Building a simulator

[Ramapriya]

Any idea how much it might cost to build a simulator at home - say of
a 747?
Also, how good is Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 for use on a desktop
PC? What additional hardware would I require to act as a control
column, rudder pedal, etc.? Inputs welcome, thank you.

Ramapriya

[Chuck]

"Ramapriya" > wrote in message
om...
> Any idea how much it might cost to build a simulator at home - say of
> a 747?
> Also, how good is Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 for use on a desktop
> PC? What additional hardware would I require to act as a control
> column, rudder pedal, etc.? Inputs welcome, thank you.
>
> Ramapriya
>


Are you planning on flying a 747 into the superbowl or something?



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[tony roberts]

Why not ask in rec.aviation.simulators?

Tony

--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Cessna 172H C-GICE

In article >,
(Ramapriya) wrote:

> Any idea how much it might cost to build a simulator at home - say of
> a 747?
> Also, how good is Microsoft Flight Simulator 2004 for use on a desktop
> PC? What additional hardware would I require to act as a control
> column, rudder pedal, etc.? Inputs welcome, thank you.
>
> Ramapriya
>

[Ramapriya]

"Chuck" > wrote in message >...

> Are you planning on flying a 747 into the superbowl or something?

you must be real fun at parties!

Ramapriya

[Morgans]

"Ramapriya" > wrote in message
om...
> "Chuck" > wrote in message
>...
>
> > Are you planning on flying a 747 into the superbowl or something?
>
> you must be real fun at parties!
>
> Ramapriya
>


He was not joking, and was deadly serious with his response, and only said
what many others are thinking.

Most everyone here has been real patient, and answered your questions about
flying, but you are stepping across a line, with this.

You will have to understand that Citizens of the United States are very
suspicious of ANY middle-eastern person, asking about simulators, or wanting
to learn to fly large airliners.

We helped train a number of terrorists, *in* our country, using *our*
aviation training system, to fly off in *our*large planes, with no intent
other than to murder, kill and maim *our* fellow countrymen.

Look at this from our point of view, and I hope you will understand. We
will always be suspicious, and on guard, to never let this happen again. We
really don't know you, so I would doubt if you get many replies on this
subject, from this group. You can no doubt find the answers you seek, but
it will not be this easy, here.
--
Jim in NC


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[Jeff Shirton]

"Morgans" > wrote in message
...

> Most everyone here has been real patient, and answered your
> questions about flying, but you are stepping across a line, with this.
>
> You will have to understand that Citizens of the United States are very
> suspicious of ANY middle-eastern person, asking about simulators,
> or wanting to learn to fly large airliners.

Welcome to America, where you are found "guilty" without
benefit of a trial, solely based on the colour of your skin, and/or
the ethnicity of your name.

Makes me glad I'm not an American.

(Maybe there will be other Americans who will stand up against
this prejudiced behaviour... We'll see... I'm hoping...)

Ramapriya, I'm sorry that there are people like Jim in the world.

--
Jeff Shirton jshirton at cogeco dot
ca
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
Keep thy airspeed up, less the earth come from below
and smitethee. - William Kershner
Challenge me (Theophilus) for a game of chess at Chessworld.net!

[Brad Zeigler]

> You will have to understand that Citizens of the United States are very
> suspicious of ANY middle-eastern person, asking about simulators, or
wanting
> to learn to fly large airliners.

Except that he's Indian, not middle eastern. Besides, most terrorists avoid
public newsgroups.

Are there any terrorists here that can comment?

Brad Z.

