South African Nationals 2013 - one more day ..... The JS1s are doingquite well.......

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Just one more day to go at the SA Nationals at Welkom, RSA.

For all the results see: http://www.soaringspot.com/sanats2013/ .

Facebook carries the daily stories from Carol Clifford. See>> https://www.facebook.com/SouthAfricanNationals2012?ref=hl for more.

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nothing against the JS-1, but in the 18/Open class 13 of the 17 contestants are in JS-1s. The other four are two Nimbus 3s (not a new glider design), a Lak 17, and and ASG-29... which happens to be in 2nd. No surprise the JS-1s are doing well, they are practically the only gliders in the field.

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

On Friday, December 20, 2013 3:43:47 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> nothing against the JS-1, but in the 18/Open class 13 of the 17 contestants are in JS-1s. The other four are two Nimbus 3s (not a new glider design), a Lak 17, and and ASG-29... which happens to be in 2nd. No surprise the JS-1s are doing well, they are practically the only gliders in the field.

Well, the 29 was second for the day. Up to 6th overall. I am kind of surprised at how few 1000 point days there have been.

[[email protected]]

The fat lady has warbled .....
Overall Results:
CLUB CLASS
1. Edvard Kristo 6922 pts.
2. Annemiek Koers 6887 pts.
3. Jean du Plessis 6162 pts.
15M. CLASS
1. Wayne Schmidt 7684 pts
2. Rene Coetzee 7379 pts.
3. Sven Olivier 6349 pts.
OPEN/18M CLASS
1. Uys Jonker 7158 pts.
2. Oscar Goudriaan 7147 pts.
3. Ronald Termaat 7097 pts.

[Ian[_2_]]

On 12/21/2013 10:43 PM, wrote:

> The fat lady has warbled .....

Then I think it is a fair time to comment on the handicapping that was
used, particularly as applied to 15m class:

For example on 2013-12-16:

ASW 20 03:24:39 111.5km/h 380.4km 1000
ASW 27 03:05:24 123.1km/h 380.4km 910

The ASW 27 is 12km/h faster than the ASW 20 but it is scored 900 points
less. How fast does the '27 driver have to go before he can get 1000
points too?


Ian

[Wayne Paul]

On Sun, 22 Dec 2013 09:13:25 +0200, Ian > wrote:

>On 12/21/2013 10:43 PM, wrote:
>
>> The fat lady has warbled .....
>
>Then I think it is a fair time to comment on the handicapping that was
>used, particularly as applied to 15m class:
>
>For example on 2013-12-16:
>
>ASW 20 03:24:39 111.5km/h 380.4km 1000
>ASW 27 03:05:24 123.1km/h 380.4km 910
>
>The ASW 27 is 12km/h faster than the ASW 20 but it is scored 900 points
>less. How fast does the '27 driver have to go before he can get 1000
>points too?
>

135??
>
>Ian

[Evan Ludeman[_4_]]

On Sunday, December 22, 2013 2:13:25 AM UTC-5, Ian wrote:
> On 12/21/2013 10:43 PM, wrote:
>
>
>
> > The fat lady has warbled .....
>
>
>
> Then I think it is a fair time to comment on the handicapping that was
>
> used, particularly as applied to 15m class:
>
>
>
> For example on 2013-12-16:
>
>
>
> ASW 20 03:24:39 111.5km/h 380.4km 1000
>
> ASW 27 03:05:24 123.1km/h 380.4km 910
>
>
>
> The ASW 27 is 12km/h faster than the ASW 20 but it is scored 900 points
>
> less. How fast does the '27 driver have to go before he can get 1000
>
> points too?
>
>
>
>
>
> Ian

So... the ASW-20 is presumed to be flying with at least two controls disconnected a large chunk out of one wing and the gear down?

It does seem a bit... bizarre. By US (mixed class handicap) rules, those speeds would have the 27 pilot winning, 20 pilot getting about 940 pts. By US 15m rules the 20 pilot gets 906 pts (no handicapping).

T8

[Peter Stafford Allen]

At 07:13 22 December 2013, Ian wrote:
>On 12/21/2013 10:43 PM, wrote:
>
>> The fat lady has warbled .....
>
>Then I think it is a fair time to comment on the handicapping that was
>used, particularly as applied to 15m class:
>
>For example on 2013-12-16:
>
>ASW 20 03:24:39 111.5km/h 380.4km 1000
>ASW 27 03:05:24 123.1km/h 380.4km 910
>
>The ASW 27 is 12km/h faster than the ASW 20 but it is scored 900 points
>less. How fast does the '27 driver have to go before he can get 1000
>points too?
>
>
>Ian
>
>
Ian,
In strong conditions an ASW27 is amazingly fast and to be only about 10%
faster than a ASW20 is really not enough, though it looks as if the 20
pilot did do something clever/lucky since he scored top marks

[GC[_2_]]

On 23/12/2013 05:52, Peter Stafford Allen wrote:
> At 07:13 22 December 2013, Ian wrote:

>> The ASW 27 is 12km/h faster than the ASW 20 but it is scored 900 points
>> less. How fast does the '27 driver have to go before he can get 1000
>> points too?
>>
>> Ian
>>
> Ian,
> In strong conditions an ASW27 is amazingly fast and to be only about 10%
> faster than a ASW20 is really not enough, though it looks as if the 20
> pilot did do something clever/lucky since he scored top marks

So... Does he get a better handicap when conditions aren't 'strong'? Or
does he just have to lose even more badly?

