Sectional Usage Poll

[Daniel L. Lieberman]

I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it along
their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.

Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
are flying?

TIA

[Trent Moorehead]

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>

It depends. If I am in very unfamiliar territory, I orient it along my
flight path. If I am flying locally, it stays in my lap north up, since it
is only for reference for frequencies etc. It's hard to read print upside
down!

-Trent
PP-ASEL

[Maule Driver]

North up.

I used to do a lot of intense pilotage (cc soaring) and found my self
turning it to orient along flight path. Over time, I stopped doing it. But
a line on the chart seemed mandatory to keep it all together.

Then there was GPS...

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>
>

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>

North up.

[G.R. Patterson III]

"Daniel L. Lieberman" wrote:
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?

I keep north up. I like to be able to read the labels.

I made a flight to Oshkosh one year with a guy who does things the other way
'round. He decided to "help" by taking my sectional and doing the navigation.
Drove me nuts. Fortunately, the weather on the way up was great and I didn't
really need the chart - I just followed the LORAN track. The only problem spots
were staying out of the controlled airspace around major airports.

On the way back, we were running at 1,000' AGL (more or less) under a low
ceiling with visibility of about 7 miles in haze. He was immensely helpful then.
I made him position the chart so I could read it. He had a handheld GPS with a
moving map and kept his finger just west of our position the whole way. Great
for avoiding towers and such.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

[Peter MacPherson]

North up.


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Bob Gardner]

Oriented to flight path...I learned to read upside down when I was in high
school. It is a useful skill.

Bob Gardner

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Gene Seibel]

North up.
--
Gene Seibel
Gene & Sue's Aeroplanes - http://pad39a.com/gene/planes.html
Because I fly, I envy no one.



Daniel L. Lieberman wrote:
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always
hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting
it along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in
which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA

[Peter MacPherson]

North up.


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Jerry]

Sectional - North Up

GPS - Track Up

Jerry in NC


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Ben Smith]

North Up.

[C Kingsbury]

b. I have a much easier time deciphering landmarks that way.

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>
>

[ShawnD2112]

In the interest of opening my own fuel vessel and passing out the matches,
I'll offer that a book I read addresses this issue specifically from a
gender perspective. The research showed that men will typically orient
north up and do the mental gymnastics in their heads - the male brain is
built such that this is a strength. Women's brains are apparently wired
differently and don't cope with the 3-D spatial analysis as well and so they
will typically orient along the track and turn the map every which way,
keeping the left on the left and so on.

Of course there are always exceptions so you don't all have to individually
respond to say this doesn't apply to you. Funnily enough, I blow the theory
as well by being a male but moving the map. As a student I used to do the
north up routine but I think I didn't get enough testosterone in the womb or
something because I kept getting lost. So an instructor tipped me off to
the "move the map" method. I still get lost, but at least I'm more
definitive about it!!

By the way, the book was called "Why Men Don't Listen and Why Women Can't
Read Maps". A hilarious look at physiological differences between the
genders that really explains a lot. Should be mandatory reading!

Shawn

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Casey Wilson]

Sectional -- North Up
[But when I'm hiking, the topo is oriented track-up]
GPS -- Track Up


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Dave Stadt]

Sectional North up
GPS track up

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>
>

[OtisWinslow]

North up.


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Hilton]

Sectional and GPS: North up

For the pilot who use Track Up, do you turn your approach charts too? I'm
guessing not, but just trying to understand why (or why not).

Hilton

[Jack Cunniff]

North up, on both the chart and the moving-map GPS.

(It's an extremely useful habit, especially paying off when ATC asks where
you are relative to a particular navaid, and you can immediately tell your
relative location, without swiveling your chart around.)

-Jack


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > writes:

>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it along
>their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.

>Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
>are flying?

>TIA

[RobsSanta]

Oriented to flight path... my old instructor always said that was the way he
did it during their bombing runs over Germany in the 1940's

Rob


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>
>

[Chris]

what's a sectional?


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Jon Wanzer]

I keep it north up. I have been using maps (topo, av, naut, etc.) for
over 25 years so I visualize my position and heading over the physical
map. Some people have dificulty with "mental orientation", I do not.

Jon Wanzer
CP ASEL / IA
AGI IGI (CFI / CFII soon-to-be)
San Jose, CA

On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 08:33:50 -0800, "Daniel L. Lieberman"
> wrote:

>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it along
>their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
>Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
>are flying?
>
>TIA
>

[Jay Beckman]

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

TAC - North Up (I know the local area)
Sectional - Both (Direction Up Enroute, North Up Over Checkpoints)
GPS - CDI Mode
Moving Map - Direction Up

Still new enough that I haven't settled on the best way to do some things...

Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

[AJW]

North up makes graphics, text, and numbers easier to read. You'll find as you
advance to instrument training you'll keep your approach plates north up, also.

[Bob Gardner]

Because approach plates have courses printed on them.

