ClearNav Vario Spoiler Warning

[Dan Marotta]

I finally completed installation of my new CNv XC vario and am having
problems with the gear/spoiler warning logic.

In my installation, while sitting on the trailer, opening the spoiler
causes the Spoiler warning to flash and sound off. This happens without
respect to the gear position or switch reading. Reading the switches in
the Info section of the CNv, I see that both switches are correctly
wired and functioning (both show 0 and 1 status as appropriate).

Is it possible that this is a ground test function and I won't know if
everything works as intended until my first takeoff?
--
Dan Marotta

[[email protected]]

On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 4:11:24 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
> I finally completed installation of my new CNv XC vario and am
> having problems with the gear/spoiler warning logic.
>
>
>
> In my installation, while sitting on the trailer, opening the
> spoiler causes the Spoiler warning to flash and sound off.* This
> happens without respect to the gear position or switch reading.*
> Reading the switches in the Info section of the CNv, I see that both
> switches are correctly wired and functioning (both show 0 and 1
> status as appropriate).
>
>
>
> Is it possible that this is a ground test function and I won't know
> if everything works as intended until my first takeoff?
>
>
> --
>
> Dan Marotta

Is what you are seeing a "spoilers open" warning (during takeoff roll) vs. a "gear up" warning?

[Tango Eight]

On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 9:21:53 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 4:11:24 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
> > I finally completed installation of my new CNv XC vario and am
> > having problems with the gear/spoiler warning logic.
> >
> >
> >
> > In my installation, while sitting on the trailer, opening the
> > spoiler causes the Spoiler warning to flash and sound off.* This
> > happens without respect to the gear position or switch reading.*
> > Reading the switches in the Info section of the CNv, I see that both
> > switches are correctly wired and functioning (both show 0 and 1
> > status as appropriate).
> >
> >
> >
> > Is it possible that this is a ground test function and I won't know
> > if everything works as intended until my first takeoff?
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Dan Marotta
>
> Is what you are seeing a "spoilers open" warning (during takeoff roll) vs.. a "gear up" warning?

Yes, exactly.

Evan Ludeman for CNi

[Peter Purdie[_3_]]

Hi Dan

In case the rather shorthand answers have still left things unclear,
the system is working correctly for Gear and Spoiler Warnings
active.

In most ships you don't want to roll with spoilers open, so
have that warning active. Spoilers open, gear down, no
airspeed is a warning and SPOILERS will show on the screen.
For LS8/ASW24 or whatever where you want to roll with them
open until you have good roll control, disable the warning.

You will still get a warning (with Gear Warning enabled) if
you open spoilers with gear up. You can test the spoiler
warning function is correct by pressurising pitot to
50 knots, opening the spoilers should then give no warning
unless the gear is up.

Peter.

>> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 4:11:24 PM UTC-8, Dan
Marotta wrote:
>> > I finally completed installation of my new CNv XC vario and
am
>> > having problems with the gear/spoiler warning logic.
>> >=20
>> > =20
>> >=20
>> > In my installation, while sitting on the trailer, opening the
>> > spoiler causes the Spoiler warning to flash and sound
off.=A0 This
>> > happens without respect to the gear position or switch
reading.=A0
>> > Reading the switches in the Info section of the CNv, I see
that
>bot=
>h
>> > switches are correctly wired and functioning (both show 0
and 1
>> > status as appropriate).
>> >=20
>> > =20
>> >=20
>> > Is it possible that this is a ground test function and I won't
know
>> > if everything works as intended until my first takeoff?
>> >=20
>> > =20
>> > --=20
>> >=20
>> > Dan Marotta
>>=20
>> Is what you are seeing a "spoilers open" warning (during
takeoff roll)
>vs=
>.. a "gear up" warning?

[Dan Marotta]

Thanks Evan and Peter. If the winds are light enough to rig today, I'll
try it out.

