Re: AMS selling LS4 package

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 28, 2011 5:25:09 AM UTC-7, Peter Scholz wrote:
> May be this is interesting, especially for those who may have claims
> towards AMS.
>
> I found this in the classified ads on segelflug.de:
> --------------------------------
> Kategorie: Biete Sonstiges
>
> Anzeigennummer: 11578
> Aufgegeben am: 28/04/2011
> Kontakt: Ales Cebavs
> Lesce, Slovenia
>
> Details
> LS 4,-a,-b tools, documentation and rights in offer include:
>
> -complete tools (moulds, jigs, fuselage, wings, control surfaces, ...)
> -know how and rights
> -all necessary drawings and other instructions for parts and assembly,
> in pdf and in paper
> -other documentation, certification and calculation files
> -initial support, organizing the tools preparation and loadings
> -more of the LS gliders parts from the stock included (metal and
> composite parts)
>
> I will contact and communicate between the leads to purchase they will
> express to buy the package in partnership between such the persons to
> organize share option.
>
> Representing AMS - Flight as the holder of LS 4 series project in sales.
>
> Price 31.000 EUR
> ------------------------------------------------
>
> --
> Peter Scholz
> ASW24 JE

For those of us who don't know the back-story on AMS and the LS-4, can someone enlighten us.

[Bob Kuykendall]

On Monday, February 24, 2014 6:44:02 PM UTC-8, wrote:

> For those of us who don't know the back-story on AMS and the LS-4, can someone enlighten us.

I'd kinda like to know more of the whole story myself. But only in a popcorny-munchy deconstructing-a-train-wreck kind of way.

What I do know is a bunch of semi-random connect-the-dots factoids:

* AMS Flight was a contractor for DG Flugzeugbau, making large assemblies for DG gliders. It appears that they built entire DG500 and DG505 for DG.

* AMS Flight was apparently not involved in the whole DG300 "Got Ondulation?" fiasco. That was ELAN, but not verve:

http://www.hpaircraft.com/misc/dg300spars.htm

* There was an episode in which a DG500 or DG505 imported into the US was denied an airworthiness certificate because of lack of traceability between the type certificate and production certificate owner (DG Flugzeugbau) and the actual manufacturer (AMS Flight):

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.aviation.soaring/2g3Rs4terrQ

* Apparently, in the transactions that resulted in DG Flugzeugbau owning the rights and responsibilities for the Wolf Lemke-designed LS series sailplanes, the LS-4 was separated out and DG did not get either the rights or the tooling. It seems pretty clear that AMS Flight ended up with the tooling (they might have had it all along as a contract manufacturer for LS, but that is speculation).

* Searching r.a.s on the term "Cebavs" (no, not "Kebabs" as Google attempts to autocorrect) reveals some reports of puzzling business practices on the part of Ales Cebavs, who is apparently the proprietor of AMS Flight. I have no information as to the veracity of those reports.

* As this thread attests, Cebavs was trying to sell the LS4 tooling a while back. Based on what I've heard, I think a deal did eventually go through and the tooling was sold.

Thanks, Bob K.

[Dave Nadler]

On Monday, February 24, 2014 9:44:02 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> For those of us who don't know the back-story on AMS
> and the LS-4, can someone enlighten us.

In today's installment of "How the glider manufacturers turn"...

After LS went bankrupt, a very nice gent bought the LS-4 rights,
toolings, and parts in progress (DG buying everything else LS-*).
He endeavored to LS-4 resurrect production with AMS, and they showed
one example constructed from parts in-progress at Friedrichshafen,
then the subsequent exhibit 2 years later IIRC they showed
the first (and IIRC only) unit built from scratch.

I don't have any knowledge of the commercial misadventures
or ultimate demise of this attempt. Even though the LS-4c
is a fantastic club glider, they weren't able to make a go
of it. Too bad!

At least that's what I remember - it was long ago.
Hope that helps,
Best Regards, Dave "YO electric"