Pirep needed: Boston Airports

[Bob Chilcoat]

I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get to the
New England Medical Center for a meeting. I would appreciate tips on best
airports, FBO's, transportation, etc. Thanks.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)

I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to love
America

[Gary Drescher]

"Bob Chilcoat" > wrote in message
...
> I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get to
the
> New England Medical Center for a meeting. I would appreciate tips on best
> airports, FBO's, transportation, etc. Thanks.

The Boston-area airport I'm most familiar with is BED (Hanscom Field), which
is very GA-friendly. There's public transportation (bus, then subway) into
the city (http://www.mbta.com/index.asp), as well as taxis and rental cars.
There's a Signature FBO, but I'm not familiar with their services since I
rent planes at Hanscom.

--Gary

>
> --
> Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)
>
> I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to love
> America
>
>

[Peter Gottlieb]

I had heard all sorts of horror stories about BED but when I went there to
the Signature FBO everything was great. I usually find it best in the long
run to get a rental car as the cost is reasonable as compared to taxis and
the convenience can't be beat. Call ahead to Signature and they will have
it for you. As is my standard practice, I had the plane's tanks topped off.
There was no ramp fee, I only paid for the fuel and I was there most of the
day.


"Gary Drescher" > wrote in message
news:on2rc.120550$Ik.10197785@attbi_s53...
> "Bob Chilcoat" > wrote in message
> ...
> > I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get to
> the
> > New England Medical Center for a meeting. I would appreciate tips on
best
> > airports, FBO's, transportation, etc. Thanks.
>
> The Boston-area airport I'm most familiar with is BED (Hanscom Field),
which
> is very GA-friendly. There's public transportation (bus, then subway) into
> the city (http://www.mbta.com/index.asp), as well as taxis and rental
cars.
> There's a Signature FBO, but I'm not familiar with their services since I
> rent planes at Hanscom.
>
> --Gary
>
> >
> > --
> > Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)
> >
> > I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to love
> > America
> >
> >
>
>

[Bob Chilcoat]

Thanks. I just got a call from the guy I have to meet with. Turns out he's
a pilot and wants to meet me at Mansfield Airport. Guess that solves that
problem. Now if the weather will only cooperate.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)

I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to love
America

"Peter Gottlieb" > wrote in message
. net...
> I had heard all sorts of horror stories about BED but when I went there to
> the Signature FBO everything was great. I usually find it best in the
long
> run to get a rental car as the cost is reasonable as compared to taxis and
> the convenience can't be beat. Call ahead to Signature and they will have
> it for you. As is my standard practice, I had the plane's tanks topped
off.
> There was no ramp fee, I only paid for the fuel and I was there most of
the
> day.
>
>
> "Gary Drescher" > wrote in message
> news:on2rc.120550$Ik.10197785@attbi_s53...
> > "Bob Chilcoat" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get
to
> > the
> > > New England Medical Center for a meeting. I would appreciate tips on
> best
> > > airports, FBO's, transportation, etc. Thanks.
> >
> > The Boston-area airport I'm most familiar with is BED (Hanscom Field),
> which
> > is very GA-friendly. There's public transportation (bus, then subway)
into
> > the city (http://www.mbta.com/index.asp), as well as taxis and rental
> cars.
> > There's a Signature FBO, but I'm not familiar with their services since
I
> > rent planes at Hanscom.
> >
> > --Gary
> >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)
> > >
> > > I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to
love
> > > America
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

[Peter Gottlieb]

Yes, the weather has been somewhat unstable lately. I had a heck of a time
getting back from Dayton last weekend.


"Bob Chilcoat" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks. I just got a call from the guy I have to meet with. Turns out
he's
> a pilot and wants to meet me at Mansfield Airport. Guess that solves that
> problem. Now if the weather will only cooperate.
>
> --
> Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)
>
> I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to love
> America
>
> "Peter Gottlieb" > wrote in message
> . net...
> > I had heard all sorts of horror stories about BED but when I went there
to
> > the Signature FBO everything was great. I usually find it best in the
> long
> > run to get a rental car as the cost is reasonable as compared to taxis
and
> > the convenience can't be beat. Call ahead to Signature and they will
have
> > it for you. As is my standard practice, I had the plane's tanks topped
> off.
> > There was no ramp fee, I only paid for the fuel and I was there most of
> the
> > day.
> >
> >
> > "Gary Drescher" > wrote in message
> > news:on2rc.120550$Ik.10197785@attbi_s53...
> > > "Bob Chilcoat" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > > I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get
> to
> > > the
> > > > New England Medical Center for a meeting. I would appreciate tips
on
> > best
> > > > airports, FBO's, transportation, etc. Thanks.
> > >
> > > The Boston-area airport I'm most familiar with is BED (Hanscom Field),
> > which
> > > is very GA-friendly. There's public transportation (bus, then subway)
> into
> > > the city (http://www.mbta.com/index.asp), as well as taxis and rental
> > cars.
> > > There's a Signature FBO, but I'm not familiar with their services
since
> I
> > > rent planes at Hanscom.
> > >
> > > --Gary
> > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)
> > > >
> > > > I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to
> love
> > > > America
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>

[tony]

>
>> Thanks. I just got a call from the guy I have to meet with. Turns out
>he's
>> a pilot and wants to meet me at Mansfield Airport.

fwiw, Mansfield has only a VOR approach as best I remember. Should you want
something a little more convienent, think of Norwood -- you'll drive by it on
the way from Mansfield to the Medical Center.

