Towing X2 - Possible? Dangerous? Illegal?

[OHM Ω]

A friend of mine (seriously) is about to retire and wants to begin touring the US with an RV while towing a glider trailer. Been done many times. No issues to speak of with this concept.

But he also does NOT want to use the RV to tow the assembled glider around the airport during events. He would much rather bring another smaller vehicle along for the tour for the "tow out".

His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.

But a car might be better than a motorcycle (for events and for side trips) so is there an option for that? It might be a hair-brained idea but could an RV haul a ramped car trailer and add a glider trailer behind that? Obviously, you cannot back up but is it too long? Too dangerous? Too illegal?

Expiring minds want to know.

Thanks, John OHM

[Bruce Hoult]

On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 4:04:41 PM UTC+3, OHM Ω wrote:
> A friend of mine (seriously) is about to retire and wants to begin touring the US with an RV while towing a glider trailer. Been done many times. No issues to speak of with this concept.
>
> But he also does NOT want to use the RV to tow the assembled glider around the airport during events. He would much rather bring another smaller vehicle along for the tour for the "tow out".
>
> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.
>
> But a car might be better than a motorcycle (for events and for side trips) so is there an option for that? It might be a hair-brained idea but could an RV haul a ramped car trailer and add a glider trailer behind that? Obviously, you cannot back up but is it too long? Too dangerous? Too illegal?

Why can't you back up? It's only a matter of skill :-)

The most evil thing I've reversed with on a regular basis is the Bamford hay rake, which is a trailer with the hitch attached to a steering front wheel via a pretty short tongue. But we do it :-)

http://images2.hellotrade.com/data3/HI/YK/HTVENDOR-12801299/bamford-seven-reel-hay-rake-500x500.jpg

I have no idea about the legality.

If you can arrange for the glider trailer to hitch onto the car trailer right above the axle (i.e. have the axle at the back, not in the middle) then you might well end up with something both more stable to tow and easier on the glider than attaching it directly to the RV.

If you use a tray for a trike/quad then you'd want to extend the glider trailer tongue to still attach to the regular hitch, not to the back of the tray.

[Dan Marotta]

It's too long in New Mexico and Colorado. I researched it. Thankfully I
never tried it since losing the car would also result in losing the
glider. Better to simply rent a car while at the event.

On 10/20/2016 7:04 AM, OHM Ω wrote:
> A friend of mine (seriously) is about to retire and wants to begin touring the US with an RV while towing a glider trailer. Been done many times. No issues to speak of with this concept.
>
> But he also does NOT want to use the RV to tow the assembled glider around the airport during events. He would much rather bring another smaller vehicle along for the tour for the "tow out".
>
> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.
>
> But a car might be better than a motorcycle (for events and for side trips) so is there an option for that? It might be a hair-brained idea but could an RV haul a ramped car trailer and add a glider trailer behind that? Obviously, you cannot back up but is it too long? Too dangerous? Too illegal?
>
> Expiring minds want to know.
>
> Thanks, John OHM

--
Dan, 5J

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

A friend just bought an RV with a "toy box" in the back end. He has a three wheel Morgan on its way that he will haul around in there, park, open the back door, and drive the Morgan out. It will be his "get around" vehicle once he gets where he wants to stay for a while. Or, for any stop where he decides he wants to do a little "cruising around" without doing it in a big, clumsy for close quarters RV.

And with this setup, the other vehicle is stored indoors while on the road (basically, the back 10 or so feet of the motorhome is the garage).

Steve Leonard

[[email protected]]

I have a 34 foot class A that I tow my Glider with. I also tow a toad 4 wheel down cavalier when I don't have the glider. The problem I have is the weight I could put on the rear axle is limited to about 200 lbs. So I custom built a rack for the front where I had 600 lbs to use and mounted a Honda Rebel 250 motorcycle. Most States have max vehicle length combined at 65 feet and you can't have more than one thing in tow unless the first vehicle is a fifth wheel configuration to which you can add a trailer. The real issue then becomes total length. Also I thought of a "Stacker" trailer for both a Car and glider trailer, but they are expensive as well. I don't ground tow the glider with the motorcycle at flying sites but probably could if very careful and slow. There are usually friends with other vehicles to borrow and in case of the occasional land out I can use the Motorhome to retrieve.

