Reachable landing sites in iGlide

[[email protected]]

Does iGlide show the reachable landing sites in the current McCready setting ?
Oudie changes landing sites color to Green for reachable sites.
In any case, how important is this feature ?
Dan

[Dan Marotta]

It's a very nice feature to have. It shows at a glance which sites can
be reached at an altitude you've specified during your setup of the program.

I have no experience with iGlide, but with XCSoar there is displayed
(user selectable) a "glide amoeba" which outlines the area the glider
can reach given the current polar, weight, altitude, wind, terrain,
etc. Airfields are also colored green within the outline. With
ClearNav, there is a double concentric "glide amoeba". The outer one
shows the point where the glider will land under the above conditions,
and the inner one shows where the glider will be at a user selectable
altitude.

Check your user manual/help files for how to set it up on your device.

Dan

On 2/5/2017 7:22 AM, wrote:
> Does iGlide show the reachable landing sites in the current McCready setting ?
> Oudie changes landing sites color to Green for reachable sites.
> In any case, how important is this feature ?
> Dan

--
Dan, 5J

[jfitch]

On Sunday, February 5, 2017 at 6:22:07 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> Does iGlide show the reachable landing sites in the current McCready setting ?
> Oudie changes landing sites color to Green for reachable sites.
> In any case, how important is this feature ?
> Dan

Yes it does. If set up properly, makeable fields are green, marginal yellow, and unmakeable are red. The arrival altitude will be shown for each. A red dot will be drawn where you will impact intervening terrain. I like the feature, and find it more useful than the amoeba - it does not shade the terrain map, and the arrival altitude puts considerable color on the information.

[Casey[_2_]]

Go to know. I will have to try that setting. I've just been using the circle that shows what
is reachable.

[Casey[_2_]]

Isn't that only in final glide that yellow, red, green shows up? Otherwise area within the flight alt circle are reachable.

[Dan Marotta]

The amoeba does not shade the terrain map unless you specifically set it
up to do that, and why would you? XCSoar prints a large orange X on the
map where you will land. All of these programs are pretty much the same
and can be configured as the user likes.

On 2/5/2017 9:33 AM, jfitch wrote:
> On Sunday, February 5, 2017 at 6:22:07 AM UTC-8, wrote:
>> Does iGlide show the reachable landing sites in the current McCready setting ?
>> Oudie changes landing sites color to Green for reachable sites.
>> In any case, how important is this feature ?
>> Dan
> Yes it does. If set up properly, makeable fields are green, marginal yellow, and unmakeable are red. The arrival altitude will be shown for each. A red dot will be drawn where you will impact intervening terrain. I like the feature, and find it more useful than the amoeba - it does not shade the terrain map, and the arrival altitude puts considerable color on the information.

--
Dan, 5J

[jfitch]

On Sunday, February 5, 2017 at 4:43:05 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> Isn't that only in final glide that yellow, red, green shows up? Otherwise area within the flight alt circle are reachable.

If iGlide is properly configured, it will show the colors and altitudes for every landing site. The zoom level at which they appear, and the format that in which they appear at different zoom levels is configurable. If you have no airport database (or have airports turned off in the database) and no turnpoint database loaded (with appropriate TPs marked as landing sites) then I suppose nothing would show up. I am using the pro version, but as I remember even the basic has this capability.

Yes, these programs pretty much all do the same things, it is how they do it that makes the difference.

[[email protected]]

On Sunday, February 5, 2017 at 9:22:07 AM UTC-5, wrote:
> Does iGlide show the reachable landing sites in the current McCready setting ?
> Oudie changes landing sites color to Green for reachable sites.
> In any case, how important is this feature ?
> Dan

Thanks To all.
I am switching my Oudie 2 to iglide. Looks much simpler to operate.
Dan

[jfitch]

On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 12:46:18 PM UTC-8, wrote:
> On Sunday, February 5, 2017 at 9:22:07 AM UTC-5, wrote:
> > Does iGlide show the reachable landing sites in the current McCready setting ?
> > Oudie changes landing sites color to Green for reachable sites.
> > In any case, how important is this feature ?
> > Dan
>
> Thanks To all.
> I am switching my Oudie 2 to iglide. Looks much simpler to operate.
> Dan

If you are going with iGlide, be aware that many of the configurable features are hidden in the xml files of the app. They are easily editable, but iGlide has no published documentation for them. Also, to get routes, you need the Adv version, and to get configurable turn points for racing, you need the pro version. If you need assistance email me and I will try to help.

In my opinion (remember, everyone has one...) iGlide is far easier to use than SYM - or any of the others. I own and have flown extensively with XCSoar, SYM, and Winpilot, often 2 at a time.

[Casey[_2_]]

> If you are going with iGlide, be aware that many of the configurable features are hidden in the xml files of the app. They are easily editable, but iGlide has no published documentation for them. Also, to get routes, you need the Adv version, and to get configurable turn points for racing, you need the pro version. If you need assistance email me and I will try to help.
>
> In my opinion (remember, everyone has one...) iGlide is far easier to use than SYM - or any of the others. I own and have flown extensively with XCSoar, SYM, and Winpilot, often 2 at a time.

I like iGlide but I keep having to reinstall "Aeronautical Data", "Map Data", "Flight Parameters", and "Flight Recorder" information. Airglide said its because I do not have enough memory remaining on phone, but I'm wondering if anyone else has had this problem.

[MNLou]

You might want to think twice about that Dan.

The Oudie with See You Mobile software has a much bigger base of users.

I love mine.

