SSA sailplane tracker - too complex

[[email protected]]

Can someone explain how you are supposed to use the SSA sailplane tracker?
It seems way overly complex. You should have the option just to zoom and pan to an area of interest and see all the live tracks.

However it seems you have to figure out what airport the pilot took off from and what contest they are part of on what date etc.

It should be as simple as this, go to the map, see the aircraft, done!
https://www.flightradar24.com/

If I ever go missing it look hopeless that someone could find a broadcasting spot.
Or do you have to be registered with glideport.aero?

How do we get our club's current airport to be listed as an option?

thanks
Chris

[[email protected]]

Chris

Sorry the SSA Sailplane tracker is giving you trouble. You are correct in that registering with GlidePort.aero will open up additional features.

The app you compare us to is a different animal entirely. That app track aircraft that are active in the national airspace system (talking to ATC). Our app does not interact with the national ATC system.

To use our app you will need SPOT, InReach or the free smartphone app (glide track or IGC Droid).

Regarding your crew locating you in an emergency I trust that they will at least know the state you departed from and can find your track via a simple look down the list of sites reporting tracks that particular day. What tracking device are you using? For additional assistance you may refer to the two articles in Soaring magazine or the Sailplane Tracking Committee web page on the SSA web. There are several PDF manuals.

Hopefully the Tracker will become easier as you explore its features. We can't automate every flight at once because it would slow the animation down severely. Notice the site you referred to does not provide 3D imaging, track history, altitudes or instrument panel view.

Lane

[Tango Eight]

On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 7:14:50 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> Chris
>
> Sorry the SSA Sailplane tracker is giving you trouble. You are correct in that registering with GlidePort.aero will open up additional features.
>
> The app you compare us to is a different animal entirely. That app track aircraft that are active in the national airspace system (talking to ATC). Our app does not interact with the national ATC system.
>
> To use our app you will need SPOT, InReach or the free smartphone app (glide track or IGC Droid).
>
> Regarding your crew locating you in an emergency I trust that they will at least know the state you departed from and can find your track via a simple look down the list of sites reporting tracks that particular day. What tracking device are you using? For additional assistance you may refer to the two articles in Soaring magazine or the Sailplane Tracking Committee web page on the SSA web. There are several PDF manuals.
>
> Hopefully the Tracker will become easier as you explore its features. We can't automate every flight at once because it would slow the animation down severely. Notice the site you referred to does not provide 3D imaging, track history, altitudes or instrument panel view.
>
> Lane

Hi Lane,

I'm with Chris.

A simple, intuitive tracker that works reliably with all smart phones would be of significantly greater value (no registration or agree-to-terms pages, please).

I don't care about simulated 3D, instrument panel views, weather or any other "enhancements", thank you. I want Joe club member to be able to go to the SSA site and very quickly account for the local fleet and see at a glance if someone is on the ground and requires assistance.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8

[[email protected]]

Evan, how about this one. http://xcfind.paraglide.us/ PG biased but there are some sailplane pilots listed. Might be able to get a club specific page setup.

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 9:21:02 AM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 7:14:50 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > Chris
> >
> > Sorry the SSA Sailplane tracker is giving you trouble. You are correct in that registering with GlidePort.aero will open up additional features.
> >
> > The app you compare us to is a different animal entirely. That app track aircraft that are active in the national airspace system (talking to ATC).. Our app does not interact with the national ATC system.
> >
> > To use our app you will need SPOT, InReach or the free smartphone app (glide track or IGC Droid).
> >
> > Regarding your crew locating you in an emergency I trust that they will at least know the state you departed from and can find your track via a simple look down the list of sites reporting tracks that particular day. What tracking device are you using? For additional assistance you may refer to the two articles in Soaring magazine or the Sailplane Tracking Committee web page on the SSA web. There are several PDF manuals.
> >
> > Hopefully the Tracker will become easier as you explore its features. We can't automate every flight at once because it would slow the animation down severely. Notice the site you referred to does not provide 3D imaging, track history, altitudes or instrument panel view.
> >
> > Lane
>
> Hi Lane,
>
> I'm with Chris.
>
> A simple, intuitive tracker that works reliably with all smart phones would be of significantly greater value (no registration or agree-to-terms pages, please).
>
> I don't care about simulated 3D, instrument panel views, weather or any other "enhancements", thank you. I want Joe club member to be able to go to the SSA site and very quickly account for the local fleet and see at a glance if someone is on the ground and requires assistance.
>
> best,
> Evan Ludeman / T8

[Dan Marotta]

How would you track all club ships? I'm sure things are changing, but
I've never seen a club or rental glider with a transponder and I'll
wager that a lot of people (including me) don't have data plans on their
cell phones. Maybe when we're all ADS-B Out equipped...

