Aero Composites Propellers

[Badwater Bill]

Anybody have any experience with these props? I just bought one
today. After reading their website they look good, but what do you
guys know, if anything?

BWb

[John Ammeter]

On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 01:48:56 GMT,
(Badwater Bill) wrote:

>
>Anybody have any experience with these props? I just bought one
>today. After reading their website they look good, but what do you
>guys know, if anything?
>
>BWb
>

I know I'd have asked that question before buying the
prop....

John

[AWSOME]

Right........... :-)


"Badwater Bill" > wrote in message
.. .
>
> Anybody have any experience with these props? I just bought one
> today. After reading their website they look good, but what do you
> guys know, if anything?
>
> BWb
>
>

[Badwater Bill]

On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 02:45:01 GMT, John Ammeter >
wrote:

>On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 01:48:56 GMT,
>(Badwater Bill) wrote:
>
>>
>>Anybody have any experience with these props? I just bought one
>>today. After reading their website they look good, but what do you
>>guys know, if anything?
>>
>>BWb
>>
>
>I know I'd have asked that question before buying the
>prop....
>
>John


Yeah John. I did. I just didn't ask it here because I figured that
no one here would know anything about it. It's too "High End" both
technically and monetarily for the RAHians.

If it were a wooden $250 prop to mount on an ultralight, everyone here
would have an opinion. Since it's a $15,000 prop (model 3300 three
blade) to mount on an IO-550 that also costs another $50,000, I
really didn't think of using RAH as my technical source of data.

For some strange reason, I just felt like fishing here to see if by
chance there was someone...just one person who might have had some
experience with these guys. I should have known better.

I'll shoot a picture of it later today and post it so you can see it.
It's a work of art. I'm going to bring it home and put it in the
middle of my living room floor along with the IO-550 core I just
bought. In fact, John, do you think that wall between my living room
and the garage is load bearing? I may just knock that wall out and
turn the living room and garage into one big airplane building room.

BWB

[John Ammeter]

On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 15:11:38 GMT,
(Badwater Bill) wrote:

>On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 02:45:01 GMT, John Ammeter >
>wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 01:48:56 GMT,
>>(Badwater Bill) wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>Anybody have any experience with these props? I just bought one
>>>today. After reading their website they look good, but what do you
>>>guys know, if anything?
>>>
>>>BWb
>>>
>>
>>I know I'd have asked that question before buying the
>>prop....
>>
>>John
>
>
>Yeah John. I did. I just didn't ask it here because I figured that
>no one here would know anything about it. It's too "High End" both
>technically and monetarily for the RAHians.
>
>If it were a wooden $250 prop to mount on an ultralight, everyone here
>would have an opinion. Since it's a $15,000 prop (model 3300 three
>blade) to mount on an IO-550 that also costs another $50,000, I
>really didn't think of using RAH as my technical source of data.
>
>For some strange reason, I just felt like fishing here to see if by
>chance there was someone...just one person who might have had some
>experience with these guys. I should have known better.
>
>I'll shoot a picture of it later today and post it so you can see it.
>It's a work of art. I'm going to bring it home and put it in the
>middle of my living room floor along with the IO-550 core I just
>bought. In fact, John, do you think that wall between my living room
>and the garage is load bearing? I may just knock that wall out and
>turn the living room and garage into one big airplane building room.
>
>BWB
>
>

No, that isn't a load bearing wall... just holds up the rest
of your house.

Why not just set up a tent in your backyard?

When you first posted about that prop I thought it might
like one I saw several years ago. Actually, all I saw was
the hub and the stubs where the blades used to be. I don't
recall the make but it was an air-adjustable (not CS) prop.
They used wooden blades with metal bands bonded to the wood
prop. The pitch angle could be changed via a small electric
motor and drive mechanism.

The pilot was flying from eastern Washington west to the
Seattle area. He was almost exactly halfway between Stevens
and Snoqualmie Passes above a solid cloud deck when the prop
shed both blades. If I recall the details, he was at about
10,000 feet. He did see one opening below him but only saw
tree tops. There aren't ANY flat areas in the Cascades...

His wife was in the back seat of the RV-4 and getting pretty
panicked by now...

He chose to glide northwest hoping to find an opening in the
clouds and flat ground under him. Gliding down through the
clouds, he spotted the emergency airport near Highway 2 east
of Goldbar. He still didn't know exactly what had happened
to the prop. Coming in for a landing, there was no drag
from the prop and he ran off the far end of the runway but
no real damage to the plane or any injurys.