Lou

[jfitch]

On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 4:17:27 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > If you are going with iGlide, be aware that many of the configurable features are hidden in the xml files of the app. They are easily editable, but iGlide has no published documentation for them. Also, to get routes, you need the Adv version, and to get configurable turn points for racing, you need the pro version. If you need assistance email me and I will try to help..
> >
> > In my opinion (remember, everyone has one...) iGlide is far easier to use than SYM - or any of the others. I own and have flown extensively with XCSoar, SYM, and Winpilot, often 2 at a time.
>
> I like iGlide but I keep having to reinstall "Aeronautical Data", "Map Data", "Flight Parameters", and "Flight Recorder" information. Airglide said its because I do not have enough memory remaining on phone, but I'm wondering if anyone else has had this problem.

I have not had to replace the files, except after certain iOS updates. There have been two that have wiped one or more of the data files that iGlide uses, while perhaps 10 or 12 others have not. I don't know why the difference. I do have sufficient memory left. I am running it in two phones, a 5s and a 6 Plus. It is possible to back up and reinstall the files from iTunes without having to download them again if this happens. The only ones that are very large are the terrain maps, and they are very large indeed.

[Casey[_2_]]

I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.

[JS]

On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.

It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
Jim

[jfitch]

On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:49:01 PM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.
>
> It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> Jim

I do. An iPhone 6 Plus.

[Dan Marotta]

<snip>
> It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> Jim
</snip>

What a concept! Considering you can now find a Dell Streak 5 on eBay
for under $50 (I've seen them as low as $15), and it's daylight
readable, and XCSoar is free and doesn't do all the bad things I'm
reading about iGlide, and it's continually maintained and updated, and
it has a nearly 200 page user's manual... Then you can turn off your
phone so that, should you land or bail out, you'll have a charged phone
to call for help. Maybe not so crazy...
--
Dan, 5J

[[email protected]]

Dan
I am not a computer geek so am a bit concerned that xcsoar has no parents....
Did you/do you have any problems with support ?
Dan
On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 12:36:51 PM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:
> <snip>
> > It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> > Jim
> </snip>
>
> What a concept! Considering you can now find a Dell Streak 5 on eBay
> for under $50 (I've seen them as low as $15), and it's daylight
> readable, and XCSoar is free and doesn't do all the bad things I'm
> reading about iGlide, and it's continually maintained and updated, and
> it has a nearly 200 page user's manual... Then you can turn off your
> phone so that, should you land or bail out, you'll have a charged phone
> to call for help. Maybe not so crazy...
> --
> Dan, 5J

[[email protected]]

If I use an iPhone 6 plus and not upgrade the OS (it's and old phone ?) I shouldn't have these problems ? it's a question and a wish as well...
Dan
On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:52:31 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 4:17:27 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > If you are going with iGlide, be aware that many of the configurable features are hidden in the xml files of the app. They are easily editable, but iGlide has no published documentation for them. Also, to get routes, you need the Adv version, and to get configurable turn points for racing, you need the pro version. If you need assistance email me and I will try to help.
> > >
> > > In my opinion (remember, everyone has one...) iGlide is far easier to use than SYM - or any of the others. I own and have flown extensively with XCSoar, SYM, and Winpilot, often 2 at a time.
> >
> > I like iGlide but I keep having to reinstall "Aeronautical Data", "Map Data", "Flight Parameters", and "Flight Recorder" information. Airglide said its because I do not have enough memory remaining on phone, but I'm wondering if anyone else has had this problem.
>
> I have not had to replace the files, except after certain iOS updates. There have been two that have wiped one or more of the data files that iGlide uses, while perhaps 10 or 12 others have not. I don't know why the difference. I do have sufficient memory left. I am running it in two phones, a 5s and a 6 Plus. It is possible to back up and reinstall the files from iTunes without having to download them again if this happens. The only ones that are very large are the terrain maps, and they are very large indeed.

[Dan Marotta]

XCSoar is an open source program with programmers around the world.
There's also a user forum and a facility to log problems which are then
fixed and updates released on the Google Play Store. On the very rare
occasion when I've had a problem, it's been quickly addressed and
usually was my fault. A quick look in the user manual usually has the
answer. Go to https://xcsoar.org/ and have a look around. There's no
obligation.

I'm not associated with them in any way, but I have used the program for
the past 5 years and have been very impressed with it.

Dan

On 2/7/2017 11:03 AM, wrote:
> Dan
> I am not a computer geek so am a bit concerned that xcsoar has no parents....
> Did you/do you have any problems with support ?
> Dan
> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 12:36:51 PM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:
>> <snip>
>>> It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
>>> Jim
>> </snip>
>>
>> What a concept! Considering you can now find a Dell Streak 5 on eBay
>> for under $50 (I've seen them as low as $15), and it's daylight
>> readable, and XCSoar is free and doesn't do all the bad things I'm
>> reading about iGlide, and it's continually maintained and updated, and
>> it has a nearly 200 page user's manual... Then you can turn off your
>> phone so that, should you land or bail out, you'll have a charged phone
>> to call for help. Maybe not so crazy...
>> --
>> Dan, 5J

--
Dan, 5J

[Craig Funston]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 10:44:51 AM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
> XCSoar is an open source program with programmers around the world.
> There's also a user forum and a facility to log problems which are then
> fixed and updates released on the Google Play Store. On the very rare
> occasion when I've had a problem, it's been quickly addressed and
> usually was my fault. A quick look in the user manual usually has the
> answer. Go to https://xcsoar.org/ and have a look around. There's no
> obligation.
>
> I'm not associated with them in any way, but I have used the program for
> the past 5 years and have been very impressed with it.
>
> Dan
>
> On 2/7/2017 11:03 AM, wrote:
> > Dan
> > I am not a computer geek so am a bit concerned that xcsoar has no parents....
> > Did you/do you have any problems with support ?
> > Dan
> > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 12:36:51 PM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:
> >> <snip>
> >>> It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> >>> Jim
> >> </snip>
> >>
> >> What a concept! Considering you can now find a Dell Streak 5 on eBay
> >> for under $50 (I've seen them as low as $15), and it's daylight
> >> readable, and XCSoar is free and doesn't do all the bad things I'm
> >> reading about iGlide, and it's continually maintained and updated, and
> >> it has a nearly 200 page user's manual... Then you can turn off your
> >> phone so that, should you land or bail out, you'll have a charged phone
> >> to call for help. Maybe not so crazy...
> >> --
> >> Dan, 5J
>
> --
> Dan, 5J

Dan, what are all the "bad things" you're reading about iGlide?