On 7/24/2016 7:20 AM, Tango Eight wrote:
> On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 7:14:50 PM UTC-4, wrote:
>> Chris
>>
>> Sorry the SSA Sailplane tracker is giving you trouble. You are correct in that registering with GlidePort.aero will open up additional features.
>>
>> The app you compare us to is a different animal entirely. That app track aircraft that are active in the national airspace system (talking to ATC). Our app does not interact with the national ATC system.
>>
>> To use our app you will need SPOT, InReach or the free smartphone app (glide track or IGC Droid).
>>
>> Regarding your crew locating you in an emergency I trust that they will at least know the state you departed from and can find your track via a simple look down the list of sites reporting tracks that particular day. What tracking device are you using? For additional assistance you may refer to the two articles in Soaring magazine or the Sailplane Tracking Committee web page on the SSA web. There are several PDF manuals.
>>
>> Hopefully the Tracker will become easier as you explore its features. We can't automate every flight at once because it would slow the animation down severely. Notice the site you referred to does not provide 3D imaging, track history, altitudes or instrument panel view.
>>
>> Lane
> Hi Lane,
>
> I'm with Chris.
>
> A simple, intuitive tracker that works reliably with all smart phones would be of significantly greater value (no registration or agree-to-terms pages, please).
>
> I don't care about simulated 3D, instrument panel views, weather or any other "enhancements", thank you. I want Joe club member to be able to go to the SSA site and very quickly account for the local fleet and see at a glance if someone is on the ground and requires assistance.
>
> best,
> Evan Ludeman / T8

--
Dan, 5J

[[email protected]]

On the initial use of the Tracker you must agree to the terms (this was a requirement of the SSA retained lawyer). After first sign in the Tracker never requires that computer to acknowledge terms again.

If you want to quickly go to your clubs site, just bookmark that map page in your browser.

We can track all your club ships, if they have tracking devices onboard.

Remember please that this is a fee service that requires some equipment and knowledge on the users part. We will never be able to track gliders without devices, pop up on your computer without you pointing your browser, customize views for every pilot or just in general please all the people all the time. But hey, it's free!

Lane

[[email protected]]

And it does work really well with all "smart" phones. We will not be able to make it work with non data plan phones. If you know a way please drop Pedja an email.

Lane

[[email protected]]

It does work with "all smart phones".

Apple = Glide Track - free
Droid = IGCDroid - $10 one time purchase (free trial)

Lane

[Dan Marotta]

Tell me how it will work with my Android smart phone which has no data
plan. I might be interested in trying it then.

On 7/24/2016 11:09 AM, wrote:
> It does work with "all smart phones".
>
> Apple = Glide Track - free
> Droid = IGCDroid - $10 one time purchase (free trial)
>
> Lane

--
Dan, 5J

[Martin Gregorie[_5_]]

On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 16:02:18 -0600, Dan Marotta wrote:

> Tell me how it will work with my Android smart phone which has no data
> plan. I might be interested in trying it then.
>
Maybe the only way would be something like we have in the UK, but your
population density may be too low to give good coverage.

There is a really cheap FLARM software receiver, that runs on a
RaspberryPi with a small collection of additional hardware that, with a
decent antenna, can pick up FLARM transmissions from up to 50km or so
away. These receivers belong to glider pilots, plane spotters and
(probably) some hams. All feed into a server that publishes maps showing
where the gliders are. For instance, planefinder.net and flightradar24.com
use FLARM to track gliders. I use OGN (glidernet.org) to track gliders
here in the UK. This technology is in use in a lot of countries including
Canada, but not, I note, in USA.