[Jonathan St. Cloud]

Why not get a fifth wheel set up, with the trailer with the entire back acts as a ramp. The guy that go tear up the desert use these, they have living space and space for the toys inside.

On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 9:17:13 AM UTC-7, wrote:
> I have a 34 foot class A that I tow my Glider with. I also tow a toad 4 wheel down cavalier when I don't have the glider. The problem I have is the weight I could put on the rear axle is limited to about 200 lbs. So I custom built a rack for the front where I had 600 lbs to use and mounted a Honda Rebel 250 motorcycle. Most States have max vehicle length combined at 65 feet and you can't have more than one thing in tow unless the first vehicle is a fifth wheel configuration to which you can add a trailer. The real issue then becomes total length. Also I thought of a "Stacker" trailer for both a Car and glider trailer, but they are expensive as well. I don't ground tow the glider with the motorcycle at flying sites but probably could if very careful and slow. There are usually friends with other vehicles to borrow and in case of the occasional land out I can use the Motorhome to retrieve.

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 9:27:55 AM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote:
> A friend just bought an RV with a "toy box" in the back end. He has a three wheel Morgan on its way that he will haul around in there, park, open the back door, and drive the Morgan out. It will be his "get around" vehicle once he gets where he wants to stay for a while. Or, for any stop where he decides he wants to do a little "cruising around" without doing it in a big, clumsy for close quarters RV.
>
> And with this setup, the other vehicle is stored indoors while on the road (basically, the back 10 or so feet of the motorhome is the garage).
>
> Steve Leonard

I think he got one of the Class A of this type.

https://thormotorcoach.com/outlaw/

Should be able to pull your glider behind, and have your run-about with you inside in the "toybox" at the back end. You don't need two trailers...

[JS]

Talk to the Willats.
They used a pickup and toy hauler with two gliders (Nimbus 3 and Discus) and one trailer inside.
Jim

[Craig Funston]

I'd forgotten about that Jim. Brings back great mental pictures complete with granny Clampett on top in a rocking chair. :)

7Q

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 9:04:41 AM UTC-4, OHM Ω wrote:
> A friend of mine (seriously) is about to retire and wants to begin touring the US with an RV while towing a glider trailer. Been done many times. No issues to speak of with this concept.
>
> But he also does NOT want to use the RV to tow the assembled glider around the airport during events. He would much rather bring another smaller vehicle along for the tour for the "tow out".
>
> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.
>
> But a car might be better than a motorcycle (for events and for side trips) so is there an option for that? It might be a hair-brained idea but could an RV haul a ramped car trailer and add a glider trailer behind that? Obviously, you cannot back up but is it too long? Too dangerous? Too illegal?
>
> Expiring minds want to know.
>
> Thanks, John OHM

Tom Kelly- 711 brings his Motorcycle on the back of the RV when towing his trailer. The bike is his local transportation and has a tow ball for bringing the glider to the grid.
He's been doin' this for years.
UH

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

OHM Ω wrote on 10/20/2016 6:04 AM:
> A friend of mine (seriously) is about to retire and wants to begin touring the US with an RV while towing a glider trailer. Been done many times. No issues to speak of with this concept.
>
> But he also does NOT want to use the RV to tow the assembled glider around the airport during events. He would much rather bring another smaller vehicle along for the tour for the "tow out".
>
> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.
>
> But a car might be better than a motorcycle (for events and for side trips) so is there an option for that? It might be a hair-brained idea but could an RV haul a ramped car trailer and add a glider trailer behind that? Obviously, you cannot back up but is it too long? Too dangerous? Too illegal?
>
> Expiring minds want to know.
>
> Thanks, John OHM
>


--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"

https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Dec 2014a" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm

http://soaringsafety.org/prevention/Guide-to-transponders-in-sailplanes-2014A.pdf

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

How about renting a golf cart for the duration of the contest? That way,
you only tow the glider trailer.