Dan

On 2/3/2015 3:45 AM, Peter Purdie wrote:
> Hi Dan
>
> In case the rather shorthand answers have still left things unclear,
> the system is working correctly for Gear and Spoiler Warnings
> active.
>
> In most ships you don't want to roll with spoilers open, so
> have that warning active. Spoilers open, gear down, no
> airspeed is a warning and SPOILERS will show on the screen.
> For LS8/ASW24 or whatever where you want to roll with them
> open until you have good roll control, disable the warning.
>
> You will still get a warning (with Gear Warning enabled) if
> you open spoilers with gear up. You can test the spoiler
> warning function is correct by pressurising pitot to
> 50 knots, opening the spoilers should then give no warning
> unless the gear is up.
>
> Peter.
>
>>> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 4:11:24 PM UTC-8, Dan
> Marotta wrote:
>>>> I finally completed installation of my new CNv XC vario and
> am
>>>> having problems with the gear/spoiler warning logic.
>>>> =20
>>>> =20
>>>> =20
>>>> In my installation, while sitting on the trailer, opening the
>>>> spoiler causes the Spoiler warning to flash and sound
> off.=A0 This
>>>> happens without respect to the gear position or switch
> reading.=A0
>>>> Reading the switches in the Info section of the CNv, I see
> that
>> bot=
>> h
>>>> switches are correctly wired and functioning (both show 0
> and 1
>>>> status as appropriate).
>>>> =20
>>>> =20
>>>> =20
>>>> Is it possible that this is a ground test function and I won't
> know
>>>> if everything works as intended until my first takeoff?
>>>> =20
>>>> =20
>>>> --=20
>>>> =20
>>>> Dan Marotta
>>> =20
>>> Is what you are seeing a "spoilers open" warning (during
> takeoff roll)
>> vs=
>> .. a "gear up" warning?
>

--
Dan Marotta

[John Firth[_4_]]

In my book, warnings for take off roll and landing approach should be
audio, not on the panel. To divert your attention from outside risks a
ground loop or worse.
During takeoff, the only point at which I glance at the ASI
is after I have three axis control.
JMF

At 15:12 03 February 2015, Dan Marotta wrote:
>Thanks Evan and Peter. If the winds are light enough to rig today, I'll
>try it out.
>
>Dan
>
>On 2/3/2015 3:45 AM, Peter Purdie wrote:
>> Hi Dan
>>
>> In case the rather shorthand answers have still left things unclear,
>> the system is working correctly for Gear and Spoiler Warnings
>> active.
>>
>> In most ships you don't want to roll with spoilers open, so
>> have that warning active. Spoilers open, gear down, no
>> airspeed is a warning and SPOILERS will show on the screen.
>> For LS8/ASW24 or whatever where you want to roll with them
>> open until you have good roll control, disable the warning.
>>
>> You will still get a warning (with Gear Warning enabled) if
>> you open spoilers with gear up. You can test the spoiler
>> warning function is correct by pressurising pitot to
>> 50 knots, opening the spoilers should then give no warning
>> unless the gear is up.
>>
>> Peter.
>>
>>>> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 4:11:24 PM UTC-8, Dan
>> Marotta wrote:
>>>>> I finally completed installation of my new CNv XC vario and
>> am
>>>>> having problems with the gear/spoiler warning logic.
>>>>>
>
>>>>>
>
>>>>>
>
>>>>> In my installation, while sitting on the trailer, opening the
>>>>> spoiler causes the Spoiler warning to flash and sound
>> off.=A0 This
>>>>> happens without respect to the gear position or switch
>> reading.=A0
>>>>> Reading the switches in the Info section of the CNv, I see
>> that
>>> bot
>>> h
>>>>> switches are correctly wired and functioning (both show 0
>> and 1
>>>>> status as appropriate).
>>>>>
>
>>>>>
>
>>>>>
>
>>>>> Is it possible that this is a ground test function and I won't
>> know
>>>>> if everything works as intended until my first takeoff?
>>>>>
>
>>>>>
>
>>>>> --
>
>>>>>
>
>>>>> Dan Marotta
>>>>
>
>>>> Is what you are seeing a "spoilers open" warning (during
>> takeoff roll)
>>> vs
>>> .. a "gear up" warning?
>>
>
>--
>Dan Marotta
>

[Tango Eight]

On Tuesday, February 3, 2015 at 10:45:06 AM UTC-5, firsys wrote:
> In my book, warnings for take off roll and landing approach should be
> audio, not on the panel. To divert your attention from outside risks a
> ground loop or worse.
> During takeoff, the only point at which I glance at the ASI
> is after I have three axis control.
> JMF

Just to be clear on this: CNv provides both audio and visual. The visual message is more for setup and confirming all the switchology is correct.

Next release of CNv will offer the ability to defeat the spoilers open on takeoff warning for pilots that use spoilers on the take off roll and don't want the alarm going.

best,
Evan Ludeman for CNi

[[email protected]]

Will that warning suppression be groundspeed based so that protection is still given once the glider has accelerated through the initial, spoilers-out takeoff roll?

B3

"Next release of CNv will offer the ability to defeat the spoilers open on takeoff warning"

[Tango Eight]

I am told that the way it will work is via an alarm silence function. So open spoilers (alarm sounds), push lower right button briefly to silence alarm, alarm resets when either gear or spoiler switch changes state. I like your airspeed idea better... I'll forward that.