> On 7/24/2016 11:09 AM, wrote:
>> It does work with "all smart phones".
>>
>> Apple = Glide Track - free Droid = IGCDroid - $10 one time purchase
>> (free trial)
>>
>> Lane



--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[Tom Kelley #711]

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 5:08:59 PM UTC-6, Martin Gregorie wrote:
> On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 16:02:18 -0600, Dan Marotta wrote:
>
> > Tell me how it will work with my Android smart phone which has no data
> > plan. I might be interested in trying it then.
> >
> Maybe the only way would be something like we have in the UK, but your
> population density may be too low to give good coverage.
>
> There is a really cheap FLARM software receiver, that runs on a
> RaspberryPi with a small collection of additional hardware that, with a
> decent antenna, can pick up FLARM transmissions from up to 50km or so
> away. These receivers belong to glider pilots, plane spotters and
> (probably) some hams. All feed into a server that publishes maps showing
> where the gliders are. For instance, planefinder.net and flightradar24.com
> use FLARM to track gliders. I use OGN (glidernet.org) to track gliders
> here in the UK. This technology is in use in a lot of countries including
> Canada, but not, I note, in USA.
>
>
>
> > On 7/24/2016 11:09 AM, wrote:
> >> It does work with "all smart phones".
> >>
> >> Apple = Glide Track - free Droid = IGCDroid - $10 one time purchase
> >> (free trial)
> >>
> >> Lane
>
>
>
> --
> martin@ | Martin Gregorie
> gregorie. | Essex, UK
> org |

NOTE: It sure is in the USA with some folks having current ground stations with antennas sticking way up in the air! They currently have 60++ miles range.............

Best #711.

[jfitch]

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 6:21:02 AM UTC-7, Tango Eight wrote:
> On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 7:14:50 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > Chris
> >
> > Sorry the SSA Sailplane tracker is giving you trouble. You are correct in that registering with GlidePort.aero will open up additional features.
> >
> > The app you compare us to is a different animal entirely. That app track aircraft that are active in the national airspace system (talking to ATC).. Our app does not interact with the national ATC system.
> >
> > To use our app you will need SPOT, InReach or the free smartphone app (glide track or IGC Droid).
> >
> > Regarding your crew locating you in an emergency I trust that they will at least know the state you departed from and can find your track via a simple look down the list of sites reporting tracks that particular day. What tracking device are you using? For additional assistance you may refer to the two articles in Soaring magazine or the Sailplane Tracking Committee web page on the SSA web. There are several PDF manuals.
> >
> > Hopefully the Tracker will become easier as you explore its features. We can't automate every flight at once because it would slow the animation down severely. Notice the site you referred to does not provide 3D imaging, track history, altitudes or instrument panel view.
> >
> > Lane
>
> Hi Lane,
>
> I'm with Chris.
>
> A simple, intuitive tracker that works reliably with all smart phones would be of significantly greater value (no registration or agree-to-terms pages, please).
>
> I don't care about simulated 3D, instrument panel views, weather or any other "enhancements", thank you. I want Joe club member to be able to go to the SSA site and very quickly account for the local fleet and see at a glance if someone is on the ground and requires assistance.
>
> best,
> Evan Ludeman / T8

In a large part of the US West, cell phone trackers are effectively useless, because cell phone coverage does not exist there. Some of the cell phone tracking apps save up track points and upload when they can later connect, for finding a down pilot this is obviously useless.

I don't find GlidePort to be all that difficult to use, certainly if you can master something as obscure as SeeYou it is quite accessible.

[[email protected]]

I have found the SSA map tracker too non-intuitive and generally too clunky to be useful. The 3D display does not seem useful at all. I go to the SSA website and look up one SSA member's tracker URL, and that individual site has always been useful for monitoring progress of a particular pilot.

[Tango Eight]

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 1:09:04 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> It does work with "all smart phones".

Not on mine, it doesn't (iphone 5). I'm accessing through Safari and I get "Oops, cannot run embedded" with a link to GlidePort, which gives me a map of North America with links I can't get past.

I realize this is all volunteer labor and I applaud the guys who are trying their best. But it would be my preference to see that best effort applied to simpler, more reliable, more useful stuff.

Locating a glider in a field with spot or inreach, but no cell service is the height of useful...

best,
Evan

[Tango Eight]