Just curious
Craig
7Q

[[email protected]]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 1:44:51 PM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:
> XCSoar is an open source program with programmers around the world.
> There's also a user forum and a facility to log problems which are then
> fixed and updates released on the Google Play Store. On the very rare
> occasion when I've had a problem, it's been quickly addressed and
> usually was my fault. A quick look in the user manual usually has the
> answer. Go to https://xcsoar.org/ and have a look around. There's no
> obligation.
>
> I'm not associated with them in any way, but I have used the program for
> the past 5 years and have been very impressed with it.
>
> Dan
>
> On 2/7/2017 11:03 AM, wrote:
> > Dan
> > I am not a computer geek so am a bit concerned that xcsoar has no parents....
> > Did you/do you have any problems with support ?
> > Dan
> > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 12:36:51 PM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:
> >> <snip>
> >>> It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> >>> Jim
> >> </snip>
> >>
> >> What a concept! Considering you can now find a Dell Streak 5 on eBay
> >> for under $50 (I've seen them as low as $15), and it's daylight
> >> readable, and XCSoar is free and doesn't do all the bad things I'm
> >> reading about iGlide, and it's continually maintained and updated, and
> >> it has a nearly 200 page user's manual... Then you can turn off your
> >> phone so that, should you land or bail out, you'll have a charged phone
> >> to call for help. Maybe not so crazy...
> >> --
> >> Dan, 5J
>
> --
> Dan, 5J

Hold on Dan. This is a thread about iGlide which you have stated you have no experience using. Show some respect to the OP buy not "hyjacking" his interest. If you want to chat up XCSoar and the Dell Streak, start your own thread.

[jfitch]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 10:44:08 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> If I use an iPhone 6 plus and not upgrade the OS (it's and old phone ?) I shouldn't have these problems ? it's a question and a wish as well...
> Dan
> On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:52:31 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 4:17:27 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > > If you are going with iGlide, be aware that many of the configurable features are hidden in the xml files of the app. They are easily editable, but iGlide has no published documentation for them. Also, to get routes, you need the Adv version, and to get configurable turn points for racing, you need the pro version. If you need assistance email me and I will try to help.
> > > >
> > > > In my opinion (remember, everyone has one...) iGlide is far easier to use than SYM - or any of the others. I own and have flown extensively with XCSoar, SYM, and Winpilot, often 2 at a time.
> > >
> > > I like iGlide but I keep having to reinstall "Aeronautical Data", "Map Data", "Flight Parameters", and "Flight Recorder" information. Airglide said its because I do not have enough memory remaining on phone, but I'm wondering if anyone else has had this problem.
> >
> > I have not had to replace the files, except after certain iOS updates. There have been two that have wiped one or more of the data files that iGlide uses, while perhaps 10 or 12 others have not. I don't know why the difference. I do have sufficient memory left. I am running it in two phones, a 5s and a 6 Plus. It is possible to back up and reinstall the files from iTunes without having to download them again if this happens. The only ones that are very large are the terrain maps, and they are very large indeed.

It isn't really much of a problem. I have been running iGlide on two iPhones for 4 years now, and have upgraded the OS on both with every new release. This has broken iGlide a couple of times, each time easily fixed. But certainly with any computer, leaving it alone is the best insurance against problems. Since both the program itself, and all of the associated files can be downloaded via WiFi or cellular data it is generally easy to maintain.

[Bruce Hoult]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 9:03:40 PM UTC+3, wrote:
> Dan
> I am not a computer geek so am a bit concerned that xcsoar has no parents....
> Did you/do you have any problems with support ?

If you'd ever seen the inside of any commercial software company, you wouldn't ask such a question!!

Anything that is developed and supported by its own users will very quickly attain higher quality than something that is pushed out the door when some manager says it's time, and assigns the programmers to a new project.

Companies die or simply abandon products more regularly and with far more finality than user-supported projects.

Only the very largest companies can afford the expense of doing things better than user communities -- Microsoft, Apple, Intel, Google. And even they lean to a very large degree on community-supported projects.

[jfitch]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 9:36:51 AM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
> <snip>
> > It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> > Jim
> </snip>
>
> What a concept! Considering you can now find a Dell Streak 5 on eBay
> for under $50 (I've seen them as low as $15), and it's daylight
> readable, and XCSoar is free and doesn't do all the bad things I'm
> reading about iGlide, and it's continually maintained and updated, and
> it has a nearly 200 page user's manual... Then you can turn off your
> phone so that, should you land or bail out, you'll have a charged phone
> to call for help. Maybe not so crazy...
> --
> Dan, 5J

The 2 main advantages of XCSoar is that it is free, and it runs on several platforms. The main advantage of iGlide is that it is better in most other respects, but particularly UI.

Now that's my opinion and as I said, everybody has one. I have many, many cross country hours flying with both XCSoar and iGlide, including more than a few flights with both side-by-side, so I am not speaking from ignorance of one or the other. The thermal assistant in XCSoar is perhaps overall a little more useful than iGlide, but neither are even close to the old Winpilot (which the new Winpilot does not have).

