SSA National Convention, every year, every other?

[Jim Culp]

Questions of costs and benefits,
and preferences:

Who benefits from annual SSA national convention?


Do glider and electronics vendors benefit by annual
show, vs the cost to them to go?

Can you, vendor, afford to go annually and is it cost/benefit
justified?

Can you, SSA member, afford to go annually?

How much debt or cash or debt do you lay out to go
to SSA convention considering registration fees, dinners,
party fees, hotel, transportation, incidentals: As
a vendor? As an SSA member?

Would you be satisfied with an every other year convention,
as a SSA member or as a vendor ?

Who makes out well by annual SSA conventions?

Does SSA make money? If so, how much?

Does host club or committee make money? If so, how
much?

Are annual SSA conventions sufficiently well attended
to justify annual efforts?

How many full registrants were in Atlanta AirExpo2004?

Year before that?

Understand, I love the conventions. Good, yes.

Can I go annually. No way.
Can others?

Would every other year be just as good, and regional
or state soaring efforts could host 1 or 2 day sessions
like the Soaring Symposiums and similar efforts did.


Would anyone, and any vendor suffer if there were every
other year SSA National Convention? Would SSA suffer?
How?

Your ideas, preferences?

Kindest regards.

Dancing on clouds,
Keep it up!

Jim Culp USA
Asw-20c/Std Libelle
Gatorcity Florida

[Tim Mara]

IMHO.......
I have made my case to many in the SSA and others...I hope the powers to be
are listening....
I think the SSA does OK with the conventions....at least, it's the feather
in their cap to have their name known and seen as the spotlight feature for
these events.....and the cost to the SSA (and I speak here as the office
itself, not specifically the organization (us) as a whole...) are relatively
low.
As a small vendor (we are all small vendors if we are selling sailplanes and
sailplane related supplies...big fish, very small pond) the costs to attend
these events are very high....every turn you make in one of these convention
centers you'll find someone with another charge. Aside from simple
exhibition space costs itself, if you need a table.it's $150 +, a chair
$60...electricity on a simple extension cord almost $100...telephone service
or internet hook-up..forget it, either of these might cost you $500 for 3
days!..on and on....I shipped boxes of items to display, the cost to ship
big boxes by UPS or FedEx insured costs lots of $$........then, on top of
this the convention center charges you $50 +++ just to receive the
box!...convention centers are expensive, convention center hotels are
expensive, travel is expensive.....I honestly can't say being there can or
does ever generate the business necessary to cover the cost to do
these.....not being there probably also has a negative effect as it then
looks like you're not really in business if your customers don't find you
there.....
Personally, I don't really go to the convention with the intention of
selling products there (it's far easier to do this and ship from here) but
many non-soaring businesses do, I go there hopefully just to show what's
available, to let visitors touch and see things close up and compare for
themselves so there's really no profit for these events to cover these cost
directly from the convention itself.....and, like most of us, we miss
customer calls from our places of business when we're there...It's also not
easy to give good answers to everyone who stops by and some visitors get put
off by this too...it can't always be helped.
The nuts and bolts of this are that there really isn't enough new or
exciting stuff to put on display every year to make these really worthwhile
for the vendors..or, more importantly, for the members and visitors who
attend these events....
I have suggested we do these every 2 years....every year is just too much
(IMHO)...nearly all of the exhibitors I spoke with agree.....the SSA I hope
will listen......We have essentially the same speakers giving mostly the
same (sales pitch) talks as they did the year before and the year before
that too.....granted, there are new and fresh speakers, a few new topics to
ponder and my hat comes off to those you do prepare and work hard to try to
make their talks interesting and entertaining......many are there though to
self serve and have their own infomercial under the guise of some technical
topic....most of us see through this.
I really think a great event for the conventions would be a used glider
sale.....we could easily have dozens of anxious sellers with their gliders
on display and hundreds of anxious buyers with a single shopping center at
their fingertips to compare in a single place....the SSA could (I think if
they don't have the proper tax status get the NSM, SRA or SSF who might have
access to this status to run this) even auction off gliders donated by their
owners as charitable (read: Tax write-off) contributions.....now that would
get some excitement going!.....and new owners do add life to the sport!
Moving gliders between owners and want-to-be-owners also helps the
sport....just my idea...
anyway...I may not be popular with some for these comments...but it is my
(our) sport and organizations...I think we all need to make these opinions
known....to our fellow members, and our officers as well....
sorry to be so lengthy......I could go on.I won't
Respectfully
Tim
Wings & Wheels
www.wingsandwheels.com


