"Bad" CAI302 Display

[Dan Marotta]

Well, I seem to have one. The polarization looks like it's about 45 degrees
off horizontal and, since I bought Eagle Eyes sunglasses specifically for
soaring, I'm disappointed that I can't see the 302 with the glasses on.

So I hit on a crazy scheme... Since Cambridge is no longer with us, I'm
thinking of simply drilling new screw holes in my panel rotated by the
required amount, which I'll measure with the instrument out of the panel.
It'll look a little strange, but I'm pretty sure it won't take long for my
feeble brain to accomodate to the rotation.

Of course, before I start drilling, I'd gladly consider any other ideas.
The glasses are terrific for soaring, but I'm not terribly fond of them
outside the cockpit. Don't like the brown tint to everything.

[[email protected]]

Surely there is someone out there, maybe who ever is servicing 302's these days, can rotate your lens 90 degrees!

Regards,
-DW






On Monday, September 16, 2013 4:01:37 PM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
> Well, I seem to have one. The polarization looks like it's about 45 degrees
>
> off horizontal and, since I bought Eagle Eyes sunglasses specifically for
>
> soaring, I'm disappointed that I can't see the 302 with the glasses on.
>
>
>
> So I hit on a crazy scheme... Since Cambridge is no longer with us, I'm
>
> thinking of simply drilling new screw holes in my panel rotated by the
>
> required amount, which I'll measure with the instrument out of the panel.
>
> It'll look a little strange, but I'm pretty sure it won't take long for my
>
> feeble brain to accomodate to the rotation.
>
>
>
> Of course, before I start drilling, I'd gladly consider any other ideas.
>
> The glasses are terrific for soaring, but I'm not terribly fond of them
>
> outside the cockpit. Don't like the brown tint to everything.

[[email protected]]

On Monday, September 16, 2013 4:01:37 PM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
> Well, I seem to have one. The polarization looks like it's about 45 degrees
>
> off horizontal and, since I bought Eagle Eyes sunglasses specifically for
>
> soaring, I'm disappointed that I can't see the 302 with the glasses on.
>
>
>
> So I hit on a crazy scheme... Since Cambridge is no longer with us, I'm
>
> thinking of simply drilling new screw holes in my panel rotated by the
>
> required amount, which I'll measure with the instrument out of the panel.
>
> It'll look a little strange, but I'm pretty sure it won't take long for my
>
> feeble brain to accomodate to the rotation.
>
>
>
> Of course, before I start drilling, I'd gladly consider any other ideas.
>
> The glasses are terrific for soaring, but I'm not terribly fond of them
>
> outside the cockpit. Don't like the brown tint to everything.

[Doug Mueller]

Dan how difficult is it to take the case apart and rotate the
glass 90 degrees? That is all that is necessary. D

[Ramy]

On Monday, September 16, 2013 1:01:37 PM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
> Well, I seem to have one. The polarization looks like it's about 45 degrees
>
> off horizontal and, since I bought Eagle Eyes sunglasses specifically for
>
> soaring, I'm disappointed that I can't see the 302 with the glasses on.
>
>
>
> So I hit on a crazy scheme... Since Cambridge is no longer with us, I'm
>
> thinking of simply drilling new screw holes in my panel rotated by the
>
> required amount, which I'll measure with the instrument out of the panel.
>
> It'll look a little strange, but I'm pretty sure it won't take long for my
>
> feeble brain to accomodate to the rotation.
>
>
>
> Of course, before I start drilling, I'd gladly consider any other ideas.
>
> The glasses are terrific for soaring, but I'm not terribly fond of them
>
> outside the cockpit. Don't like the brown tint to everything.

A friend got his 302 repaired just few weeks ago by Gary Kammerer.

Ramy

[KiloKilo[_2_]]

http://clearnav.net/main/cn-service.html

[Dan Marotta]

Well, calling Gary *would* be the elegant solution but I thought he wasn't
working on CAI instruments any more. I can call...