[Casey[_2_]]

I like thermal assistant in iGlide better than my LXNav s100.

I bought a iPad mini 4 to dedicate to just soaring but the screen was not quite as bright as my iPhone 6s Plus. The problems I've had with iGlide have been self induced for the most part. And the little bit of reconfiguring after loss of parameters is not that big a deal. I may dedicate this iPhone to soaring but has been one less item on check list and one less item to charge up.

[Eric Greenwell[_4_]]

Casey wrote on 2/7/2017 2:07 PM:
> I like thermal assistant in iGlide better than my LXNav s100.
>
> I bought a iPad mini 4 to dedicate to just soaring but the screen was not quite as bright as my iPhone 6s Plus.

Was "not quite as bright" acceptable? My older iPad mini isn't quite
bright enough to use in my Phoenix, but I do like the bigger screen over
my iPhone 6 (not an S).

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"

https://sites.google.com/site/motorgliders/publications/download-the-guide-1
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Dec 2014a" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm

http://soaringsafety.org/prevention/Guide-to-transponders-in-sailplanes-2014A.pdf

[Dan Marotta]

Just what I've read in this thread: OS upgrades breaking it or forcing
reloading of the databases, and having to buy increasingly expensive
versions to get more functionality. I also question the sunlight
readability of the iPhone, but I've never actually looked at one. My
experience with my Motorola Android phone is that it's pathetic in
sunlight. The Streak is readable in direct sunlight due to its TFT display.



On 2/7/2017 12:26 PM, Craig Funston wrote:
> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 10:44:51 AM UTC-8, Dan Marotta wrote:
>> XCSoar is an open source program with programmers around the world.
>> There's also a user forum and a facility to log problems which are then
>> fixed and updates released on the Google Play Store. On the very rare
>> occasion when I've had a problem, it's been quickly addressed and
>> usually was my fault. A quick look in the user manual usually has the
>> answer. Go to https://xcsoar.org/ and have a look around. There's no
>> obligation.
>>
>> I'm not associated with them in any way, but I have used the program for
>> the past 5 years and have been very impressed with it.
>>
>> Dan
>>
>> On 2/7/2017 11:03 AM, wrote:
>>> Dan
>>> I am not a computer geek so am a bit concerned that xcsoar has no parents....
>>> Did you/do you have any problems with support ?
>>> Dan
>>> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 12:36:51 PM UTC-5, Dan Marotta wrote:
>>>> <snip>
>>>>> It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
>>>>> Jim
>>>> </snip>
>>>>
>>>> What a concept! Considering you can now find a Dell Streak 5 on eBay
>>>> for under $50 (I've seen them as low as $15), and it's daylight
>>>> readable, and XCSoar is free and doesn't do all the bad things I'm
>>>> reading about iGlide, and it's continually maintained and updated, and
>>>> it has a nearly 200 page user's manual... Then you can turn off your
>>>> phone so that, should you land or bail out, you'll have a charged phone
>>>> to call for help. Maybe not so crazy...
>>>> --
>>>> Dan, 5J
>> --
>> Dan, 5J
> Dan, what are all the "bad things" you're reading about iGlide?
>
> Just curious
> Craig
> 7Q

--
Dan, 5J

[Dan Marotta]

Well, you have a valid point.

Bye!

On 2/7/2017 1:25 PM, wrote:
> <snip>
> Hold on Dan. This is a thread about iGlide which you have stated you have no experience using. Show some respect to the OP buy not "hyjacking" his interest. If you want to chat up XCSoar and the Dell Streak, start your own thread.

--
Dan, 5J

[Casey[_2_]]

The iPhone is nothing like any other phone that I have seen in direct sun light. The mini pad 4 was not as bright but I only tried once. I wanted a larger screen due to on the verg of having to wear glasses. I think I may try an extra extension to bring the iPhone closer to me. I also was thinking about making a sun screen for the mini pad but have not yet. I'm also using bad elf with my iPhone and I had a connect problem with the mini so that is another reason I have not pursued more. But I plan too.

iPhone use to not be sun light readable and I amagine they will continue to improve faster than any other off the shelf glider display.

[jfitch]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 4:45:15 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> The iPhone is nothing like any other phone that I have seen in direct sun light. The mini pad 4 was not as bright but I only tried once. I wanted a larger screen due to on the verg of having to wear glasses. I think I may try an extra extension to bring the iPhone closer to me. I also was thinking about making a sun screen for the mini pad but have not yet. I'm also using bad elf with my iPhone and I had a connect problem with the mini so that is another reason I have not pursued more. But I plan too.
>
> iPhone use to not be sun light readable and I amagine they will continue to improve faster than any other off the shelf glider display.

Why the Bad Elf with the iPhone? Both my 5s and my 6 Plus work fine from the built in GPS. In fact the 6 Plus, with its built in barometrics, makes quite a decent stand alone glide computer. Better still if you connect it up to your variometer, but very good all by itself.

[Casey[_2_]]

A little more accurate.

[[email protected]]

Do you connect it your butterfly/air glide vario ? Can you declare a task with the iglide and transfer to the logger in air glide ?
Dan
On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 9:23:32 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 4:45:15 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > The iPhone is nothing like any other phone that I have seen in direct sun light. The mini pad 4 was not as bright but I only tried once. I wanted a larger screen due to on the verg of having to wear glasses. I think I may try an extra extension to bring the iPhone closer to me. I also was thinking about making a sun screen for the mini pad but have not yet. I'm also using bad elf with my iPhone and I had a connect problem with the mini so that is another reason I have not pursued more. But I plan too.
> >
> > iPhone use to not be sun light readable and I amagine they will continue to improve faster than any other off the shelf glider display.
>
> Why the Bad Elf with the iPhone? Both my 5s and my 6 Plus work fine from the built in GPS. In fact the 6 Plus, with its built in barometrics, makes quite a decent stand alone glide computer. Better still if you connect it up to your variometer, but very good all by itself.