[Blueskies]

"Morgans" > wrote in message ...
>
> "Ramapriya" > wrote in message
> om...
>> "Chuck" > wrote in message
> >...
>>
>> > Are you planning on flying a 747 into the superbowl or something?
>>
>> you must be real fun at parties!
>>
>> Ramapriya
>>
>
>
> He was not joking, and was deadly serious with his response, and only said
> what many others are thinking.
>
> Most everyone here has been real patient, and answered your questions about
> flying, but you are stepping across a line, with this.
>
> You will have to understand that Citizens of the United States are very
> suspicious of ANY middle-eastern person, asking about simulators, or wanting
> to learn to fly large airliners.
>
> We helped train a number of terrorists, *in* our country, using *our*
> aviation training system, to fly off in *our*large planes, with no intent
> other than to murder, kill and maim *our* fellow countrymen.
>
> Look at this from our point of view, and I hope you will understand. We
> will always be suspicious, and on guard, to never let this happen again. We
> really don't know you, so I would doubt if you get many replies on this
> subject, from this group. You can no doubt find the answers you seek, but
> it will not be this easy, here.
> --
> Jim in NC
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.794 / Virus Database: 538 - Release Date: 11/10/2004
>
>


Silly American! You think that you not giving an answer is the right thing to do. Sad.. We need to be much more
creative to avoid the next 'attack'. I'm sure it will not look anything like what has been seen before. As Rummy says,
the unknown unknowns...


Back OT, a good google will turn up all kinds of good stuff re: flight simulators, full motion....

[Vas Chellappa]

Glad that there's at least someone who knows that "Indians" have nothing
whatsoever to do with "Middle Eastern." Wish more people in the US would
try to understand this.

--
SC
>>> Sent using Pine 4.60 running on Redhat 9 GNU/Linux <<<

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004, Brad Zeigler wrote:

>> You will have to understand that Citizens of the United States are very
>> suspicious of ANY middle-eastern person, asking about simulators, or
> wanting
>> to learn to fly large airliners.
>
> Except that he's Indian, not middle eastern. Besides, most terrorists avoid
> public newsgroups.
>
> Are there any terrorists here that can comment?
>
> Brad Z.
>
>
>

[Wizard of Draws]

On 11/14/04 8:37 PM, in article
, "Vas Chellappa"
> wrote:

> Glad that there's at least someone who knows that "Indians" have nothing
> whatsoever to do with "Middle Eastern." Wish more people in the US would
> try to understand this.

In all seriousness, I would be interested to know how one can tell an Indian
from an American from an Israeli from a Mexican, etc., on a newsgroup with
any degree of certainty.

You may be able to tell from my last name that I have a bit of Italian blood
in my veins, but who can say if that is in fact my real name just because it
appears here? You can snoop around my websites, do a little research and
find out where I live and such, but not every poster has a website with that
information readily available. As far as I've seen Mr.(?) Ramapriya did not
include anything more than an email address in his sig.
--
Jeff 'The Wizard of Draws' Bucchino
Cartoons with a Touch of Magic�
http://www.wizardofdraws.com
http://www.cartoonclipart.com

[Brad Zeigler]

"Wizard of Draws" > wrote in
message news:BDBD7F22.33813%jeffbTAKEOUTCAPS@TAKEOUTCAPSwi zardofdraws.com...
> On 11/14/04 8:37 PM, in article

> In all seriousness, I would be interested to know how one can tell an
Indian
> from an American from an Israeli from a Mexican, etc., on a newsgroup with
> any degree of certainty.
> You may be able to tell from my last name that I have a bit of Italian
blood
> in my veins, but who can say if that is in fact my real name just because
it
> appears here? You can snoop around my websites, do a little research and
> find out where I live and such, but not every poster has a website with
that
> information readily available. As far as I've seen Mr.(?) Ramapriya did
not
> include anything more than an email address in his sig.

Except for his admission that he's Indian...

http://makeashorterlink.com/?S351438C9

....and five foot four.