The stubs of the blades looked like the wood was crumbling,
kind of like "dry rot".

So, anyway, your prop is a completely different design....

John

[Fastglasair]

>For some strange reason, I just felt like fishing here to see if by
>chance there was someone...just one person who might have had some
>experience with these guys. I should have known better.

I would have purchased from Whirlwind in El Cajon, CA at Gillespie Field. I put
a 3 blade on my race modified HIO360-C1D6 This is the same type of Prop Wayne
Handley used on his piston driven Raven. They have been around for 9 or 10
years. I would have also considered Hoffman. BTW mine is on a Glasair 1-RG
located in Ogden, UT. I have had it up to 210 Kts true so far, only been flying
it a few months. Also, I enjoyed your Alien story.

[Morgans]

"Badwater Bill" > wrote

do you think that wall between my living room
> and the garage is load bearing? I may just knock that wall out and
> turn the living room and garage into one big airplane building room.
>
> BWB

Is it a one story? If so, go in the attic and look which way the ceiling
joists or trusses run. If they are parallel to the wall in question, the
wall may be safely removed.
--
Jim in NC


---
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Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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[RobertR237]

>wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 01:48:56 GMT,
>>(Badwater Bill) wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>Anybody have any experience with these props? I just bought one
>>>today. After reading their website they look good, but what do you
>>>guys know, if anything?
>>>
>>>BWb
>>>
>>
>>I know I'd have asked that question before buying the
>>prop....
>>
>>John
>
>
>Yeah John. I did. I just didn't ask it here because I figured that
>no one here would know anything about it. It's too "High End" both
>technically and monetarily for the RAHians.
>
>If it were a wooden $250 prop to mount on an ultralight, everyone here
>would have an opinion. Since it's a $15,000 prop (model 3300 three
>blade) to mount on an IO-550 that also costs another $50,000, I
>really didn't think of using RAH as my technical source of data.
>
>For some strange reason, I just felt like fishing here to see if by
>chance there was someone...just one person who might have had some
>experience with these guys. I should have known better.
>
>I'll shoot a picture of it later today and post it so you can see it.
>It's a work of art. I'm going to bring it home and put it in the
>middle of my living room floor along with the IO-550 core I just
>bought. In fact, John, do you think that wall between my living room
>and the garage is load bearing? I may just knock that wall out and
>turn the living room and garage into one big airplane building room.
>
>BWB
>

Let me put it this way Bill, if I had that kind of money to spend on a prop, it
would not have been spent on the Aero Composites Propeller. I would have spent
it on the best prop I could find for the money and that would have been the MT
Propeller.

So why did you bother to ask here at all? Just to try and start a flame fest
or otherwise show how superior you think you are to everyone else here?


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

[Dave Driscoll]

Bob,

Not that I want to start a flame war, but what is your basis for the
claim that the MT is a superior product? I'm actually quite interested
as I've reviewed them both recently and find that while one certainly
has a more proven commercial record, in my opinion, the other is
technically a far superior product.

Regards,

Dave Driscoll


RobertR237 wrote:

>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 01:48:56 GMT,
>>>(Badwater Bill) wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Anybody have any experience with these props? I just bought one
>>>>today. After reading their website they look good, but what do you
>>>>guys know, if anything?
>>>>
>>>>BWb
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>I know I'd have asked that question before buying the
>>>prop....
>>>
>>>John
>>>
>>>
>>Yeah John. I did. I just didn't ask it here because I figured that
>>no one here would know anything about it. It's too "High End" both
>>technically and monetarily for the RAHians.
>>
>>If it were a wooden $250 prop to mount on an ultralight, everyone here
>>would have an opinion. Since it's a $15,000 prop (model 3300 three
>>blade) to mount on an IO-550 that also costs another $50,000, I
>>really didn't think of using RAH as my technical source of data.
>>
>>For some strange reason, I just felt like fishing here to see if by
>>chance there was someone...just one person who might have had some
>>experience with these guys. I should have known better.
>>
>>I'll shoot a picture of it later today and post it so you can see it.
>>It's a work of art. I'm going to bring it home and put it in the
>>middle of my living room floor along with the IO-550 core I just
>>bought. In fact, John, do you think that wall between my living room
>>and the garage is load bearing? I may just knock that wall out and
>>turn the living room and garage into one big airplane building room.
>>
>>BWB
>>
>>
>>
>
>Let me put it this way Bill, if I had that kind of money to spend on a prop, it
>would not have been spent on the Aero Composites Propeller. I would have spent
>it on the best prop I could find for the money and that would have been the MT
>Propeller.
>
>So why did you bother to ask here at all? Just to try and start a flame fest
>or otherwise show how superior you think you are to everyone else here?
>
>
>Bob Reed
>www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
>KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....
>
>"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
>pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
>(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)
>
>
>