There used to be lots of glider activity at Mansfield.

BED is still the best general aviation airport serving Boston's fringes, but
for planning purposes, if you and your airplane are suitably equipt, don't
overlook Logan.

[Gary Drescher]

"tony" > wrote in message
...
> >
> >> Thanks. I just got a call from the guy I have to meet with. Turns out
> >he's
> >> a pilot and wants to meet me at Mansfield Airport.
>
> fwiw, Mansfield has only a VOR approach as best I remember. Should you
want
> something a little more convienent, think of Norwood -- you'll drive by it
on
> the way from Mansfield to the Medical Center.
>
> There used to be lots of glider activity at Mansfield.
>
> BED is still the best general aviation airport serving Boston's fringes,
but
> for planning purposes, if you and your airplane are suitably equipt, don't
> overlook Logan.

I've flown into Logan a couple of times on Angel Flight missions. It's quite
fun. I wouldn't fly there if I had to pay the landing fee, though.

--Gary

[Bob Noel]

In article >, "Bob Chilcoat"
> wrote:

> I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get to
> the
> New England Medical Center for a meeting. I would appreciate tips on
> best
> airports, FBO's, transportation, etc. Thanks.

I know you said you'll be going to Mansfield, but be aware of
the landing fee at KBED, which was recently implemented.

--
Bob Noel

[Gary Drescher]

"Bob Noel" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, "Bob Chilcoat"
> > wrote:
>
> > I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get to
> > the
> > New England Medical Center for a meeting. I would appreciate tips on
> > best
> > airports, FBO's, transportation, etc. Thanks.
>
> I know you said you'll be going to Mansfield, but be aware of
> the landing fee at KBED, which was recently implemented.

Really? How recently? There's always been a landing fee there at night, but
did they start having one during the day as well?

--Gary

[Bob Noel]

In article <xmarc.13912$zw.7434@attbi_s01>, "Gary Drescher"
> wrote:

> > I know you said you'll be going to Mansfield, but be aware of
> > the landing fee at KBED, which was recently implemented.
>
> Really? How recently? There's always been a landing fee there at night,
> but
> did they start having one during the day as well?

I think the landing fee for transients began July 2003.
The one annoucement I can find easily said it would be a
flat fee of $10-$15 for transient and commerical aircraft
under 10,000 lbs. Somewhere around here I might still have
the letter telling me about hangar rent increases, custom fees,
and landing fees.

--
Bob Noel

[Gary Drescher]

"Bob Noel" > wrote in message
...
> In article <xmarc.13912$zw.7434@attbi_s01>, "Gary Drescher"
> > wrote:
>
> > > I know you said you'll be going to Mansfield, but be aware of
> > > the landing fee at KBED, which was recently implemented.
> >
> > Really? How recently? There's always been a landing fee there at night,
> > but
> > did they start having one during the day as well?
>
> I think the landing fee for transients began July 2003.
> The one annoucement I can find easily said it would be a
> flat fee of $10-$15 for transient and commerical aircraft
> under 10,000 lbs. Somewhere around here I might still have
> the letter telling me about hangar rent increases, custom fees,
> and landing fees.

Oh ok, I didn't realize there could be a different fee for transients (I
only fly rental planes that are based at BED). Strange that the A/FD doesn't
mention a landing fee (except the one at night). But the fee is listed at
Massport's web site (http://www.massport.com/hansc/hansc_operating.html).

--Gary

>
> --
> Bob Noel

[Peter Gottlieb]

I guess they forgot to charge me since I was there a couple of months ago.


"Bob Noel" > wrote in message
...
> In article <xmarc.13912$zw.7434@attbi_s01>, "Gary Drescher"
> > wrote:
>
> > > I know you said you'll be going to Mansfield, but be aware of
> > > the landing fee at KBED, which was recently implemented.
> >
> > Really? How recently? There's always been a landing fee there at night,
> > but
> > did they start having one during the day as well?
>
> I think the landing fee for transients began July 2003.
> The one annoucement I can find easily said it would be a
> flat fee of $10-$15 for transient and commerical aircraft
> under 10,000 lbs. Somewhere around here I might still have
> the letter telling me about hangar rent increases, custom fees,
> and landing fees.
>
> --
> Bob Noel

[Greg]

Peter Gottlieb wrote:

> I guess they forgot to charge me since I was there a couple of months ago.