As to simply rotating the glass - that was my initial thought so I asked
Paul at Cumulus Soaring. He thought the problem was with the actual LCD and
not the front glass. So I started thinking about it... Having no direct
knowledge of LCD construction other than at the highest level, I believe
there's a back layer which contains the electronics, a layer of the liquid
crystal, probably a transparent layer in front of that with whatever
circuitry is necessary to complete the electric fields to change the state
of the crystal, and a front layer, which may be polarized. There may be
other layers which I don't think matter to this discussion.

If it's the front layer of the sandwich, then it was incorrectly applied
during manufacture and there's no fixing it. If, on the other hand, my
imaginings are wrong and it *is* the front glass, then that should be easily
rotated. Then the only problem is the possible violation of the electronic
seal.

Isn't this fun?


"KiloKilo" > wrote in message
...
> http://clearnav.net/main/cn-service.html

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

Are you sure height and width of the display are the same? If not, no dice for taking it apart and rotating the glass.

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

Dan Marotta wrote, On 9/17/2013 8:42 AM:
> Well, calling Gary *would* be the elegant solution but I thought he
> wasn't working on CAI instruments any more. I can call...
>
> As to simply rotating the glass - that was my initial thought so I asked
> Paul at Cumulus Soaring. He thought the problem was with the actual LCD
> and not the front glass. So I started thinking about it... Having no
> direct knowledge of LCD construction other than at the highest level, I
> believe there's a back layer which contains the electronics, a layer of
> the liquid crystal, probably a transparent layer in front of that with
> whatever circuitry is necessary to complete the electric fields to
> change the state of the crystal, and a front layer, which may be
> polarized. There may be other layers which I don't think matter to this
> discussion.
>
> If it's the front layer of the sandwich, then it was incorrectly applied
> during manufacture and there's no fixing it. If, on the other hand, my
> imaginings are wrong and it *is* the front glass, then that should be
> easily rotated. Then the only problem is the possible violation of the
> electronic seal.

I don't think it's the front glass, as I can see the needle clearly
through my polarized glasses, but not the LCD.

The 302 isn't my only problem, but also the Butterfly display for
PowerFlarm, and the ClearNav display to some extent. The Becker
transponder display and the MGL radio display are not affected,
regardless of the sunglasses orientation, so they must use a different
kind of LCD.

I've dealt with the problem by punching holes in the polarized clip-ons
that I use with my prescription glasses. The holes are located low on
the clip-ons so I can see the panel while I'm looking outside. The
oblong holes are about 0.3" high and 0.4" long. Besides solving the LCD
problem, the lack of tinting makes it easier to read the instruments and
flight computer in any lighting, but especially dim light.

And, yes, I do look a little strange when wandering around the airport
with holes in my sunglasses, but it's a small price to pay for being
able to see!

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm
http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

[StaPo]

hmmm,
and what about to ask your neighbour optician
to rotate the lenses in your glasses
instead of rotating the 302?
Supposing it should be cheaper...

[[email protected]]

Dan:

There's a much easier way that drilling new holes. Fly the glider while lying on the wing. This turns your head sideways. Hard to reach the pedals, of course, but no new holes in the panel. Fred

[Doug Mueller]

Dan, you can rotate your glasses 90 degrees, if the display
becomes visable, it is the glass not the LCD on the 302.

[Peter Purdie[_3_]]

The material in polarised sunglasses is oriented to minimise specular
reflection from water/snow surfaces. As a bonus for soaring pilots this
enhances cloud definition. Rotating sunglasses material reduces the useful
effect appreciably, so negates the benefit of polarising sunglasses.

Early production CAI302s had an LCD with the 'wrong' orientation for
polarising sunglasses, and nobody is likely to have a new batch
manufactured now.

The only practical answer is to use non-polarising sunglasses; brown tint
is good for cloud definition. A reddish tint is even better, but at the
expense of false colour which can cause problems when identifying crop
types for the field selected, and in reading paper charts.