[RobertR237]

>
>Bob,
>
>Not that I want to start a flame war, but what is your basis for the
>claim that the MT is a superior product? I'm actually quite interested
>as I've reviewed them both recently and find that while one certainly
>has a more proven commercial record, in my opinion, the other is
>technically a far superior product.
>
>Regards,
>
>Dave Driscoll

I have reviewed them both as well and was not convinced that Technical
Superiority was enough. I have always leaned toward the technical end myself
but the more I have learned about props, the more convinced I become that a
proven track record is more important. The MT has not only established a
proven commmercial record, they are well proven in application.



Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

[Badwater Bill]

On 11 Jun 2004 17:47:07 GMT, (Fastglasair) wrote:

>>For some strange reason, I just felt like fishing here to see if by
>>chance there was someone...just one person who might have had some
>>experience with these guys. I should have known better.
>
>I would have purchased from Whirlwind in El Cajon, CA at Gillespie Field. I put
>a 3 blade on my race modified HIO360-C1D6 This is the same type of Prop Wayne
>Handley used on his piston driven Raven. They have been around for 9 or 10
>years. I would have also considered Hoffman. BTW mine is on a Glasair 1-RG
>located in Ogden, UT. I have had it up to 210 Kts true so far, only been flying
>it a few months. Also, I enjoyed your Alien story.


Cool man. Did you build it?

BWB

[Badwater Bill]

>
>Is it a one story? If so, go in the attic and look which way the ceiling
>joists or trusses run. If they are parallel to the wall in question, the
>wall may be safely removed.


Thanks Jim. Alread did that. I just knocked out the wall a couple
days ago. Now I have about 1500 square feet to build within.

BWB

[Badwater Bill]

>>
>
>Let me put it this way Bill, if I had that kind of money to spend on a prop, it
>would not have been spent on the Aero Composites Propeller. I would have spent
>it on the best prop I could find for the money and that would have been the MT
>Propeller.
>
>So why did you bother to ask here at all? Just to try and start a flame fest
>or otherwise show how superior you think you are to everyone else here?
>
>
>Bob Reed

Yes, preciscely.

In fact I saw an MT on a glassair today and that thing looked
identical to mine. I wonder what the differences are? Gotta do some
reasearch.

I'll tell you why I bought the prop. It was on a Legacy and the owner
put on a Hartzell. The Hartzell weighed 25 pounds more and didn't
make the airplane go any faster. Since I'm going to put a SUPER
charger on it that weighs about 25 pounds, the prop cancelled out the
moment arm. That, plus it was local here and the fact that it went
just as fast as the Hartzell, and I bought it at a DEEP discount, is
why I bought it.

BWB

[Badwater Bill]

On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 14:15:41 -0500, Dave Driscoll
> wrote:

>Bob,
>
>Not that I want to start a flame war, but what is your basis for the
>claim that the MT is a superior product? I'm actually quite interested
>as I've reviewed them both recently and find that while one certainly
>has a more proven commercial record, in my opinion, the other is
>technically a far superior product.
>
>Regards,
>
>Dave Driscoll

Which is which Dave? What are you saying? Is the AeroComp better or
is the MT? I can't follow.

BWB

[Badwater Bill]

On Fri, 11 Jun 2004 00:29:20 -0400, "AWSOME" >
wrote:

>Right........... :

Yep....Right.......... :

What's your point? That I didn't buy it? That it doesn't exist?
That I don't know anything about it? That martians are invading the
Earth?

Too much.... Maybe not for RAH however.

BWB

[RobertR237]

>>>
>>
>>Let me put it this way Bill, if I had that kind of money to spend on a prop,
>it
>>would not have been spent on the Aero Composites Propeller. I would have
>spent
>>it on the best prop I could find for the money and that would have been the
>MT
>>Propeller.
>>
>>So why did you bother to ask here at all? Just to try and start a flame
>fest
>>or otherwise show how superior you think you are to everyone else here?
>>
>>
>>Bob Reed
>
>Yes, preciscely.
>
>In fact I saw an MT on a glassair today and that thing looked
>identical to mine. I wonder what the differences are? Gotta do some
>reasearch.
>

Look at what most of the Competition Aerobatic pilots are flying and I believe
you will find a lot of MT props.

