PJ Hunt
April 13th 04, 09:46 PM
So it's been almost a year now since the last post and I'm dying to know,
What ever happened to this clown?
PJ
===================================
"Murphy's law" > wrote in message
m...
> Dennis Fetters > wrote in message
>...
> > Murphy's law wrote:
> > >>>>Well, it is obvious that you are no rocket scientist to try and say
that
> > >>>>if a tail boom gets cut of in and accident that it was mast bumping.
By
> > >>>>the way, you better read your contract.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>Obviously if the rotor blades cut off the tail boom first the mast
bumping occurs.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Obviously, your ignorance in the matter astounds us all.
> > >
> > >
> > > You are an ignoramus. That is why you could not even copy the
> > > brilliant design of Augusto Cicare. I rest the case.
> >
> >
> > I'm ignorant? Where on the totem pole dose that place you? The root?
> >
> > Well, you rest your case with no foundation or facts. Here I'll post the
> > facts about the dealings between Augusto Cicare and myself, so people
> > can read what really happened, not what you are trying to insinuate.
> > Also, it was later that Augusto Cicare posted a statement that I did not
> > copy his system, and that they are indeed to separate designs.
> >
> >
> > From: )
> > Subject: Part 3 - Revolution Helicopters Defense to False Accusations
> > View: Complete Thread (8 articles)
> > Original Format
> > Newsgroups: rec.aviation.homebuilt
> > Date: 1998/10/21
> >
> > Revolution Helicopters Defense to False Accusations - Part 3
> >
> > Wednesday, Oct. 21, 1998
> >
> > Dear Newsgroup Participants,
> >
> > This is the final segment of my three part report on the issues
concerning
> > Revolution Helicopter and the Mini-500.
> >
> > Today's post will regard the subjects of:
> >
> > ~ The Fetters / Cicare Facts
> > ~ Magazines? Articles / US Aviator
> > ~ Closing statements
> >
> > I hope it gets the information across, and all who read it will now
> > have another view to consider.
> >
> > ~ The Fetters / Cicare Facts----
> >
> > There is no secret about the dealings I had with Mr. Cicare. Even
> > though it?s all documented facts, some people try to make it sound like
> > a big conspiracy that RHCI is trying to cover up. That?s not the case at
> > all, but naturally we no longer place the information about our early
> > involvement in present day brochures. I?ll explain what took place,
> > while making the story as brief as possible.
> >
> > As many of you know, before I started RHCI, I had a company called Air
> > Command and produced the Commander giroplanes. Then, Air Command sold
> > 97% of all gyroplanes being built in the world, and shipped 1100
> > aircraft. I was already a commercial rated helicopter pilot, and gaining
> > and interest in designing a helicopter.
> >
> > In the fall of 1989 I received a call from a man in California called
> > Hugo Zucarelli, who explained to me that he had a friend in Argentina
> > that had built a small helicopter, and he was doing him a favor by
> > looking for someone to build them. Finally, I received a video of the
> > Cicare prototype flying, and it gained my attention. After many phone
> > conversations with Mr. Cicare, my wife Laura and I traveled to Argentina
> > in the spring or 1990 to see his machine.
>
>
1---------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> I flew the prototype, and with
> > my evaluation informed Mr. Cicare that I would be interested to build
> > them, but only if we redesigned it by improving the design in many
> > areas, and enclosing it with a cabin. He then agreed to a deal as to
> > where I would buy the prototype, sell my present company Air Command and
> > start a new company to build the helicopter. In this new company Mr.
> > Cicare would own part of it, and be paid a commission for every
> > helicopter shipped. His part would be to provide his prototype, rights
> > to his Argentine patent on his control system, and come to the USA to
> > help me redesign the helicopter and put it into production. All was
> > agreed to.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
> Next, to my surprise, Mr. Zucarelli called me and asked for a
> > large commission for setting us up to make a deal! So much for doing a
> > friend a favor, and he never mentioned anything like that before. Both
> > Mr. Cicare and I turned him down.
> >
> > I came back to the USA, and started with what I could do. First we
> > needed money, and I needed to find an investor to help us out. We also
> > wrote the contract for the deal we had agreed to and sent it to him to
> > sign. Now the 1990 Oshkosh was coming up fast, so I paid for the
> > prototype to be sent here so I could fly it in the show. This would help
> > bring an investor to the table and allow us to raise the money to pay
> > the $30,000 for the prototype and all the expenses for the development.