At 04:14 18 September 2013, Doug Mueller wrote:
>Dan, you can rotate your glasses 90 degrees, if the display
>becomes visable, it is the glass not the LCD on the 302.
>
>

[Dan Marotta]

It's 45 degrees, not 90. Very strange.

And still no definite answer about whether it's the LCD waver or the front
glass that's the problem. I wear my old standby smoke colored sunglasses in
the glider and the Eagle Eyes in the car. I'd much prefer the reverse.

I sent Gary an email but no reply just yet...

"Peter Purdie" > wrote in message
...
> The material in polarised sunglasses is oriented to minimise specular
> reflection from water/snow surfaces. As a bonus for soaring pilots this
> enhances cloud definition. Rotating sunglasses material reduces the useful
> effect appreciably, so negates the benefit of polarising sunglasses.
>
> Early production CAI302s had an LCD with the 'wrong' orientation for
> polarising sunglasses, and nobody is likely to have a new batch
> manufactured now.
>
> The only practical answer is to use non-polarising sunglasses; brown tint
> is good for cloud definition. A reddish tint is even better, but at the
> expense of false colour which can cause problems when identifying crop
> types for the field selected, and in reading paper charts.
>
> At 04:14 18 September 2013, Doug Mueller wrote:
>>Dan, you can rotate your glasses 90 degrees, if the display
>>becomes visable, it is the glass not the LCD on the 302.
>>
>>
>

[Dan Marotta]

I'll look again, but I believe the instrument face (that protrudes through
the panel) is round. At least, the hole is...


"Steve Leonard" > wrote in message
...
> Are you sure height and width of the display are the same? If not, no
> dice for taking it apart and rotating the glass.
>

[Dan Marotta]

The glasses are not round.


"StaPo" > wrote in message
...
> hmmm,
> and what about to ask your neighbour optician
> to rotate the lenses in your glasses
> instead of rotating the 302?
> Supposing it should be cheaper...

[Dan Marotta]

Excellent! I'd just need to install hand-operated rudder controls and some
velcro to hold me in place when I fly fast.


> wrote in message
...
> Dan:
>
> There's a much easier way that drilling new holes. Fly the glider while
> lying on the wing. This turns your head sideways. Hard to reach the
> pedals, of course, but no new holes in the panel. Fred

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

Peter Purdie wrote, On 9/18/2013 5:51 AM:
> The only practical answer is to use non-polarising sunglasses; brown tint
> is good for cloud definition. A reddish tint is even better, but at the
> expense of false colour which can cause problems when identifying crop
> types for the field selected, and in reading paper charts.
>
> At 04:14 18 September 2013, Doug Mueller wrote:
>> >Dan, you can rotate your glasses 90 degrees, if the display
>> >becomes visable, it is the glass not the LCD on the 302.

I found it practical to punch holes in my polarized clip-ons. That
eliminated the polarization over the area of the panel, and also the
tinting: no LCD problems, no paper chart problems (not that I look at a
chart very often). It does not solve the tinting problem for crops,
because I'm using bifocal glasses, and the holes are over the bifocal part.

I'd probably use non-polarized clip-ons if I could find them. If you
don't need distant vision correction, there are polarized "sunreaders"
available that have non-polarized, non (or lightly)-tinted inserts with
correction for reading.

http://www.amazon.com/Polarized-Bifocal-Sunglasses-Retention-Outdoors/dp/B007849VDI/ref=sr_1_10?ie=UTF8&qid=1379515976&sr=8-10&keywords=sunreader+glasses

These look like the inserts are tinted, unlike the ones I have. Since
the inserts aren't polarized, looking at LCDs isn't a problem.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm
http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

[[email protected]]

You fly fast?



