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John Godfrey (QT)[_2_]
July 7th 17, 08:41 PM
Blue Ridge Soaring Society in New Castle Virginia is again hosting the Region 4 South contest with 18 meter, 15 meter, standard and OLC classes. Practice days are 9/16/2017 - 9/17/2017 and the contest runs from 9/18/2017 - 9/23/2017. Preferential registration date of 7/20/17 is coming up fast. Register on-line at SSA.org. Come join us for the flying and social event of the season. Fly the ridge with kettles of hawks. Enjoy the unparalleled social environs.

We look forward to seeing you there!

John Godfrey (QT)[_2_]
August 2nd 17, 01:11 AM
On Friday, July 7, 2017 at 3:41:14 PM UTC-4, John Godfrey (QT) wrote:
> Blue Ridge Soaring Society in New Castle Virginia is again hosting the Region 4 South contest with 18 meter, 15 meter, standard and OLC classes. Practice days are 9/16/2017 - 9/17/2017 and the contest runs from 9/18/2017 - 9/23/2017. Preferential registration date of 7/20/17 is coming up fast. Register on-line at SSA.org. Come join us for the flying and social event of the season. Fly the ridge with kettles of hawks. Enjoy the unparalleled social environs.
>
> We look forward to seeing you there!


R4S Contest
2017 Region 4 South – Sep. 16th to Sep. 23rd

For more than thirty-five years, pilots have gathered in New Castle, Virginia to enjoy the challenge of flying its impressive collection of Appalachian ridges, and the warmth and hospitality of the Blue Ridge Soaring Society, which is again hosting this wonderful contest.

With Standard, 15-meter, 18-meter classes, and an OLC guest group, the 2017 contest promises the opportunity for everyone to have fun and to compete with great pilots. The contest usually coincides with the fall raptor migration to the south – expect to share the sky with kettles of broad wing hawks, plus golden and bald eagles. The social calendar is also filling out – with food, music and entertaining company.
Details

Practice: Saturday, September 16 and Sunday, September 17, 2017

Contest: Monday, September 18, 2017 – Saturday, September 23, 2017

Cost: $430 plus $20 guest BRSS membership (includes up to 4 tows); additional tows are $55

Deposit (refundable until August 16): To hold your place, send $150 check payable to:
Region 4 South Contest c/o Charlie Cole 6310 Sunnyvale Road Roanoke, VA 24018

Contest Managers: Sandra Danoff (412-973-1417) and Charlie Cole (540-797-2486).

Camping is permitted on the field and is free (donations welcome); some rental units are available. Contact Charlie Cole for more information.

Registration procedure:

You may register online at the SSA website: SSA Contest Registration Online..

In order to complete registration on site, you must provide the signed waiver form, along with a valid pilot license, proof of current SSA membership, and proof of insurance (See Regional Class Rule 5.5.3 for specifics).

Other: We fly without water ballast, unless blessed with extremely strong conditions and a long ridge mission. Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching. If we do not have enough entrants for any specific class, we will combine “adjacent” classes into a FAI Handicapped class.
Social Calendar

BRSS is famed for its inviting social environs, prompting one regular to opine that “bringing a glider to the contest just complicates the experience.”

There are several evening meals planned along with nightly impromptu music (bring your instrument) and bonfires to complement the open air “fine dining” experience:

Saturday night — Judge John’s spaghetti dinner (free)

Sunday night — welcome dinner at the home of Thecla and Lanier Frantz (free)

Monday night — Open grill/bring your own protein or reserve burger fixing at the tow plane tavern. Sides provided by R4S.

Tuesday night — BBQ chicken ($15/person)

Wednesday night — low country boil ($15/person)

Thursday night — leftovers/potluck/open grill night (free)

Friday night — Glenn Maxwell’s famous pig roast ($15/person)

Contest Team

The contest team is an amazing group of volunteers. We are extremely grateful to everyone who helps make this such a wonderful event!

