First flying experience for young child

[Dave]

Howdy all,

I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.

I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
consider taking her for a ride.

Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
possible?

Thanks in advance!
Dave M.

[Morgans]

"Dave" *m> wrote

> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day.

> Dave M.

I taught a dog to learn to ride a motorcycle with me, using positive
reinforcement, and acclimatization, to make it a very enjoyable thing for
her. I feel there is much that could be transferred, in taking a small
child for their first rides, so that it is not terrifying, and even
enjoyable, and looked forward to.

At first, put the child into the plane, and do nothing but get her used to
the airport atmosphere, noise, and small quarters. Figure out what is a
reward, for the immediate, like coloring books, or candy, or whatever. The
next time, start the same way, with the reinforcement, then add starting the
engine, but go nowhere. Next time, taxi around some and do a runup. Next
time, try the flight, but pick a smooth day, once around the pattern, and
land. All the time, keep that distraction, and positive reinforcement
going. If you push too hard, and scare her, all is lost; back up and work
up again.

It must be fun for her, on her level. In time, the other joys may grow.

Others will tell you about the other stuff; I wanted to cover the "mind"
part.
--
Jim in NC


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[Dan Truesdell]

We took our daughter up when she was three. We figured that this was an
age where she would really appreciate the concept. She had been in the
plane a few times before while on the ground, and had a few flights
commercially as well. (On one, we were in the front row of a BAE 320
IIRC. The captain gave us a set of headphones so we could listen in.
She thought that was great.)

When we took her up, I had her in the back seat (in a booster seat that
we use in the car) with mom right next to her in case the flight did not
turn out as planned. Her first comment was "Boy, are we high up!". It
was all downhill from there. The only problem now is that mom is
relegated to the back seat when ever we go anywhere. Our daughter is
now 7, and jumps at the chance to go flying.

Sigtronics does sell a headphone set with a shorter headband, along with
a replacement band when an adult size is needed (got them from Sportys).
We use a chair cushion so she can see better. (I would love to have a
thicker cushion, but that interferes with the control wheel. 1964 C172)
She can handle the plane pretty well, given her 7-year-old size. Good
luck.

Dave wrote:
> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
> license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.
>
> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
> possible?
>
> Thanks in advance!
> Dave M.


--
Remove "2PLANES" to reply.

[Jay Honeck]

> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as

Mary (my wife, also a pilot) and I have been flying with our kids pretty
much since birth. (They're now 10 and 14.)

Flying with a very small child is simple: All you've got to do is buckle the
car seat in and go. They won't differentiate between riding in the car, and
riding in the plane.

Your main concern is the noise in the cabin, as very young children simply
do not want to wear headphones, and will do anything to get them off. We
eventually gave up trying, and simply used ear-plugs...

....which presented ANOTHER problem, in that little kids will do almost
anything to remove ear-plugs. Our solution was to put them in a hooded
sweat-shirt or jacket, and lace up the hood tightly around their little
faces. This effectively prevents them from removing the ear-plugs, and you
can fly without worrying about their hearing. (Of course, this doesn't work
when it's hot out.)

Within minutes they usually fall asleep anyway! :-)

> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.

I would start taking her flying NOW, and just make it a normal part of her
life. As she matures she will gradually become aware of her surroundings,
and -- since she'll have been flying all of her life -- there will be no
chance for fear or discomfort to develop.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Paul Hamilton]

We started taking our daughter along on flights when she was six
months old. She is nearly six years old now, and has been all over,
including one coast-to-coast round trip.

First step is to go to a gun store and pick up a pair of child-sized
ear protectors. These are like a headset without electronics. They
are very comfortable and adust all the way to infant size. Add a car
seat, and you are ready to go. Make sure the car seat is FAA approved
for aviation use. Our first flight was to a restaurant a half mile
away.

We kept a car seat in the airplane until she outgrew it last year.
Since then, she sits in the back on a thick pillow. She also
graduated to a real headset (Lightspeed ANR) so that she can listen to
her favorite music and talk with us while in flight.