>I'll tell you why I bought the prop. It was on a Legacy and the owner
>put on a Hartzell. The Hartzell weighed 25 pounds more and didn't
>make the airplane go any faster. Since I'm going to put a SUPER
>charger on it that weighs about 25 pounds, the prop cancelled out the
>moment arm. That, plus it was local here and the fact that it went
>just as fast as the Hartzell, and I bought it at a DEEP discount, is
>why I bought it.
>
>BWB

A Deep Discount is a very good reason and I think you will be happy with the
choice under those circumstances.


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

[Fastglasair]

>>I would have purchased from Whirlwind in El Cajon, CA at Gillespie Field. I
>put
>>a 3 blade on my race modified HIO360-C1D6 This is the same type of Prop
>Wayne
>>Handley used on his piston driven Raven. They have been around for 9 or 10
>>years. I would have also considered Hoffman. BTW mine is on a Glasair 1-RG
>>located in Ogden, UT. I have had it up to 210 Kts true so far, only been
>flying
>>it a few months. Also, I enjoyed your Alien story.
>
>
>Cool man. Did you build it?
>
>BWB

Yes I did, took 19 years with a 10 year hiatus in the middle due to a new
business ,marriage and 4 kids.

[Badwater Bill]

>>
>>Cool man. Did you build it?
>>
>>BWB
>
>Yes I did, took 19 years with a 10 year hiatus in the middle due to a new
>business ,marriage and 4 kids.

That's a serious commitment...19 years. How do you like it? Does it
have any peculiar characteristics that you didn't expect in flight?
How's the stall? I mean, how does it break? I hear the Lancair VI
breaks like an anvil let go into free fall. How about the Glassair?

BWB

[Fastglasair]

>That's a serious commitment...19 years. How do you like it? Does it
>have any peculiar characteristics that you didn't expect in flight?
>How's the stall? I mean, how does it break? I hear the Lancair VI
>breaks like an anvil let go into free fall. How about the Glassair?
>
>BWB
I am very happy with it. At altitude 9.3 gph with about 200 Kts true. Thats
about 25 statute mpg. I have wing root stall strips which helps control stall
behavior. It falls straight and has good characteristics. The Glasair is still
a friendly aircraft when considering the high wing loading. One must keep up
the air speed on final and never chop the power, at least not with a 3 blade
like mine. That prop is a mean speed brake. As everyone says, slowing it down
takes planning and practice. One very nice benefit of this issue is, I don't
know how I could ever forget to put gear down. I can't slow down enough to put
flaps down or land without the gear out first to slow things down.

[Dave Driscoll]

Speaking solely about the mechanics of the blade and hub (I haven't
looked very closely at their actuator and its system), in my opinion the
AeroComp is a vastly superior product. This is not to say that MT makes
a bad product, they don't, and they have an enviable product history.
However, in my opinion, AeroComp has a more robust design, is using a
much more sophisticated manufacturing process, and has some impressive
test results in the areas of both product strength and performance. The
only area that is yet a great unknown for AeroComp is how durable is
their product? Time will tell, but based upon the other aspects of
their design, I'd wager that they've got longevity nailed as well.
Money not being an issue, I'd hang a pair of AeroComp's on my plane and
very well may now that they make a pusher in addition to the tractor.

Dave

Badwater Bill wrote:

>On Sat, 12 Jun 2004 14:15:41 -0500, Dave Driscoll
> wrote:
>
>
>
>>Bob,
>>
>>Not that I want to start a flame war, but what is your basis for the
>>claim that the MT is a superior product? I'm actually quite interested
>>as I've reviewed them both recently and find that while one certainly
>>has a more proven commercial record, in my opinion, the other is
>>technically a far superior product.
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Dave Driscoll
>>
>>
>
>Which is which Dave? What are you saying? Is the AeroComp better or
>is the MT? I can't follow.
>
>BWB
>
>
>
>
>

[RobertR237]

>
>>>I would have purchased from Whirlwind in El Cajon, CA at Gillespie Field. I
>>put
>>>a 3 blade on my race modified HIO360-C1D6 This is the same type of Prop
>>Wayne
>>>Handley used on his piston driven Raven. They have been around for 9 or 10
>>>years. I would have also considered Hoffman. BTW mine is on a Glasair 1-RG
>>>located in Ogden, UT. I have had it up to 210 Kts true so far, only been
>>flying
>>>it a few months. Also, I enjoyed your Alien story.
>>
>>
>>Cool man. Did you build it?
>>
>>BWB
>
>Yes I did, took 19 years with a 10 year hiatus in the middle due to a new
>business ,marriage and 4 kids.
>
>

Damn, I am sure glad to hear you tell that. Maybe there is hope for me
finishing my project some day when life quits getting in the way.



Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

[Barnyard BOb -]

>>Yes I did, took 19 years with a 10 year hiatus in the middle due to a new
>>business ,marriage and 4 kids.
>>
>>
>
>Damn, I am sure glad to hear you tell that. Maybe there is hope for me
>finishing my project some day when life quits getting in the way.
>
>
>
>Bob Reed
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Bob,

You will finish.
Of this, I am sure.....
even if you are not at this time.


Barnyard BOb - keeping the faith

[Badwater Bill]

>
>Damn, I am sure glad to hear you tell that. Maybe there is hope for me
>finishing my project some day when life quits getting in the way.
>
>
>
>Bob Reed

Damn Bob. You been building that for so long, I almost forgot what
you are building. How far along are you?

BWB

[Badwater Bill]

On Wed, 16 Jun 2004 14:16:27 -0500, Dave Driscoll
> wrote:

>Speaking solely about the mechanics of the blade and hub (I haven't
>looked very closely at their actuator and its system), in my opinion the
>AeroComp is a vastly superior product. This is not to say that MT makes
>a bad product, they don't, and they have an enviable product history.
> However, in my opinion, AeroComp has a more robust design, is using a
>much more sophisticated manufacturing process, and has some impressive
>test results in the areas of both product strength and performance. The
>only area that is yet a great unknown for AeroComp is how durable is
>their product? Time will tell, but based upon the other aspects of
>their design, I'd wager that they've got longevity nailed as well.
> Money not being an issue, I'd hang a pair of AeroComp's on my plane and
>very well may now that they make a pusher in addition to the tractor.
>
>Dave

Thanks Dave. It is rare that I ever get anything out of this ng. I
appreciate your candid evaluation.

Thanks again.

Bill

[RobertR237]

>
>>>Yes I did, took 19 years with a 10 year hiatus in the middle due to a new
>>>business ,marriage and 4 kids.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Damn, I am sure glad to hear you tell that. Maybe there is hope for me
>>finishing my project some day when life quits getting in the way.
>>
>>
>>
>>Bob Reed
>+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
>
>Bob,
>
>You will finish.
>Of this, I am sure.....
>even if you are not at this time.
>
>
>Barnyard BOb - keeping the faith
>

I came close to selling it a few months back but couldn't do it. I have never
been one to give up on anything and I am getting too damn old to start now. I
will finish it even if I can't afford to keep and fly it afterward. Thanks for
your support.

Yes, I am keeping the faith...


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

[RobertR237]

>
>>
>>Damn, I am sure glad to hear you tell that. Maybe there is hope for me
>>finishing my project some day when life quits getting in the way.
>>
>>
>>
>>Bob Reed
>
>Damn Bob. You been building that for so long, I almost forgot what
>you are building. How far along are you?
>
>BWB
>

All the glass work is finished, the seats are finished, got my engine
(XP-IOF360), wings have been fitted, have the Blue Mtn EFIS. Need to finish
sanding, painting, propeller, and radio stack. I need about $20k to finish
but have a shortage of money and time to work on it. Had to put a new roof and
siding on the house last year while unemployed. Took a big hit on my funds.


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)

[RobertR237]

>
>:All the glass work is finished, the seats are finished, got my engine
>:(XP-IOF360), wings have been fitted, have the Blue Mtn EFIS. Need to finish
>:sanding, painting, propeller, and radio stack. I need about $20k to finish
>:but have a shortage of money and time to work on it. Had to put a new roof
>and
>:siding on the house last year while unemployed. Took a big hit on my funds.
>
>Do you just want minimal radios to get in the air, or are you saving
>up for the super stack that the plane deserves?
>

What I want is the stack that the plane deserves but would settle for the
minimum in good quality radios. Right now though, both are out of the
question.


Bob Reed
www.kisbuild.r-a-reed-assoc.com (KIS Builders Site)
KIS Cruiser in progress...Slow but steady progress....

"Ladies and Gentlemen, take my advice,
pull down your pants and Slide on the Ice!"
(M.A.S.H. Sidney Freedman)