[Wizard of Draws]

On 11/14/04 10:00 PM, in article , "Brad
Zeigler" > wrote:

>
> Except for his admission that he's Indian...
>
> http://makeashorterlink.com/?S351438C9
>
> ...and five foot four.
>
>

Is that why you made it a shorter link?
--
Jeff 'The Wizard of Draws' Bucchino
Cartoons with a Touch of Magic�
http://www.wizardofdraws.com
http://www.cartoonclipart.com

[Brad Zeigler]

"Wizard of Draws" > wrote in
message news:BDBD89F6.33862%jeffbTAKEOUTCAPS@TAKEOUTCAPSwi zardofdraws.com...
> On 11/14/04 10:00 PM, in article , "Brad
> Zeigler" > wrote:
>
> >
> > Except for his admission that he's Indian...
> >
> > http://makeashorterlink.com/?S351438C9
> >
> > ...and five foot four.
> >
> >
>
> Is that why you made it a shorter link?

Good one!

[Richard Hertz]

"Jeff Shirton" > wrote in message
...
> "Morgans" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>> Most everyone here has been real patient, and answered your
>> questions about flying, but you are stepping across a line, with this.
>>
>> You will have to understand that Citizens of the United States are very
>> suspicious of ANY middle-eastern person, asking about simulators,
>> or wanting to learn to fly large airliners.
>
> Welcome to America, where you are found "guilty" without
> benefit of a trial, solely based on the colour of your skin, and/or
> the ethnicity of your name.

That is not the case. Our legal system suggests othewise. Personal
perception has always been subject to wide variations and I believe you will
find that in ANY country. It is unfair to make this unique to the US.

(Canada, the traced entry of AIDS into the US and also an easy entry point
to the US for terrorists. Makes me glad I'm not a Canadian. Are those fair
statements? Perhaps not, but they are accurate.)

>
> Makes me glad I'm not an American.

And we are likewise pleased.

>
> (Maybe there will be other Americans who will stand up against
> this prejudiced behaviour... We'll see... I'm hoping...)

Yes, his comments were insulting and uncalled for. Unfortunately the ugly
Americans are so easily taken for representing the entire population. I try
my best to steer clear of US tourists when abroad. It is usually
embarrassing.

>
> Ramapriya, I'm sorry that there are people like Jim in the world.

Why are you apologizing for someone else? Jim is free to post what he
wishes.

>
> --
> Jeff Shirton jshirton at cogeco
> dot ca
> <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
> Keep thy airspeed up, less the earth come from below
> and smitethee. - William Kershner
> Challenge me (Theophilus) for a game of chess at Chessworld.net!
>

[G.R. Patterson III]

Brad Zeigler wrote:
>
> Except that he's Indian, not middle eastern.

Perhaps, but in another post he spoke of a price he obtained from the nearest flight
school. In Dubai. That's in the United Arab Emirates. It's possible that he's
planning to travel there from India for training, but it's generated a bit of
confusion and (apparently) suspicion.

George Patterson
If a man gets into a fight 3,000 miles away from home, he *had* to have
been looking for it.

[Morgans]

"Jeff Shirton" > wrote

> Welcome to America, where you are found "guilty" without
> benefit of a trial, solely based on the colour of your skin, and/or
> the ethnicity of your name.

*******
All I said was that answering this question without knowing the person
posting, is akin to giving the keys to the bomb, that could destroy your
home, to a stranger. Would you do that Jeff? If you say yes, you ar a
liar.

And yes, it is profiling. Unfortunately, all of the World Trade center
terrorists, did fit this profile. Sorry, but those are the facts.
******
>
> Makes me glad I'm not an American.

*******
Where do *you* live, Jeff? If you are not American, have you had *your*
largest city attacked, thousands of civilians killed, and two of your finest
landmarks destroyed?
******

> (Maybe there will be other Americans who will stand up against
> this prejudiced behaviour... We'll see... I'm hoping...)
>
> Ramapriya, I'm sorry that there are people like Jim in the world.>
> --
> Jeff Shirton

******
I am sorry that there are people in the world that would have such hatred
in their lives, that they would gladly commit suicide, to kill other people
of a nation, because of some rational and agenda of their own beliefs.

