How blue is 100LL?

[Ben Jackson]

I usually pump my own, but today I called ahead and had the FBO fill it
for me (only 53 cents more/gal!). I wasn't even present for the fueling
so I was extra paranoid during preflight, and I swear the 100LL was not
as "blue" as it usually is. It smelled like gas, and when I finally got
a big enough sample you could see a slight blue tint, but on a dip tube
I would have sworn it was clear.

So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
work fine)?

--
Ben Jackson
>
http://www.ben.com/

[Thomas J. Paladino Jr.]

The blue color in the gas is actually from a dye, not a property of the fuel
itself; so if the blue color you see is not quite what you're used to, it
does not necessarially mean that there is a problem with the fuel. It could
just be a different or more dispersed dye.

With that having been said, Sporty's sells a fuel tester that has a float to
determine the fuel type regardless of color. It works just like any other
tester, except for the ball float; if the ball sinks to the bottom, it's
avgas or auto gas, if it's in suspension, its contaminated or mixed fuel,
and if it floats, its jet fuel or water.

http://www.sportys.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&did=19&product_id=1276



"Ben Jackson" > wrote in message
news:%91jc.37417$_L6.2182786@attbi_s53...
> I usually pump my own, but today I called ahead and had the FBO fill it
> for me (only 53 cents more/gal!). I wasn't even present for the fueling
> so I was extra paranoid during preflight, and I swear the 100LL was not
> as "blue" as it usually is. It smelled like gas, and when I finally got
> a big enough sample you could see a slight blue tint, but on a dip tube
> I would have sworn it was clear.
>
> So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
> have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
> work fine)?
>
> --
> Ben Jackson
> >
> http://www.ben.com/

[[email protected]]

On Mon, 26 Apr 2004 05:32:43 GMT, (Ben Jackson) wrote:

>I usually pump my own, but today I called ahead and had the FBO fill it
>for me (only 53 cents more/gal!). I wasn't even present for the fueling
>so I was extra paranoid during preflight, and I swear the 100LL was not
>as "blue" as it usually is. It smelled like gas, and when I finally got
>a big enough sample you could see a slight blue tint, but on a dip tube
>I would have sworn it was clear.

IIRC, mixed octane avgas blends (resulting from mixing different
grades together) result in a clear or undyed apparance.

[Cub Driver]

As 80 octane was phasing out over the past five years, it got so pale
in the end (locally, anyhow) that you couldn't tell it from kerosene
save by the smell.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com
Viva Bush! blog www.vivabush.org

[John Gaquin]

"Ben Jackson" > wrote in message news:%91jc.37417
>
> So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
> have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
> work fine)?

Does your FBO also sell 80 or 115 octane? Is there routinely an autogas
truck working around the airport?

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"John Gaquin" > wrote in message
...
>
> Does your FBO also sell 80 or 115 octane?
>

Does anybody make 115 octane anymore?

[James M. Knox]

(Ben Jackson) wrote in news:%91jc.37417$_L6.2182786@attbi_s53:

> So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
> have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
> work fine)?

I've seen it all over the place. From almost navy blue (at an airport that
doesn't get much traffic, to no discernable color at all). At the old
Austin Executive (3R3) it never had ANY color that you could prove wasn't
in your imagination. I asked a line boy about it once, and his reply was a
puzzled "Is it supposed to have a color?"


--
-----------------------------------------------
James M. Knox
TriSoft ph 512-385-0316
1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331
Austin, Tx 78721
-----------------------------------------------

[John Gaquin]

"Steven P. McNicoll" > wrote in message > >
>
> Does anybody make 115 octane anymore?

I don't know. My point is that on most med to small airports, if it smells
like gas, it's going to be 100LL.

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"John Gaquin" > wrote in message
...
>
> My point is that on most med to small airports, if it smells
> like gas, it's going to be 100LL.
>

If that was so there'd be little reason to add dyes to avgas. There's
reason for concern if the fuel is not the proper color.

[Bob Gardner]

Dribble a little fuel onto a piece of white paper...if it evaporates and
leaves behind a tint, it is avgas; if it spreads out, soaking into the
paper, it is jet fuel.

Bob Gardner

"Ben Jackson" > wrote in message
news:%91jc.37417$_L6.2182786@attbi_s53...
> I usually pump my own, but today I called ahead and had the FBO fill it
> for me (only 53 cents more/gal!). I wasn't even present for the fueling
> so I was extra paranoid during preflight, and I swear the 100LL was not
> as "blue" as it usually is. It smelled like gas, and when I finally got
> a big enough sample you could see a slight blue tint, but on a dip tube
> I would have sworn it was clear.
>
> So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
> have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
> work fine)?
>
> --
> Ben Jackson
> >
> http://www.ben.com/

[C J Campbell]

Throw some of the fuel on the pavement. If it evaporates quickly, it is
avgas. If it just sits there, it is jet fuel. Avgas also acts differently if
you throw it onto a puddle of water than jet fuel does.

