airnav?

[Hankal]

I had reported on my trip to Georgia a few days ago.
Now the rest of the story. I used Airnav for the cheapest fuel stops.
Also used it to get my motel at Days Inn with the discount on Airnav.
When I called for my reservation the gentle man quoted a price of $71.00.
I told him I could get a better price and he stated I would get the room for
$65.00 Tax included.
When I checked in at the Day Inn they told me that I had 2 rooms reserved, I
assured them I only required one room.
When I checked out they ask if I wanted to pay now with my credit card or be
billed by Hotel.com. I paid by credit card and the price was $44.75
Now I get my credit card statement and it has a charge of $71.00
Of course I called Hotel.com and they ask that I fax the credit card statement
and the paid bill from Days INN.
My point is that one can spend a lot more money by ordering over the Internet
than going directly to the motel.
And now you know the rest of the story.
Hank 172 driver

[Jay Honeck]

> My point is that one can spend a lot more money by ordering over the
> Internet
> than going directly to the motel.

Hank, you have discovered the reason we (and many lodging establishments) do
NOT use booking agents like "Hotels.com" and "Priceline" or "Travelocity".
Like so many things that seem too good to be true, these companies are just
another rip-off. Each of these glorified booking agents demand up to 30%
of each reservation, which means that you, the consumer, are going to pay
more for those rooms in the long run.

I especially cringe at the commercials that portray "Hotels.com" as some
sort of an organization that goes out and checks each hotel to make sure
that they meet some sort of consumer standards. What a joke! All they
want is money, and they will say anything you want them to say in exchange
for cold, hard cash.

Take my advice -- follow these steps to get the best possible room rates at
any hotel, in any city:

1. Go on-line to the local Convention and Visitor's Bureau for the area you
wish to stay. (Smaller towns may only have Chambers of Commerce)
2. ALL reputable lodging establishments belong to one or both of these
groups.
3. You should be able to find any local hotel's website or phone number at
either of these two sites.
4. Find the LOCAL hotel number -- never call the 800 number.
5. Ask to speak to the owner or manager when you make your reservation. Only
they are authorized to give you the best rate.

Avoid the chain motels at all costs -- they are the biggest rip-off of all.
(See: "Holiday Inn Express" for the most blatant rip-off in the history of
lodging.)

Any hotel with an extra couple of words in front of the chain's name (I.E.:
"Plaza Center Holiday Inn" or "Five Seasons Hilton") is going to take you to
the cleaners worse than a turboprop FBO -- avoid them at all costs. Seek
out the privately -- and locally -- owned hotels. Call the Convention
center and ask the people who answer the phone which hotels are privately
owned AND OPERATED, versus which ones are run remotely by a chain through an
on-site manager. They will know, and this simple difference in management
makes all the difference in the world.

Chain hotels, by definition, must send between 10 and 15% of each booking
back to the chain owner. Now combine this with "Hotels.com" and you are
looking at paying 40% to 45% MORE to stay in an equivalent room at a chain
hotel, as compared with a privately owned hotel. The math is simple, and
it is only the genius of marketing that has blinded the consumer to this
fact.