[Casey[_2_]]

I do not have a butterfly vario at this time but plan to get one for next glider.

[[email protected]]

I was asking jfitch, sorry..
On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 9:46:15 PM UTC-5, Casey wrote:
> I do not have a butterfly vario at this time but plan to get one for next glider.

[jfitch]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 6:32:40 PM UTC-8, wrote:
> Do you connect it your butterfly/air glide vario ? Can you declare a task with the iglide and transfer to the logger in air glide ?
> Dan
> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 9:23:32 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 4:45:15 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > The iPhone is nothing like any other phone that I have seen in direct sun light. The mini pad 4 was not as bright but I only tried once. I wanted a larger screen due to on the verg of having to wear glasses. I think I may try an extra extension to bring the iPhone closer to me. I also was thinking about making a sun screen for the mini pad but have not yet. I'm also using bad elf with my iPhone and I had a connect problem with the mini so that is another reason I have not pursued more. But I plan too.
> > >
> > > iPhone use to not be sun light readable and I amagine they will continue to improve faster than any other off the shelf glider display.
> >
> > Why the Bad Elf with the iPhone? Both my 5s and my 6 Plus work fine from the built in GPS. In fact the 6 Plus, with its built in barometrics, makes quite a decent stand alone glide computer. Better still if you connect it up to your variometer, but very good all by itself.

I do have it connected to an Air Vario. I think you can declare a task to the logger, but have never really investigated that. John Carlyle is the guy to ask. I don't believe you can declare a task to the PowerFlarm logger, and I know you cannot upload PowerFlarm flight logs through the Air Vario (it can apparently upload Flarm logs). When connected to the Air Vario, the thermal assistant in iGlide gets much more interesting due to the use of instantaneous wind.

Looking at the HDOP of the iPhone 6 Plus, it seems to think it is pretty accurate. More so than the PowerFlarm gps. But less so than the Air Vario gps.. Of the 5 gps units in my glider, it makes claims to the greatest accuracy..

[JS]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 10:36:24 PM UTC-8, jfitch wrote:
>
> When connected to the Air Vario, the thermal assistant in iGlide gets much more interesting due to the use of instantaneous wind.
>

Jon, I'm interested in that point of interest!
Do the reachable landing points in iGlide keep changing with the fast wind?
Won't mention what I'm thinking of connecting the Air-Glide to, not part of this thread.
Jim

[jfitch]

On Wednesday, February 8, 2017 at 8:38:56 AM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 10:36:24 PM UTC-8, jfitch wrote:
> >
> > When connected to the Air Vario, the thermal assistant in iGlide gets much more interesting due to the use of instantaneous wind.
> >
>
> Jon, I'm interested in that point of interest!
> Do the reachable landing points in iGlide keep changing with the fast wind?
> Won't mention what I'm thinking of connecting the Air-Glide to, not part of this thread.
> Jim

Yes, the landing points change based on wind. The wind is embedded in the LX1600 serial stream that iGlide and Air seem to use, once per second. The Air Vario calculates the true wind about 20 times a second. There are some averaging constants and it is not completely clear to me what applies to the landing site arrivals. It changes pretty quickly, but not instantly so I *think* it is using the time averaged wind (if I recall the default is 20 seconds). Wind can make quite a large difference in landing site reachability or arrival altitude as you know. In iGlide you can also fix the wind for calculation, if that is appropriate.

The thermal assistant shows an instantaneous wind vector in each lift dot, each second (not averaged). This adds quite a lot of information to the thermal assistant, as the wind is quite dynamic in and around thermals, generally pointing towards the center of the thermal or greatly deflected towards the center of the thermal.

[JS]

On Wednesday, February 8, 2017 at 10:44:43 AM UTC-8, jfitch wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 8, 2017 at 8:38:56 AM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 10:36:24 PM UTC-8, jfitch wrote:
> > >
> > > When connected to the Air Vario, the thermal assistant in iGlide gets much more interesting due to the use of instantaneous wind.
> > >
> >
> > Jon, I'm interested in that point of interest!
> > Do the reachable landing points in iGlide keep changing with the fast wind?
> > Won't mention what I'm thinking of connecting the Air-Glide to, not part of this thread.
> > Jim
>
> Yes, the landing points change based on wind. The wind is embedded in the LX1600 serial stream that iGlide and Air seem to use, once per second. The Air Vario calculates the true wind about 20 times a second. There are some averaging constants and it is not completely clear to me what applies to the landing site arrivals. It changes pretty quickly, but not instantly so I *think* it is using the time averaged wind (if I recall the default is 20 seconds). Wind can make quite a large difference in landing site reachability or arrival altitude as you know. In iGlide you can also fix the wind for calculation, if that is appropriate.
>
> The thermal assistant shows an instantaneous wind vector in each lift dot, each second (not averaged). This adds quite a lot of information to the thermal assistant, as the wind is quite dynamic in and around thermals, generally pointing towards the center of the thermal or greatly deflected towards the center of the thermal.

Thanks.
Nice to know the Air vario output has some averaging, as the instant wind would be pretty useless in the reachable landing point display.
Probably does that with the internal "Nearest" list, but haven't looked at that page for any period of time.
Jim

[[email protected]]

Can you use the iPhone 6 as a screen only without getting a wireless line ?
Dan
On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 1:02:45 AM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:49:01 PM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.
> >
> > It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> > Jim
>
> I do. An iPhone 6 Plus.

[Casey[_2_]]

I think so but have not tried that. I would think an external GPS would be required.