Anything that is put into a fuel tank is going to come out dyed blue and
smelling like gas.

[Cub Driver]

>I don't know. My point is that on most med to small airports, if it smells
>like gas, it's going to be 100LL.

And not mogas, which has a very distinctive and unpleasant smell. The
Cubs on my airfield were STC'ed for mogas, but the instructors
complained so much that the STCs were yanked, and the planes are now
placard for 100LL.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com
Viva Bush! blog www.vivabush.org

[G.R. Patterson III]

Cub Driver wrote:
>
> And not mogas, which has a very distinctive and unpleasant smell. The
> Cubs on my airfield were STC'ed for mogas, but the instructors
> complained so much that the STCs were yanked, and the planes are now
> placard for 100LL.

If I can smell gas of either sort during normal operations, I won't be flying that
aircraft.

George Patterson
If you don't tell lies, you never have to remember what you said.

[gatt]

"James M. Knox" > wrote in message

> > So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
> > have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
> > work fine)?
>
> I've seen it all over the place. From almost navy blue (at an airport
that
> doesn't get much traffic, to no discernable color at all).

Ran into this at the FBO that I fly out of at PDX-TTD. Sometimes the dye is
so pale that you have to hold it right up against a white surface such as
the vertical stabilizer to confirm the blue dye.

-c

[Teacherjh]

>>
Dribble a little fuel onto a piece of white paper...if it evaporates and
leaves behind a tint, it is avgas; if it spreads out, soaking into the
paper, it is jet fuel.
<<

If it leaves a ring, it's jet fuel. I've been told even a little (like 5%) is
sufficient to leave a visible ring.

But yes, I've seen very pale 100LL. In fact, I've rarely seen really blue
stuff. When I got my license (1980) it was supposed to be as blue as Windex.
(in fact, that's what was used in a slide my ground instructor had to show the
fuel colors - El Monte didn't have 100LL at the time)

To top it off, my fuel tester has little plastic inserts - they are blue. I
wish they'd get smart and make them white or clear.

Jose

--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

[Robert M. Gary]

(Ben Jackson) wrote in message news:<%91jc.37417$_L6.2182786@attbi_s53>...
> I usually pump my own, but today I called ahead and had the FBO fill it
> for me (only 53 cents more/gal!). I wasn't even present for the fueling
> so I was extra paranoid during preflight, and I swear the 100LL was not
> as "blue" as it usually is. It smelled like gas, and when I finally got
> a big enough sample you could see a slight blue tint, but on a dip tube
> I would have sworn it was clear.
>
> So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
> have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
> work fine)?

In certain levels of light our blue 100LL can look very clear. I'll
usually hold the sample up to the light behind a white part of the
plane. After contrasting with the white paint of the plane, the fuel
tends to look much more blue. Years ago, I almost made myself pass out
smelling the fuel from the Aeronca. I couldn't convince myself whether
or not I saw blue (I wasn't worried about mogas, I was concerned about
water since it has just rained). I got so light headed I had to
terminate the flight early. I now try to only take a quick sniff.

-Robert

[Eclipsme]

"Robert M. Gary" > wrote in message
om...
> (Ben Jackson) wrote in message
news:<%91jc.37417$_L6.2182786@attbi_s53>...
> > I usually pump my own, but today I called ahead and had the FBO fill it
> > for me (only 53 cents more/gal!). I wasn't even present for the fueling
> > so I was extra paranoid during preflight, and I swear the 100LL was not
> > as "blue" as it usually is. It smelled like gas, and when I finally got
> > a big enough sample you could see a slight blue tint, but on a dip tube
> > I would have sworn it was clear.
> >
> > So how blue is it supposed to be? Is there another simple test I could
> > have done to reassure myself (besides burning 30gal of it and having it
> > work fine)?
>
> In certain levels of light our blue 100LL can look very clear. I'll
> usually hold the sample up to the light behind a white part of the
> plane. After contrasting with the white paint of the plane, the fuel
> tends to look much more blue. Years ago, I almost made myself pass out
> smelling the fuel from the Aeronca. I couldn't convince myself whether
> or not I saw blue (I wasn't worried about mogas, I was concerned about
> water since it has just rained). I got so light headed I had to
> terminate the flight early. I now try to only take a quick sniff.
>
> -Robert

Robert,

Next time try pouring a few ounces of the fuel onto the ramp. Fuel will soak
in, but water will bead up.

Harvey

[Bob Moore]

"Eclipsme" > wrote

> Next time try pouring a few ounces of the fuel onto the ramp. Fuel
> will soak in, but water will bead up.

And in Florida, gets you a $50,000 fine.

Bob Moore

[James M. Knox]

(Robert M. Gary) wrote in
om:

> Years ago, I almost made myself pass out
> smelling the fuel from the Aeronca. I couldn't convince myself whether
> or not I saw blue (I wasn't worried about mogas, I was concerned about
> water since it has just rained).

