Instrument Panel Color

[[email protected]]

What is the reason that most instrument panels are black ? is it to reduce reflection ? I have a white panel I want to use.
Dan

[[email protected]]

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 3:05:03 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> What is the reason that most instrument panels are black ? is it to reduce reflection ? I have a white panel I want to use.
> Dan

Perfect way to have a heads up display when everything is reflected in the canopy is to use white.
Reflections are the reason for black mostly.
UH

[WAVEGURU]

I hate it when someone paints the panel white. Don't do it. It is dangerous. There is a reason panels and instruments are black and also the noses of fighters.

Boggs

[kirk.stant]

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 4:55:43 PM UTC-6, Waveguru wrote:
> I hate it when someone paints the panel white. Don't do it. It is dangerous. There is a reason panels and instruments are black and also the noses of fighters.
>
> Boggs

Ok, I'll bite.

Most panels in US military jets are gray, not black. Most current fighter noses (I assume you mean radomes) are also gray. Many early radomes had black rubber/plastic coatings that couldn't be painted - newer ones come in matching colors.

Oddly, panels in the latest F-15K (for Korea) and F-15SG (Singapore) are black - and trust me, it's ugly.

Russian jets tend to have an odd turquoise color panels. And Boeing airliners are an odd brown.

My panel is gray (primer color) and works just fine.

Kirk
66

[kirk.stant]

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 5:43:35 PM UTC-6, kirk.stant wrote:
> On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 4:55:43 PM UTC-6, Waveguru wrote:
> > I hate it when someone paints the panel white. Don't do it. It is dangerous. There is a reason panels and instruments are black and also the noses of fighters.
> >
> > Boggs
>
> Ok, I'll bite.
>
> Most panels in US military jets are gray, not black. Most current fighter noses (I assume you mean radomes) are also gray. Many early radomes had black rubber/plastic coatings that couldn't be painted - newer ones come in matching colors.
>
> Oddly, panels in the latest F-15K (for Korea) and F-15SG (Singapore) are black - and trust me, it's ugly.
>
> Russian jets tend to have an odd turquoise color panels. And Boeing airliners are an odd brown.
>
> My panel is gray (primer color) and works just fine.
>
> Kirk
> 66

And having read your post a little closer, I assume you are talking about the anti-glare panels on unpainted or white planes. Good point. The key is that the paint be flat - a glossy black can be just as reflective as glossy white!

Kirk
66

[Dan Marotta]

Go for it, and enjoy!

I've had panels that were black, grey, and sky blue and all were just
fine. The overhang of your glare shield will block most, if not all of
the reflections. If it doesn't work out the way you like, simply
repaint it. Ignore the safety nazis who want you to do everything their
way "in the name of safety".

On 11/23/2015 1:05 PM, wrote:
> What is the reason that most instrument panels are black ? is it to reduce reflection ? I have a white panel I want to use.
> Dan

--
Dan, 5J

[krasw]

On Monday, 23 November 2015 22:05:03 UTC+2, wrote:
> What is the reason that most instrument panels are black ? is it to reduce reflection ? I have a white panel I want to use.
> Dan

New glider panels are mostly with grey matte Nextel paint (with exceptions, of course).

[[email protected]]

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 3:46:12 PM UTC-8, kirk.stant wrote:
> On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 5:43:35 PM UTC-6, kirk.stant wrote:
> > On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 4:55:43 PM UTC-6, Waveguru wrote:
> > > I hate it when someone paints the panel white. Don't do it. It is dangerous. There is a reason panels and instruments are black and also the noses of fighters.
> > >
> > > Boggs
> >
> > Ok, I'll bite.
> >
> > Most panels in US military jets are gray, not black. Most current fighter noses (I assume you mean radomes) are also gray. Many early radomes had black rubber/plastic coatings that couldn't be painted - newer ones come in matching colors.
> >
> > Oddly, panels in the latest F-15K (for Korea) and F-15SG (Singapore) are black - and trust me, it's ugly.
> >
> > Russian jets tend to have an odd turquoise color panels. And Boeing airliners are an odd brown.
> >
> > My panel is gray (primer color) and works just fine.
> >
> > Kirk
> > 66
>
> And having read your post a little closer, I assume you are talking about the anti-glare panels on unpainted or white planes. Good point. The key is that the paint be flat - a glossy black can be just as reflective as glossy white!
>
> Kirk
> 66

Ok I'll bite :). Not sure if Boggs was making the distinction between black and grey... Anyway, wouldn't a "flat white" panel be much worse than a flat grey or flat black? I can't think of a single airplane that has a white panel of any kind. I can't even wear a light colored shirt in my non-tinted canopy glider, the glare drives me absolutely nuts. I now wear black, grey or dark blue or similar.