Charlene (Charlie) Cole and Sandra Danoff, Contest Managers

John Godfrey (QT)[_2_]
August 2nd 17, 01:14 AM
On Friday, July 7, 2017 at 3:41:14 PM UTC-4, John Godfrey (QT) wrote:
> Blue Ridge Soaring Society in New Castle Virginia is again hosting the Region 4 South contest with 18 meter, 15 meter, standard and OLC classes. Practice days are 9/16/2017 - 9/17/2017 and the contest runs from 9/18/2017 - 9/23/2017. Preferential registration date of 7/20/17 is coming up fast. Register on-line at SSA.org. Come join us for the flying and social event of the season. Fly the ridge with kettles of hawks. Enjoy the unparalleled social environs.
>
> We look forward to seeing you there!


R4S Contest
2017 Region 4 South – Sep. 16th to Sep. 23rd

For more than thirty-five years, pilots have gathered in New Castle, Virginia to enjoy the challenge of flying its impressive collection of Appalachian ridges, and the warmth and hospitality of the Blue Ridge Soaring Society, which is again hosting this wonderful contest.

With Standard, 15-meter, 18-meter classes, and an OLC guest group, the 2017 contest promises the opportunity for everyone to have fun and to compete with great pilots. The contest usually coincides with the fall raptor migration to the south – expect to share the sky with kettles of broad wing hawks, plus golden and bald eagles. The social calendar is also filling out – with food, music and entertaining company.
Details

Practice: Saturday, September 16 and Sunday, September 17, 2017

Contest: Monday, September 18, 2017 – Saturday, September 23, 2017

Cost: $430 plus $20 guest BRSS membership (includes up to 4 tows); additional tows are $55

Deposit (refundable until August 16): To hold your place, send $150 check payable to:
<see SSA website>

Contest Managers: Sandra Danoff and Charlie Cole.

Camping is permitted on the field and is free (donations welcome); some rental units are available. Contact Charlie Cole for more information.

Registration procedure:

You may register online at the SSA website: SSA Contest Registration Online..

In order to complete registration on site, you must provide the signed waiver form, along with a valid pilot license, proof of current SSA membership, and proof of insurance (See Regional Class Rule 5.5.3 for specifics).

Other: We fly without water ballast, unless blessed with extremely strong conditions and a long ridge mission. Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching. If we do not have enough entrants for any specific class, we will combine “adjacent” classes into a FAI Handicapped class.
Social Calendar

BRSS is famed for its inviting social environs, prompting one regular to opine that “bringing a glider to the contest just complicates the experience.”

There are several evening meals planned along with nightly impromptu music (bring your instrument) and bonfires to complement the open air “fine dining” experience:

Saturday night — Judge John’s spaghetti dinner (free)

Sunday night — welcome dinner at the home of Thecla and Lanier Frantz (free)

Monday night — Open grill/bring your own protein or reserve burger fixing at the tow plane tavern. Sides provided by R4S.

Tuesday night — BBQ chicken ($15/person)

Wednesday night — low country boil ($15/person)

Thursday night — leftovers/potluck/open grill night (free)

Friday night — Glenn Maxwell’s famous pig roast ($15/person)

Contest Team

The contest team is an amazing group of volunteers. We are extremely grateful to everyone who helps make this such a wonderful event!

Charlene (Charlie) Cole and Sandra Danoff, Contest Managers

August 2nd 17, 01:42 AM
I'm really looking forward to participating in my first R4South as a pilot. Thanks to Ron Sutton for bringing me here 12 years ago as crew and sharing the magic that is New Castle with me (first time I ever met Charlie Spratt). And, thanks to the BRSS folks too as their hospitality is 2nd to none. Like other 1st timers who come here, I'm coming here to learn, and to enjoy the weather and the festivities. JP, I'm counting on you to mentor me!

-Chris Schrader (B2G flying "CN")

Soartech
August 4th 17, 06:45 PM
>Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.

Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching. Get with the program.

Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)
August 4th 17, 07:44 PM
I did my first Newcastle contest 22 years ago, how do I know? My son was about 4 months old and we rented a hunting lodge.