OHM Ω wrote on 10/20/2016 6:04 AM:
> A friend of mine (seriously) is about to retire and wants to begin
> touring the US with an RV while towing a glider trailer. Been done
> many times. No issues to speak of with this concept.
>
> But he also does NOT want to use the RV to tow the assembled glider
> around the airport during events. He would much rather bring another
> smaller vehicle along for the tour for the "tow out".
>
> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on
> a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the
> glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here
> http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider).
> Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.
>
> But a car might be better than a motorcycle (for events and for side
> trips) so is there an option for that? It might be a hair-brained
> idea but could an RV haul a ramped car trailer and add a glider
> trailer behind that? Obviously, you cannot back up but is it too
> long? Too dangerous? Too illegal?
>
> Expiring minds want to know.
>
> Thanks, John OHM
>


--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"

https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Dec 2014a" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm

http://soaringsafety.org/prevention/Guide-to-transponders-in-sailplanes-2014A.pdf

[Don Grillo[_2_]]

As Steve mentioned, one thought is to purchase the Thor Outlaw 37RB (link below) that has a 10ft garage in the rear and was made to accommodate a Smart Car. A class one trailer hitch is available for the Smart Car which carries a max load of about 200# on the tongue and about 1100# towing capacity. That would work out fine for a tow out vehicle and would also be able to use the car for site seeing etc. It will not and would not be safe to tow the glider trailer with the Smart Car (maybe just around the airport grounds) so landing out still requires the use of the RV or a borrowed car/truck. That would require the RV to be on the airport grounds. But what if RV parking is not allowed on the airport? The RV then needs to be at an RV park, possibly a long distance from the airport, which then requires the RV to be unhooked from power/water/sewer everyday and brought out to the airport daily.. Kind of a pain.

More thoughts to follow.

Don
F2


On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 12:47:54 PM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote:
> On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 9:27:55 AM UTC-5, Steve Leonard wrote:

> > And with this setup, the other vehicle is stored indoors while on the road (basically, the back 10 or so feet of the motorhome is the garage).
> >
> > Steve Leonard
>
> I think he got one of the Class A of this type.
>
> https://thormotorcoach.com/outlaw/
>
> Should be able to pull your glider behind, and have your run-about with you inside in the "toybox" at the back end. You don't need two trailers...

[Don Grillo[_2_]]

Another Thought:
Purchase a 30+ foot RV, install a HydraLift capable of carrying a trike or Can-Am Spyder (3 wheeler) on the back of the RV. Put a hitch on the 3 wheeler for a tow out vehicle. The hydralift also allows for towing a vehicle or trailer.

http://hydralift-usa.com/canam-spyder/


On Friday, October 21, 2016 at 8:47:05 AM UTC-5, Don Grillo wrote:
> As Steve mentioned, one thought is to purchase the Thor Outlaw 37RB (link below) that has a 10ft garage in the rear and was made to accommodate a Smart Car.

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 8:04:41 AM UTC-5, OHM Ω wrote:
> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.

The RV jargon for the type of RV that he's looking for is a "toy hauler".

Many RVs have a small garage in the back for 4-wheelers and other "toys". He could easily transport a golf cart or a motorcycle in there.

-Luke

[POPS]

Do what I do.
Put your licensed motorcycle on a ramp on the FRONT of your RV, you can drive into town with your license plated bike when you need to, like when you are off on back country mountain trip and need fuel or what ever. Cops can't give you any BS. Just have a trailer hitch installed there, like the rear. Don't get a 3 wheeler, they are worthless.