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 8:15:25 PM UTC-4, jfitch wrote:
> On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 6:21:02 AM UTC-7, Tango Eight wrote:
> > On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 7:14:50 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > Chris
> > >
> > > Sorry the SSA Sailplane tracker is giving you trouble. You are correct in that registering with GlidePort.aero will open up additional features.
> > >
> > > The app you compare us to is a different animal entirely. That app track aircraft that are active in the national airspace system (talking to ATC). Our app does not interact with the national ATC system.
> > >
> > > To use our app you will need SPOT, InReach or the free smartphone app (glide track or IGC Droid).
> > >
> > > Regarding your crew locating you in an emergency I trust that they will at least know the state you departed from and can find your track via a simple look down the list of sites reporting tracks that particular day. What tracking device are you using? For additional assistance you may refer to the two articles in Soaring magazine or the Sailplane Tracking Committee web page on the SSA web. There are several PDF manuals.
> > >
> > > Hopefully the Tracker will become easier as you explore its features. We can't automate every flight at once because it would slow the animation down severely. Notice the site you referred to does not provide 3D imaging, track history, altitudes or instrument panel view.
> > >
> > > Lane
> >
> > Hi Lane,
> >
> > I'm with Chris.
> >
> > A simple, intuitive tracker that works reliably with all smart phones would be of significantly greater value (no registration or agree-to-terms pages, please).
> >
> > I don't care about simulated 3D, instrument panel views, weather or any other "enhancements", thank you. I want Joe club member to be able to go to the SSA site and very quickly account for the local fleet and see at a glance if someone is on the ground and requires assistance.
> >
> > best,
> > Evan Ludeman / T8
>
> In a large part of the US West, cell phone trackers are effectively useless, because cell phone coverage does not exist there. Some of the cell phone tracking apps save up track points and upload when they can later connect, for finding a down pilot this is obviously useless.

....and that's why we use things like spot & inreach, of course.

>
> I don't find GlidePort to be all that difficult to use, certainly if you can master something as obscure as SeeYou it is quite accessible.

It's not surprising that you personally don't find it difficult, but you're not the guy I have in mind. I'm suggesting that the target for ease of use ought to be closer to facebook than SeeYou.

best,
Evan

[Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)]

I get the same message on a gen-2 Ipad via the Internet through SSA. I do have the option to run "unembedded" via the site though.

[[email protected]]

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 5:54:04 PM UTC-7, Tango Eight wrote:
> Not on mine, it doesn't (iphone 5). I'm accessing through Safari and I get "Oops, cannot run embedded" with a link to GlidePort, which gives me a map of North America with links I can't get past.

And if you follow the further instructions, you set it up to run un-embedded. It means creating a home page shortcut icon to the URL.

Used to work just fine on my iPhone 4S and really nice on my iPhone 6S+

5Z

[Tango Eight]

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 9:57:02 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 5:54:04 PM UTC-7, Tango Eight wrote:
> > Not on mine, it doesn't (iphone 5). I'm accessing through Safari and I get "Oops, cannot run embedded" with a link to GlidePort, which gives me a map of North America with links I can't get past.
>
> And if you follow the further instructions, you set it up to run un-embedded. It means creating a home page shortcut icon to the URL.
>
> Used to work just fine on my iPhone 4S and really nice on my iPhone 6S+
>
> 5Z

WHAT INSTRUCTIONS? No instructions are evident on my phone. None should be necessary.


best,
Evan

[[email protected]]

> I don't find GlidePort to be all that difficult to use, certainly if you can >master something as obscure as SeeYou it is quite accessible.

I can run SeeYou, that's not the point. I want someone else, such as a non-flying non-technical spouse to be able to go to the SSA website and look for me by name or contest number and find what farm field or dry lake in the desert i am in without cell phone service.
Nothing fancy, this is supposed to be a SAFETY system, not some 3D animated entertainment system!
Make the basic safety part work, make the fancy other stuff optional.

Chris

[[email protected]]

Well, I just opened it in Safari, got the message and clicked on "run un-embedded" and it runs "OK".

At this point, what you need to do is tap the "share" icon (square box with arrow pointing up) an choose "Add to home screen" (scroll to the right in the list of icons that begin with "copy". Then when you open the link from the home screen, the safari browser stuff doesn't take up screen real estate.

The iPhone experience is just like on a regular computer. Problem is that the left hand menu takes up most of the screen, so you need to hide and unhide it to see the map. If all you see is the map, then tap the red ">" at the upper left of the screen to get a list of countries. Then tap on the grey triangle to the right of the country of interest, then again on the grey triangle of the region or airport of interest.

At this point, hide the left menu and tap on carious pushpin icons to see the track. Hold your finger on the pin to see a popup of the pilot name.

I'm quite sure I learned about adding it to the home screen somewhere on GlidePort, but it's been a long time.

-Tom

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 7:45:50 PM UTC-7, Tango Eight wrote:
> WHAT INSTRUCTIONS? No instructions are evident on my phone. None should be necessary.

[[email protected]]

Don't use the live sailplane tracker for "emergency" location of a particular pilot. On the SSA website, under "member resources", there's a "*911* Sailplane Locator" option. Enter the pilot's name or contest number, and you have the simple view.