Don't worry, Massachusetts Port Authority won't make that mistake again, they
are installing a camera/imaging system to automatically recognize and record
your registration number while you're on the runway. They can then send you
the bill in the mail if you don't pay it at an fbo.

[Tom Nery]

I'm based out of Mansfield. We currently have no glider or parachuting
activity, quite a bit of training however. Also I think if you check we
have a GPS and NDB approach. If you need VOR, then Norwood is your best
bet.

Have a safe trip.

Tom

"tony" > wrote in message
...
> >
> >> Thanks. I just got a call from the guy I have to meet with. Turns out
> >he's
> >> a pilot and wants to meet me at Mansfield Airport.
>
> fwiw, Mansfield has only a VOR approach as best I remember. Should you
want
> something a little more convienent, think of Norwood -- you'll drive by it
on
> the way from Mansfield to the Medical Center.
>
> There used to be lots of glider activity at Mansfield.
>
> BED is still the best general aviation airport serving Boston's fringes,
but
> for planning purposes, if you and your airplane are suitably equipt, don't
> overlook Logan.
>
>
>
>

[Bob Chilcoat]

Thanks for the info. I got up @ 4:30 AM yesterday to check the weather, but
as I suspected it was below minimums and expected to be so until too late to
make my meeting. So I flew @ 55 knots and 0' AGL for four hours to get
there by 10:30 for my 2-hour meeting. Sad, but just part of aviation. Next
time, perhaps I will be able to get off the tarmac. The airport looks nice,
though.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)

I don't have to like Bush and Cheney (Or Kerry, for that matter) to love
America

"Tom Nery" > wrote in message
news:24Qtc.15433$Ly.2009@attbi_s01...
> I'm based out of Mansfield. We currently have no glider or parachuting
> activity, quite a bit of training however. Also I think if you check we
> have a GPS and NDB approach. If you need VOR, then Norwood is your best
> bet.
>
> Have a safe trip.
>
> Tom
>
> "tony" > wrote in message
> ...
> > >
> > >> Thanks. I just got a call from the guy I have to meet with. Turns
out
> > >he's
> > >> a pilot and wants to meet me at Mansfield Airport.
> >
> > fwiw, Mansfield has only a VOR approach as best I remember. Should you
> want
> > something a little more convienent, think of Norwood -- you'll drive by
it
> on
> > the way from Mansfield to the Medical Center.
> >
> > There used to be lots of glider activity at Mansfield.
> >
> > BED is still the best general aviation airport serving Boston's fringes,
> but
> > for planning purposes, if you and your airplane are suitably equipt,
don't
> > overlook Logan.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[HECTOP]

"Bob Chilcoat" > wrote in message
>I need to make a trip to Boston soon (from NJ), and will need to get to the

remember to bring your Ausweis when boarding public transportation in
Boston:

http://www.berkshireeagle.com/Stories/0,1413,101~7514~2166861,00.html


HECTOP
PP-ASEL-IA
http://www.maxho.com
maxho_at_maxho.com

[David Megginson]

Tom Nery wrote:

> I'm based out of Mansfield. We currently have no glider or parachuting
> activity, quite a bit of training however. Also I think if you check we
> have a GPS and NDB approach. If you need VOR, then Norwood is your best
> bet.

I'll second for Norwood -- I landed there on a trip to Boston a couple of
months ago and had a good experience. The airport is a 5 minute cab ride
from the Route 128 train station, so it's easy to get into town (or down to
Rhode Island) from the airport. At the time, parking and gas were
reasonable, and it's just outside what I think of as the Boston Security
(i.e. B.S.) zone, so it doesn't have the landing fees, security fees, prop
lock requirements, etc.


All the best,


David

[S Green]

Not everyone knows where "Boston or Mansfield" is... this is a world wide
posting...
.... some information as to
Continent, Country, County and Town would be nice..



"Tom Nery" > wrote in message
news:24Qtc.15433$Ly.2009@attbi_s01...
> I'm based out of Mansfield. We currently have no glider or parachuting
> activity, quite a bit of training however. Also I think if you check we
> have a GPS and NDB approach. If you need VOR, then Norwood is your best
> bet.
>
> Have a safe trip.
>
> Tom
>
> "tony" > wrote in message
> ...
> > >
> > >> Thanks. I just got a call from the guy I have to meet with. Turns
out
> > >he's
> > >> a pilot and wants to meet me at Mansfield Airport.
> >
> > fwiw, Mansfield has only a VOR approach as best I remember. Should you
> want
> > something a little more convienent, think of Norwood -- you'll drive by
it
> on
> > the way from Mansfield to the Medical Center.
> >
> > There used to be lots of glider activity at Mansfield.
> >
> > BED is still the best general aviation airport serving Boston's fringes,
> but
> > for planning purposes, if you and your airplane are suitably equipt,
don't
> > overlook Logan.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>

[Peter Gottlieb]

"S Green" > wrote in message
...
> Not everyone knows where "Boston or Mansfield" is...