Slide in your motorcycle ramp when you need it.

Most important, if you have any tongue weight to deal with while connecting your glider tow bar to the bike, install an easily removable 'training wheel rig'.

Go to Google images "motorcycles with training wheels" for that visual
and ideas.

I don't use training wheels myself, but other may find it would keep the bike from eventually falling over and getting pinned to the ground.

I use my XR 350 dirt bike. Fantastic go anywhere anytime machine as well.
A 125cc something would suffice. Multi-use is always best.


A friend of mine (seriously) is about to retire and wants to begin touring the US with an RV while towing a glider trailer. Been done many times. No issues to speak of with this concept.

But he also does NOT want to use the RV to tow the assembled glider around the airport during events. He would much rather bring another smaller vehicle along for the tour for the "tow out".

His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.

But a car might be better than a motorcycle (for events and for side trips) so is there an option for that? It might be a hair-brained idea but could an RV haul a ramped car trailer and add a glider trailer behind that? Obviously, you cannot back up but is it too long? Too dangerous? Too illegal?

Expiring minds want to know.

Thanks, John OHM

[Dan Marotta]

And renting a car locally would not require buying a "Smart" car or a
"Toy Hauler". So you rent a car for a week or two and don't have to own
a special airport car, or other apparatus. My wife and I have done this
on several gliding trips. Park the RV and rent a car. It's that simple.

On 10/21/2016 8:28 AM, wrote:
> On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 8:04:41 AM UTC-5, OHM Ω wrote:
>> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.
> The RV jargon for the type of RV that he's looking for is a "toy hauler".
>
> Many RVs have a small garage in the back for 4-wheelers and other "toys". He could easily transport a golf cart or a motorcycle in there.
>
> -Luke

--
Dan, 5J

[Andrzej Kobus]

On Friday, October 21, 2016 at 12:07:32 PM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
> And renting a car locally would not require buying a "Smart" car or a
> "Toy Hauler". So you rent a car for a week or two and don't have to own
> a special airport car, or other apparatus. My wife and I have done this
> on several gliding trips. Park the RV and rent a car. It's that simple.
>
> On 10/21/2016 8:28 AM, wrote:
> > On Thursday, October 20, 2016 at 8:04:41 AM UTC-5, OHM Ω wrote:
> >> His current idea is using a three-wheeler motorcycle. It would be on a ramped flat bed suspended from the back of the RV and then the glider trailer behind that. You can see some of those ideas here http://www.mightyhauler.com/ (with a car instead of a glider). Anyone done this? So that is idea number one.
> > The RV jargon for the type of RV that he's looking for is a "toy hauler".
> >
> > Many RVs have a small garage in the back for 4-wheelers and other "toys". He could easily transport a golf cart or a motorcycle in there.
> >
> > -Luke
>
> --
> Dan, 5J

Good luck finding a rental car in Ely or anywhere within 3 hours of driving..

[[email protected]]

Googlefu failed me. Somewhere on line I've seen pics of this being done with a 1-26. It was out West and allegedly legal. Ask a hardcore 1-26er someone will know.

[[email protected]]

Found it on the 1-26 association site. http://www.126association.org/graphics/Scan0004_007.jpg

[Bruce Hoult]

On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 12:35:02 AM UTC+3, wrote:
> Found it on the 1-26 association site. http://www.126association.org/graphics/Scan0004_007.jpg

Looks like a 5th wheel setup, which is definitely ok to tow something else.

[Dan Marotta]

<snip>

> Good luck finding a rental car in Ely or anywhere within 3 hours of driving.
I think the difficulty might be with finding a rental with a trailer
hitch. Who says you have to rent it in Ely? How about in Salt Lake
City if coming from the east, Reno from the west, etc. You can return
the car on your trip home. For example, on one planned trip for ground
launching at Roach Dry Lake, my wife had a car reserved in Bullhead
City, AZ, about 90 road miles away from the lake.
--
Dan, 5J