On Wednesday, September 18, 2013 7:19:11 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
> Excellent! I'd just need to install hand-operated rudder controls and some
>
> velcro to hold me in place when I fly fast.
>
>
>
>
>
> > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
> > Dan:
>
> >
>
> > There's a much easier way that drilling new holes. Fly the glider while
>
> > lying on the wing. This turns your head sideways. Hard to reach the
>
> > pedals, of course, but no new holes in the panel. Fred

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

On Wednesday, September 18, 2013 9:17:15 AM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:
> I'll look again, but I believe the instrument face (that protrudes through the panel) is round. At least, the hole is...

My bad, Dan. My first read thought you were talking about the nav display, not the vario display.

[Dan Marotta]

I try, but usually fly too fast, which results in more thermalling, which
means I fly slow. Gotta work on that...


> wrote in message
...
> You fly fast?
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, September 18, 2013 7:19:11 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
>> Excellent! I'd just need to install hand-operated rudder controls and
>> some
>>
>> velcro to hold me in place when I fly fast.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > wrote in message
>>
>> ...
>>
>> > Dan:
>>
>> >
>>
>> > There's a much easier way that drilling new holes. Fly the glider
>> > while
>>
>> > lying on the wing. This turns your head sideways. Hard to reach the
>>
>> > pedals, of course, but no new holes in the panel. Fred
>

[Dan Marotta]

Got a PM from Gary who told me that it's the LCD, like Paul said, not the
front glass. He told me that they're looking into getting more of CAI's
parts inventory so help may be available in the future.


"Dan Marotta" > wrote in message
...
>I try, but usually fly too fast, which results in more thermalling, which
>means I fly slow. Gotta work on that...
>
>
> > wrote in message
> ...
>> You fly fast?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 18, 2013 7:19:11 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
>>> Excellent! I'd just need to install hand-operated rudder controls and
>>> some
>>>
>>> velcro to hold me in place when I fly fast.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> > wrote in message
>>>
>>> ...
>>>
>>> > Dan:
>>>
>>> >
>>>
>>> > There's a much easier way that drilling new holes. Fly the glider
>>> > while
>>>
>>> > lying on the wing. This turns your head sideways. Hard to reach the
>>>
>>> > pedals, of course, but no new holes in the panel. Fred
>>
>

[JohnDeRosa]

On Tuesday, September 17, 2013 5:24:36 AM UTC-5, KiloKilo wrote:
> http://clearnav.net/main/cn-service.html

I may have read the http://clearnav.net/main/cn-service.html page wrong but it appears they only service the older Cambridge products.

GPS-NAV™ Datalogger
GPS-NAV™ Display
L-NAV™ Glide Computer
S-NAV™ Glide Computer
CAVII™ Variometer

Probably because they use discrete components (individual resistors, capitors, transitors, etc) or single technology ICs which they can easily troubleshoot. Not so the 302.

My $0.02.

[Dan Marotta]

Gary's email to me:

Hi Dan,

I was browsing rec.aviation.soaring and read about your troubles with the
302 polarization. Unfortunately it is the LCD that is polarized and not the
window glass.

As I recall, in the early production days of the 302 the first batch of LCD’s
received were not polarized correctly and nobody at CAI noticed. Once the
complaints started rolling in, the manufacturer was notified and further
shipments of the LCD’s were polarized properly. I suspect you have a very
early instrument?

In regards to replacing the LCD with the newer polarized glass, we (ClearNav
Instruments) are looking into purchasing some of Cambridge’s inventory so we
can go forward with support of the 300 Series.

Stay tuned…….

Best Regards,

Gary


"JohnDeRosa" > wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, September 17, 2013 5:24:36 AM UTC-5, KiloKilo wrote:
> http://clearnav.net/main/cn-service.html

I may have read the http://clearnav.net/main/cn-service.html page wrong but
it appears they only service the older Cambridge products.

GPS-NAV™ Datalogger
GPS-NAV™ Display
L-NAV™ Glide Computer
S-NAV™ Glide Computer
CAVII™ Variometer

Probably because they use discrete components (individual resistors,
capitors, transitors, etc) or single technology ICs which they can easily
troubleshoot. Not so the 302.

My $0.02.