> > After the air show, we put the prototype into a storage building, and
> > Mr. Cicare had the only key. We never had access after that to the
> > prototype.
> >
> > The airshow did the job, and I was able to find some people ready to
> > jump. Now came the trouble. First, Mr. Cicare would not sign the
> > contract, and none of the investors would do anything until that
> > happened. Next, Mr. Cicare was supposed to come to the USA and help me
> > in the design of the new helicopter, which he never did. This also made
> > the development of the Mini-500 take much longer without his help or the
> > prototype. Add to that, I had to invest my own personal finances to get
> > Revolution going. I couldn?t get outside investors, because time after
> > time we would lose any potential investors from the reluctance of Mr.
> > Cicare to sign the contract. He wanted to now change the deal after he
> > saw the response from Oshkosh, which I was reluctant to do since I was
> > putting all of the investment and work into the deal.
> >
> > Next, we found out that Mr. Cicare was dealing behind our back with a
> > separate deal with a company then called Helicraft. He was selling them
> > the plans and rights to his previous design of the CH-5! This was
> > competition we didn?t count on, and a direct conflict of interest. I was
> > in trouble. I sold my only source of making a living, Air Command, and
> > put my personal money into the Mini-500, and because of the contract and
> > conflict of interest situation, no more people were interested in
> > investing. I then gave Mr. Cicare an ultimatum...... Cancel the deal
> > with Helicraft, and sign the contract by January 15, 1991, or I would
> > have to do the project without him. Simply, the deadline came and went
> > with only the comment from him that I could not do it on my own. The
> > deal was off, and I was on my own with a helicopter project that I not
> > only financed and designed all by myself, but without the benefit of the
> > prototype to even look at.
>
>
2---------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> Later, I even redesigned and improved the
> > control system to the point that it was different enough to merit it?s
> > own patent #5,163,815, issued Nov. 17, 1992.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------>
> This is not the end of the story. We found out later that Mr. Hugo
> > Zucarelli was visiting Italy, and noticed an ad from our distributor
> > there, Mr. Barbero of Ellisport. Mr. Zucarelli approached them and
> > convinced them to make a deal with Mr. Cicare and build their own
> > helicopter, the CH-7. Well, as you know this is what did happened.
>
>
3---------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> > After, Mr. Cicare applied for a patent on his control design and was
> > issued #5,165,854 on Nov. 24, 1992. I found out later that the original
> > idea for this control system was not invented by Mr. Cicare! It was, and
> > is being used on the Kaman helicopters. The difference is that on the
> > Kaman, the controls operate trim tabs on the tips of the rotors. Still,
> > there was enough difference between all three that they all merited
> > their own patents.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
> > Later, I received another call followed by a fax from Mr. Zucarelli
> > asking me to reconsider a deal with Mr. Cicare, because the deal was
> > falling apart in Italy. Come to find out, Mr. Zucarelli hit them up for
> > a commission for setting the deal up, and the Barbero?s took offense to
> > it in a big way. Also, they told Mr. Cicare that unless he stopped RHCI
> > from building the Mini-500, they would stop their deal with him. After
> > he finished helping them put the CH-7 into production, they did just
> > that, and to this day Mr. Cicare has only got the money for the
> > prototype, and nothing more from Ellisport. The rest is history.
> >
> > I still respect Mr. Cicare for his own accomplishments. I truly wish it
> > would have worked out with him, I could have finished the project much
> > faster and with a lot less of my money invested. Deals come and go,
> > there?s nothing new about that. It was out of my hands to make him sign,
> > so I continued with the project rather then go bankrupt because he
> > changed his mind.
>
> Now, let's see here the facts 1, 2, 3 : your statement with your own
> words.
> Read it more closely & slowly.
> "Later, I even redisigned & inproved the control system to the point
> that was different enough".
> Different enough from what? Cicare's?
> At that time you did not know that Kaman design existed, the so called
> "original idea".
> So you only had one control system to redisign & improve. Cicare's.
> Any way you slice it, the original concept of-control system & drive
> train etc.-is not yours. Only the redisign (M500) of the original CH6.
> Anyone can apply for patent, original or redisign.
> No one is disputing the fact that you created the M500.
> But the design idea of the M500 did come from Cicare's CH6.
> You admit it in your own statement.
> So therfore you are liable for all the M550s' design characteristics.