Bring along a supply of toys. For longer trips, bring along a few new
toys, books, etc, and present them as surprises.

Up until about the age of three, she slept for most of all flights.
At about that time, she started getting interested in things out the
window.

Paul

[Ross Richardson]

I took my 2 year old grandson in my Skyhawk. I put the carseat in the
back and lock it in. Not very user friendly getting the buckle locked
and unlocked behind the carseat, but doable. I built some extenders that
fit on the headphone headband and will raise the headset about 3/4 of an
inch, which is enough to let them fit. They are made out of foam and
cloth and afix with velcro. Works great. I came up with the idea when I
fly EAA young eagles. He loves it when he can go flying with grandpa. I
also fly my 5 year old and 9 year old grand daughters.

Ross

Dave wrote:
>
> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
> license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.
>
> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
> possible?
>
> Thanks in advance!
> Dave M.

[Captain Wubba]

Hello,

Our son Alexander is almost 8 months old. He took his first flight in
our Beech Musketeer when he was 4 months old. He's been up 5 or 6
times since. We just use his normal car seat in the rear seat of the
plane. I bought a child's 'shooters' hearing protector at Dick's
Sporting Goods for $10. It adjusts and seals fine; supposedly it is
rated at 24 db noise reduction, which is better than the passive
reduction on my aviation headset. He ends up going to sleep very
quickly; he seems to like the vibration. I try not to climb or descend
more than 300 FPM. ATC has always been accomodating when I've had to
ask for a slower climb. We keep a bottle or sippy cup handy in case he
wakes up and needs to suck on something to equalize the pressure in
his ears.

We haven't had the slighest problem with him. I just wish all my
passengers were as well behaved as Alex. All my other passengers are
constantly complaining: "What's that F-16 doing off your wing?", "Are
we supposed to be upside down?", "Why did the tower tell you to
prepare to copy a phone number down?", "What do you mean you landed at
the wrong airport?"...whine, whine, whine...Alex just sits there and
sleeps. I'm sure your little one will do great :)

Cheers,

Cap


Dave *m> wrote in message >...
> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
> license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.
>
> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
> possible?
>
> Thanks in advance!
> Dave M.

[Jørn Reidel]

"Dave" *m> wrote in message
...
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.

There is no problem to bring small kids/infants. My boy was 3 months
the first time (2 hours cross country), Oslo to Stockholm. It is
important to use a proper car seat, and to test it before the flight
(to be sure that you are able to use the planes seatbelts).



Use ear-protection!! You can not be absolutely sure about their
hearing, so I recommend the Peltor Kid Eardefender or the Pilot P51C
headset if he/she can talk. Do not use ear-plugs on infants; at least
discuss it with your doctor. If your kid refuses to use any ear
protection, put it on when he/she falls asleep (if you are to adults,
or have an autopilot.).



Happy flying,





-Jorn

[A Lieberman]

On Wed, 08 Sep 2004 00:50:05 -0400, Dave wrote:

> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
> license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.

Hey Dave,

Never too young! Took my nephew up when he was 1 1/2 years old. All he
does now is walk and talks airplanes much to my sisters chagrin. I think
he has been smitten by the aviation bug.

Car seat should fit the bill. I had bought him a child size headset which
he wears without any problems.

His first "cross country" was when he turned two years old. His father
remembered everything except for something to drink. Kids I think will
dehydrate quicker.

We put him in the back seat and toward the end of his first cross country,
he did get figity, but we just pulled the microphone plug out so he was no
longer a distraction for listening to ATC.

So, in a nutshell, if flight is longer then 1/2 hour, food, drink and maybe
a hand held toy. My newphew was happy looking out the window at the clouds
go by so he didn't need a toy.

Allen

[Newps]

Dave wrote:

> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
> license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.
>
> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
> possible?
>

Put her in a car seat and you have a 90% chance the kid will fall right
asleep immediately aftert takeoff.