Yes, great site, I had good mentors (UH, KS and others).

It was worth paying for a power plane area view by John Malumphy(sp?) to see general area a well as "contest finish" routes from a glider view.
Well worth the cost.

Notes.....
If coming back from Blacksburg on the ridge, do NOT dive off the ridge to do a speed finish!
Ever!
Unless you have a death wish or a ASW-17 with 15M tips (which I believe has no redline) because you WILL exceed redline!

If you get to the front ridge, listen to notes about "Jessie's knob", I heard about it the day AFTER I got low there.......not fun.

The Blacksburg tunnel run can be fun with "flexie wings" and tight belts. Sorta common run if nothing else works, low, fast, rough, dry.... Figure on about 120MPH+ for this, so, about an hour on course. Reread comment on bailing off the ridge for a low speed finish.......!

Social aspect is great.
Local peeps are great, fun local stuff to do.
Have a Teflon stomach, ask about "shine"!

Really, east coast soaring, Newcastle flying is great to do at least once, most sign up for the following year before leaving the current contest.

Wanting to go back......soon......

Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)
August 4th 17, 07:54 PM
How many "new gliders" will be at this contest"?

Some sites preclude self launching unless it's a healthy launch, thus why most flights out of here are dry, not wet.

Maybe you didn't have a "/sarcasm" button.....?

Papa3[_2_]
August 4th 17, 08:27 PM
Nah. I think watching someone die attempting a self launch from the shortish grass field with an uphill run and a 50 foot high tension line at the end is/was enough of a reason. It's one thing to self-launch on a nice, paved, 5,000 foot runway. Another thing entirely to try it on a fairly constrained field.

https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/ReportGeneratorFile.ashx?EventID=20001212X18038&AKey=1&RType=Final&IType=LA

Erik Mann (P3)

Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)
August 4th 17, 08:48 PM
Where did your sense of adventure go?!?!
;-)

The site does not want "splatters there", I can understand the local rules.....

August 4th 17, 09:21 PM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 1:45:49 PM UTC-4, Soartech wrote:
> >Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.
>
> Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching. Get with the program.

One out of the current entries is self launch capable.
Possibly you could list the self launching sailplanes that could participate in this event if BRSS allowed self launching.
I know the list- let's see if you do.
UH

Andrzej Kobus
August 4th 17, 11:59 PM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 3:27:08 PM UTC-4, Papa3 wrote:
> Nah. I think watching someone die attempting a self launch from the shortish grass field with an uphill run and a 50 foot high tension line at the end is/was enough of a reason. It's one thing to self-launch on a nice, paved, 5,000 foot runway. Another thing entirely to try it on a fairly constrained field.
>
> https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/ReportGeneratorFile.ashx?EventID=20001212X18038&AKey=1&RType=Final&IType=LA
>
> Erik Mann (P3)

Eric, my ASH-31Mi will outclimb any regular tow plane with me in tow. It is actually far more safer for me to self launch than it is to take a tow.

Andrzej Kobus
August 5th 17, 12:00 AM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 4:21:33 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 1:45:49 PM UTC-4, Soartech wrote:
> > >Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.
> >
> > Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching. Get with the program.
>
> One out of the current entries is self launch capable.
> Possibly you could list the self launching sailplanes that could participate in this event if BRSS allowed self launching.
> I know the list- let's see if you do.
> UH

Hank, I am sure there could be more than one that can self launch and do it safer than taking a tow.

August 5th 17, 02:12 AM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 7:00:51 PM UTC-4, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 4:21:33 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 1:45:49 PM UTC-4, Soartech wrote:
> > > >Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.
> > >
> > > Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching. Get with the program.
> >
> > One out of the current entries is self launch capable.
> > Possibly you could list the self launching sailplanes that could participate in this event if BRSS allowed self launching.
> > I know the list- let's see if you do.
> > UH
>
> Hank, I am sure there could be more than one that can self launch and do it safer than taking a tow.