You will notice that I was very kind and courteous, answering other
questions of the original poster, and am not a person filled with hatred. I
would like to get along with everyone, but everyone does not want peace with
us. I will always be a person that trusts other people, and treats others
with respect, but there are limits, and caution needs to be used in times of
war. We are at war, and must protect ourselves.

--
Jim in NC
******


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[Brad Zeigler]

I recall in a previous thread that he was an Indian currently working in
Dubai. Consisting of a population of nearly 80% foreigners, Dubai is best
known in the middle east for oil, industry and shopping, rather than islamic
fundementalism and terrorist incubation.

"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Brad Zeigler wrote:
> >
> > Except that he's Indian, not middle eastern.
>
> Perhaps, but in another post he spoke of a price he obtained from the
nearest flight
> school. In Dubai. That's in the United Arab Emirates. It's possible that
he's
> planning to travel there from India for training, but it's generated a bit
of
> confusion and (apparently) suspicion.
>
> George Patterson
> If a man gets into a fight 3,000 miles away from home, he *had* to
have
> been looking for it.

[Morgans]

"Vas Chellappa" > wrote in message
...
> Glad that there's at least someone who knows that "Indians" have nothing
> whatsoever to do with "Middle Eastern." Wish more people in the US would
> try to understand this.
>
> --
> SC

Wrong, in this case, I believe. Someone said he was from India, by mistake,
and you must not have seen where he was from. That post is not in my reader
now, and I am not going to go back and find it. The city he said he was
from was in Arab Emirates Republic, or something close to that, as I am not
fantastic in world geography, but that was what my search at the time
showed.

So where are you from, Ramapriya? I continue to respect your right to ask
questions, and be treated with respect, as you are most likely not a
terrorist, <g> but my point was that the current thread of building a
simulator may be viewed as a "sore" point among some here.
--
Jim in NC


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[Morgans]

"Brad Zeigler" > wrote

> Except for his admission that he's Indian...
>
> http://makeashorterlink.com/?S351438C9
>
> ...and five foot four.

That was George Patterson, saying that flying was expensive in India,
mistakenly, not Ramapriya saying he was from India.
--
Jim in NC


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[Morgans]

"Blueskies" > wrote

>
> Silly American! You think that you not giving an answer is the right thing
to do. Sad.. We need to be much more
> creative to avoid the next 'attack'. I'm sure it will not look anything
like what has been seen before. As Rummy says,
> the unknown unknowns...
>
>
> Back OT, a good google will turn up all kinds of good stuff re: flight
simulators, full motion....
>

True, but don't expect me, or any other thinking American to give it to him
on a silver platter. I also agree that the next attack will most likely not
be just like the first attack.
--
Jim in NC



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[Brad Zeigler]

"Morgans" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Vas Chellappa" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Glad that there's at least someone who knows that "Indians" have nothing
> > whatsoever to do with "Middle Eastern." Wish more people in the US would
> > try to understand this.
> >
> > --
> > SC
>
> Wrong, in this case, I believe. Someone said he was from India, by
mistake,
> and you must not have seen where he was from. That post is not in my
reader
> now, and I am not going to go back and find it. The city he said he was
> from was in Arab Emirates Republic, or something close to that, as I am
not
> fantastic in world geography, but that was what my search at the time
> showed.
>
> So where are you from, Ramapriya? I continue to respect your right to ask
> questions, and be treated with respect, as you are most likely not a
> terrorist, <g> but my point was that the current thread of building a
> simulator may be viewed as a "sore" point among some here.
> --
> Jim in NC

Jim, you are incredibly paranoid. He mentioned in a previous post that he
was an Indian working in Dubai. Lots of Indians work in Dubai. There's not
a lot to do in Dubai. I'd probably want to put together a flight simulator
setup if I lived in Dubai.

Quite frankly, accusations such as yours make southerners (myself included,
I'm from VA) sound like a bunch of rednecks. If you don't know where Dubai
is, look it up. Don't just assume that a non-american asking about aviation
is a terrorist. That's just rediculous.

Go pick on the woman who saw the hovering airliner. Now she's probably a
terrorist.