The live tracker is to be used to get the big picture, and many people love the 3D entertainment it provides.

-Tom

On Sunday, July 24, 2016 at 8:55:18 PM UTC-7, wrote:
> I want someone else, such as a non-flying non-technical spouse to be able to go to the SSA website and look for me by name or contest number and find what farm field or dry lake in the desert i am in without cell phone service.
> Nothing fancy, this is supposed to be a SAFETY system, not some 3D animated entertainment system!
> Make the basic safety part work, make the fancy other stuff optional.
>
> Chris

[Ramy[_2_]]

I must wonder if the folks who complain actually spent the time to read instructions and learn how to use this service. It works very well if you just spend few minutes, maybe an hour, to understand how to use it.
You do need Spot or Inreach (Dan, this may be a good reason for you to turn your spot on). The Glidetrack app works as well but only when there is cell reception.
As for tracking flights from the ground, this can easily be done from your computer or from your smart phone. Just ignore the embedded message and run unembedded.

Ramy

[Fox Two[_2_]]

Here's what we use in Europe, it tracks all FLARM gliders on the continent. We have an antennae on the largest nearby mountain (it's plugged into the local weather station equipment), and we track all of our club gliders, all of the time.

http://live.glidernet.org/#c=50.98464,7.63795&z=4

Chris Fleming

[Martin Gregorie[_5_]]

On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 17:05:33 -0700, Tom Kelley #711 wrote:

> NOTE: It sure is in the USA with some folks having current ground
> stations with antennas sticking way up in the air! They currently have
> 60++ miles range.............
>
.... thanks for the correction, but it appears that none of them are
registered with OGN, which is where I found the country coverage details.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

[Tango Eight]

On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 12:49:13 AM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
> I must wonder if the folks who complain actually spent the time to read instructions and learn how to use this service.

This is the point: if it takes an hour to figure out how to use it, then it's basically designed for time wasting technophiles sitting at computers. That's fine. But there are many other potential users, e.g. the spouse, kid, crew or student at the gliderport. Most of those would be users aren't going to be motivated enough to "spend an hour" climbing the learning curve and more than likely the device available is going to be a phone, not a full on computer.

I'd like to integrate something sort of like this tracker into my club. We have a bunch of guys who routinely fly crewless XC and eventually, one of us is going to park somewhere awkward and find communication really difficult.

Right now, the probability of the glideport aero tracker providing any assistance in that scenario is z e r o, because no one uses it, because it's too damned fussy and complicated. That's not a complaint, that's a review.

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8

[Papa3[_2_]]

On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 3:50:03 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> Can someone explain how you are supposed to use the SSA sailplane tracker?
> It seems way overly complex. You should have the option just to zoom and pan to an area of interest and see all the live tracks.
>
> thanks
> Chris

Typical of R.A.S. this thread has partly gone off the rails. There are two "legitimate" complaints arising.

1. Platform: The tracker throws an error message when I try to use it on my Android devices (a Kindle running Chrome and my Galaxy S6 also running Chrome). "Oops! Mobile GlidePort cannot run embedded in an iFrame" However, it does display a hyperlink to "Run un-embedded" and that works. It's a mild annoyance, but it's not a show stopper on Android/Chrome. Maybe worse on iOS?

2. UI: As pointed out, it's impossible to find an individual pilot unless you know where they launched (or where GP thinks they launched). You have to drill down from the site to get a list of tracks (leaving out competitions). That's not a big problem for someone like me who usually knows who I'm looking for and where they launched. But it's probably not very user friendly for John Q. Public who might stumble on this site.. "Hey, I know Erik flies gliders, I wonder if he's up today?"

NB: The 911 feature on the SSA Website does let you find an individual pilot by name or contest number. It relies on the pilot to have correctly linked to their individual tracker. In my case, it links to the Delorme page, which has some quirks of its own in terms of easily finding the latest position.