I can understand not knowing where Mansfield is, but Boston?

I thought it was the Americans who were supposed to be "geographically
challenged."

[HECTOP]

"Peter Gottlieb" > wrote:
> geographically challenged

it's not about being geographically challenged, it's about being anal :-)

it's greatly adds to one's sense of self-worthiness to point out how big the
world is to others ;)

HECTOP
PP-ASEL-IA
http://www.maxho.com
maxho_at_maxho.com

[Peter Gottlieb]

"HECTOP" > wrote in message
.. .
>
> "Peter Gottlieb" > wrote:
> > geographically challenged
>
> it's not about being geographically challenged, it's about being anal :-)
>
> it's greatly adds to one's sense of self-worthiness to point out how big
the
> world is to others ;)


Aha. It's smaller for us as a group, though.

[S Green]

"Peter Gottlieb" > wrote in message
. net...
>
> "S Green" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Not everyone knows where "Boston or Mansfield" is...
>
> I can understand not knowing where Mansfield is, but Boston?
>
> I thought it was the Americans who were supposed to be "geographically
> challenged."

They don't under stand irony too it seems!

[S Green]

"Peter Gottlieb" > wrote in message
. net...
>
> "S Green" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Not everyone knows where "Boston or Mansfield" is...
>
> I can understand not knowing where Mansfield is, but Boston?
>
> I thought it was the Americans who were supposed to be "geographically
> challenged."

They don't understand irony too, this is from another post:

Not everyone knows where "Southend" is... this is a world wide posting...
although now I can see that "nick" is in the "uk"... some information as to
Continent, Country, County and Town would be nice..

BT

Geddit!

[David Megginson]

Peter Gottlieb wrote:

>>Not everyone knows where "Boston or Mansfield" is...
>
> I can understand not knowing where Mansfield is, but Boston?
>
> I thought it was the Americans who were supposed to be "geographically
> challenged."

The city of Boston, MA, USA is named after the town of Boston, Lincs., UK.
I think that was the original poster's point -- which Boston?


All the best,


David

[tony]

>
>The city of Boston, MA, USA is named after the town of Boston, Lincs., UK.

People in Boston might tell you the name is a contraction of Saint Boylston's
Town.

The intersting thing is, when discussing Boston, no one has mentioned the real
risk of that city. It's driving. In Boston, it's a blood sport. Turn signals?
that's giving information to the enemy. There are actully a few intesections
that meet at 90 degrees, but, keeping in mind the streets followed the
origional cow paths, and the cows had a bad sense of direction, driving and
right of way is an adventure.

Then you have to park. I remember, it is considered bad taste to triple park,
unless you're connected. Double parking is OK.

In NYC when traffic is merging to get into a tunnel, there's this funny notion
that cars take turns. The guy on the right goes, then the guy on the left. In
Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.

Drivers are much more polite in Dallas or Houston, but I think that's because
you're never sure if the guy in the car you're thinking about cutting off has a
gun.

[Louis L. Perley III]

"tony" > wrote in message
...
> >
> >The city of Boston, MA, USA is named after the town of Boston, Lincs.,
UK.
>
> People in Boston might tell you the name is a contraction of Saint
Boylston's
> Town.
>
> The intersting thing is, when discussing Boston, no one has mentioned the
real
> risk of that city. It's driving. In Boston, it's a blood sport. Turn
signals?
> that's giving information to the enemy. There are actully a few
intesections
> that meet at 90 degrees, but, keeping in mind the streets followed the
> origional cow paths, and the cows had a bad sense of direction, driving
and
> right of way is an adventure.
>
> Then you have to park. I remember, it is considered bad taste to triple
park,
> unless you're connected. Double parking is OK.
>
> In NYC when traffic is merging to get into a tunnel, there's this funny
notion
> that cars take turns. The guy on the right goes, then the guy on the left.
In
> Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.
>
> Drivers are much more polite in Dallas or Houston, but I think that's
because
> you're never sure if the guy in the car you're thinking about cutting off
has a
> gun.
>
>

Totally agree. One of the worse experiences I've ever had was going to
Boston on a business trip. We flew into Boston Logan late, and hearing of
the traffic 'rules' for this particular city, was grateful that it was just
past midnight when we finally picked up our rental. Never having been there
only having a rough idea as to where Southborough is relative to the city.
Right after leaving the airport you take this turn that throws you right
into one of those tunnels, I figured we were done for, as we were merging
into one of these with a Semi truck, and he paid no mind that we were there.
I found it absolutely amazing that even at midnight, the tunnel was packed
and only once inside figuring we may have taken a wrong turn and needed to
get out. It took us awhile, but we finally figured things out and were able
to get to our destination. I've never been back since, for while I'm
grateful, although I hear there are parts of Boston that are actually quite
nice (Cambridge area perhaps?)