[jfitch]

On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 10:57:53 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> Can you use the iPhone 6 as a screen only without getting a wireless line ?
> Dan
> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 1:02:45 AM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:49:01 PM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> > > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > > I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.
> > >
> > > It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> > > Jim
> >
> > I do. An iPhone 6 Plus.

Not sure what you are asking. Using iGlide and an iPhone 6 or 7, regular or plus, by itself, you will have a fully featured glider computer. It uses its internal GPS and barometer, and works pretty well. What you will not get is any variometer or Flarm data. You will get position and glide slope information, makable landing sites and arrival altitudes, terrain and airspace clearance, even the thermal assistant works (though not as well). You will not get instantaneous wind. The thermal assistant is not as accurate, nor does it have the wind vectors. No Flarm targets will be displayed. For those, you need the serial stream of data either from an Air Vario, or the Air serial-to-WiFi convertor hooked up to another variometer system capable of streaming LX style serial data. With a proper connection, it will synchronize the McReady setting between vario and iGlide, and all the GPS and barographic data will come from the vario.

You will also find you want to connect the iPhone to a charging cable, as it will only last 3 hours or a bit less on the internal battery.

When I say it works pretty well: One season I had some trouble with my WiFi stick in the Air Vario, so the iPhone would disconnect from the vario in flight. After a few seconds of no data, iGlide defaults to the iPhone internal sensors and keeps going. On several occasions I flew for long periods without having noticed the difference. When I noticed, it was due to the lack of Flarm and wind data. You can put up a navbox displaying the GPS source, which tells you right away - but you might not notice otherwise. There is very little difference in the GPS recorded fixes from the phone vs. the vario. The barograph in the phone is not quite as sensitive (and of course not total energy).

[Casey[_2_]]

jfitch. When the iPhone disconnected from the wifi stick, was the IGC file in either the iPhone or vario corrupt?

[jfitch]

On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 6:01:46 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> jfitch. When the iPhone disconnected from the wifi stick, was the IGC file in either the iPhone or vario corrupt?

Not corrupt in the Vario. I didn't check the one in the phone on those occasions, as I rarely use the one in the phone. It is not secure for contests or records (I don't think?), and I already have one in the Vario and one in the Flarm. The WiFi connection is an additional source of faults not present in a wired serial setup (iGlide only does WiFi). Overall it has been pretty reliable for me, with occasional issues. Normally, if something goes wrong it happens right from the beginning when you turn everything on, and reconnecting fixes it. Once working for the flight, it normally stays working for the flight. When I was having the issues in flight, I attempted several things including power cycling the vario. Even in that instance, as long as you turn it back on within a few seconds, the IGC file is intact. In a race, you are allowed a maximum of 60 seconds between fixes, and a power cycle might push that.

[[email protected]]

I intend to use the iPhone only for soaring. I was asking whether I need to have a Verizon (or others) wireless line for the iPhone in this scenario.
Dan
On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 8:44:46 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 10:57:53 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> > Can you use the iPhone 6 as a screen only without getting a wireless line ?
> > Dan
> > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 1:02:45 AM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:49:01 PM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> > > > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > > > I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.
> > > >
> > > > It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> > > > Jim
> > >
> > > I do. An iPhone 6 Plus.
>
> Not sure what you are asking. Using iGlide and an iPhone 6 or 7, regular or plus, by itself, you will have a fully featured glider computer. It uses its internal GPS and barometer, and works pretty well. What you will not get is any variometer or Flarm data. You will get position and glide slope information, makable landing sites and arrival altitudes, terrain and airspace clearance, even the thermal assistant works (though not as well). You will not get instantaneous wind. The thermal assistant is not as accurate, nor does it have the wind vectors. No Flarm targets will be displayed. For those, you need the serial stream of data either from an Air Vario, or the Air serial-to-WiFi convertor hooked up to another variometer system capable of streaming LX style serial data. With a proper connection, it will synchronize the McReady setting between vario and iGlide, and all the GPS and barographic data will come from the vario.
>
> You will also find you want to connect the iPhone to a charging cable, as it will only last 3 hours or a bit less on the internal battery.
>
> When I say it works pretty well: One season I had some trouble with my WiFi stick in the Air Vario, so the iPhone would disconnect from the vario in flight. After a few seconds of no data, iGlide defaults to the iPhone internal sensors and keeps going. On several occasions I flew for long periods without having noticed the difference. When I noticed, it was due to the lack of Flarm and wind data. You can put up a navbox displaying the GPS source, which tells you right away - but you might not notice otherwise. There is very little difference in the GPS recorded fixes from the phone vs. the vario. The barograph in the phone is not quite as sensitive (and of course not total energy).

[JS]

Dan:
A smart phone used for navigation doesn't need a SIM card. The maps, etc can be downloaded and installed at home.
Jon:
I noticed that there's a 13s wind average set (likely the default) in my Air-Glide S. This is likely the wind used to send to another device and internal glide calculations.
We're overdue for a manual update, but there will be a firmware update soon, so perhaps they'll come together.
Jim


On Sunday, February 12, 2017 at 9:34:23 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> I intend to use the iPhone only for soaring. I was asking whether I need to have a Verizon (or others) wireless line for the iPhone in this scenario.
> Dan

[jfitch]