Bob Gardner

"Hilton" > wrote in message
ink.net...
> Sectional and GPS: North up
>
> For the pilot who use Track Up, do you turn your approach charts too? I'm
> guessing not, but just trying to understand why (or why not).
>
> Hilton
>
>

[Jon Wanzer]

My wife and I have discussed this matter at length, you are quite
right about the generality. ( I am however quite wrong, my wife points
out) ;)

On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 18:19:14 GMT, "ShawnD2112"
> wrote:

>In the interest of opening my own fuel vessel and passing out the matches,
>I'll offer that a book I read addresses this issue specifically from a
>gender perspective. The research showed that men will typically orient
>north up and do the mental gymnastics in their heads - the male brain is
>built such that this is a strength. Women's brains are apparently wired
>differently and don't cope with the 3-D spatial analysis as well and so they
>will typically orient along the track and turn the map every which way,
>keeping the left on the left and so on.
Jon Wanzer
CP ASEL / IA
AGI IGI (CFI / CFII soon-to-be)
San Jose,CA

[Judah]

Track up. I have more important things to focus on in flight than whether
I'm supposed to turn left or right.

Of course the correlary is that I am way-to-often telling tower that I am
15 miles West when I am really 15 miles East and vice versa...

;)

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in
:

> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold
> it with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting
> it along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS
> systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which
> you are flying?
>
> TIA
>
>

[Dudley Henriques]

I've always been an "oriented to the flight path" kind of guy. I have no
problem reading things upside down, in fact, when I would arrive to do
an airshow somewhere, if there were a gang of us waiting to check in to
the motel or hotel at the same time, I used to get everybody laughing
like hell by signing my name on the register upside down and backwards
so the clerk could read it normally. It got to be kind of an "event"
where the guys would actually wait around to see it happen :-)) For the
sectionals; I like things to be where they should be appearing if flying
VFR. The "north people" are fine doing it their way as well. I think
it's just a matter of personal preference really.
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/CFI Retired
for email; take out the trash


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold
>it with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting
>it along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS
>systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which
> you are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Bob Chilcoat]

Sectional: North up
GPS: North up until I bought into the Archer partnership. Everyone else
likes track up, and it's a pain to reconfigure it just for me every time I
fly, so now it's track up.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)

"Casey Wilson" > wrote in message
news:ik_xd.6476$L7.3598@trnddc05...
> Sectional -- North Up
> [But when I'm hiking, the topo is oriented track-up]
> GPS -- Track Up
>
>
> "Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
> ...
> >I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold
it
> >with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
> >along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
> >
> > Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which
you
> > are flying?
> >
> > TIA
> >
>
>

[C J Campbell]

I hold sectionals north up; GPS moving maps I set for north up en route and
track up for approaches, unless I have an EFIS type display, then I always
use track up.


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>
>

[john smith]

GPS... track up
Sectional... sometimes track, sometimes North up.
If I am flying something high performance, up high, north up works fine.
If I am flying the Champ at or below 500 feet agl through the hills amd
mountains, then I am definitely following the map in track mode.

[AJW]

You actually wrote this, and GAVE YOUR NAME!

Has it occured to you that your wife will get mail from nearly everyone who
reads this who is not equipt with a, ah, kickstand, suggesting yours
(kickstand, that is) be removed.

>e discussed this matter at length, you are quite
>right about the generality. ( I am however quite wrong, my wife points
>out) ;)
>
>On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 18:19:14 GMT, "ShawnD2112"
> wrote:
>
>>In the interest of opening my own fuel vessel and passing out the matches,
>>I'll offer that a book I read addresses this issue specifically from a
>>gender perspective. The research showed that men will typically orient
>>north up and do the mental gymnastics in their heads - the male brain is
>>built such that this is a strength. Women's brains are apparently wired
>>differently and don't cope with the 3-D spatial analysis as well and so they
>
>>will typically orient along the track and turn the map every which way,
>>keeping the left on the left and so on.
>Jon Wanzer
>CP ASEL / IA
>AGI IGI (CFI / CFII soon-to-be)
>San Jose,CA
>
>
>
>
>
>

[Jim Fisher]

"ShawnD2112" > wrote in message
The research showed that men will typically orient
> north up and do the mental gymnastics in their heads - the male brain is
> built such that this is a strength. Women's (. . . )
> will typically orient along the track

Not surprisingly, research shows that high wingers orient the map and low
wingers north-up it.

--
Jim Fisher

[Jim Fisher]

"Judah" > wrote in message
. ..
> Track up. I have more important things to focus on in flight than whether
> I'm supposed to turn left or right.

Once you are in the groove with north-upping the map, you don't consciously
do the mental twisting. You don't even think - it's just natural - so
"focus" is not an issue. For me, anyway.

--
Jim Fisher

[Bob Noel]

In article >,
"ShawnD2112" > wrote:

> In the interest of opening my own fuel vessel and passing out the matches,
> I'll offer that a book I read addresses this issue specifically from a
> gender perspective. The research showed that men will typically orient
> north up and do the mental gymnastics in their heads - the male brain is
> built such that this is a strength. Women's brains are apparently wired
> differently and don't cope with the 3-D spatial analysis as well and so they
> will typically orient along the track and turn the map every which way,
> keeping the left on the left and so on.
>
> Of course there are always exceptions so you don't all have to individually
> respond to say this doesn't apply to you.