--
Louis L. Perley III
N46000

[tony]

>. I've never been back since, for while I'm
>grateful, although I hear there are parts of Boston that are actually quite
>nice (Cambridge area perhaps?)
>
>--
>Louis L. Perley III
>N46000
>
In spite of what I had written about driving in Boston, it's a great city and
area to visit. First of all, it's compact, great for walking. The North End is
Italian, clothes lines going from building to building, and it's a short walk
from downtown, Beacon Hill and Louisburg Square, the waterfront, all that good
stuff.

Cambridge on the other hand is someting of a blue collar town, with several
obvious exceptions.

For a truly remarkable experience, though, I recommend you find your way to
Concord, where it might be route 62 that crosses the Concord River, and rent a
canoe. Go downstream to the Old North Bridge, where the shot heard around the
world was fired. It's a magical experience. Go upstream, you'll experience some
of Thoreau's inspiration.

Then there's this: after driving around Boston for awhile, you'll disconver
driving in your home area (unless it's Paris) is like being the 800 pound
gorilla.

BTW, Boston in a snow storm is a graduate class in Offensive Driving.

[Peter Gottlieb]

"S Green" > wrote in message
...
>
> They don't under stand irony too it seems!


Only "heavy" irony, at least in this group.

[Peter Gottlieb]

"tony" > wrote in message
...
>> The intersting thing is, when discussing Boston, no one has mentioned the
real
> risk of that city. It's driving. In Boston, it's a blood sport.

I lived there for over 10 years and the driving "skills" I acquired have
been of immeasureable use to me in other cities. NY cab drivers? No
problem! Tame!

So, how do you think my beat up car got that way?

[G.R. Patterson III]

S Green wrote:
>
> Not everyone knows where "Boston or Mansfield" is... this is a world wide
> posting...

If you're that ignorant of the area, then you should simply ignore the thread. The
original poster was asking for information, and he certainly can't expect that from
you, so why expect him to add a bunch of unnecessary data in order to allow you to
participate?

George Patterson
None of us is as dumb as all of us.

[S Green]

"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> S Green wrote:
> >
> > Not everyone knows where "Boston or Mansfield" is... this is a world
wide
> > posting...
>
> If you're that ignorant of the area, then you should simply ignore the
thread. The
> original poster was asking for information, and he certainly can't expect
that from
> you, so why expect him to add a bunch of unnecessary data in order to
allow you to
> participate?

Totally agree

[tony]

> discussing Boston, no one has mentioned the
>real
>> risk of that city. It's driving. In Boston, it's a blood sport.
>
>I lived there for over 10 years and the driving "skills" I acquired have
>been of immeasureable use to me in other cities. NY cab drivers? No
>problem! Tame!
>
>So, how do you think my beat up car got that way?
>
Ya can't beat it, a fairly good education at a smallish college in Cambridge,
driver's ed (postgraduate level) in Boston. . .

The hardest thing was taking flying lessons with a Boston residing CFI. "You're
supposed to yell 'clear' to warn people," he said, "but man, if you drove out
here from Boston, I don't know how could could."

And then there was the Division of Motor Vehicles.

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
(tony) wrote:

> And then there was the Division of Motor Vehicles.

Registry of Motor Vehicles...

--
Bob Noel

[Cub Driver]

>Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.

Having New Hampshire plates is a big help. The drivers worry that you
don't know the rules, especially if you don't look at them.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
wrote:

> >Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.
>
> Having New Hampshire plates is a big help. The drivers worry that you
> don't know the rules, especially if you don't look at them.

you are making the error of thinking that the Boston driver
actually notices the NH plates.

--
Bob Noel

[tony]

>
>> >Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.
>>
>> Having New Hampshire plates is a big help. The drivers worry that you
>> don't know the rules, especially if you don't look at them.
>
>you are making the error of thinking that the Boston driver
>actually notices the NH plates.
>
Don't you know that you have to be almost a carlength behind someone to be able
to actually see their plates? The half life, in traffic, no matter what the
speed, of a carlength gap is pretty small. You know about precision flying --
in traffic in Boston, it's 'The Thundercars". You may not brief with them, you
may not know their name, but man, 9 out of 10 can pull into a carlength slot
with as much percision as the guy flyuing the number 4 jet.

Read the state ID on the plate? Next to the bunper sticker that says "I got
schrod in Boston"* is the one that says "If you can read this, you're not close
enough".

* yeah, I know it really was on Legal Seafood's tee shirts, and schrod is the
past pluperfect of screw, but Boston is in the home state of Ted Kennedy, so
there's a tradition of taking certain liberties. Now I have to hope most
pilots, even those who live in Massachusetts, are Republicans.

[G.R. Patterson III]

Bob Noel wrote:
>
> In article >,
> wrote:
>
> > >Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.
> >
> > Having New Hampshire plates is a big help. The drivers worry that you
> > don't know the rules, especially if you don't look at them.
>
> you are making the error of thinking that the Boston driver
> actually notices the NH plates.