On Sunday, February 12, 2017 at 9:34:23 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> I intend to use the iPhone only for soaring. I was asking whether I need to have a Verizon (or others) wireless line for the iPhone in this scenario..
> Dan
> On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 8:44:46 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 10:57:53 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> > > Can you use the iPhone 6 as a screen only without getting a wireless line ?
> > > Dan
> > > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 1:02:45 AM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > > > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:49:01 PM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> > > > > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > > > > I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.
> > > > >
> > > > > It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> > > > > Jim
> > > >
> > > > I do. An iPhone 6 Plus.
> >
> > Not sure what you are asking. Using iGlide and an iPhone 6 or 7, regular or plus, by itself, you will have a fully featured glider computer. It uses its internal GPS and barometer, and works pretty well. What you will not get is any variometer or Flarm data. You will get position and glide slope information, makable landing sites and arrival altitudes, terrain and airspace clearance, even the thermal assistant works (though not as well). You will not get instantaneous wind. The thermal assistant is not as accurate, nor does it have the wind vectors. No Flarm targets will be displayed. For those, you need the serial stream of data either from an Air Vario, or the Air serial-to-WiFi convertor hooked up to another variometer system capable of streaming LX style serial data. With a proper connection, it will synchronize the McReady setting between vario and iGlide, and all the GPS and barographic data will come from the vario.
> >
> > You will also find you want to connect the iPhone to a charging cable, as it will only last 3 hours or a bit less on the internal battery.
> >
> > When I say it works pretty well: One season I had some trouble with my WiFi stick in the Air Vario, so the iPhone would disconnect from the vario in flight. After a few seconds of no data, iGlide defaults to the iPhone internal sensors and keeps going. On several occasions I flew for long periods without having noticed the difference. When I noticed, it was due to the lack of Flarm and wind data. You can put up a navbox displaying the GPS source, which tells you right away - but you might not notice otherwise. There is very little difference in the GPS recorded fixes from the phone vs. the vario. The barograph in the phone is not quite as sensitive (and of course not total energy).

No cellular connection is needed. I don't have a sim card in the iPhone 6 Plus I use in the glider, and it has never been on a cellular network. You can download and install data or maps anywhere you can get a WiFi connection..

Jim: yes, I've seen the wind average setting in the Air Glide S. I believe mine is set to 20 seconds. John Carlyle has looked into this a bit, because iGlide and the S display will often show a difference, sometimes large, in arrival altitude: it seems to be due to the wind value used, one averaged over a longer constant than the other. What have you heard about a firmware update?

[JS]

On Sunday, February 12, 2017 at 1:19:30 PM UTC-8, jfitch wrote:
> On Sunday, February 12, 2017 at 9:34:23 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> > I intend to use the iPhone only for soaring. I was asking whether I need to have a Verizon (or others) wireless line for the iPhone in this scenario.
> > Dan
> > On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 8:44:46 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > > On Saturday, February 11, 2017 at 10:57:53 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> > > > Can you use the iPhone 6 as a screen only without getting a wireless line ?
> > > > Dan
> > > > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 1:02:45 AM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> > > > > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 7:49:01 PM UTC-8, JS wrote:
> > > > > > On Monday, February 6, 2017 at 5:31:41 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> > > > > > > I believe the one time I had to reinstall data files was due to an iOS update. And I belive the clearing of data from parameters and map data is from storage availability. I have too many apps and photos and sometimes forget about adding more photos.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It might sound completely crazy, but how about using a dedicated device in the glider?
> > > > > > Jim
> > > > >
> > > > > I do. An iPhone 6 Plus.
> > >
> > > Not sure what you are asking. Using iGlide and an iPhone 6 or 7, regular or plus, by itself, you will have a fully featured glider computer. It uses its internal GPS and barometer, and works pretty well. What you will not get is any variometer or Flarm data. You will get position and glide slope information, makable landing sites and arrival altitudes, terrain and airspace clearance, even the thermal assistant works (though not as well). You will not get instantaneous wind. The thermal assistant is not as accurate, nor does it have the wind vectors. No Flarm targets will be displayed. For those, you need the serial stream of data either from an Air Vario, or the Air serial-to-WiFi convertor hooked up to another variometer system capable of streaming LX style serial data. With a proper connection, it will synchronize the McReady setting between vario and iGlide, and all the GPS and barographic data will come from the vario.
> > >
> > > You will also find you want to connect the iPhone to a charging cable, as it will only last 3 hours or a bit less on the internal battery.
> > >
> > > When I say it works pretty well: One season I had some trouble with my WiFi stick in the Air Vario, so the iPhone would disconnect from the vario in flight. After a few seconds of no data, iGlide defaults to the iPhone internal sensors and keeps going. On several occasions I flew for long periods without having noticed the difference. When I noticed, it was due to the lack of Flarm and wind data. You can put up a navbox displaying the GPS source, which tells you right away - but you might not notice otherwise. There is very little difference in the GPS recorded fixes from the phone vs. the vario. The barograph in the phone is not quite as sensitive (and of course not total energy).
>
> No cellular connection is needed. I don't have a sim card in the iPhone 6 Plus I use in the glider, and it has never been on a cellular network. You can download and install data or maps anywhere you can get a WiFi connection.
>
> Jim: yes, I've seen the wind average setting in the Air Glide S. I believe mine is set to 20 seconds. John Carlyle has looked into this a bit, because iGlide and the S display will often show a difference, sometimes large, in arrival altitude: it seems to be due to the wind value used, one averaged over a longer constant than the other. What have you heard about a firmware update?

Jon, a PM to you bounced.
Jim

[[email protected]]

On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 5:07:53 PM UTC-5, Casey wrote:
> I like thermal assistant in iGlide better than my LXNav s100.
>
> I bought a iPad mini 4 to dedicate to just soaring but the screen was not quite as bright as my iPhone 6s Plus. The problems I've had with iGlide have been self induced for the most part. And the little bit of reconfiguring after loss of parameters is not that big a deal. I may dedicate this iPhone to soaring but has been one less item on check list and one less item to charge up.