Finally, aside from the price, you get the coolest stays in privately owned
and operated hotels. We've found some truly unique lodging establishments
by following the procedure I've outlined above.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[The Weiss Family]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:uxEgd.274280$wV.218211@attbi_s54...
>> My point is that one can spend a lot more money by ordering over the
>> Internet
>> than going directly to the motel.
>
> Hank, you have discovered the reason we (and many lodging establishments)
> do NOT use booking agents like "Hotels.com" and "Priceline" or
> "Travelocity". Like so many things that seem too good to be true, these
> companies are just another rip-off. Each of these glorified booking
> agents demand up to 30% of each reservation, which means that you, the
> consumer, are going to pay more for those rooms in the long run.
>
> I especially cringe at the commercials that portray "Hotels.com" as some
> sort of an organization that goes out and checks each hotel to make sure
> that they meet some sort of consumer standards. What a joke! All they
> want is money, and they will say anything you want them to say in exchange
> for cold, hard cash.
>
> Take my advice -- follow these steps to get the best possible room rates
> at any hotel, in any city:
>
> 1. Go on-line to the local Convention and Visitor's Bureau for the area
> you wish to stay. (Smaller towns may only have Chambers of Commerce)
> 2. ALL reputable lodging establishments belong to one or both of these
> groups.
> 3. You should be able to find any local hotel's website or phone number at
> either of these two sites.
> 4. Find the LOCAL hotel number -- never call the 800 number.
> 5. Ask to speak to the owner or manager when you make your reservation.
> Only they are authorized to give you the best rate.
>
> Avoid the chain motels at all costs -- they are the biggest rip-off of
> all. (See: "Holiday Inn Express" for the most blatant rip-off in the
> history of lodging.)
>
> Any hotel with an extra couple of words in front of the chain's name
> (I.E.: "Plaza Center Holiday Inn" or "Five Seasons Hilton") is going to
> take you to the cleaners worse than a turboprop FBO -- avoid them at all
> costs. Seek out the privately -- and locally -- owned hotels. Call the
> Convention center and ask the people who answer the phone which hotels are
> privately owned AND OPERATED, versus which ones are run remotely by a
> chain through an on-site manager. They will know, and this simple
> difference in management makes all the difference in the world.
>
> Chain hotels, by definition, must send between 10 and 15% of each booking
> back to the chain owner. Now combine this with "Hotels.com" and you are
> looking at paying 40% to 45% MORE to stay in an equivalent room at a chain
> hotel, as compared with a privately owned hotel. The math is simple,
> and it is only the genius of marketing that has blinded the consumer to
> this fact.
>
> Finally, aside from the price, you get the coolest stays in privately
> owned and operated hotels. We've found some truly unique lodging
> establishments by following the procedure I've outlined above.
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>

Jay,

Yet another reason I love rec.aviation.
These kinds of golden nuggets are priceless.

Adam

[Peter Duniho]

"The Weiss Family" > wrote in message
...
> Yet another reason I love rec.aviation.
> These kinds of golden nuggets are priceless.

While there's a lot of truth in what Jay writes, remember that he is not an
unbiased source of information.

Having traveled the entire US on a variety of occasions, including one two
month trip in which most of that time was spent in paid lodging of one sort
or the other, I can say definitively that pretty much all of the absolutes
in Jay's post are wrong at least some of the time.

Regardless of the financials (where Jay assumes that chain hotels always
cost more than non-chain hotels, which is just not true all of the time),
one also needs to consider the value of one's time. Would you rather spend
your time vacationing? Or trying to chase down lodging for your next
night's stay?

Chain hotels, with nationwide toll-free numbers, make it VERY easy to not
only find a place to stay, but also to figure out what city to stay in
(when, for example, one city is completely booked due to some event you
didn't know about). It's "one-stop-shopping", and in addition chain hotels
provide a very consistent lodging experience. Yes, there's variation, and
yes there are non-chain hotels that crush the chains with respect to comfort
and service. But it's very hard to know in advance which non-chain hotels
are actually going to do that.

I certainly think it's worth seeking out non-chain hotels, and they often
provide pleasant surprises at good prices. But they are not the "end all,
be all" when it comes to finding a place to overnight.

Jay's advice will serve you best when you are going to exactly one place,
are doing all the planning ahead of the trip, and expect to stay for several
days or more. It will waste the most time, and even possibly money, when
you are traveling for several days or more, staying in a new place each
night, especially when you cannot plan before the trip (due, for example, to
having a schedule that depends on how each day of the trip goes).

As always, beware the person who says "always". :) The real world is
almost never so cut and dried.