Andy- Not among the entries listed. There is one self launching glider entered.
Why not join us and make it two.
UH

Andrzej Kobus
August 5th 17, 03:26 AM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 9:12:54 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 7:00:51 PM UTC-4, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 4:21:33 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 1:45:49 PM UTC-4, Soartech wrote:
> > > > >Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.
> > > >
> > > > Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching. Get with the program.
> > >
> > > One out of the current entries is self launch capable.
> > > Possibly you could list the self launching sailplanes that could participate in this event if BRSS allowed self launching.
> > > I know the list- let's see if you do.
> > > UH
> >
> > Hank, I am sure there could be more than one that can self launch and do it safer than taking a tow.
>
> Andy- Not among the entries listed. There is one self launching glider entered.
> Why not join us and make it two.
> UH

I was thinking about it until I saw the note on self launchers.

Dave Nadler
August 5th 17, 04:11 AM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 12:45:49 PM UTC-5, Soartech wrote:
> >Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.
>
> Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch
> or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching.
> Get with the program.

The above is a spectacularly clueless post, even by RAS standards.

This is not a site safe for most self-launchers.
I had to take the widow to the crash site of the accident leading to this rule.
Gliders such as Antares with extremely fast acceleration and climb are
safe here (and too heavy to tow here), but most self-launchers dubious.

Hence the entirely appropriate rule.

Absolutely idiotic post, really.

Soartech, try to refrain from making an ass of yourself with such posts .
Better yet, don't post as you're usually content free to dangerously wrong.

Andy Blackburn[_3_]
August 5th 17, 05:34 AM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 3:59:17 PM UTC-7, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 3:27:08 PM UTC-4, Papa3 wrote:
> > Nah. I think watching someone die attempting a self launch from the shortish grass field with an uphill run and a 50 foot high tension line at the end is/was enough of a reason. It's one thing to self-launch on a nice, paved, 5,000 foot runway. Another thing entirely to try it on a fairly constrained field.
> >
> > https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/ReportGeneratorFile.ashx?EventID=20001212X18038&AKey=1&RType=Final&IType=LA
> >
> > Erik Mann (P3)
>
> Eric, my ASH-31Mi will outclimb any regular tow plane with me in tow. It is actually far more safer for me to self launch than it is to take a tow.

Might not be the climb rate as much as the initial ground acceleration that gets you on a hot day flying out of a 2500-2800' soft sod field, uphill. According to the NTSB report the calculated distance for a Ventus 2CM to clear a 50' obstacle (on a 10-degree cooler day) was 3000'. I don't remember where the power lines are relative to the end of the runway, but that's not a lot of margin and I recon the calculated performance numbers assume a paved runway - so even more marginal. If you've launched (or self-launched) out of New Castle before I guess you have a reason to make specific claims about your glider or maybe other motor gliders you've flow there, but it sounds like maybe that's not the case. I'd be inclined to defer to the judgement of the people who dealt with the NTSB on the subject - sadly.

Best,

9B

Tango Eight
August 5th 17, 01:30 PM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 10:26:15 PM UTC-4, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 9:12:54 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 7:00:51 PM UTC-4, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> > > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 4:21:33 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 1:45:49 PM UTC-4, Soartech wrote:
> > > > > >Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.
> > > > >
> > > > > Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching. Get with the program.
> > > >
> > > > One out of the current entries is self launch capable.
> > > > Possibly you could list the self launching sailplanes that could participate in this event if BRSS allowed self launching.
> > > > I know the list- let's see if you do.
> > > > UH
> > >
> > > Hank, I am sure there could be more than one that can self launch and do it safer than taking a tow.
> >
> > Andy- Not among the entries listed. There is one self launching glider entered.
> > Why not join us and make it two.
> > UH
>
> I was thinking about it until I saw the note on self launchers.

Look up VA85 on AirNav, study in GE. You'll see the issues.

There's an honest concern here, but r.a.s. isn't the place to sort it out.