Brad

[Brad Zeigler]

Let me try this again, as you didn't scroll up the page from the last
link...
http://makeashorterlink.com/?T233328C9

"Morgans" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Brad Zeigler" > wrote
>
> > Except for his admission that he's Indian...
> >
> > http://makeashorterlink.com/?S351438C9
> >
> > ...and five foot four.
>
> That was George Patterson, saying that flying was expensive in India,
> mistakenly, not Ramapriya saying he was from India.
> --
> Jim in NC
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
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>
>

[Morgans]

"Richard Hertz" <no one@no one.com> wrote

>
> Yes, his comments were insulting and uncalled for. Unfortunately the ugly
> Americans are so easily taken for representing the entire population. I
try
> my best to steer clear of US tourists when abroad. It is usually
> embarrassing.

Insulting? I don't think so. Point out one insulting comment in my
original post.

I was explaining the current climate towards questions like how to build a
large plane simulator.

I am not an "ugly American." I have travel widely abroad. I respect other
people and cultures.

It was not me that made the original comment, about wanting to learn to fly
a plane into the super bowl, or something to that effect.

I was responding as to why someone would think of making a comment like
that.

I'm done here. I accept all flames, and hope my reputation is not too badly
damaged. If you come to visit us, Ramapriya, let me be the first one to
shake your hand and buy you a beer. 'Nuff said.
--
Jim in NC


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[Morgans]

"Brad Zeigler" > wrote in message
...
> Let me try this again, as you didn't scroll up the page from the last
> link...
> http://makeashorterlink.com/?T233328C9

I found it this time. Thanks for setting me straight. I didn't recall
that, as reading and remembering everything is a bit difficult, at times.
(CRS) He did mention an Arab country, as a place of training, and I picked
up on that.
--
Jim in NC


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[Morgans]

"Brad Zeigler" > wrote

> Jim, you are incredibly paranoid. He mentioned in a previous post that he
> was an Indian working in Dubai. Lots of Indians work in Dubai.

Brad, you are a bit unforgiving, and quick to judge someone who has made a
mistake. I have now been brought up to speed.

>There's not
> a lot to do in Dubai. I'd probably want to put together a flight
simulator
> setup if I lived in Dubai.

Good for you. If you were in Dubai, and asked questions like his, on a
primarly US newsgroup, you would be treated with suspiction, also. Ask the
FBI what they would do, in response to someone making a 747 simulator in an
Arab country.

> Quite frankly, accusations

I did not make any accusations.

>such as yours make southerners (myself included,
> I'm from VA) sound like a bunch of rednecks.

So if you inform a foreigner of a prevailing climate in your own country,
you are a redneck? Hmm, that *is* interesting, from a definition point of
view.

> If you don't know where Dubai
> is, look it up.

Thank you, I already have. A day or so ago.

Don't just assume that a non-american asking about aviation
> is a terrorist. That's just rediculous.

I didn't. His other threads, I have participated in, and enjoyed.

>
> Go pick on the woman who saw the hovering airliner. Now she's probably a
> terrorist.
>
> Brad

Attacking others is in your style, I see. It is not my own style.
--
Jim in NC


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[tony roberts]

There seems to be a lot of paranoia surrounding this guy.

Here is how it is -

He is from Bangalore India
Until recently he only had two declared interests - astrology and
cricket.
He moved to Dubai as a foreign worker - lots of Indians do - I used to
employ them there (Costain Interrnational and The Chaudhry Group)
Now he has a third interest - Aviation.
Of the over 100 replies he has received to his continuous questions he
asks he has only replied to two of them - both were to responses that
irritated him.
To all of those who have taken time and effort to respond, guide and
educate him, he has totally ignored them and gone on to the next
question. And yet people keep feeding him.

A thank you would be nice.
I for one will not continue to answer his never ending questions when he
doesn't even have the courtesy to thank anyone in this group for their
time and effort.