Pete

[Andrew Sarangan]

I don't know about Hotels.com, but I have had generally good experience
with priceline.com. Sometimes I've stayed at the Hilton for much less
than what it costs to stay at a Motel6. I don't pretend to understand
the inner workings of hotel booking, so I don't know how they priceline
is able to offer these rates. When I am traveling, I am looking for
convenience, clean, fast and cheap. I am not looking for an exceptional
hoteling experience. Independently run hotels may be a great bargain,
but they are not well known outside a small circle. Some independent
hotels may cater to a specialty crowd with exceptional service, such as
Jay's hotel, and may be well known within that circle. But the average
traveler outside that circle may not have the time or patience to seek
out such hotels.





"Jay Honeck" > wrote in
news:uxEgd.274280$wV.218211@attbi_s54:

>> My point is that one can spend a lot more money by ordering over the
>> Internet
>> than going directly to the motel.
>
> Hank, you have discovered the reason we (and many lodging
> establishments) do NOT use booking agents like "Hotels.com" and
> "Priceline" or "Travelocity". Like so many things that seem too good
> to be true, these companies are just another rip-off. Each of these
> glorified booking agents demand up to 30% of each reservation, which
> means that you, the consumer, are going to pay more for those rooms in
> the long run.
>
> I especially cringe at the commercials that portray "Hotels.com" as
> some sort of an organization that goes out and checks each hotel to
> make sure that they meet some sort of consumer standards. What a
> joke! All they want is money, and they will say anything you want
> them to say in exchange for cold, hard cash.
>
> Take my advice -- follow these steps to get the best possible room
> rates at any hotel, in any city:
>
> 1. Go on-line to the local Convention and Visitor's Bureau for the
> area you wish to stay. (Smaller towns may only have Chambers of
> Commerce) 2. ALL reputable lodging establishments belong to one or
> both of these groups.
> 3. You should be able to find any local hotel's website or phone
> number at either of these two sites.
> 4. Find the LOCAL hotel number -- never call the 800 number.
> 5. Ask to speak to the owner or manager when you make your
> reservation. Only they are authorized to give you the best rate.
>
> Avoid the chain motels at all costs -- they are the biggest rip-off of
> all. (See: "Holiday Inn Express" for the most blatant rip-off in the
> history of lodging.)
>
> Any hotel with an extra couple of words in front of the chain's name
> (I.E.: "Plaza Center Holiday Inn" or "Five Seasons Hilton") is going
> to take you to the cleaners worse than a turboprop FBO -- avoid them
> at all costs. Seek out the privately -- and locally -- owned hotels.
> Call the Convention center and ask the people who answer the phone
> which hotels are privately owned AND OPERATED, versus which ones are
> run remotely by a chain through an on-site manager. They will know,
> and this simple difference in management makes all the difference in
> the world.
>
> Chain hotels, by definition, must send between 10 and 15% of each
> booking back to the chain owner. Now combine this with "Hotels.com"
> and you are looking at paying 40% to 45% MORE to stay in an equivalent
> room at a chain hotel, as compared with a privately owned hotel.
> The math is simple, and it is only the genius of marketing that has
> blinded the consumer to this fact.
>
> Finally, aside from the price, you get the coolest stays in privately
> owned and operated hotels. We've found some truly unique lodging
> establishments by following the procedure I've outlined above.


Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
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[Jay Honeck]

> Jay's advice will serve you best when you are going to exactly one place,
> are doing all the planning ahead of the trip, and expect to stay for
> several days or more.

Very true. Their are exceptions to every rule.

If you're on a road trip, and are merely looking for a brief roof over your
head, a Super 8 at the freeway exit is hard to beat. We (and most privately
owned hotels) will NEVER be able to compete head-to-head with the econobox
"McHotels" -- nor should we.

But if you're looking for service, space, and amenities, we will blow away
the chain competition. Our SMALLEST suite, at $59.95 per night, is larger
than the Sheraton's BIGGEST suite, at over $200 per night. And we deliver
breakfast to your suite as part of the cost.

(We stayed at a chain hotel in Wisconsin this past summer that wanted $40 to
deliver the EXACT same continental breakfast to our suite that we throw in
as part of your $59.95 cost!)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Kyler Laird]

(Hankal) writes:

>My point is that one can spend a lot more money by ordering over the Internet
>than going directly to the motel.