[[email protected]]

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 4:43:46 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
> Go for it, and enjoy!
>
>
>
> I've had panels that were black, grey, and sky blue and all were
> just fine.* The overhang of your glare shield will block most, if
> not all of the reflections.* If it doesn't work out the way you
> like, simply repaint it.* Ignore the safety nazis who want you to do
> everything their way "in the name of safety".
>
>
>
>
> On 11/23/2015 1:05 PM,
> wrote:
>
>
>
> What is the reason that most instrument panels are black ? is it to reduce reflection ? I have a white panel I want to use.
> Dan
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Dan, 5J

The original post was inquiring whether or not to use a white panel, is anyone actually recommending that he go ahead and do that?

[Dan Marotta]

I do! If it doesn't work out for him he can always repaint it. If
that's too much trouble, simply cut out a panel shape from white paper
and tape it in place. Sit in the glider with the canopy down on a sunny
day and have a friend rotate the glider around a complete circle. That
won't account for bank beyond a wing on the ground, but will give him a
good idea if it will work for him.

BTW, in the summer, I only wear white shirts and it's never been a
problem. I wear darker clothes in the colder months and glare is more
of a problem then, but it's the lower sun angle, not the color of my
clothes. Check the ramp at a contest and tally what everyone's
wearing. I'm not suggesting that contest pilots know what's best to
wear, just that there are more of them in one location at one time so
you'll have a better sample.

My personal opinion of a white panel is that it will be too bright with
the sun over the pilot's shoulder and will make it harder to read the
instruments. Softer, non-gloss colors will provide better contrast, I
think.

On 11/24/2015 7:43 AM, wrote:
> On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 4:43:46 PM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
>> Go for it, and enjoy!
>>
>>
>>
>> I've had panels that were black, grey, and sky blue and all were
>> just fine. The overhang of your glare shield will block most, if
>> not all of the reflections. If it doesn't work out the way you
>> like, simply repaint it. Ignore the safety nazis who want you to do
>> everything their way "in the name of safety".
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 11/23/2015 1:05 PM,
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> What is the reason that most instrument panels are black ? is it to reduce reflection ? I have a white panel I want to use.
>> Dan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> Dan, 5J
> The original post was inquiring whether or not to use a white panel, is anyone actually recommending that he go ahead and do that?

--
Dan, 5J

[WAVEGURU]

The glare from a white panel will make it much harder to see outside the aircraft, but nobody looks outside these days, eh Dan? I am obviously against reducing the ability to see outside the cockpit. A clean canopy is also an important thing, and often overlooked in the preflight. He could repaint it, after seeing how bad it is, but he won't get around to it for some time, and while he is flying around with all that glare, he will be less able to see his fellow pilots around him. A white panel is a very bad idea. Grey, dark blue, or some other darkish color is fine, but not white.

Boggs

[Papa3[_2_]]

As others have said, seems pretty sketchy to me. I flew a club glider recently that had a white Kobo as the primary Nav device. Very distracting to have white reflections in the canopy. I can't imagine a completely white panel with the cutouts for instruments having dark faces. I expect that "mottling" would be very obvious in the reflections on the canopy. You'll notice many people go beyond flat black paint and coat the tops of their glareshields with black felt which is even less reflective. There's a good reason they go to the trouble...

P3

[Dan Marotta]

I must be missing something here since I'm never annoyed by glare from
my white shirt (another contributor mentioned only wearing dark
clothes). I wonder if all the objections are based upon observation or
simply conjecture. Have you actually seen "the glare from a white
panel"? The sky blue panel in my ASW-19b was never a problem.

On 11/24/2015 10:27 AM, Waveguru wrote:
> The glare from a white panel will make it much harder to see outside the aircraft, but nobody looks outside these days, eh Dan? I am obviously against reducing the ability to see outside the cockpit. A clean canopy is also an important thing, and often overlooked in the preflight. He could repaint it, after seeing how bad it is, but he won't get around to it for some time, and while he is flying around with all that glare, he will be less able to see his fellow pilots around him. A white panel is a very bad idea. Grey, dark blue, or some other darkish color is fine, but not white.
>
> Boggs

--
Dan, 5J

[BruceGreeff]

I went a little crazy and painted my modified panel glareshield with the
self shaping bumper paint that makes an extremely rough matt black surface.
Noticeably less total reflection on the canopy.