"Jim Culp" > wrote in message
...
>
> Questions of costs and benefits,
> and preferences:
>
> Who benefits from annual SSA national convention?
>
>
> Do glider and electronics vendors benefit by annual
> show, vs the cost to them to go?
>
> Can you, vendor, afford to go annually and is it cost/benefit
> justified?
>
> Can you, SSA member, afford to go annually?
>
> How much debt or cash or debt do you lay out to go
> to SSA convention considering registration fees, dinners,
> party fees, hotel, transportation, incidentals: As
> a vendor? As an SSA member?
>
> Would you be satisfied with an every other year convention,
> as a SSA member or as a vendor ?
>
> Who makes out well by annual SSA conventions?
>
> Does SSA make money? If so, how much?
>
> Does host club or committee make money? If so, how
> much?
>
> Are annual SSA conventions sufficiently well attended
> to justify annual efforts?
>
> How many full registrants were in Atlanta AirExpo2004?
>
> Year before that?
>
> Understand, I love the conventions. Good, yes.
>
> Can I go annually. No way.
> Can others?
>
> Would every other year be just as good, and regional
> or state soaring efforts could host 1 or 2 day sessions
> like the Soaring Symposiums and similar efforts did.
>
>
> Would anyone, and any vendor suffer if there were every
> other year SSA National Convention? Would SSA suffer?
> How?
>
> Your ideas, preferences?
>
> Kindest regards.
>
> Dancing on clouds,
> Keep it up!
>
> Jim Culp USA
> Asw-20c/Std Libelle
> Gatorcity Florida
>
>

[Tim Mara]

IMHO.......
I have made my case to many in the SSA and others...I hope the powers to be
are listening....
I think the SSA does OK with the conventions....at least, it's the feather
in their cap to have their name known and seen as the spotlight feature for
these events.....and the cost to the SSA (and I speak here as the office
itself, not specifically the organization (us) as a whole...) are relatively
low.
As a small vendor (we are all small vendors if we are selling sailplanes and
sailplane related supplies...big fish, very small pond) the costs to attend
these events are very high....every turn you make in one of these convention
centers you'll find someone with another charge. Aside from simple
exhibition space costs itself, if you need a table.it's $150 +, a chair
$60...electricity on a simple extension cord almost $100...telephone service
or internet hook-up..forget it, either of these might cost you $500 for 3
days!..on and on....I shipped boxes of items to display, the cost to ship
big boxes by UPS or FedEx insured costs lots of $$........then, on top of
this the convention center charges you $50 +++ just to receive the
box!...convention centers are expensive, convention center hotels are
expensive, travel is expensive.....I honestly can't say being there can or
does ever generate the business necessary to cover the cost to do
these.....not being there probably also has a negative effect as it then
looks like you're not really in business if your customers don't find you
there.....
Personally, I don't really go to the convention with the intention of
selling products there (it's far easier to do this and ship from here) but
many non-soaring businesses do, I go there hopefully just to show what's
available, to let visitors touch and see things close up and compare for
themselves so there's really no profit for these events to cover these cost
directly from the convention itself.....and, like most of us, we miss
customer calls from our places of business when we're there...It's also not
easy to give good answers to everyone who stops by and some visitors get put
off by this too...it can't always be helped.
The nuts and bolts of this are that there really isn't enough new or
exciting stuff to put on display every year to make these really worthwhile
for the vendors..or, more importantly, for the members and visitors who
attend these events....
I have suggested we do these every 2 years....every year is just too much
(IMHO)...nearly all of the exhibitors I spoke with agree.....the SSA I hope
will listen......We have essentially the same speakers giving mostly the
same (sales pitch) talks as they did the year before and the year before
that too.....granted, there are new and fresh speakers, a few new topics to
ponder and my hat comes off to those you do prepare and work hard to try to
make their talks interesting and entertaining......many are there though to
self serve and have their own infomercial under the guise of some technical
topic....most of us see through this.
I really think a great event for the conventions would be a used glider
sale.....we could easily have dozens of anxious sellers with their gliders
on display and hundreds of anxious buyers with a single shopping center at
their fingertips to compare in a single place....the SSA could (I think if
they don't have the proper tax status get the NSM, SRA or SSF who might have
access to this status to run this) even auction off gliders donated by their
owners as charitable (read: Tax write-off) contributions.....now that would
get some excitement going!.....and new owners do add life to the sport!
Moving gliders between owners and want-to-be-owners also helps the
sport....just my idea...
anyway...I may not be popular with some for these comments...but it is my
(our) sport and organizations...I think we all need to make these opinions
known....to our fellow members, and our officers as well....
sorry to be so lengthy......I could go on.I won't
Respectfully
Tim
Wings & Wheels
www.wingsandwheels.com


