponsor donated about $75K to help fund the WGC in Uvalde.
That same sponsor contributed a significant amount to the USTC specifically to support the Club Class team and the Junior team.
This generous individual has quietly donated over a quarter of a million dollars to US competition over the last dozen years or so.
This started by asking for a bit of help.
UH

[[email protected]]

These contributions are fantastic and it appears they are doing it for the love of the sport. When you view WGC events it stands out that the US is unique in not carrying sponsor logos on the fuselages. Is this a market we are not pursuing?

Lane

[[email protected]]

On Monday, January 14, 2013 7:02:27 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> These contributions are fantastic and it appears they are doing it for the love of the sport. When you view WGC events it stands out that the US is unique in not carrying sponsor logos on the fuselages. Is this a market we are not pursuing?
>
>
>
> Lane

Lane
My Discus wore a Network General billboard on the fuselage in 1995. More common is a sign on the trailer- less drag and more exposure.

Richard Walters

[Bob]

On Jan 12, 2:51*pm, John Carlyle > wrote:
> Very good read about Dustin Martin beating Jonny Durand during a 475 mile hang gliding world distance record, with Gary Osoba providing the day's forecast.http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/13/sports/two-men-one-sky-the-silent-r...
>
> -John, Q3

Two more comments on this thread. 1) I am often amazed how one story
gets hijacked into something else. The thread went from celebrating a
good article about hang gliding in a non-flying publication to a
discussion of how to fly past sunset. 2) more importantly - For those
who just read the article on the web and didn't get to see it in
actual print - you REALLY missed the impressiveness of this article!
A friend of mine who reads the New York Times sent me a the section of
the paper with the article... the Sports Section. The story occupies
the majority of 5 full pages, including the front page. Page 1 has a
full half page color aerial photo, which really gets your attention.
The center section page has a full 2 -page wide color aerial photo
that fills the top 1/2 of the pages. There are 9 color photos in this
spread and 10 well-done drawings that show much about the flight and
how hang gliders work, including a full 2-page wide barograph trace of
both pilots' flights. Plus, the whole story is VERY well done and
VERY complimentary about the sport of hang gliding.

The sport of soaring would do well if we could convince this author to
do a story on Dick Butler, his Concordia, and the World Meet in
Uvalde.

Bob
19