What you do is call (contest manager) Charlie C. and ask who the chief tow pilot is. Then you call him, tell him you are interested in flying but have concerns about launching your heavy self launcher. Your -31Mi isn't very much lighter than Dave's "too heavy to aero tow [out of NCI]" Antares, it's a serious concern imo.

Reasonable people can make reasonable plans from there.

best regards,
Evan Ludeman, New Castle fan

Andrzej Kobus
August 5th 17, 03:01 PM
On Saturday, August 5, 2017 at 12:34:25 AM UTC-4, Andy Blackburn wrote:
> On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 3:59:17 PM UTC-7, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 3:27:08 PM UTC-4, Papa3 wrote:
> > > Nah. I think watching someone die attempting a self launch from the shortish grass field with an uphill run and a 50 foot high tension line at the end is/was enough of a reason. It's one thing to self-launch on a nice, paved, 5,000 foot runway. Another thing entirely to try it on a fairly constrained field.
> > >
> > > https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/ReportGeneratorFile.ashx?EventID=20001212X18038&AKey=1&RType=Final&IType=LA
> > >
> > > Erik Mann (P3)
> >
> > Eric, my ASH-31Mi will outclimb any regular tow plane with me in tow. It is actually far more safer for me to self launch than it is to take a tow..
>
> Might not be the climb rate as much as the initial ground acceleration that gets you on a hot day flying out of a 2500-2800' soft sod field, uphill. According to the NTSB report the calculated distance for a Ventus 2CM to clear a 50' obstacle (on a 10-degree cooler day) was 3000'. I don't remember where the power lines are relative to the end of the runway, but that's not a lot of margin and I recon the calculated performance numbers assume a paved runway - so even more marginal. If you've launched (or self-launched) out of New Castle before I guess you have a reason to make specific claims about your glider or maybe other motor gliders you've flow there, but it sounds like maybe that's not the case. I'd be inclined to defer to the judgement of the people who dealt with the NTSB on the subject - sadly.
>
> Best,
>
> 9B

All tows I took from grass runways behind Pawnees were far worse in terms of distance to clear 50' obstacle and that includes 80-90 degrees days. My ready to fly weight is close to 1200 lb (dry). Also I climb at much lower speed which contributes to better distance to clear 50' obstacle. If it is not safe for me to self launch there it is not safe to take a tow. This is how I see it based on experience.

Andrzej Kobus
August 5th 17, 03:02 PM
On Saturday, August 5, 2017 at 8:30:56 AM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 10:26:15 PM UTC-4, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 9:12:54 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 7:00:51 PM UTC-4, Andrzej Kobus wrote:
> > > > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 4:21:33 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > > > On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 1:45:49 PM UTC-4, Soartech wrote:
> > > > > > >Due to field conditions we do not permit self-launching.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Huh? What does this mean? Just an effort to collect $55 per launch or something more subtle? 85% of all new gliders are self-launching. Get with the program.
> > > > >
> > > > > One out of the current entries is self launch capable.
> > > > > Possibly you could list the self launching sailplanes that could participate in this event if BRSS allowed self launching.
> > > > > I know the list- let's see if you do.
> > > > > UH
> > > >
> > > > Hank, I am sure there could be more than one that can self launch and do it safer than taking a tow.
> > >
> > > Andy- Not among the entries listed. There is one self launching glider entered.
> > > Why not join us and make it two.
> > > UH
> >
> > I was thinking about it until I saw the note on self launchers.
>
> Look up VA85 on AirNav, study in GE. You'll see the issues.
>
> There's an honest concern here, but r.a.s. isn't the place to sort it out..
>
> What you do is call (contest manager) Charlie C. and ask who the chief tow pilot is. Then you call him, tell him you are interested in flying but have concerns about launching your heavy self launcher. Your -31Mi isn't very much lighter than Dave's "too heavy to aero tow [out of NCI]" Antares, it's a serious concern imo.
>
> Reasonable people can make reasonable plans from there.
>
> best regards,
> Evan Ludeman, New Castle fan

Good points Evan.