"Jim Culp" > wrote in message
...
>
> Questions of costs and benefits,
> and preferences:
>
> Who benefits from annual SSA national convention?
>
>
> Do glider and electronics vendors benefit by annual
> show, vs the cost to them to go?
>
> Can you, vendor, afford to go annually and is it cost/benefit
> justified?
>
> Can you, SSA member, afford to go annually?
>
> How much debt or cash or debt do you lay out to go
> to SSA convention considering registration fees, dinners,
> party fees, hotel, transportation, incidentals: As
> a vendor? As an SSA member?
>
> Would you be satisfied with an every other year convention,
> as a SSA member or as a vendor ?
>
> Who makes out well by annual SSA conventions?
>
> Does SSA make money? If so, how much?
>
> Does host club or committee make money? If so, how
> much?
>
> Are annual SSA conventions sufficiently well attended
> to justify annual efforts?
>
> How many full registrants were in Atlanta AirExpo2004?
>
> Year before that?
>
> Understand, I love the conventions. Good, yes.
>
> Can I go annually. No way.
> Can others?
>
> Would every other year be just as good, and regional
> or state soaring efforts could host 1 or 2 day sessions
> like the Soaring Symposiums and similar efforts did.
>
>
> Would anyone, and any vendor suffer if there were every
> other year SSA National Convention? Would SSA suffer?
> How?
>
> Your ideas, preferences?
>
> Kindest regards.
>
> Dancing on clouds,
> Keep it up!
>
> Jim Culp USA
> Asw-20c/Std Libelle
> Gatorcity Florida
>
>

[JJ Sinclair]

Very good question, Jim
The last one I went to was "Local" (as in only 1000 mile drive). I spent $1000
bucks and didn't buy anything.

I have been on a "Every 5 year", schedule for about the last 20 years, now.
They're nice, but not very.
JJ Sinclair

[Chris OCallaghan]

Hey Jim,

Here's a member opinion for what it's worth. During 26 years of SSA
membership, I have attended 3 conventions (Valley Forge, Chicago,
Dayton). This was dictated wholly by convenience (can I get there
easily and within the contraints of my work schedule?). I enjoyed
myself each time, but more for the opportunity of chance meetings with
old friends. The petting zoo is nice... but there really isn't enough
new under the sun to justify a visit solely to see gliders and related
paraphernalia, and certainly not once a year. The presentations have
changed little over the years. Every convention features something
new, but for the most part, we're hearing tales oft told. This is
great for new members, but a better balance of new and golden oldies
would be preferable. If staging the event every other year helps this,
I am all for it.

If I had the sense that a convention had many new, interesting
products and insights to offer, I might be enticed to make it a
regular pilgrimage. Under the current formula, I'm coming once every 8
years.

OC

[Steve Pawling]

Very good questions Jim. SSA could find out what membership thinks
about annual conventions by doing a survey. USHGA has recently done
three online surveys and you can see the results at:

http://www.ushga.org/ballot3_results.asp

After "ballot" replace the "3" with 1 or 2 to see the other surveys.