Casey, could you please describe how to use the "thermal assistant"? I have yet to figure that out. Am running an iphone 6 +, with Bad Elf gps and iGlide advanced. I may use an iphone 5S on the dash this season? Last year I used a 6 plus on a knee board, because its too large for the dash.

[Casey[_2_]]

On Friday, February 24, 2017 at 7:08:24 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 5:07:53 PM UTC-5, Casey wrote:
> > I like thermal assistant in iGlide better than my LXNav s100.
> >
> > I bought a iPad mini 4 to dedicate to just soaring but the screen was not quite as bright as my iPhone 6s Plus. The problems I've had with iGlide have been self induced for the most part. And the little bit of reconfiguring after loss of parameters is not that big a deal. I may dedicate this iPhone to soaring but has been one less item on check list and one less item to charge up.
>
> Casey, could you please describe how to use the "thermal assistant"? I have yet to figure that out. Am running an iphone 6 +, with Bad Elf gps and iGlide advanced. I may use an iphone 5S on the dash this season? Last year I used a 6 plus on a knee board, because its too large for the dash.

The Thermal Assistant only comes with the Pro. If you originally purchase the Advance and upgrade to Pro, it will remain the Advance Icon but will have pro features purchased in the settings. Air Glide calls it Climb Optimizer in the list of Pro features. The Thermal Assistant / Climb Optimizer is automatic.

I like having my iPhone on a Ram mount closer to me so I can see better and touch the screen easier. Short arms and vision not as strong as it use to be.

[jfitch]

On Friday, February 24, 2017 at 7:02:00 PM UTC-8, Casey wrote:
> On Friday, February 24, 2017 at 7:08:24 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > On Tuesday, February 7, 2017 at 5:07:53 PM UTC-5, Casey wrote:
> > > I like thermal assistant in iGlide better than my LXNav s100.
> > >
> > > I bought a iPad mini 4 to dedicate to just soaring but the screen was not quite as bright as my iPhone 6s Plus. The problems I've had with iGlide have been self induced for the most part. And the little bit of reconfiguring after loss of parameters is not that big a deal. I may dedicate this iPhone to soaring but has been one less item on check list and one less item to charge up.
> >
> > Casey, could you please describe how to use the "thermal assistant"? I have yet to figure that out. Am running an iphone 6 +, with Bad Elf gps and iGlide advanced. I may use an iphone 5S on the dash this season? Last year I used a 6 plus on a knee board, because its too large for the dash.
>
> The Thermal Assistant only comes with the Pro. If you originally purchase the Advance and upgrade to Pro, it will remain the Advance Icon but will have pro features purchased in the settings. Air Glide calls it Climb Optimizer in the list of Pro features. The Thermal Assistant / Climb Optimizer is automatic.
>
> I like having my iPhone on a Ram mount closer to me so I can see better and touch the screen easier. Short arms and vision not as strong as it use to be.

I would not purchase the Pro just for the thermal assistant - it isn't that good, particularly with no Air Vario connected. If you are racing, then the Pro is desirable of necessary, to create the correct turn points.

[[email protected]]

Okay thanks, I don't race (yet?). I upgraded to Advance to get some better wind data. It does work but takes several circles to get it going, maybe the GPS signal quality varies allot, (with the banking) etc.
I may go with the Air Connect Wifi device to plug in my C302 data? That way I could move the bad elf pro gps out of my way. Also, I could mount an older 5S iphone where the PNA used to sit. The 6+ is awesome but, but last year I smashed a screen while while setting up my glider. No big deal, $150 and it's good as new.

[jfitch]

On Saturday, February 25, 2017 at 10:32:56 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> Okay thanks, I don't race (yet?). I upgraded to Advance to get some better wind data. It does work but takes several circles to get it going, maybe the GPS signal quality varies allot, (with the banking) etc.
> I may go with the Air Connect Wifi device to plug in my C302 data? That way I could move the bad elf pro gps out of my way. Also, I could mount an older 5S iphone where the PNA used to sit. The 6+ is awesome but, but last year I smashed a screen while while setting up my glider. No big deal, $150 and it's good as new.

Using an iPhone 6+ alone, I have not seen any problem with GPS quality. The HDOP appears to be about as good as the on-board dedicated GPS engines. Have you tried loosing the Bad Elf and just using the internal GPS? You would have to ask Air if they support the C302 data stream. I know their serial interface for the Vario supports both LX and CAI formats. But - I don't think you will get much better information out of iGlide with it connected to the CAI (though I have never tried that). The reason it works better connected to an Air Vario is that instrument calculates wind inertially many times per second.

[Casey[_2_]]

On Saturday, February 25, 2017 at 4:33:55 PM UTC-5, jfitch wrote:
> On Saturday, February 25, 2017 at 10:32:56 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> > Okay thanks, I don't race (yet?). I upgraded to Advance to get some better wind data. It does work but takes several circles to get it going, maybe the GPS signal quality varies allot, (with the banking) etc.
> > I may go with the Air Connect Wifi device to plug in my C302 data? That way I could move the bad elf pro gps out of my way. Also, I could mount an older 5S iphone where the PNA used to sit. The 6+ is awesome but, but last year I smashed a screen while while setting up my glider. No big deal, $150 and it's good as new.
>
> Using an iPhone 6+ alone, I have not seen any problem with GPS quality. The HDOP appears to be about as good as the on-board dedicated GPS engines. Have you tried loosing the Bad Elf and just using the internal GPS? You would have to ask Air if they support the C302 data stream. I know their serial interface for the Vario supports both LX and CAI formats. But - I don't think you will get much better information out of iGlide with it connected to the CAI (though I have never tried that). The reason it works better connected to an Air Vario is that instrument calculates wind inertially many times per second.

I don't think the Bad Elf is necessary but find in at least 50' more accurate.