So, I'd fall into the camp of "mildly annoyed" but certainly not "outraged" :-)

P3

[Dave Leonard]

On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 8:18:35 AM UTC-6, Papa3 wrote:
> On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 3:50:03 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > Can someone explain how you are supposed to use the SSA sailplane tracker?
> > It seems way overly complex. You should have the option just to zoom and pan to an area of interest and see all the live tracks.
> >
> > thanks
> > Chris
>
> Typical of R.A.S. this thread has partly gone off the rails. There are two "legitimate" complaints arising.
>
> 1. Platform: The tracker throws an error message when I try to use it on my Android devices (a Kindle running Chrome and my Galaxy S6 also running Chrome). "Oops! Mobile GlidePort cannot run embedded in an iFrame" However, it does display a hyperlink to "Run un-embedded" and that works. It's a mild annoyance, but it's not a show stopper on Android/Chrome. Maybe worse on iOS?
>
> 2. UI: As pointed out, it's impossible to find an individual pilot unless you know where they launched (or where GP thinks they launched). You have to drill down from the site to get a list of tracks (leaving out competitions). That's not a big problem for someone like me who usually knows who I'm looking for and where they launched. But it's probably not very user friendly for John Q. Public who might stumble on this site.. "Hey, I know Erik flies gliders, I wonder if he's up today?"
>
> NB: The 911 feature on the SSA Website does let you find an individual pilot by name or contest number. It relies on the pilot to have correctly linked to their individual tracker. In my case, it links to the Delorme page, which has some quirks of its own in terms of easily finding the latest position.
>
> So, I'd fall into the camp of "mildly annoyed" but certainly not "outraged" :-)
>
> P3

Did you try the "Search" button at the top left of the screen? Right next to the "Map" button. Allows search by name or ID. You don't even have to know the day of the track.

ZL

[Tom Kelley #711]

On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 5:38:35 AM UTC-6, Tango Eight wrote:
> On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 12:49:13 AM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:
> > I must wonder if the folks who complain actually spent the time to read instructions and learn how to use this service.
>
> This is the point: if it takes an hour to figure out how to use it, then it's basically designed for time wasting technophiles sitting at computers. That's fine. But there are many other potential users, e.g. the spouse, kid, crew or student at the gliderport. Most of those would be users aren't going to be motivated enough to "spend an hour" climbing the learning curve and more than likely the device available is going to be a phone, not a full on computer.
>
> I'd like to integrate something sort of like this tracker into my club. We have a bunch of guys who routinely fly crewless XC and eventually, one of us is going to park somewhere awkward and find communication really difficult.
>
> Right now, the probability of the glideport aero tracker providing any assistance in that scenario is z e r o, because no one uses it, because it's too damned fussy and complicated. That's not a complaint, that's a review.
>
> best,
> Evan Ludeman / T8

Well, at the 2016 Nationals in Nephi, the developer of Gliderport.Aero, Pedja Bogdanovich, not only gave us a development talk, but I spoke with him over several days(we were gridded right next to each other). The number of pure hits (folks using his site) he sees are very large in numbers and they are from all over the World. When a contest is being held the number of hits rises rapidly. He also sees many, mnay repeated hits.
He also spoke on the development of a small tracker which will be carried giving instance altitude and position. The cost was in the range of mid $200 dollars. Most folks attended(+75 folks) his talk and when asked almost all raised their hand when asked if they would purchase such a tracker for use..
Maybe best to remember he's developing this site for free, its better than we have ever had and as time passes it will offer more features. But only he is doing it, its his passion, it takes time.
Everyone, including the SSA chair, KM, were very pleased with its development. He got a standing ovation for his many, many hours of free work he has put into it.
IMHO, I really don't see anyone needing a hour or so in how to use this site. After Pedja's talk my thoughts are he would be open to hear useful comments.

Best. #711.

[Tom Kelley #711]

On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 9:38:55 AM UTC-6, Dave Leonard wrote:
> On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 8:18:35 AM UTC-6, Papa3 wrote:
> > On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 3:50:03 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > Can someone explain how you are supposed to use the SSA sailplane tracker?
> > > It seems way overly complex. You should have the option just to zoom and pan to an area of interest and see all the live tracks.
> > >
> > > thanks
> > > Chris
> >
> > Typical of R.A.S. this thread has partly gone off the rails. There are two "legitimate" complaints arising.
> >
> > 1. Platform: The tracker throws an error message when I try to use it on my Android devices (a Kindle running Chrome and my Galaxy S6 also running Chrome). "Oops! Mobile GlidePort cannot run embedded in an iFrame" However, it does display a hyperlink to "Run un-embedded" and that works. It's a mild annoyance, but it's not a show stopper on Android/Chrome. Maybe worse on iOS?
> >
> > 2. UI: As pointed out, it's impossible to find an individual pilot unless you know where they launched (or where GP thinks they launched). You have to drill down from the site to get a list of tracks (leaving out competitions). That's not a big problem for someone like me who usually knows who I'm looking for and where they launched. But it's probably not very user friendly for John Q. Public who might stumble on this site.. "Hey, I know Erik flies gliders, I wonder if he's up today?"
> >
> > NB: The 911 feature on the SSA Website does let you find an individual pilot by name or contest number. It relies on the pilot to have correctly linked to their individual tracker. In my case, it links to the Delorme page, which has some quirks of its own in terms of easily finding the latest position.
> >
> > So, I'd fall into the camp of "mildly annoyed" but certainly not "outraged" :-)
> >
> > P3
>
> Did you try the "Search" button at the top left of the screen? Right next to the "Map" button. Allows search by name or ID. You don't even have to know the day of the track.
>
> ZL