The BGA handicaps the 20 at 100. On that basis your handicap was over
112 and at that point you're the only 15m glider. All the others at
that level (110+) are 18m or wider.

You were robbed, Ian.

The BGA handicaps the 27 at 104. You need to start offering brown
envelopes to the scorer. Flying better won't get you anywhere.

GC

[Ian[_2_]]

On 12/23/2013 09:57 AM, GC wrote:

> You were robbed, Ian.

Just for the record. I don't fly an ASW 27, nor even an ASW 20 and I did
not participate in that competition. If I had been there I would have
been well behind both of the pilots I quoted - irrespective of any
handicap that I might have been given.

I would be very reluctant to make public comment about a competition if
I had been there.

But I read the scores on the 'net and I thought it was a bit tough on
some of the guys.

Ian

[GC[_2_]]

On 23/12/2013 20:23, Ian wrote:
> On 12/23/2013 09:57 AM, GC wrote:
>
>> You were robbed, Ian.
>
> Just for the record. I don't fly an ASW 27, nor even an ASW 20 and I did
> not participate in that competition. If I had been there I would have
> been well behind both of the pilots I quoted - irrespective of any
> handicap that I might have been given.
>
> I would be very reluctant to make public comment about a competition if
> I had been there.
>
> But I read the scores on the 'net and I thought it was a bit tough on
> some of the guys.
>
> Ian
>
Ok. Somebody else was robbed. :)

GC

[Evan Ludeman[_4_]]

Does anyone have a link to SA nats rules & handicapping scheme? I've come up dry so far.

T8

[Vernon Brown]

At 13:56 23 December 2013, Evan Ludeman wrote:
>Does anyone have a link to SA nats rules & handicapping scheme? I've
come
>up dry so far.
>
>T8
>


I did not understand the scoring on the last day of the 18M.
A two hour AAT won by a Nimbus3, but the man in second placed (JS1) was
faster by 2.6 Kph and was only 1 minute 40 seconds over time, whereas the
Nimbus was 3 minutes 52 seconds over time and did 0.5 km more than the JS1,
but I cant see if any penalties was awarded.
Vernon

[Vernon Brown[_2_]]

At 13:17 23 December 2013, GC wrote:
>On 23/12/2013 20:23, Ian wrote:
>> On 12/23/2013 09:57 AM, GC wrote:
>>
>>> You were robbed, Ian.
>>
>> Just for the record. I don't fly an ASW 27, nor even an ASW 20 and I
did
>> not participate in that competition. If I had been there I would have
>> been well behind both of the pilots I quoted - irrespective of any
>> handicap that I might have been given.
>>
>> I would be very reluctant to make public comment about a competition if
>> I had been there.
>>
>> But I read the scores on the 'net and I thought it was a bit tough on
>> some of the guys.
>>
>> Ian
>>
>Ok. Somebody else was robbed. :)
>
>GC
>

I did not understand the scoring on the last day of the 18M.
A two hour AAT won by a Nimbus3, but the man in second placed (JS1) was
faster by 2.6 Kph and was only 1 minute 40 seconds over time, whereas the
Nimbus was 3 minutes 52 seconds over time and did 0.5 km more than the JS1,
but I cant see if any penalties was awarded.

Vernon

[[email protected]]

Le lundi 23 décembre 2013 14:56:49 UTC+1, Evan Ludeman a écrit*:
> Does anyone have a link to SA nats rules & handicapping scheme? I've come up dry so far.
>
>
>
> T8

http://sssa.org.za/index.php/download/viewcategory/8-nationals-2013-competition-docs-forms-and-info

[Evan Ludeman[_4_]]

On Tuesday, December 24, 2013 5:50:59 AM UTC-5, wrote:

> http://sssa.org.za/index.php/download/viewcategory/8-nationals-2013-competition-docs-forms-and-info

Thanks... but when I open the 'handicap' files in (my very old, v3.95) version of See You I get a score sheet from September 28... and no handicap info that I can see. I opened the file in a text editor and I see a lot of code, but again no handicaps.

Just curious to see how others are handling this.

Evan Ludeman / T8