The opposite is also true. We flew in somewhere in the Colorado
area and I looked up hotels on my phone. It was late and we were
just going to fly out the next day so I picked something cheap.
We drove a courtesy car there and my wife checked us in.

It was much more expensive than the quoted price. They told her
they only give that price for reservations made online.

--kyler

[Chuck]

"Andrew Sarangan" > wrote in message
. 145...
> I don't know about Hotels.com, but I have had generally good experience
> with priceline.com. Sometimes I've stayed at the Hilton for much less
> than what it costs to stay at a Motel6. I don't pretend to understand
> the inner workings of hotel booking, so I don't know how they priceline
> is able to offer these rates. When I am traveling, I am looking for
> convenience, clean, fast and cheap. I am not looking for an exceptional
> hoteling experience. Independently run hotels may be a great bargain,
> but they are not well known outside a small circle. Some independent
> hotels may cater to a specialty crowd with exceptional service, such as
> Jay's hotel, and may be well known within that circle. But the average
> traveler outside that circle may not have the time or patience to seek
> out such hotels.
>

<snip>

In Jay's previous post, he said *never* call the 800 number, but to always
book via the local number for the hotel/motel.

In the bit of travel that I have done, which consists of mainly family
vacations, etc., I always check the internet first, then call the 800 number
and then call the local number. In my case, I have better luck with the
internet or the 800 number, infact, I guess that the 800 number has served
me the best. I will inform them that the internet quoted me a price, and
they normally beat it by a few dollars.

The only problem with staying at a independent hotel/motel, is that I have
seen some "trashy" ones. I feel that if I stick with a chain such as La
Quinta or Best Western, I have a better chance of a nicer room, although
that isn't always the case.

We stayed in Houston weekend, booked at the Sheraton at around $150 per
night. We get to the room. No TV remote, no hot water, construction going on
real close to our room. We were tired and just wanted to go to shower and go
to bed. I ended up trying to call around and look for another hotel. Phone
wouldn't work. Front desk said that I had to make a $20 deposit to use the
phone. Anyway, we found a Hilton for $79 per night. *Much* nicer place!

When we stay in Galveston, the *always* stay at an certain independently
owned motel there. It's got large, clean rooms, overlooking the beach, and
cost about half of anywhere else on the beach.



---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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[Jay Honeck]

> In the bit of travel that I have done, which consists of mainly family
> vacations, etc., I always check the internet first, then call the 800
> number
> and then call the local number. In my case, I have better luck with the
> internet or the 800 number, infact, I guess that the 800 number has served
> me the best. I will inform them that the internet quoted me a price, and
> they normally beat it by a few dollars.

That's why I said to ask for the manager or owner when you call the local
number.

The poor desk staff clerk is not authorized to go down more than 20%. The
owner or manager can do whatever the hell he wants, up to and including
FREE. Those are the folks to talk to -- otherwise you're just wasting your
breath.

Now, of course, if it's a busy weekend, with few openings, you might not do
any better than anywhere else. Ask me for a room on the weekend Iowa plays
Purdue, and I will quote you a price hundreds of dollars HIGHER than normal,
with a 2-night minimum stay. As with all things, supply and demand rules.

But, in general, my advice will save you big bucks, and will get you better
rooms.

> The only problem with staying at a independent hotel/motel, is that I have
> seen some "trashy" ones. I feel that if I stick with a chain such as La
> Quinta or Best Western, I have a better chance of a nicer room, although
> that isn't always the case.

True, the "Bate's Motels" are out there. But, in my experience, more likely
than not, they are chain motels.

The worst places Mary and I have ever stayed have been chain motels owned
and/or operated by 3rd world immigrants. I'm sure the chains eventually
yank their contracts, but that might take years -- and in the meantime, you,
the paying guest, are subjected to the worst possible experience.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> It was much more expensive than the quoted price. They told her
> they only give that price for reservations made online.

This would ONLY happen at a chain.