[Sloan Essman]

My 2 boys were 6 months and 4 months old on their first flights. The oldest
will be 3 on Sept 11 and he wears a child headset from Softcom. We got it
at avshop.com. Sometimes he wants to wear it, sometimes he doesn't.

http://www.avshop.com/catalog/product.html?productid=4275&categoryid=127

For the youngest, we just use some very soft earplugs and either a cap for
headband to help keep them in. We've used the Macks silicone earplugs a few
times, but I don't personally think that putting in the adult size are very
comfortable to my own ears, so we've stopped using them on the kids.

For the seats, we just use the seats out of the trucks after we checked that
they had the sticker on them that says something about being "approved for
airplane usage".

"Dave" *m> wrote in message
...
> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
> license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.
>
> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
> possible?
>
> Thanks in advance!
> Dave M.

[C J Campbell]

Many headset manufacturers make child headsets. I have a couple of Softcomm
child headsets. They are useful not only for children, but also adults that
have very small heads (you know who you are).

Car seats work very well in most small planes.

When you have small children on board, make your descents very slowly. The
planes are unpressurized. I know of one guy who ruptured both of his kids'
eardrums by hot dogging the descent.

Small children have short attention spans, so don't make the flight too
long. If you are taking them on a long trip, make sure they have something
to do.

Kids like airplanes because they have not yet watched enough Hollywood junk
to make them afraid. They think it is cool that every seat is a window seat.

[Morgans]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message

> I would start taking her flying NOW, and just make it a normal part of her
> life. As she matures she will gradually become aware of her surroundings,
> and -- since she'll have been flying all of her life -- there will be no
> chance for fear or discomfort to develop.
> --
> Jay Honeck

Good point. That is another way to go.
--
Jim in NC


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[Capt.Doug]

>"Dave" wrote in message What else did you do to make the flight as
>enjoyable as possible?

I take my 2 year-old with me on trips quite often. On one trip he sat on the
laps of the swimsuit models and drew pictures with them. While deplaning,
one model asked if she could take him home. I replied it was a package deal.
The deal fell through.

D.

[Grasshopper]

Capt.Doug wrote:
> I take my 2 year-old with me on trips quite often. On one trip he sat
> on the laps of the swimsuit models and drew pictures with them. While
> deplaning, one model asked if she could take him home. I replied it
> was a package deal. The deal fell through.

Dang. I was rooting for you. You'll get 'em next time!


--
____________________________
Ah, Young Grasshopper.
Sometimes it is eyes that blind a man.

[Effie Andree Wiltens]

> eventually gave up trying, and simply used ear-plugs...
>
> ...which presented ANOTHER problem, in that little kids will do almost
> anything to remove ear-plugs. Our solution was to put them in a hooded
> sweat-shirt or jacket, and lace up the hood tightly around their little
> faces. This effectively prevents them from removing the ear-plugs, and you
> can fly without worrying about their hearing. (Of course, this doesn't work
> when it's hot out.)

A small note about earplugs... I don't think it's wise to use them if
you're not sure whether the wearer may remove them at high altitude
and if there is a chance the earplugs may be put back in at altitude
and not removed until after landing. Ears can get damaged in that
way!
Make sure that whoever uses earplugs in your plane understands the
risks. At what age would a child understand as well as remember?

I have a friend who took his daughter up from the time she was a baby.
He is a flight instructor, she has been his youngest pupil at the age
of five. She has always used headsets.

Effie.

[H.P.]

Make sure you use a car seat and PROTECT HER EARS, even to the extent of
using a headset AND earplugs.

see:
http://www.earplugsonline.com/index.html
http://www.etymotic.com/ephp/erme.asp\
http://www.hear-more.com/musician.htm



"Dave" *m> wrote in message
...
> Howdy all,
>
> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
> forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
> license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.
>
> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
> possible?
>
> Thanks in advance!
> Dave M.