When you do use search and type in name or ID it also brings up the "past history" as well. Then when you click the blue arrow along side of the "like" box (far right and run your cursor over that line) it will show the track for that particular day.

Thanks Dave for point that out.

Best. #711.

[Ramy[_2_]]

On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 9:44:14 AM UTC-7, Tom Kelley #711 wrote:
> On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 9:38:55 AM UTC-6, Dave Leonard wrote:
> > On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 8:18:35 AM UTC-6, Papa3 wrote:
> > > On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 3:50:03 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > > Can someone explain how you are supposed to use the SSA sailplane tracker?
> > > > It seems way overly complex. You should have the option just to zoom and pan to an area of interest and see all the live tracks.
> > > >
> > > > thanks
> > > > Chris
> > >
> > > Typical of R.A.S. this thread has partly gone off the rails. There are two "legitimate" complaints arising.
> > >
> > > 1. Platform: The tracker throws an error message when I try to use it on my Android devices (a Kindle running Chrome and my Galaxy S6 also running Chrome). "Oops! Mobile GlidePort cannot run embedded in an iFrame" However, it does display a hyperlink to "Run un-embedded" and that works. It's a mild annoyance, but it's not a show stopper on Android/Chrome. Maybe worse on iOS?
> > >
> > > 2. UI: As pointed out, it's impossible to find an individual pilot unless you know where they launched (or where GP thinks they launched). You have to drill down from the site to get a list of tracks (leaving out competitions). That's not a big problem for someone like me who usually knows who I'm looking for and where they launched. But it's probably not very user friendly for John Q. Public who might stumble on this site.. "Hey, I know Erik flies gliders, I wonder if he's up today?"
> > >
> > > NB: The 911 feature on the SSA Website does let you find an individual pilot by name or contest number. It relies on the pilot to have correctly linked to their individual tracker. In my case, it links to the Delorme page, which has some quirks of its own in terms of easily finding the latest position.
> > >
> > > So, I'd fall into the camp of "mildly annoyed" but certainly not "outraged" :-)
> > >
> > > P3
> >
> > Did you try the "Search" button at the top left of the screen? Right next to the "Map" button. Allows search by name or ID. You don't even have to know the day of the track.
> >
> > ZL
>
> When you do use search and type in name or ID it also brings up the "past history" as well. Then when you click the blue arrow along side of the "like" box (far right and run your cursor over that line) it will show the track for that particular day.
>
> Thanks Dave for point that out.
>
> Best. #711.

And for those who want to track only a particular pilot on a mobile device, try "spot buddy" app. It only cost couple of bucks and can track Spot and Inreach devices. No learning curve, and works very well for spouses etc, although myself I much prefer to use the SSA tracker even on my mobile device..

Ramy

[[email protected]]

<This is the point: if it takes an hour to figure out how to use it, then it's basically designed for time wasting technophiles sitting at computers.>

Spot on (pun intended). If I had a dollar for every time I heard "I don't see what the problem is. You just click on [insert appropriate OS-specific, multi-step, inscrutable-icon-driven, undocumented sequence]", I'd be flying a shiny new glider.

This is what's referred to as unintuitive design. That's fine for Photoshop, or possibly even for something like SeeYou (highly motivated users willing to climb the learning curve) or Snapchat (users who take pride in being members of an exclusive "club" who have climbed said learning curve). Not so good for those who need something simple and easy to use from the beginning.

Two different user profiles and sets of user stories/use cases. The "simple" functionality is a subset of the full-featured functionality. But the user profiles can be very different. That means the user interface for the "simple functionality" may need special attention, rather than less attention, which is the way it often occurs.

"I don't see what the problem is" couldn't be more true in situations like this.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24 "JB"

[Papa3[_2_]]

Nope. No search button. Can't post a screenshot, but there is no "search." Home. Map. Login. Those are the only top nav options. Also, the "filter" option that renders with Chrome on Windows 7 doesn't show up on Android. It's obviously not a fully responsive design; the experience is definitely degraded on mobile platforms. Same with Silknon Android.