No, he's making the mistake that there are rules.

George Patterson
None of us is as dumb as all of us.

[Tom A. Carlson]

Bob Noel wrote:

> In article >,
> wrote:
>
> > >Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.
> >
> > Having New Hampshire plates is a big help. The drivers worry that you
> > don't know the rules, especially if you don't look at them.
>
> you are making the error of thinking that the Boston driver
> actually notices the NH plates.

The guy with the NH plates probably IS a Boston driver.

Why bother to register in Mass? High insurance, high fees, high annual
vehicle property taxes.

[Paul Sengupta]

"tony" > wrote in message
...
>There are actully a few intesections
> that meet at 90 degrees, but, keeping in mind the streets followed the
> origional cow paths, and the cows had a bad sense of direction, driving
and
> right of way is an adventure.

That's one of the reasons I could never live in the US. Most of
the roads are just too boring (straight) for a driving enthusiast.

Paul (UK, where most roads apart from motorways and the
occasional Roman Road follow the farmer's path!)

[Peter Gottlieb]

"tony" > wrote in message
...
> Now I have to hope most
> pilots, even those who live in Massachusetts, are Republicans.
>

Mass is pretty Democrat leaning IIRC.

What are you, one of those "single issue" voters? The party is more
important than anything else?

[Cub Driver]

>you are making the error of thinking that the Boston driver
>actually notices the NH plates.

Oh, they notice everything! You only *think* that they are not looking
around them. The trick of driving in Boston is to move your eyes,
never your head. It is pretty much the same theory as not making eye
contact on the NY subway.

I used to flick my parking lights when cars crowded me too close on
the rat-race into Storrow Drive, coming off the Tobin Bridge. The
tailgaters figured I was braking and drew back (those NH plates
again!). But the guvmint ruined that technique when it mandated the
cylop's eye brake light.

I recall my astonishment when I went to Washington DC, and the drivers
actually stopped for me to cross the street. (In a different vein, I
was equally astonished when I went to NYC and found that the cops were
polite!)


all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com

[tony]

>
>I recall my astonishment when I went to Washington DC, and the drivers
>actually stopped for me to cross the street. (In a different vein, I
>was equally astonished when I went to NYC and found that the cops were
>polite!)
>


For real culture shock as a driver, Drive through Boston, park at Logan. Fly to
SFO, and drive in that city. I mean, they actually stop when people step off
the curb to cross the street! I thought it was to give them a chance to get
into the kill zone, but no, those people were allowed to just walk across the
street!

Never saw anything like it. Must be because it's so far from the ocean or
something.

Speaking again of Boston, is Dergan Park (not sure of the spelling) still
training its waitresses to be clerks at the Registry of Motor Vehicles?

[Gary Drescher]

"Cub Driver" > wrote in message
...
> Oh, they notice everything! You only *think* that they are not looking
> around them. The trick of driving in Boston is to move your eyes,
> never your head. It is pretty much the same theory as not making eye
> contact on the NY subway.

The leading cause of traffic accidents in Boston is two cars trying to hit
the same pedestrian.

--Gary

[Pixel Dent]

In article <H1Fuc.30271$Ly.27863@attbi_s01>,
"Gary Drescher" > wrote:

> "Cub Driver" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Oh, they notice everything! You only *think* that they are not looking
> > around them. The trick of driving in Boston is to move your eyes,
> > never your head. It is pretty much the same theory as not making eye
> > contact on the NY subway.
>
> The leading cause of traffic accidents in Boston is two cars trying to hit
> the same pedestrian.
>
> --Gary

The truly amazing thing is that Massachusetts has the lowest traffic
fatality rate and one of the lowest accident rates in the country. I was
never able to figure that one out.

[AES/newspost]

In article >,
(tony) wrote:

> For real culture shock as a driver, Drive through Boston, park at Logan. Fly
> to SFO, and drive in that city. I mean, they actually stop when people step off
> the curb to cross the street! I thought it was to give them a chance to get
> into the kill zone, but no, those people were allowed to just walk across
> the street!

True enough. That's more or less the law in all of California.

But at the same time there's currently a really serious red-light
running problem -- don't slow, don't even look except for a cursory
glance, then bomb on through -- in SF, and it's caused some really nasty
incidents.

[Bob Noel]

In article
>, Pixel
Dent > wrote:

> The truly amazing thing is that Massachusetts has the lowest traffic
> fatality rate and one of the lowest accident rates in the country. I was
> never able to figure that one out.

it must be because everyone is hitting the insurance companies
(apparently MA has the highest claim rate).

--
Bob Noel

[G.R. Patterson III]

Pixel Dent wrote:
>
> The truly amazing thing is that Massachusetts has the lowest traffic
> fatality rate and one of the lowest accident rates in the country. I was
> never able to figure that one out.