[John Ousterhout]

My Grandson is crazy about airplanes. Before he was 2 he'd sit and
"read" my aviation magazines, turning the pages from front to back.
He has a bunch of toy planes and loves them. He likes to look at
planes flying.

Right after his 2nd birthday I took him for a flight in the 172. I
put him (in his car seat) in back and his Mom beside him. He enjoyed
the flight, although he kept trying to take his headset off and he did
fall asleep after about 30 minutes.

The part he still talks about was the preflight inspection because he
got to walk around the airplane and touch it everywhere.

- J.O.-

On Wed, 08 Sep 2004 00:50:05 -0400, Dave *m> wrote:

>Howdy all,
>
>I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) who I am looking
>forward to taking up in a plane some day. I have a private pilot's
>license and typically fly C172s, Pipers, etc.
>
>I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
>understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
>consider taking her for a ride.
>
>Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
>about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
>there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
>first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
>possible?
>
>Thanks in advance!
>Dave M.

[Andrew Gideon]

John Ousterhout wrote:

> The part he still talks about was the preflight inspection because he
> got to walk around the airplane and touch it everywhere.

Hey, thanks!

My Alexander just passed his second birthday. He's flown with us a few
times, and is mostly in the "falls asleep" class for now.

But I've always taken care to preflight before he arrives, thinking it best
to "keep him moving". You've caused me to rethink that.

- Andrew

[Snowbird]

Dave *m> wrote in message >...

> I have a young daughter (currently 17 months old) <...>
> I feel she's too young right now, but as soon as she's old enough to
> understand most anything we (my wife and I) say to her, we will
> consider taking her for a ride.

> Has anyone else taking their youngin' for their first flight? What
> about seating (carseat compatibility in abovementioned planes)? Are
> there headsets for smaller heads? (I didn't see any at Sporty's, at
> first look). What else did you do to make the flight as enjoyable as
> possible?

Hi Dave,

I'm not sure what you're looking for in age? We took my daughter for
her first airplane flight when she was 12 weeks old. Basically as soon
as she could look out the window, she seemed to enjoy looking at
clouds, boats on the river below, etc. Her major complaint is "tiggerplane
hurts my ears".

We started out using a high-quality muff-style shooting hearing protector
(Tasco Golden Eagle is one brand that will work, Peltor something II is
another). These adjust small width-wise, and we filled in the top with
soft foam covered with knit fabric (top of an old cotton sock will do if
you're not skilled in sewing). If you want your child to be able to talk
on the intercom or hear you talk, several headset makers make a child
size version. I know Sigtronics does, and Peltor. But we use again,
and adult headset with the top filled in as necessary. At age 4, no
filling-in.

Bring something for your child to suck during climb-out and descent.
Bottle, juice box, sucker depending on age. If the nose is running administer
decongestant.

Carseats are a "measure it and see" thing. Not obvious -- make sure
seatbelt in the plane will actually fit when you're checking. Our
seatbelts fit the infant seat and the forward-facing carseat but don't
fit the same seat when used as a booster. We had to get a different
booster. You may need some foam "noodles" and tightly-rolled towels
to get a good fit, so bring along a stash when you test the fit. In
our experience, the thing most likely to have a problem is the rear-seat
passenger next to the child.

My daughter was 4 before we started leaving her in back by herself.
Before that one of us always sat next to her to take care of diaper
changes/feeding snacks/amusement (maybe not an issue if you're only
talking short hops).

I'm trying to remember how old our daughter was the first time we let
her sit up front and touch the controls. 2 1/2 or 3 I think. She
still can't see over the panel. Anyway, the point: put the child in
front only with the greatest of caution and a high degree of confidence
that they've reached the age where they will listen to you reliably.
And just in case one of us rides in back with instructions to pop
the seatbelt and haul her into the back at the first sign of not listening.
I have yet to find a carseat that will fit in the front of the plane
and not interfere with the yoke. We just use cushions to boost her to
the height where the shoulder belt fits reasonably.

Hope this helps, any other questions please ask.

Cheers,
Sydney