[Tango Eight]

I'll have to take back what I said about the tracker on ios. It works. The issue is that if you aren't logged in, glideport aero doesn't tell you this, it just sits there on the map of North America and refuses to do anything useful.

So okay -- user error on my part. But still wondering why an observer needs an account in the first place.

best,
Evan

[David Kinsell[_2_]]

On Mon, 25 Jul 2016 19:44:00 -0700, Papa3 wrote:

> Nope. No search button. Can't post a screenshot, but there is no
> "search." Home. Map. Login. Those are the only top nav options. Also,
> the "filter" option that renders with Chrome on Windows 7 doesn't show
> up on Android. It's obviously not a fully responsive design; the
> experience is definitely degraded on mobile platforms. Same with
> Silknon Android.

I'm a very casual user of the tracker on a laptop, works reasonably well
now.

The big hangup for me was initially trying to use the SSA version, it
frequently gave a blank window when trying to start it, and once demanded
a security exemption be approved on Firefox. Wasted time trying
different browsers and different OS's.

Big breakthrough was when I dumped the SSA version and just went directly
to glideport.aero. Works so much better.

Case in point, glideport.aero for me has the nice search box that works
as expected, when I go back to the ssa version, it's missing. No
apparent way to log in, not even sure if you log in to that version.
Maybe if I spent hours reading manuals, all this would be clear, but I'm
not going to do that.

Just saw a meme, it said software is like a joke. If you have to explain
it, it's not very good. I'm sure that will offend somebody, but I'm
still scratching my head over what the advantage of the SSA front end is.

-Dave

[Papa3[_2_]]

On Tuesday, July 26, 2016 at 10:45:06 AM UTC-4, David Kinsell wrote:
> On Mon, 25 Jul 2016 19:44:00 -0700, Papa3 wrote:
>
> > Nope. No search button. Can't post a screenshot, but there is no
> > "search." Home. Map. Login. Those are the only top nav options. Also,
> > the "filter" option that renders with Chrome on Windows 7 doesn't show
> > up on Android. It's obviously not a fully responsive design; the
> > experience is definitely degraded on mobile platforms. Same with
> > Silknon Android.
>
> I'm a very casual user of the tracker on a laptop, works reasonably well
> now.
>
> The big hangup for me was initially trying to use the SSA version, it
> frequently gave a blank window when trying to start it, and once demanded
> a security exemption be approved on Firefox. Wasted time trying
> different browsers and different OS's.
>
> Big breakthrough was when I dumped the SSA version and just went directly
> to glideport.aero. Works so much better.
>
> Case in point, glideport.aero for me has the nice search box that works
> as expected, when I go back to the ssa version, it's missing. No
> apparent way to log in, not even sure if you log in to that version.
> Maybe if I spent hours reading manuals, all this would be clear, but I'm
> not going to do that.
>
> Just saw a meme, it said software is like a joke. If you have to explain
> it, it's not very good. I'm sure that will offend somebody, but I'm
> still scratching my head over what the advantage of the SSA front end is.
>
> -Dave

Wow - just tried that, and it's definitely different. For example, there's the search function that wasn't there in the SSA version. Of course, I tried it, and I got some fairly unintuitive results, but I can see where the "direct" version might be better. However, when I tried the "direct" version on my Galaxy running Chrome, I get yet another user experience.

Whatever. Works for me when I want to see what the local gang is up to while I'm stuck at work. Certainly wouldn't win any awards for Information Architecture or Usability, but not the worst application I've ever used.

[[email protected]]

On Saturday, July 23, 2016 at 1:50:03 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> Can someone explain how you are supposed to use the SSA sailplane tracker?
> It seems way overly complex. You should have the option just to zoom and pan to an area of interest and see all the live tracks.
>
> However it seems you have to figure out what airport the pilot took off from and what contest they are part of on what date etc.
>
> It should be as simple as this, go to the map, see the aircraft, done!
> https://www.flightradar24.com/
>
> If I ever go missing it look hopeless that someone could find a broadcasting spot.
> Or do you have to be registered with glideport.aero?
>
> How do we get our club's current airport to be listed as an option?
>
> thanks
> Chris

I had trouble when ssa suggested that I needed a modern browser like chrome suckered into loading chrome onto two computers. This resulted in two messed up machines as Microsoft and google battled to take over the computers.

Yuck!

6W