Cu skies,
Steve
LS-3a, Arcus XL

Jim Culp > wrote in message >...
> Questions of costs and benefits,
> and preferences:
>
> Who benefits from annual SSA national convention?
>
>
> Do glider and electronics vendors benefit by annual
> show, vs the cost to them to go?
>
> Can you, vendor, afford to go annually and is it cost/benefit
> justified?
>
> Can you, SSA member, afford to go annually?
>
> How much debt or cash or debt do you lay out to go
> to SSA convention considering registration fees, dinners,
> party fees, hotel, transportation, incidentals: As
> a vendor? As an SSA member?
>
> Would you be satisfied with an every other year convention,
> as a SSA member or as a vendor ?
>
> Who makes out well by annual SSA conventions?
>
> Does SSA make money? If so, how much?
>
> Does host club or committee make money? If so, how
> much?
>
> Are annual SSA conventions sufficiently well attended
> to justify annual efforts?
>
> How many full registrants were in Atlanta AirExpo2004?
>
> Year before that?
>
> Understand, I love the conventions. Good, yes.
>
> Can I go annually. No way.
> Can others?
>
> Would every other year be just as good, and regional
> or state soaring efforts could host 1 or 2 day sessions
> like the Soaring Symposiums and similar efforts did.
>
>
> Would anyone, and any vendor suffer if there were every
> other year SSA National Convention? Would SSA suffer?
> How?
>
> Your ideas, preferences?
>
> Kindest regards.
>
> Dancing on clouds,
> Keep it up!
>
> Jim Culp USA
> Asw-20c/Std Libelle
> Gatorcity Florida

[bumper]

I've only been in gliding since '98 and have attended two conventions
(Albuquerque and Ontario). Ontario gave me the opportunity to go back and
forth between two gliders and finally make up my mind which to order (g).

The problem with going to less frequent conventions is that, for those
unwilling to travel far to attend, reasonably close conventions are already
infrequent.

How about some "open air" conventions held at major soaring sites using a
similar format to airshows and fly-ins? That would help keep costs down,
promote soaring sites, and put more money and recognition for soaring into
the smaller economic environments where we live and play.

Let's do one at Minden!

--
bumper ZZ (reverse all after @)>
"Dare to be different . . . circle in sink."







"Tim Mara" > wrote in message
...
> IMHO.......
> I have made my case to many in the SSA and others...I hope the powers to
be
> are listening....
> I think the SSA does OK with the conventions....at least, it's the feather
> in their cap to have their name known and seen as the spotlight feature
for
> these events.....and the cost to the SSA (and I speak here as the office
> itself, not specifically the organization (us) as a whole...) are
relatively
> low.

[Ian Cant]

What Tim says is very true, we are in a survival mode
and costs have to be watched.

Since the content of the convention necessarily has
little change year-to-year, annual conventions for
the whole existing membership don't make much sense.
But the whole membership does not attend, because
of the rotation round the country. What we really
have right now is the cost of an annual convention
for the vendors, but the potential attendance of only
one-third of the already small membership each year.

A suggestion: if a few vendors experimented with either
Oshkosh or another major EAA event instead, would the
still-high costs be better repaid by the much larger
audience ? And instead of preaching only to the choir,
there would be the rest of the congregation who might
be encouraged to singalong ?