When dealing with hotels, always talk to the manager or the owner. The poor
desk clerk is not authorized to go down more than 20%, while the
owner/manager can do whatever he wants -- up to and including FREE.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[VideoGuy]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:iuZgd.279331$wV.144847@attbi_s54...
>
> The worst places Mary and I have ever stayed have been chain motels owned
> and/or operated by 3rd world immigrants. I'm sure the chains eventually
> yank their contracts, but that might take years -- and in the meantime,
you,
> the paying guest, are subjected to the worst possible experience.
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>
Jay,

This has also been our experience. More than once we stopped at one of the
"RamaHoli"Inn and were disappointed. But a R*m*d* Inn in Atlanta, GA has
our current prize for the worst we've EVER encountered. It's late, and we
are tired and need sleep. Long story short, English was not the 1st (or
maybe 2nd) language of the employees. Keys didn't open doors, VERY rude desk
"clerk" seemed annoyed that I should have complained we can't open the damn
door. Room was DIRTY! Carpeting looked like a motorcycle ralley had been
there last. We were soooo glad to get out of there the next morning.

I wrote a letter of complaint to the chain headquarters, and they were
curiously unconcerned. I did receive a postcard from a Mr. Chin, apparently
the local store manager, who offered me a 50% discount on ONE nights stay.
It had to be within 90 days, and I had to bring the postcard with me to get
the "rate". I was disappointed to say the least. I then sent the postcard
to the chain headquarters with another letter suggesting this was poor
customer relations. Still waiting for a reply... But it's only been three
years!

Somehow I believe the R*M*D* Inn HQ doesn't really do much to control the
quality of their stores. That being the case, then WHY would I give them
another shot? If THEY don't care, why should I?

We've absolutely had the BEST service from smaller B&B's, mostly away from
the town's "motel row".

GWK

[MLenoch]

>"Jay Honeck"

wrote:>Ask me for a room on the weekend Iowa plays
>Purdue, and I will quote you a price hundreds of dollars HIGHER than normal,

But, do Purdue alums get a discount?
VL
(Oh Yeah!!)

[Martin Hotze]

On Sun, 31 Oct 2004 04:03:26 GMT, Jay Honeck wrote:

>The poor desk staff clerk is not authorized to go down more than 20%.

you have 20% and more in your calculation? *phew* I should switch to
tourism and rent out some beds [1]. How do you make your calculation? With
an event calendar?

#m

[1] I know how to do it, I grew up in the business.
--
Buck Fush!

[Jay Honeck]

> But, do Purdue alums get a discount?

Vlado, you would be the ONLY Purdue alumnus to EVER receive a hotel discount
on game day in Iowa City -- of that I am certain!

;-)

Of course, your discount would be pretty good, at 100% off! ("Your" suite
still awaits your presence, you know...)

Hey, BTW -- where can we get a copy of the Discovery Wings video where
you're teaching people to fly formation in a Mustang? I've heard about it
in another thread, and we'd like to have one for our guests to borrow during
their stay...

Is it for sale?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Kyler Laird]

"Jay Honeck" > writes:

>> It was much more expensive than the quoted price. They told her
>> they only give that price for reservations made online.

>This would ONLY happen at a chain.

It was. Chains are fairly common in AirNav and it's often easier
for us to locate dog-friendly hotels because we know the chains.
Yes, we typically try to stay in B&Bs/inns when we travel and we
have stayed at some wonderful ones but it's usually the really nice
(expensive) ones that are dog-friendly and that's a bit of a waste
when all I need is a bed for the night.

>When dealing with hotels, always talk to the manager or the owner.

Yeah, I know. I let a lot of things slide - especially when we've
been flying all day, it's late, she's hungry, and I'm finding a
room with three (four back then) dogs. We've received so many
perks when flying with our family that I try not to sweat the
occasional bumps.

--kyler

[MLenoch]

> Discovery Wings video

????

Its in the mail in a few days.......DVD or VHS?

[Jay Honeck]

> Its in the mail in a few days.......DVD or VHS?

Neat-o! It'll make a great addition to the Mustang Suite.

DVD, please. And I'll gladly pay for it!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"