Perhaps the Boston area has a very high rate which is balanced by a very low rate in
the rest of the Commonwealth?

George Patterson
None of us is as dumb as all of us.

[tony]

>
>
>> The truly amazing thing is that Massachusetts has the lowest traffic
>> fatality rate and one of the lowest accident rates in the country. I was
>> never able to figure that one out.
>
>it must be because everyone is hitting the insurance companies
>(apparently MA has the highest claim rate).
>
>--
>Bob Noel
>

I think, really, that most time sheet metal is rearranged in MA it's at fairly
low speeds. Those beat up cars lose a lot of their zip early on.

[William W. Plummer]

"Pixel Dent" > wrote in message
. ..
> In article <H1Fuc.30271$Ly.27863@attbi_s01>,
> "Gary Drescher" > wrote:
>
> > "Cub Driver" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Oh, they notice everything! You only *think* that they are not looking
> > > around them. The trick of driving in Boston is to move your eyes,
> > > never your head. It is pretty much the same theory as not making eye
> > > contact on the NY subway.
> >
> > The leading cause of traffic accidents in Boston is two cars trying to
hit
> > the same pedestrian.
> >
> > --Gary
>
> The truly amazing thing is that Massachusetts has the lowest traffic
> fatality rate and one of the lowest accident rates in the country. I was
> never able to figure that one out.

My theory is that our crosssections are very low because of the high driving
speed. So it's like hitting one bullet with another.

[Duck Dog]

On Mon, 31 May 2004 06:34:12 -0400, Cub Driver
> wrote:

>I recall my astonishment when I went to Washington DC, and the drivers
>actually stopped for me to cross the street.

I'm stunned. Someone is actually praising Washington drivers.

Duck Dog -- who's driven around the beltway enough to know better.

[John Baker]

Er.. I believe that its an distortion of "St Bartolph's town", and too its name from
Boston in Linconshire, England. The driving there is better, but on the "wrong side of the
road!".

John Baker

(tony) wrote:

>>
>>The city of Boston, MA, USA is named after the town of Boston, Lincs., UK.
>
>People in Boston might tell you the name is a contraction of Saint Boylston's
>Town.
>
>The intersting thing is, when discussing Boston, no one has mentioned the real
>risk of that city. It's driving. In Boston, it's a blood sport. Turn signals?
>that's giving information to the enemy. There are actully a few intesections
>that meet at 90 degrees, but, keeping in mind the streets followed the
>origional cow paths, and the cows had a bad sense of direction, driving and
>right of way is an adventure.
>
>Then you have to park. I remember, it is considered bad taste to triple park,
>unless you're connected. Double parking is OK.
>
>In NYC when traffic is merging to get into a tunnel, there's this funny notion
>that cars take turns. The guy on the right goes, then the guy on the left. In
>Boston, the guy with the beat up car always has the right of way.
>
>Drivers are much more polite in Dallas or Houston, but I think that's because
>you're never sure if the guy in the car you're thinking about cutting off has a
>gun.
>

[John Baker]

There are said to be two kinds of pedestrians in Boston: the Quick, and the Dead!

[Cub Driver]

> is Dergan Park (not sure of the spelling) still
>training its waitresses to be clerks at the Registry of Motor Vehicles?

I haven't been there (Durgin, I think) since I was in college. Same
with Jakie Wirth's.

I remember red-check tableclothes. Don't remember much about the
waitresses one way or the other. Maybe they were politer then.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com

[Peter Gottlieb]

I always thought of it as a tourist spot. When I was in college my parents
would want to go there when they visited.

I remember it as a very very busy place, cash only, very loud. The staff,
besides always seeming to be in a rush, were normal enough, although I could
see if you were used to a more normal setting you might think them rude.


"Cub Driver" > wrote in message
...
>
> > is Dergan Park (not sure of the spelling) still
> >training its waitresses to be clerks at the Registry of Motor Vehicles?
>
> I haven't been there (Durgin, I think) since I was in college. Same
> with Jakie Wirth's.
>
> I remember red-check tableclothes. Don't remember much about the
> waitresses one way or the other. Maybe they were politer then.
>
> all the best -- Dan Ford
> email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)
>
> The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
> The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com

[Morgans]

"Paul Sengupta" > wrote
>
> That's one of the reasons I could never live in the US. Most of
> the roads are just too boring (straight) for a driving enthusiast.
>
> Paul (UK, where most roads apart from motorways and the
> occasional Roman Road follow the farmer's path!)
>
Only one part of the country is like that. Much of it has more curves and
hills than England ever thought of having!
--
Jim in NC


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.692 / Virus Database: 453 - Release Date: 5/28/2004

[Ash Wyllie]

Paul Sengupta opined

>"tony" > wrote in message
...
>>There are actully a few intesections
>> that meet at 90 degrees, but, keeping in mind the streets followed the
>> origional cow paths, and the cows had a bad sense of direction, driving
>and
>> right of way is an adventure.