Ian



At 05:48 06 March 2004, Tim Mara wrote:
>IMHO.......
>I have made my case to many in the SSA and others...I
>hope the powers to be
>are listening....
>I think the SSA does OK with the conventions....at
>least, it's the feather
>in their cap to have their name known and seen as the
>spotlight feature for
>these events.....and the cost to the SSA (and I speak
>here as the office
>itself, not specifically the organization (us) as a
>whole...) are relatively
>low.
>As a small vendor (we are all small vendors if we are
>selling sailplanes and
>sailplane related supplies...big fish, very small pond)
>the costs to attend
>these events are very high....every turn you make in
>one of these convention
>centers you'll find someone with another charge. Aside
>from simple
>exhibition space costs itself, if you need a table.it's
>$150 +, a chair
>$60...electricity on a simple extension cord almost
>$100...telephone service
>or internet hook-up..forget it, either of these might
>cost you $500 for 3
>days!..on and on....I shipped boxes of items to display,
>the cost to ship
>big boxes by UPS or FedEx insured costs lots of $$........then,
>on top of
>this the convention center charges you $50 +++ just
>to receive the
>box!...convention centers are expensive, convention
>center hotels are
>expensive, travel is expensive.....I honestly can't
>say being there can or
>does ever generate the business necessary to cover
>the cost to do
>these.....not being there probably also has a negative
>effect as it then
>looks like you're not really in business if your customers
>don't find you
>there.....
>Personally, I don't really go to the convention with
>the intention of
>selling products there (it's far easier to do this
>and ship from here) but
>many non-soaring businesses do, I go there hopefully
>just to show what's
>available, to let visitors touch and see things close
>up and compare for
>themselves so there's really no profit for these events
>to cover these cost
>directly from the convention itself.....and, like most
>of us, we miss
>customer calls from our places of business when we're
>there...It's also not
>easy to give good answers to everyone who stops by
>and some visitors get put
>off by this too...it can't always be helped.
>The nuts and bolts of this are that there really isn't
>enough new or
>exciting stuff to put on display every year to make
>these really worthwhile
>for the vendors..or, more importantly, for the members
>and visitors who
>attend these events....
>I have suggested we do these every 2 years....every
>year is just too much
>(IMHO)...nearly all of the exhibitors I spoke with
>agree.....the SSA I hope
>will listen......We have essentially the same speakers
>giving mostly the
>same (sales pitch) talks as they did the year before
>and the year before
>that too.....granted, there are new and fresh speakers,
>a few new topics to
>ponder and my hat comes off to those you do prepare
>and work hard to try to
>make their talks interesting and entertaining......many
>are there though to
>self serve and have their own infomercial under the
>guise of some technical
>topic....most of us see through this.
>I really think a great event for the conventions would
>be a used glider
>sale.....we could easily have dozens of anxious sellers
>with their gliders
>on display and hundreds of anxious buyers with a single
>shopping center at
>their fingertips to compare in a single place....the
>SSA could (I think if
>they don't have the proper tax status get the NSM,
>SRA or SSF who might have
>access to this status to run this) even auction off
>gliders donated by their
>owners as charitable (read: Tax write-off) contributions.....now
>that would
>get some excitement going!.....and new owners do add
>life to the sport!
>Moving gliders between owners and want-to-be-owners
>also helps the
>sport....just my idea...
>anyway...I may not be popular with some for these comments...but
>it is my
>(our) sport and organizations...I think we all need
>to make these opinions
>known....to our fellow members, and our officers as
>well....
>sorry to be so lengthy......I could go on.I won't
>Respectfully
>Tim
>Wings & Wheels
>www.wingsandwheels.com
>
>
>'Jim Culp' wrote in message
...
>>
>> Questions of costs and benefits,
>> and preferences:
>>
>> Who benefits from annual SSA national convention?
>>
>>
>> Do glider and electronics vendors benefit by annual
>> show, vs the cost to them to go?
>>
>> Can you, vendor, afford to go annually and is it
>>cost/benefit
>> justified?
>>
>> Can you, SSA member, afford to go annually?
>>
>> How much debt or cash or debt do you lay out to go
>> to SSA convention considering registration fees, dinners,
>> party fees, hotel, transportation, incidentals: As
>> a vendor? As an SSA member?
>>
>> Would you be satisfied with an every other year convention,
>> as a SSA member or as a vendor ?
>>
>> Who makes out well by annual SSA conventions?
>>
>> Does SSA make money? If so, how much?
>>
>> Does host club or committee make money? If so, how
>> much?
>>
>> Are annual SSA conventions sufficiently well attended
>> to justify annual efforts?
>>
>> How many full registrants were in Atlanta AirExpo2004?
>>
>> Year before that?
>>
>> Understand, I love the conventions. Good, yes.
>>
>> Can I go annually. No way.
>> Can others?
>>
>> Would every other year be just as good, and regional
>> or state soaring efforts could host 1 or 2 day sessions
>> like the Soaring Symposiums and similar efforts did.
>>
>>
>> Would anyone, and any vendor suffer if there were
>>every
>> other year SSA National Convention? Would SSA suffer?
>> How?
>>
>> Your ideas, preferences?
>>
>> Kindest regards.
>>
>> Dancing on clouds,
>> Keep it up!
>>
>> Jim Culp USA
>> Asw-20c/Std Libelle
>> Gatorcity Florida
>>
>>
>
>
>
>

[Nyal Williams]

At 03:06 06 March 2004, Jim Culp wrote:
>
>Questions of costs and benefits,
>and preferences:
>
>Who benefits from annual SSA national convention?

The CFI renewal clinic is especially useful. It puts
us together with other instructors to talk about issues,
etc. Granted, we do that only every other year, but
half of those who use it would be on the wrong cycle,
and I'm not sure whether those who put it on would
be willing to have double the registration.

[Greg Arnold]

The idea that there are too many conventions reminds me of the person
who notices that there are 17 brands of toothpaste on the shelf, and
insists the other 16 should be eliminated because he never uses them.

