Jantar Standard 3 water ballast tank repair

[[email protected]]

Hello, has anyone here repaired a leak on the ballast tanks of a Jantar Standard 3 glider? I don't mean washing the tanks with paint but accessing the inside of the tanks to repair a leak.

I would like to know how the tanks are constructed. Are they separate tanks installed in the wings or do the spar and wing skins form the tank sides?

I am considering buying a Jantar with leaky ballast tanks and am trying to assess how big a job it is to make them water tight.

Hoping you can help.

regards

Andrew

[Per Carlin]

Has never heard of leaking integral tanks. They are leaking in the valves and/or fittings, not in the tank itself.

[Ben Coleman]

On Monday, 13 March 2017 21:11:42 UTC+11, Per Carlin wrote:
> Has never heard of leaking integral tanks. They are leaking in the valves and/or fittings, not in the tank itself.

Sorry, I haven't done this myself (owned a 3 and used to maintain the club's 2). I have heard stories of washing the inside if there is porosity but it makes little sense - as Per says, more likely a fitting (or even more likely poor sealing of the outlets and dump valve for a pressure test). Plus anecdotally the washing process was not highly successful.
Has the current owner found water somewhere or has it failed the leakdown test?
It may be possible to hear a leak with a stethoscope if it is a crack somewhere (though would be very difficult given the low pressure specified in the manual for testing).
There is a vent tube that runs from the tip to the root that would be a candidate for issues (was suspected to be partially blocked in mine). Stating the bleeding obvious here but you would want to be really sure where the leak was before cutting holes!

Cheers Ben

[Justin Couch]

On Monday, 13 March 2017 19:48:27 UTC+11, wrote:
> Hello, has anyone here repaired a leak on the ballast tanks of a Jantar Standard 3 glider? I don't mean washing the tanks with paint but accessing the inside of the tanks to repair a leak.
>
> I would like to know how the tanks are constructed. Are they separate tanks installed in the wings or do the spar and wing skins form the tank sides?

They are a double-skin tank fitted inside the leading edge of the wing. The rear wall of the tank is not shared with the spar, standing off it by about 10mm. I'll try to get some photos on the weekend of a trashed Jantar 3 wing that clearly shows the tank structure for you.

> I am considering buying a Jantar with leaky ballast tanks and am trying to assess how big a job it is to make them water tight.

Huge :( I've got 3 Jantars that I maintain currently with stuffed tanks in them and we're trying to work out the best way of determining where the leak is. Best option right now is a party smoke gun and a couple of very small witness holes to push in a borescope and look for leaks. One won't hold any pressure at all, whereas the other two have slow leaks.

I have also attempted, unsuccessfully, to chat with the factory about converting the tanks to bags, as has been done in several other glider types in the past. As usual with the Polish, nobody wants to bother talking with us.

[[email protected]]

Le lundi 13 mars 2017 04:48:27 UTC-4, a écritÂ*:
> Hello, has anyone here repaired a leak on the ballast tanks of a Jantar Standard 3 glider? I don't mean washing the tanks with paint but accessing the inside of the tanks to repair a leak.
>
> I would like to know how the tanks are constructed. Are they separate tanks installed in the wings or do the spar and wing skins form the tank sides?
>
> I am considering buying a Jantar with leaky ballast tanks and am trying to assess how big a job it is to make them water tight.
>
> Hoping you can help.
>
> regards
>
> Andrew

Hi
I had a early Jantar and we received a TN for the water tank sealing.
We had to use a quantity of sealing liquid in each tank.
Rotate the tank a number of time, drain the liquid and let dry 24 hour.
We had to air pressurised the tank to a specific psi.
This value was to stay above a percentage of lost of pressure for a number of hours.
This is the procedure we had to use. I cannot be more precise because that
is 30 years ago.
Regards
Gilles

[[email protected]]

On Monday, March 13, 2017 at 4:48:27 PM UTC+8, wrote:
> Hello, has anyone here repaired a leak on the ballast tanks of a Jantar Standard 3 glider? I don't mean washing the tanks with paint but accessing the inside of the tanks to repair a leak.
>
> I would like to know how the tanks are constructed. Are they separate tanks installed in the wings or do the spar and wing skins form the tank sides?
>
> I am considering buying a Jantar with leaky ballast tanks and am trying to assess how big a job it is to make them water tight.
>
> Hoping you can help.
>
> regards
>
> Andrew

Hi Everyone. Thankyou for your replies and comments. This seems a common problem with Jantars. Justin, I would much appreciate some photos of the wings and tanks when you get a chance. Seems to me that holes will have to be cut in the wing skin and the tank skin to access the insides of the tanks. The technical manual refers to this process as a "special repair" I have emailed Allstar for details but sounds like I shouldn't hold my breath!

regards

Andrew

[Wally Tamsen]

On Tuesday, March 14, 2017 at 10:47:58 AM UTC+2, wrote:
> On Monday, March 13, 2017 at 4:48:27 PM UTC+8, wrote:
> > Hello, has anyone here repaired a leak on the ballast tanks of a Jantar Standard 3 glider? I don't mean washing the tanks with paint but accessing the inside of the tanks to repair a leak.
> >
> > I would like to know how the tanks are constructed. Are they separate tanks installed in the wings or do the spar and wing skins form the tank sides?
> >
> > I am considering buying a Jantar with leaky ballast tanks and am trying to assess how big a job it is to make them water tight.
> >
> > Hoping you can help.
> >
> > regards
> >
> > Andrew
>
> Hi Everyone. Thankyou for your replies and comments. This seems a common problem with Jantars. Justin, I would much appreciate some photos of the wings and tanks when you get a chance. Seems to me that holes will have to be cut in the wing skin and the tank skin to access the insides of the tanks. The technical manual refers to this process as a "special repair" I have emailed Allstar for details but sounds like I shouldn't hold my breath!
>
> regards
>
> Andrew

This sounds interesting. (As in 'May you have an interesting life'.) I have recently acquired the use of a Jantar Std 41-A, which I would presume has the same construction. Any pictures or repair hints would be greatly appreciated. I have not tried the ballast yet, but even if there are no leaks now, sooner or later... I may as well be prepared.

Wally