According to my sources, USAF Navs for heavy aircraft are (were?) taught
north-up. F-111 WSO's were taught track-up.

--
Bob Noel
looking for a sig the lawyers will like

[Gig Giacona]

North Up.... When I was getting my helicopter rating I didn't know we were
going to be flying XC that day and didn't bring my knee board so the CFI
would hold the chart in his lap and kept handing it back to me track up. I
finly told him if he didn't stop handing it to me that way I was going to
stop and let him out.

[BTIZ]

most pilots NEED track up...
navigators use north up..
Master Navigators don't care..

BT

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Ronald Gardner]

I orientate to the direction of flight so that I can relate visual land marks to
where they are shown on the map.

Ron

"Daniel L. Lieberman" wrote:

> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA

[Jose]

Chart: I learned track up, and now do it both ways. If I'm using the
chart (esp at night) for reading frequencies and such, I will twist it
North up. When using it more directly for navigation, I'll do track up.

GPS - I used to prefer "desired track up", which is like track up but
doesn't swivel when I turn. However, during an approach this can
produce unexpected reorientations of the map at sharp turns, so I now
do track up.

Jose
--
Freedom. It seemed like a good idea at the time.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[Jon Wanzer]

A) she stays away from USENET
B) she is sitting next to me
C) after 13 years of being together and almost 12 of them married, I
think she already knows me well enough.

;)

Jon Wanzer
CP ASEL / IA
AGI IGI (CFI / CFII soon-to-be)
San Jose,CA

On 21 Dec 2004 22:18:07 GMT, (AJW) wrote:

>You actually wrote this, and GAVE YOUR NAME!
>
>Has it occured to you that your wife will get mail from nearly everyone who
>reads this who is not equipt with a, ah, kickstand, suggesting yours
>(kickstand, that is) be removed.
>
>>e discussed this matter at length, you are quite
>>right about the generality. ( I am however quite wrong, my wife points
>>out) ;)

[Nathan Young]

On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 08:33:50 -0800, "Daniel L. Lieberman"
> wrote:

>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it along
>their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
>Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
>are flying?

Track up. Which is also how I configure the GPS.

[Art Varrassi]

Sectional - North Up
Garmin GPSMAP 196 - North Up

Art Varrassi
PP-ASEL

"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
> with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
along
> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>
>

[Denny]

North up, definitely... There is nothing wrong with drawing lines on
the chart... I have charts that have all kinds of colored lines on
them... While I now use GPS as my primary nav tool, I always keep a
chart open and the #1 VOR tracking my progress so that when the
inevitable GPS meltdown occurs (inside or outside of the cockpit) I
will simply keep on truckin'...


Denny

[Dan Luke]

"Daniel L. Lieberman" wrote:

North up, charts & GPS moving map.

I find GPS map re-draws disorienting if I use track up. Also, geographical
shapes look unfamiliar if they're not depicted north up.
--
Dan
C-172RG at BFM

[Travis Marlatte]

For sectionals and paper maps, it's north up but it's because of the labels.
When I use an electronic chart (or a nav system in a car), I use heading up.

--
-------------------------------
Travis


"Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
...
>I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold it
>with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
>along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>
> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which you
> are flying?
>
> TIA
>

[Andrew Sarangan]

I tend to use North-Up when I am flying using other means (GPS, VOR ),
while using the sectional only for monitoring progress. I use heading-up
when I am actively looking at the section for navigation.


"RobsSanta" > wrote in
news:0i%xd.69968$DC.32060@fed1read03:

> Oriented to flight path... my old instructor always said that was the
> way he did it during their bombing runs over Germany in the 1940's
>
> Rob
>
>
> "Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always
>> hold it with North up even when they are flying South rather than
>> orienting it
> along
>> their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
>>
>> Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in
>> which you are flying?
>>
>> TIA
>>
>>
>
>

[Greg Faris]

I like North Up also. I do not have difficulty visualizing orientation when
flying in a direction different from the map's orientation. I have had
instructors try to convert me - and in some cases they made good points
about how my expectations would be better met with the "orientated map"
method. Once I flew to a small airfield with my usual, North Up method. I
had no difficulty getting there, but I was surprised for about a half a
second by the orientation of the runway. The instructor used this as proof
that I would have flown it better with the map turned.

"Travis Marlatte" > wrote in message
k.net...
> For sectionals and paper maps, it's north up but it's because of the
labels.
> When I use an electronic chart (or a nav system in a car), I use heading
up.
>
> --
> -------------------------------
> Travis
>
>
> "Daniel L. Lieberman" > wrote in message
> ...
> >I have been advised that some people when using a sectional always hold
it
> >with North up even when they are flying South rather than orienting it
> >along their flight path. This is an option on moving map GPS systems.
> >
> > Do you a) keep North up or b) orient the map in the direction in which
you
> > are flying?
> >
> > TIA
> >
>
>