>That's one of the reasons I could never live in the US. Most of
>the roads are just too boring (straight) for a driving enthusiast.

>Paul (UK, where most roads apart from motorways and the
>occasional Roman Road follow the farmer's path!)

In England, roads are laid out by following farmers going to the local pub. In
Scotland they followed the farmers leaving the pubs.

By the way, Ive seen Scots, but has anyone ever seen an Eng?


-ash
Cthulhu for President!
Why vote for a lesser evil?

[Peter Clark]

On Sat, 29 May 2004 14:33:44 GMT, "Peter Gottlieb"
> wrote:

>"tony" > wrote in message
...
>>> The intersting thing is, when discussing Boston, no one has mentioned the
>real
>> risk of that city. It's driving. In Boston, it's a blood sport.
>
>I lived there for over 10 years and the driving "skills" I acquired have
>been of immeasureable use to me in other cities. NY cab drivers? No
>problem! Tame!

Yea, it is amazing. If I drive in Boston like I drive in New Jersey
I'd never get anywhere. If I drive in New Jersey like I drive in
Boston I'd lose my license in a week...

[Peter Clark]

On Mon, 31 May 2004 02:46:57 GMT, "Peter Gottlieb"
> wrote:

>
>Mass is pretty Democrat leaning IIRC

Which makes the effective closure of Boston, MA, USA and the
surrounding communities for the Democratic convention even more
mind-boggling. I mean sheesh, look at a map. Go on Interstate 93
north to Woburn (where it meets Route 128/I-95). Now, go back south,
through boston, to Braintree (where it splits off at Route 3).
They're effectively closing that entire stretch of highway. Not to
mention what that'll do to I-90 (Mass Pike) and Storrow Drive and the
rest of the ways to get to Logan. I'd wager that if it was the
Republican convention they wouldn't even think of doing this.

[Roger Halstead]

On Thu, 03 Jun 2004 09:21:14 -0400, Peter Clark
> wrote:

>On Sat, 29 May 2004 14:33:44 GMT, "Peter Gottlieb"
> wrote:
>
>>"tony" > wrote in message
...
>>>> The intersting thing is, when discussing Boston, no one has mentioned the
>>real
>>> risk of that city. It's driving. In Boston, it's a blood sport.
>>
>>I lived there for over 10 years and the driving "skills" I acquired have
>>been of immeasureable use to me in other cities. NY cab drivers? No
>>problem! Tame!
>
>Yea, it is amazing. If I drive in Boston like I drive in New Jersey
>I'd never get anywhere. If I drive in New Jersey like I drive in
>Boston I'd lose my license in a week...

How about the "round about" just on the North side of Boston? I think
three express ways come into it. No stop signs and no stop lights. You
best be in the proper lane at the proper moment, or you either turn
where you don't want to, or you won't be able to turn at all. It was
pretty much OK during the day, but rush hour was an experience.

I remember stopping at a red light and having a kid pass me on the
sidewalk. (in a car)

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

[Dan Truesdell]

Roger Halstead wrote:
[snip]


>
> How about the "round about" just on the North side of Boston? I think
> three express ways come into it. No stop signs and no stop lights. You
> best be in the proper lane at the proper moment, or you either turn
> where you don't want to, or you won't be able to turn at all. It was
> pretty much OK during the day, but rush hour was an experience.
>
> I remember stopping at a red light and having a kid pass me on the
> sidewalk. (in a car)
>

If you are talking about the RT 60/107 Rotary, I concur. It's been
voted the worst intersection in the greater Boston area by the cabbies.
I used to commute through there every day. On three occasions, I came
within inches of T-Boning a car that failed to yield right of way. Two
of these cars opting not to follow the traffic laws were cops. Just up
the road (on 107) there was a sign that read, "Obey signal. Wait for
green."

I did find that the Boston traffic was great practice for driving almost
anywhere else. (Center of Doublin, left side of the road, rush hour:
no problem.) Finishing up my private at BED (Hanscom Field) prepared me
to fly just about anywhere that's busy, too.

--
Remove "2PLANES" to reply.

[Peter Clark]

On Thu, 03 Jun 2004 20:14:15 -0400, Dan Truesdell
> wrote:

>I did find that the Boston traffic was great practice for driving almost
>anywhere else. (Center of Doublin, left side of the road, rush hour:
>no problem.)

I seem to remember hearing/reading that the first ever traffic ticket
written here was issued in NY for someone from MA operating their
horse and carriage on the wrong side of the street back when it wasn't
standardized.....

>Finishing up my private at BED (Hanscom Field) prepared me
>to fly just about anywhere that's busy, too.

Yea, friday afternoons in the summer with a bunch of student pilots
doing pattern work, the jets trying to get in and pick up or out with
weekend vacationers, and a trainee tower controller can be quite the
challenge..