So he'll probably respond to this one - because it is intended to
irritate him. The ones we all posted to educate him were totally ignored!

To those that are knocking Americans based on the rhetoric in this
thread, I am not American, but many of my best friends are, and I really
do resent the anti-American posts that this thread has generated.

All of the non-Americans here should remember that approx half of all
Americans do not support what their government is doing right now.
But even that is irrelevant - we are not here to discuss politics - we
are here to discuss aviation, irregardless of political views.
We wouldn't attack a Chinese poster because of the Chinese governments
position in Hong Kong - so let's keep this an aviation community, with
tolerance and mutual respect.

OK - Rant over

Tony
--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Cessna 172H C-GICE

[Morgans]

"tony roberts" > wrote

so let's keep this an aviation community, with
> tolerance and mutual respect.
>
> OK - Rant over
>
> Tony


Well put, sir.
Over, and out.

(I can't believe I just wrote that<g>)
--
Jim in NC


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[Brad Zeigler]

My response was disrespectful. I'm sorry.

[Brad Zeigler]

My response was disrespectful. I'm sorry.

[Morgans]

"Brad Zeigler" > wrote in message
...
> My response was disrespectful. I'm sorry.
>
Accepted.

Reminds me of a joke.

"That's one!"
--
Jim in NC


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[Ramapriya]

"G.R. Patterson III" > wrote in message >...
> Brad Zeigler wrote:
> >
> > Except that he's Indian, not middle eastern.
>
> Perhaps, but in another post he spoke of a price he obtained from the nearest flight school. In Dubai. That's in the United Arab Emirates. It's possible that he's
> planning to travel there from India for training, but it's generated a bit of
> confusion and (apparently) suspicion.
>
> George Patterson


Sigh. Being an Indian Hindu (for those that can distinguish
religions!) who's here to make some money working honorably, this is
definitely quite a queer feeling.

I'll say this once more. I'm just a flight aficionado, who would've
surely been an aviator but for financial limitations. I greatly admire
democracies like the US and India and I detest terrorists more than
any of you do.

If anyone anywhere in the Arab world can be thought of as one with
dubious intent, why can't I think of every American to be a probable
Timothy McVeigh? Fact is, I'm NOT dumb.

This is an awful digression from my original post, and I'm sorry for
that, but I really had to defend myself against a quite baseless
insinuation. You're free not to respond or help my future posts if
that's what you want to do but spare me the bother of ridiculously
having to prove myself innocent like this.

Ramapriya


PS: Someone on this thread mentioned that I give nothing more than a
mail ID. I don't know how to build or maintain a website or web page,
thus there's nothing to add.

[Ramapriya]

tony roberts > wrote in message news:<nospam-C001AE.21290314112004@shawnews>...
> There seems to be a lot of paranoia surrounding this guy.
>
> Here is how it is -
>
> He is from Bangalore India
> Until recently he only had two declared interests - astrology and
> cricket.
> He moved to Dubai as a foreign worker - lots of Indians do - I used to
> employ them there (Costain Interrnational and The Chaudhry Group)
> Now he has a third interest - Aviation.
> Of the over 100 replies he has received to his continuous questions he
> asks he has only replied to two of them - both were to responses that
> irritated him.
> To all of those who have taken time and effort to respond, guide and
> educate him, he has totally ignored them and gone on to the next
> question. And yet people keep feeding him.
>
> A thank you would be nice.
>
> OK - Rant over
>
> Tony

Tony,

Nice research, although you wouldn't have known that I'm a cartoonist
too :@)

My sincere apologies to all those who've responded to my threads and
educated me but didn't hear anything later from me; I refrained from
saying a Thank You merely because it'd add to the length of the
thread, thereby irritating a lot more people, instead of adding value.
I've held each response to my questions with utmost respect, whether
I've said so aloud or not.

You're right about my interests. I'm a qualified cricket umpire, and
hence interested in the game, and an interested student of astrology
too. Flying has been a kind of dormant passion, largely due to
financial limitations. I came to know of this newsgroup recently when
reading John Denker's book, and decided to write and seek answers I've
always wanted.