Yeah, sure... that's your story, and you are sticking to it. <G>

You're right, it can be almost impossible to tell if it is really
slightly blue. And at night, where there isn't any good non-biased
light source to use, it can be impossible.

One option is, of course, to ADD water to the sample. No "bubble" and
it's *all* water.

What I usually do is first drain from the engine fuel filter, under the
theory that since the engine was running at shutdown there must be at
least a LITTLE gas in there. If it looks good, then don't pour all of
it out, and now add from the left main. If it looks good, then don't
pour all of it out and now add from the right main.

The idea is that there should always be some known fuel in the tube, so
you don't have the risk of thinking an all-tube WATER sample is fuel.

-----------------------------------------------
James M. Knox
TriSoft ph 512-385-0316
1109-A Shady Lane fax 512-366-4331
Austin, Tx 78721
-----------------------------------------------

[G.R. Patterson III]

Eclipsme wrote:
>
> Next time try pouring a few ounces of the fuel onto the ramp.

Don't get caught. That'll get you kicked off many airports and get you fines in some
places. Gas damages asphalt.

George Patterson
If you don't tell lies, you never have to remember what you said.

[Robert M. Gary]

> Robert,
>
> Next time try pouring a few ounces of the fuel onto the ramp. Fuel will soak
> in, but water will bead up.
>
> Harvey


The effect isn't the same on grass.

[Robert M. Gary]

"James M. Knox" > wrote in message >...
> (Robert M. Gary) wrote in
> om:
>
> > Years ago, I almost made myself pass out
> > smelling the fuel from the Aeronca. I couldn't convince myself whether
> > or not I saw blue (I wasn't worried about mogas, I was concerned about
> > water since it has just rained).
>
> Yeah, sure... that's your story, and you are sticking to it. <G>
>
> You're right, it can be almost impossible to tell if it is really
> slightly blue. And at night, where there isn't any good non-biased
> light source to use, it can be impossible.
>
> One option is, of course, to ADD water to the sample. No "bubble" and
> it's *all* water.
>
> What I usually do is first drain from the engine fuel filter, under the
> theory that since the engine was running at shutdown there must be at
> least a LITTLE gas in there. If it looks good, then don't pour all of
> it out, and now add from the left main. If it looks good, then don't
> pour all of it out and now add from the right main.
>
> The idea is that there should always be some known fuel in the tube, so
> you don't have the risk of thinking an all-tube WATER sample is fuel.

That's a good idea. I wish there was some way to catch the fuel from
the collator in my Mooney.

[Eclipsme]

"Bob Moore" > wrote in message
. 8...
> "Eclipsme" > wrote
>
> > Next time try pouring a few ounces of the fuel onto the ramp. Fuel
> > will soak in, but water will bead up.
>
> And in Florida, gets you a $50,000 fine.
>
> Bob Moore

Hmm. Not aware of this. What do you do with the drained fuel then?

Harvey

[Eclipsme]

"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Eclipsme wrote:
> >
> > Next time try pouring a few ounces of the fuel onto the ramp.
>
> Don't get caught. That'll get you kicked off many airports and get you
fines in some
> places. Gas damages asphalt.
>
> George Patterson
> If you don't tell lies, you never have to remember what you said.

I guess this comes from not flying for many years. What do you do with the
drained fuel?

Harvey

[G.R. Patterson III]

Eclipsme wrote:
>
> I guess this comes from not flying for many years. What do you do with the
> drained fuel?

I put it back in my tanks. When I had a 150 and was based at 47N, the accepted
procedure was to dump it on the grass, but *never* the asphalt. After I replaced the
cap gaskets on the 150, I never got any water in the fuel, so I've been putting it
right back in the tanks ever since. Never had any water with the Maule, either, so I
kept up the practice.

George Patterson
If you don't tell lies, you never have to remember what you said.

[Brian Burger]

On Fri, 30 Apr 2004, Eclipsme wrote:

>
> "G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> >
> > Eclipsme wrote:
> > >
> > > Next time try pouring a few ounces of the fuel onto the ramp.
> >
> > Don't get caught. That'll get you kicked off many airports and get you
> fines in some
> > places. Gas damages asphalt.
> >
> > George Patterson
> > If you don't tell lies, you never have to remember what you said.
>
> I guess this comes from not flying for many years. What do you do with the
> drained fuel?

Pour it into a jerrycan (kept outside the airside door) and that's used to
run the lawnmower tractor that tows the Cessnas around. The Club doesn't
have to buy tractor gas anymore, and it keeps pollution/ramp damage to a
minimum!

Brian.

[Cub Driver]

>Hmm. Not aware of this. What do you do with the drained fuel then?

Generally you use a capture bottle, and you return the sample to a
designated collector.

Hasn't reached this far, though I seem to recall such a deal in New
Jersey. (Where the fuel tank was above the surface, also I think
because of environmental worries.)

Besides, we don't have any asphalt :)

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com
Viva Bush! blog www.vivabush.org