Quite contrary to expectation it is not uniformly better. There are
angles of sun that somehow manage to align with the facets in the paint
and make a reflected sparkle on the canopy.

Painting the back of the panel in a light grey or white results in
easier maintenance - because you can see better.

On 2015-11-24 21:06, Papa3 wrote:
> As others have said, seems pretty sketchy to me. I flew a club glider recently that had a white Kobo as the primary Nav device. Very distracting to have white reflections in the canopy. I can't imagine a completely white panel with the cutouts for instruments having dark faces. I expect that "mottling" would be very obvious in the reflections on the canopy. You'll notice many people go beyond flat black paint and coat the tops of their glareshields with black felt which is even less reflective. There's a good reason they go to the trouble...
>
> P3
>

--
Bruce Greeff
T59D #1771

[krasw]

I remember seeing studies that black is pretty bad colour for instrument panel. Instrument scan is most effective when you see invidual instruments against panel, instead of only white needles and numbers against black background. That's why you haven't seen too much black instrument panels in military or commercial airplanes during last 50 years. (In addition they are are ugly as hell, but YMMV of course).

[Jim White[_3_]]

I painted my glare shield and canopy surround with dark grey Nextel
textured paint. Works a treat.
www.nextel-coating.com
Jim

At 15:56 25 November 2015, BruceGreeff wrote:
>I went a little crazy and painted my modified panel glareshield with the
>self shaping bumper paint that makes an extremely rough matt black
surface.
>Noticeably less total reflection on the canopy.
>
>Quite contrary to expectation it is not uniformly better. There are
>angles of sun that somehow manage to align with the facets in the paint
>and make a reflected sparkle on the canopy.
>
>Painting the back of the panel in a light grey or white results in
>easier maintenance - because you can see better.
>
>On 2015-11-24 21:06, Papa3 wrote:
>> As others have said, seems pretty sketchy to me. I flew a club glider
>recently that had a white Kobo as the primary Nav device. Very
>distracting to have white reflections in the canopy. I can't imagine a
>completely white panel with the cutouts for instruments having dark faces.

> I expect that "mottling" would be very obvious in the reflections on
the
>canopy. You'll notice many people go beyond flat black paint and coat
>the tops of their glareshields with black felt which is even less
>reflective. There's a good reason they go to the trouble...
>>
>> P3
>>
>
>--
>Bruce Greeff
>T59D #1771
>

[[email protected]]

So I think we agree that the glare shield should be dark (grey or black). The instrument panel itself can be lighter colored or black?
Dan

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, November 26, 2015 at 2:05:11 PM UTC, wrote:
> So I think we agree that the glare shield should be dark (grey or black). The instrument panel itself can be lighter colored or black?
> Dan

Even reflections from instrument dials can be really annoying at times. I would hate to have a white panel. As others have suggested, grey/black nextel is ideal and very tough.

[Dan Marotta]

Now THAT is a nice looking paint finish!

I like the anthracite primer with the cobalt blue topcoat.

On 11/26/2015 8:22 AM, wrote:
> On Thursday, November 26, 2015 at 2:05:11 PM UTC, wrote:
>> So I think we agree that the glare shield should be dark (grey or black). The instrument panel itself can be lighter colored or black?
>> Dan
> Even reflections from instrument dials can be really annoying at times. I would hate to have a white panel. As others have suggested, grey/black nextel is ideal and very tough.

--
Dan, 5J

[Van Henson]

I find that if I wear a light shirt I cannot easily read the screen of my glide computer because it is mostly washed out by the glare off my shirt. This is worst when I have the glide computer on my kneeboard (in club aircraft) where its face is more often perpendicular to the sun, but is also a problem n my glider, where I have a permanent mount in a position that isn't directly in the sun often. (I've never had success with temporary suction cup mounts).

The problem isn't really so much that the sun is directly on the instrument, it is that the sun is directly on the shirt! This gives a massive reflection on the computer, on the instrument panel, and on the canopy, all of which I find distracting.

When I wear a dark shirt all of these issues are greatly reduced.

Van