But I still don't get why so many are seemingly upset at innocuous
queries, unless the irritation was at the very elementary nature of
the questions itself.

I guess I'll keep asking until I receive no responses, in which case
I'll retreat.

Happy? :)

Ramapriya

[Gary G]

Relative to MS Flight Sim (newest versions are only $29)
and multiple monitors.

I added a PCI video card to my PC so I could have
two side views (which was my biggest complaint about using sims).
I use the sim more as a procedure practice that actual flight practice, and
I hear it's a good way for IFR practice.

The cheapest way to get 3 (or 4) minotor views is to use 2 seperate cards
as opposed to a single 3 or 4 output card.

I use about 45 degree views left and right so they
more or less match with the front view.
It is a little tricky - you have to add windows when out of full-screen mode (see
the net/google regarding multiple monitor view help - there is support on the Microsoft page).
You drag the windows to each panel, then goto full screen more again, then
pan each individually to where you want it.

You are BEST to have the same manufacturer for both video cards - as I had some problems
when using different mfgs.
nVidia is a good choice. You could go with Matrox, too.
This means that you have a video card in the AGP slot, and one in a PCI slot.
I'd recommend 64Megs for each card - higher is better - although I currently have a 32Megs
in my AGP slot.

You could certianly actually add more if you wanted.
If you have 2 dual-monitor cards, you could use the 4th as a knee-board or other view,
which is handy.
(I've used this for learning checklist procedures prior to landing, or prior to takeoff, etc. . .)

Hope that this is some form of help,

Gary

[pickle]

Jeff Shirton wrote:

> "Morgans" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>
>>Most everyone here has been real patient, and answered your
>>questions about flying, but you are stepping across a line, with this.
>>
>>You will have to understand that Citizens of the United States are very
>>suspicious of ANY middle-eastern person, asking about simulators,
>>or wanting to learn to fly large airliners.
>
>
> Welcome to America, where you are found "guilty" without
> benefit of a trial, solely based on the colour of your skin, and/or
> the ethnicity of your name.

You bet. Bring back racial profiling.

[Chuck]

"Brad Zeigler" > wrote in message
...

<snip>

>[...] Besides, most terrorists avoid
> public newsgroups.
>

<snip>


Uhhh. how do you know that?


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[Morgans]

"Ramapriya" > wrote
>
> I guess I'll keep asking until I receive no responses, in which case
> I'll retreat.
>
> Happy? :)
>
> Ramapriya

Ask away. I find someone as excited about aviation as you are, to be
refreshing, at times.
--
Jim in NC


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[tony roberts]

> Nice research, although you wouldn't have known that I'm a cartoonist
> too :@)

Damn - I missed that. Must be getting rusty :)
>

> I've held each response to my questions with utmost respect, whether
> I've said so aloud or not.

Thanks - that is good to hear.
>
> You're right about my interests. I'm a qualified cricket umpire, and
> hence interested in the game,

Many years ago I used to have a season ticket to Old Trafford.
There was some good cricket there - and of course it is where India
would play England - I saw lots of those!


> and an interested student of astrology
> too.

We'll differ there - I never got into it - even though I lived in India
for several years - Bandra beach outside Bombay (now Mumbai) and
Chandighar. I also lived in Dhaka Bangladesh for 3 years and Islamabad
Pakistan for 18 months

> Flying has been a kind of dormant passion, largely due to
> financial limitations. I came to know of this newsgroup recently when
> reading John Denker's book, and decided to write and seek answers I've
> always wanted.

Check out www.whittsflying.com
It's a great resource.

> But I still don't get why so many are seemingly upset at innocuous
> queries, unless the irritation was at the very elementary nature of
> the questions itself.

I'm not even going there :)


Tony
--

Tony Roberts
PP-ASEL
VFR OTT
Night
Cessna 172H C-GICE