> Good or bad.
> What more proof do you need?
What ever happened to this clown?
PJ
===================================
"Murphy's law" > wrote in message
m...
> Dennis Fetters > wrote in message
>...
> > Murphy's law wrote:
> > >>>>Well, it is obvious that you are no rocket scientist to try and say
that
> > >>>>if a tail boom gets cut of in and accident that it was mast bumping.
By
> > >>>>the way, you better read your contract.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>Obviously if the rotor blades cut off the tail boom first the mast
bumping occurs.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Obviously, your ignorance in the matter astounds us all.
> > >
> > >
> > > You are an ignoramus. That is why you could not even copy the
> > > brilliant design of Augusto Cicare. I rest the case.
> >
> >
> > I'm ignorant? Where on the totem pole dose that place you? The root?
> >
> > Well, you rest your case with no foundation or facts. Here I'll post the
> > facts about the dealings between Augusto Cicare and myself, so people
> > can read what really happened, not what you are trying to insinuate.
> > Also, it was later that Augusto Cicare posted a statement that I did not
> > copy his system, and that they are indeed to separate designs.
> >
> >
> > From: )
> > Subject: Part 3 - Revolution Helicopters Defense to False Accusations
> > View: Complete Thread (8 articles)
> > Original Format
> > Newsgroups: rec.aviation.homebuilt
> > Date: 1998/10/21
> >
> > Revolution Helicopters Defense to False Accusations - Part 3
> >
> > Wednesday, Oct. 21, 1998
> >
> > Dear Newsgroup Participants,
> >
> > This is the final segment of my three part report on the issues
concerning
> > Revolution Helicopter and the Mini-500.
> >
> > Today's post will regard the subjects of:
> >
> > ~ The Fetters / Cicare Facts
> > ~ Magazines? Articles / US Aviator
> > ~ Closing statements
> >
> > I hope it gets the information across, and all who read it will now
> > have another view to consider.
> >
> > ~ The Fetters / Cicare Facts----
> >
> > There is no secret about the dealings I had with Mr. Cicare. Even
> > though it?s all documented facts, some people try to make it sound like
> > a big conspiracy that RHCI is trying to cover up. That?s not the case at
> > all, but naturally we no longer place the information about our early
> > involvement in present day brochures. I?ll explain what took place,
> > while making the story as brief as possible.
> >
> > As many of you know, before I started RHCI, I had a company called Air
> > Command and produced the Commander giroplanes. Then, Air Command sold
> > 97% of all gyroplanes being built in the world, and shipped 1100
> > aircraft. I was already a commercial rated helicopter pilot, and gaining
> > and interest in designing a helicopter.
> >
> > In the fall of 1989 I received a call from a man in California called
> > Hugo Zucarelli, who explained to me that he had a friend in Argentina
> > that had built a small helicopter, and he was doing him a favor by
> > looking for someone to build them. Finally, I received a video of the
> > Cicare prototype flying, and it gained my attention. After many phone
> > conversations with Mr. Cicare, my wife Laura and I traveled to Argentina
> > in the spring or 1990 to see his machine.
>
>
1---------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> I flew the prototype, and with
> > my evaluation informed Mr. Cicare that I would be interested to build
> > them, but only if we redesigned it by improving the design in many
> > areas, and enclosing it with a cabin. He then agreed to a deal as to
> > where I would buy the prototype, sell my present company Air Command and
> > start a new company to build the helicopter. In this new company Mr.
> > Cicare would own part of it, and be paid a commission for every
> > helicopter shipped. His part would be to provide his prototype, rights
> > to his Argentine patent on his control system, and come to the USA to
> > help me redesign the helicopter and put it into production. All was
> > agreed to.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
> Next, to my surprise, Mr. Zucarelli called me and asked for a
> > large commission for setting us up to make a deal! So much for doing a
> > friend a favor, and he never mentioned anything like that before. Both
> > Mr. Cicare and I turned him down.
> >
> > I came back to the USA, and started with what I could do. First we
> > needed money, and I needed to find an investor to help us out. We also
> > wrote the contract for the deal we had agreed to and sent it to him to
> > sign. Now the 1990 Oshkosh was coming up fast, so I paid for the
> > prototype to be sent here so I could fly it in the show. This would help
> > bring an investor to the table and allow us to raise the money to pay
> > the $30,000 for the prototype and all the expenses for the development.