Dave Nadler
August 5th 17, 03:39 PM
On Friday, August 4, 2017 at 11:34:25 PM UTC-5, Andy Blackburn wrote:
> Might not be the climb rate as much as the initial ground acceleration
> that gets you on a hot day flying out of a 2500-2800' soft sod field, uphill.

Motorgliders with heavy weight and a single wheel/tire are mightily influenced
by surface condition - PSI under main is huge. For example, ArcusM at Perry
takes a *much* longer ground roll than pavement (Perry has excellent grass
surface but a bit sandy/soft). I've plowed some huge furrows taking off
at Caesar Creek in Antares.

> According to the NTSB report the calculated distance for a Ventus 2CM
> to clear a 50' obstacle (on a 10-degree cooler day) was 3000'.

The accident AC was a Ventus Cm, not a 2cM. Cm is *Very* under-powered.
Accident report fails to note that take-off attempt was with 15m tips,
which is forbidden in the manual.

> I don't remember where the power lines are relative to the end of the
> runway, but that's not a lot of margin and I recon the calculated
> performance numbers assume a paved runway - so even more marginal.

Power lines are a ways out.

> If you've launched (or self-launched) out of New Castle before I guess
> you have a reason to make specific claims about your glider or maybe
> other motor gliders you've flow there, but it sounds like maybe that's
> not the case.

Andy's being rather diplomatic. Poster is clueless.

> I'd be inclined to defer to the judgement of the people who dealt with
> the NTSB on the subject - sadly.

As I did... And of course they missed some important bits
in the accident report...

Most important part here is for ANY take-off, you need to have picked
an abort point. Should be practiced and tested (tow-pilot applies partial
power). Could save some lives.

In this accident, I was standing by the towplane tavern, watching the
launch, explaining the proceedings to a spectator. Went like this:

Looks like his acceleration is pretty poor.
No problem if he aborts.
If he doesn't abort now, he's going to crash.
He needs to abort NOW.
Oh no, he's going to crash.
Glider staggers into the air.
Clears a few trees, and sinks out of view.
Crash.

Be careful out there,
Best Regards, Dave

PS: Advance planning of abort at different points could have prevented
the crash a few days ago.
- pull the release if not off the ground by...
- land straight ahead (possibly flying into the crash)
- OK to turn around.
Make sure you run through this in your mind before starting a launch!

I had breakfast with the pilot this AM...

Andy Blackburn[_3_]
August 5th 17, 05:12 PM
On Saturday, August 5, 2017 at 7:01:35 AM UTC-7, Andrzej Kobus wrote:

> All tows I took from grass runways behind Pawnees were far worse in terms of distance to clear 50' obstacle and that includes 80-90 degrees days. My ready to fly weight is close to 1200 lb (dry). Also I climb at much lower speed which contributes to better distance to clear 50' obstacle. If it is not safe for me to self launch there it is not safe to take a tow. This is how I see it based on experience.

Fair enough point. A -31 may not be able to fly out of this airport at all, depending on conditions. Evan gives good advice.

9B

Andy Blackburn[_3_]
August 5th 17, 05:14 PM
On Saturday, August 5, 2017 at 7:39:29 AM UTC-7, Dave Nadler wrote:

> Accident report fails to note that take-off attempt was with 15m tips,
> which is forbidden in the manual.
>

That's a significant oversight.

Dave Nadler
August 6th 17, 02:18 AM
On Saturday, August 5, 2017 at 11:14:09 AM UTC-5, Andy Blackburn wrote:
> On Saturday, August 5, 2017 at 7:39:29 AM UTC-7, Dave Nadler wrote:
> > Accident report fails to note that take-off attempt was with 15m tips,
> > which is forbidden in the manual.
>
> That's a significant oversight.

Many if not most NTSB accident reports for GA are extremely poor quality;
this kind of thing is typical. I don't expect they send the
best and brightest for GA accidents.

BGA reports are better and good education; summaries in S&G.
Sailplane and Gliding is significantly higher quality than
USA's Soaring - I highly recommend subscribing and reading.
Lots of good educational material, news, in addition to accident summaries.

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