Engine Mount Tilt and Offset

[Barrie Gittens]

I am planning to install a subaru (170HP) in my C-120 on floats.I
realize that the offset of the engine should be 3 to 4 degrees but the
tilt I am not so sure of. The extra thrust should cause a reduction
from the original 85 HP application; I should think. Any suggestions
out there.

[Rich S.]

"Barrie Gittens" > wrote in message
m...
> I am planning to install a subaru (170HP) in my C-120 on floats.I
> realize that the offset of the engine should be 3 to 4 degrees but the
> tilt I am not so sure of. The extra thrust should cause a reduction
> from the original 85 HP application; I should think. Any suggestions
> out there.

Try it first, then add spacers under the engine mount as needed. Nothing
beats real life corrections.

Rich S.

[Morgans]

"Barrie Gittens" > wrote in message
m...
> I am planning to install a subaru (170HP) in my C-120 on floats.I
> realize that the offset of the engine should be 3 to 4 degrees but the
> tilt I am not so sure of. The extra thrust should cause a reduction
> from the original 85 HP application; I should think. Any suggestions
> out there.

How are you getting around puttting a non-certified engine in a certified
plane?
--
Jim in NC


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[Ron Wanttaja]

On Fri, 16 Apr 2004 00:07:30 -0400, "Morgans" >
wrote:

>
>"Barrie Gittens" > wrote in message
m...
>> I am planning to install a subaru (170HP) in my C-120 on floats.I
>> realize that the offset of the engine should be 3 to 4 degrees but the
>> tilt I am not so sure of. The extra thrust should cause a reduction
>> from the original 85 HP application; I should think. Any suggestions
>> out there.
>
>How are you getting around puttting a non-certified engine in a certified
>plane?

Note his email address... "*.ca" domain, i.e., Canada. They're allowed to
do more with the smaller aircraft, I believe.

Ron Wanttaja

[Dan Thomas]

Ron Wanttaja > wrote in message >...
> On Fri, 16 Apr 2004 00:07:30 -0400, "Morgans" >
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Barrie Gittens" > wrote in message
> m...
> >> I am planning to install a subaru (170HP) in my C-120 on floats.I
> >> realize that the offset of the engine should be 3 to 4 degrees but the
> >> tilt I am not so sure of. The extra thrust should cause a reduction
> >> from the original 85 HP application; I should think. Any suggestions
> >> out there.
> >
> >How are you getting around puttting a non-certified engine in a certified
> >plane?
>
> Note his email address... "*.ca" domain, i.e., Canada. They're allowed to
> do more with the smaller aircraft, I believe.
>
> Ron Wanttaja


It's a category called "Owner-Maintenance," designed to keep
those older airplanes flying even though parts are hard to find. The
airplane essentially becomes a homebuilt. There are drawbacks: no
flights into the U.S., for instance.
I don't think he should bother with any engine offsets to start
with. The Cessan 172 uses none, like many others. Bigger concern would
be the strength of the structure. The 120 was a pretty light airplane.

Dan

[Morgans]

"Dan Thomas" > wrote
>
> It's a category called "Owner-Maintenance," designed to keep
> those older airplanes flying even though parts are hard to find. The
> airplane essentially becomes a homebuilt. There are drawbacks: no
> flights into the U.S., for instance.
> I don't think he should bother with any engine offsets to start
> with. The Cessan 172 uses none, like many others. Bigger concern would
> be the strength of the structure. The 120 was a pretty light airplane.
>
> Dan

I would think replacing an engine with a totally different one, and not
certified for anything, would go "a bit" beyound owner maintenance. Or is
nothing too far for this category?
--
Jim in NC


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[Kevin Horton]

On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 00:24:02 -0400, Morgans wrote:

>
> "Dan Thomas" > wrote
>>
>> It's a category called "Owner-Maintenance," designed to keep
>> those older airplanes flying even though parts are hard to find. The
>> airplane essentially becomes a homebuilt. There are drawbacks: no
>> flights into the U.S., for instance.
>> I don't think he should bother with any engine offsets to start
>> with. The Cessan 172 uses none, like many others. Bigger concern would
>> be the strength of the structure. The 120 was a pretty light airplane.
>>
>> Dan
>
> I would think replacing an engine with a totally different one, and not
> certified for anything, would go "a bit" beyound owner maintenance. Or is
> nothing too far for this category?

Pretty much anything goes in the Owner Maintenance category. The
premise is that many older aircraft are very hard to keep airworthy, if
you have to use approved parts. Many of the manufacturers no longer
exist, so it can be hard to find parts that have a proper paper trail.
So, in Canada, the Owner Maintenance (OM) category was created, which
allows the owner to do whatever he wants, including engine changes, etc.
OM is only available if the aircraft type is on the offical list.

Once you move an aircraft in OM category, it is no longer eligible for a
normal Certificate of Airworthiness, so it cannot be flown outside Canada,
unless the other country provides a specific authorization. It is very
difficult to move an OM aircraft back to the type certificated category.

Lots more info at:

<http://www.copanational.org/non-members/om.htm>
<http://www.tc.gc.ca/OntarioRegion/civilaviation/manufacturing/recav/owner.htm>

--
Kevin Horton RV-8 (finishing kit)
Ottawa, Canada
http://go.phpwebhosting.com/~khorton/rv8/
e-mail: khorton02(_at_)rogers(_dot_)com

[Barrie Gittens]

OK guys, The airplane "WAS" a 120. It is being highly modified and is
quite beefed up structurally. It will be registered in the homebuilt
catagory. I guess that gives me a green light to do what I feel is
necessary to it. The owner maintenance thing is a lot more restrictive
than most people realize. You do not have "carte blanch" like we do in
the homebuilt field. I think I will take your advice and truly
experiment. Thanks for the input, much appreciated. Kevin, just where
are you from? I suspect that it is quite close to me.

Kevin Horton > wrote in message >...
> On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 00:24:02 -0400, Morgans wrote:
>
> >
> > "Dan Thomas" > wrote
> >>
> >> It's a category called "Owner-Maintenance," designed to keep
> >> those older airplanes flying even though parts are hard to find. The
> >> airplane essentially becomes a homebuilt. There are drawbacks: no
> >> flights into the U.S., for instance.
> >> I don't think he should bother with any engine offsets to start
> >> with. The Cessan 172 uses none, like many others. Bigger concern would
> >> be the strength of the structure. The 120 was a pretty light airplane.
> >>
> >> Dan
> >
> > I would think replacing an engine with a totally different one, and not
> > certified for anything, would go "a bit" beyound owner maintenance. Or is
> > nothing too far for this category?
>
> Pretty much anything goes in the Owner Maintenance category. The
> premise is that many older aircraft are very hard to keep airworthy, if
> you have to use approved parts. Many of the manufacturers no longer
> exist, so it can be hard to find parts that have a proper paper trail.
> So, in Canada, the Owner Maintenance (OM) category was created, which
> allows the owner to do whatever he wants, including engine changes, etc.
> OM is only available if the aircraft type is on the offical list.
>
> Once you move an aircraft in OM category, it is no longer eligible for a
> normal Certificate of Airworthiness, so it cannot be flown outside Canada,
> unless the other country provides a specific authorization. It is very
> difficult to move an OM aircraft back to the type certificated category.
>
> Lots more info at:
>
> <http://www.copanational.org/non-members/om.htm>
> <http://www.tc.gc.ca/OntarioRegion/civilaviation/manufacturing/recav/owner.htm>