> > After the air show, we put the prototype into a storage building, and
> > Mr. Cicare had the only key. We never had access after that to the
> > prototype.
> >
> > The airshow did the job, and I was able to find some people ready to
> > jump. Now came the trouble. First, Mr. Cicare would not sign the
> > contract, and none of the investors would do anything until that
> > happened. Next, Mr. Cicare was supposed to come to the USA and help me
> > in the design of the new helicopter, which he never did. This also made
> > the development of the Mini-500 take much longer without his help or the
> > prototype. Add to that, I had to invest my own personal finances to get
> > Revolution going. I couldn?t get outside investors, because time after
> > time we would lose any potential investors from the reluctance of Mr.
> > Cicare to sign the contract. He wanted to now change the deal after he
> > saw the response from Oshkosh, which I was reluctant to do since I was
> > putting all of the investment and work into the deal.
> >
> > Next, we found out that Mr. Cicare was dealing behind our back with a
> > separate deal with a company then called Helicraft. He was selling them
> > the plans and rights to his previous design of the CH-5! This was
> > competition we didn?t count on, and a direct conflict of interest. I was
> > in trouble. I sold my only source of making a living, Air Command, and
> > put my personal money into the Mini-500, and because of the contract and
> > conflict of interest situation, no more people were interested in
> > investing. I then gave Mr. Cicare an ultimatum...... Cancel the deal
> > with Helicraft, and sign the contract by January 15, 1991, or I would
> > have to do the project without him. Simply, the deadline came and went
> > with only the comment from him that I could not do it on my own. The
> > deal was off, and I was on my own with a helicopter project that I not
> > only financed and designed all by myself, but without the benefit of the
> > prototype to even look at.
>
>
2---------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> Later, I even redesigned and improved the
> > control system to the point that it was different enough to merit it?s
> > own patent #5,163,815, issued Nov. 17, 1992.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------>
> This is not the end of the story. We found out later that Mr. Hugo
> > Zucarelli was visiting Italy, and noticed an ad from our distributor
> > there, Mr. Barbero of Ellisport. Mr. Zucarelli approached them and
> > convinced them to make a deal with Mr. Cicare and build their own
> > helicopter, the CH-7. Well, as you know this is what did happened.
>
>
3---------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> > After, Mr. Cicare applied for a patent on his control design and was
> > issued #5,165,854 on Nov. 24, 1992. I found out later that the original
> > idea for this control system was not invented by Mr. Cicare! It was, and
> > is being used on the Kaman helicopters. The difference is that on the
> > Kaman, the controls operate trim tabs on the tips of the rotors. Still,
> > there was enough difference between all three that they all merited
> > their own patents.
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
> > Later, I received another call followed by a fax from Mr. Zucarelli
> > asking me to reconsider a deal with Mr. Cicare, because the deal was
> > falling apart in Italy. Come to find out, Mr. Zucarelli hit them up for
> > a commission for setting the deal up, and the Barbero?s took offense to
> > it in a big way. Also, they told Mr. Cicare that unless he stopped RHCI
> > from building the Mini-500, they would stop their deal with him. After
> > he finished helping them put the CH-7 into production, they did just
> > that, and to this day Mr. Cicare has only got the money for the
> > prototype, and nothing more from Ellisport. The rest is history.
> >
> > I still respect Mr. Cicare for his own accomplishments. I truly wish it
> > would have worked out with him, I could have finished the project much
> > faster and with a lot less of my money invested. Deals come and go,
> > there?s nothing new about that. It was out of my hands to make him sign,
> > so I continued with the project rather then go bankrupt because he
> > changed his mind.
>
> Now, let's see here the facts 1, 2, 3 : your statement with your own
> words.
> Read it more closely & slowly.
> "Later, I even redisigned & inproved the control system to the point
> that was different enough".
> Different enough from what? Cicare's?
> At that time you did not know that Kaman design existed, the so called
> "original idea".
> So you only had one control system to redisign & improve. Cicare's.
> Any way you slice it, the original concept of-control system & drive
> train etc.-is not yours. Only the redisign (M500) of the original CH6.
> Anyone can apply for patent, original or redisign.
> No one is disputing the fact that you created the M500.
> But the design idea of the M500 did come from Cicare's CH6.
> You admit it in your own statement.
> So therfore you are liable for all the M550s' design characteristics.
> Good or bad.
> What more proof do you need?