-Evan Ludeman for CNi

On Tuesday, February 3, 2015 at 7:33:05 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> Will that warning suppression be groundspeed based so that protection is still given once the glider has accelerated through the initial, spoilers-out takeoff roll?
>
> B3
>
> "Next release of CNv will offer the ability to defeat the spoilers open on takeoff warning"

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

Tango Eight wrote on 2/3/2015 5:34 PM:
> I am told that the way it will work is via an alarm silence function.
> So open spoilers (alarm sounds), push lower right button briefly to
> silence alarm, alarm resets when either gear or spoiler switch
> changes state. I like your airspeed idea better... I'll forward
> that.
>
> -Evan Ludeman for CNi
>
> On Tuesday, February 3, 2015 at 7:33:05 PM UTC-5,
> wrote:
>> Will that warning suppression be groundspeed based so that
>> protection is still given once the glider has accelerated through
>> the initial, spoilers-out takeoff roll?
>>
>> B3
>>
>> "Next release of CNv will offer the ability to defeat the spoilers
>> open on takeoff warning"

The 302 uses airspeed: if the spoilers are still extended as the
airspeed increases past 25 knots, the alarm goes off. It works perfectly
on my motorglider, because I taxi and have the spoilers open to apply
the brake. So far, I haven't forgotten to close the spoilers for takeoff,
but others have (they didn't have a spoiler open on takeoff alert).

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm
http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl

[jfitch]

On Tuesday, February 3, 2015 at 7:45:06 AM UTC-8, firsys wrote:
> In my book, warnings for take off roll and landing approach should be
> audio, not on the panel. To divert your attention from outside risks a
> ground loop or worse.
> During takeoff, the only point at which I glance at the ASI
> is after I have three axis control.
> JMF
>
> At 15:12 03 February 2015, Dan Marotta wrote:
> >Thanks Evan and Peter. If the winds are light enough to rig today, I'll
> >try it out.
> >
> >Dan
> >
> >On 2/3/2015 3:45 AM, Peter Purdie wrote:
> >> Hi Dan
> >>
> >> In case the rather shorthand answers have still left things unclear,
> >> the system is working correctly for Gear and Spoiler Warnings
> >> active.
> >>
> >> In most ships you don't want to roll with spoilers open, so
> >> have that warning active. Spoilers open, gear down, no
> >> airspeed is a warning and SPOILERS will show on the screen.
> >> For LS8/ASW24 or whatever where you want to roll with them
> >> open until you have good roll control, disable the warning.
> >>
> >> You will still get a warning (with Gear Warning enabled) if
> >> you open spoilers with gear up. You can test the spoiler
> >> warning function is correct by pressurising pitot to
> >> 50 knots, opening the spoilers should then give no warning
> >> unless the gear is up.
> >>
> >> Peter.
> >>
> >>>> On Monday, February 2, 2015 at 4:11:24 PM UTC-8, Dan
> >> Marotta wrote:
> >>>>> I finally completed installation of my new CNv XC vario and
> >> am
> >>>>> having problems with the gear/spoiler warning logic.
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>> In my installation, while sitting on the trailer, opening the
> >>>>> spoiler causes the Spoiler warning to flash and sound
> >> off.=A0 This
> >>>>> happens without respect to the gear position or switch
> >> reading.=A0
> >>>>> Reading the switches in the Info section of the CNv, I see
> >> that
> >>> bot
> >>> h
> >>>>> switches are correctly wired and functioning (both show 0
> >> and 1
> >>>>> status as appropriate).
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>> Is it possible that this is a ground test function and I won't
> >> know
> >>>>> if everything works as intended until my first takeoff?
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>> --
> >
> >>>>>
> >
> >>>>> Dan Marotta
> >>>>
> >
> >>>> Is what you are seeing a "spoilers open" warning (during
> >> takeoff roll)
> >>> vs
> >>> .. a "gear up" warning?
> >>
> >
> >--
> >Dan Marotta
> >

The best warnings are from the Butterfly Vario. The Bitching Betty will say in a loud clear voice "SPOILERS ARE OPEN". Or "LANDING GEAR NOT EXTENDED". This does not leave you glancing around the cockpit wondering if it is the engine controller, the gear, the spoilers, the PDA, FLARM the oxygen control - all of which were capable of beeping in my glider. Now only the engine control and O2 control beeps. Everything else is explained to me by the B.B.

[[email protected]]

Testing: Rosebud was his sled.

Nope, didn't work.

[[email protected]]

For those wanting a gear warning with voice, another option is the Tassman.
It allows you to record your own voice.
Something like..."Hey STUPID !! Lower the gear!"
No confusing that with the other beeps, clicks, whistles and such in our quiet cockpits.