I believe the conventions are a big money maker for the SSA and the
clubs putting them on. Vendors may complain about the costs, but no one
is forcing them to attend. If they feel the conventions should only be
held every other year, they are welcome to just attend every other year.


bumper wrote:
> I've only been in gliding since '98 and have attended two conventions
> (Albuquerque and Ontario). Ontario gave me the opportunity to go back and
> forth between two gliders and finally make up my mind which to order (g).
>
> The problem with going to less frequent conventions is that, for those
> unwilling to travel far to attend, reasonably close conventions are already
> infrequent.
>
> How about some "open air" conventions held at major soaring sites using a
> similar format to airshows and fly-ins? That would help keep costs down,
> promote soaring sites, and put more money and recognition for soaring into
> the smaller economic environments where we live and play.
>
> Let's do one at Minden!
>

[Eric Greenwell]

Chris OCallaghan wrote:

>
> If I had the sense that a convention had many new, interesting
> products and insights to offer, I might be enticed to make it a
> regular pilgrimage. Under the current formula, I'm coming once every 8
> years.

But would holding it every two years result in more new things to see or
talk about? I doubt that the manufacturers, vendors, or speakers would
be making/doing more just because the conentions were held less often.
Wouldn't it still take 8 years to get enough new things to entice you?

--
-----
change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA

[Nolaminar]

Vendors complain about the cost of SSA Conventions.I can't argue with them but
it is CHEAP when compared to any other conventions.
Oshkosh cost is "off the chart'. It is a major money making event for EAA.
An outside air convention during the flying season would be great. Need good
weather, willing host and no conflict with contests.
GA

[Pete Russell]

I think every other year would be best. I think some people out there may be
under the impression that you can actually make money off soaring speaking
as a vendor look around do you see anybody in the business driving fancy
cars most people just scrape buy. I work 51/2 days a week at a regular job
just so I can pay all the bills. most of the people at the conventions
aren't there to buy anything just see what's new and see old friends in fact
it's mostly the same people year after year. I am already on the at least
every other year program the problem is that I may have missed some
potential customers in the years I did not attend . I think you also need to
look at the design cycle of the new products I think if you went to two or
three year cycles you would see more new products at each show and vendors
would actually try to have new products ready for the show this would make
it a much more exciting convention.

Pete
Sage Variometers

[Tim Mara]

and......held every 2 years rather than every year the vendors who do attend
would be more willing to put their best foot forward and make it a better
event.......vendors would be more likely then to see the need....
and......quite frankly, without the vendors there in attendance there would
be no convention.....or nothing for the visitors to see....under the current
yearly program you WILL see fewer vendors.....I know at least one
less.......
tim
"Pete Russell" > wrote in message
...
> I think every other year would be best. I think some people out there may
be
> under the impression that you can actually make money off soaring speaking
> as a vendor look around do you see anybody in the business driving fancy
> cars most people just scrape buy. I work 51/2 days a week at a regular job
> just so I can pay all the bills. most of the people at the conventions
> aren't there to buy anything just see what's new and see old friends in
fact
> it's mostly the same people year after year. I am already on the at least
> every other year program the problem is that I may have missed some
> potential customers in the years I did not attend . I think you also need
to
> look at the design cycle of the new products I think if you went to two or
> three year cycles you would see more new products at each show and vendors
> would actually try to have new products ready for the show this would make
> it a much more exciting convention.
>
> Pete
> Sage Variometers
>
>

[Greg Arnold]

Pete Russell wrote:
> I think every other year would be best. I think some people out there may be
> under the impression that you can actually make money off soaring speaking
> as a vendor look around do you see anybody in the business driving fancy
> cars most people just scrape buy. I work 51/2 days a week at a regular job
> just so I can pay all the bills. most of the people at the conventions
> aren't there to buy anything just see what's new and see old friends in fact
> it's mostly the same people year after year. I am already on the at least
> every other year program the problem is that I may have missed some
> potential customers in the years I did not attend .

But wouldn't you miss those same potential customers if no convention
was held?


I think you also need to
> look at the design cycle of the new products I think if you went to two or
> three year cycles you would see more new products at each show and vendors
> would actually try to have new products ready for the show this would make
> it a much more exciting convention.
>
> Pete
> Sage Variometers
>
>

[BTIZ]

I prefer the alternating coast... which for me makes it every other year or
every third year this time.. that I can attend the "Local" convention.

There is more to the convention than marketing.. there is the time spent
with friends..

BT

"Jim Culp" > wrote in message
...
>
> Questions of costs and benefits,
> and preferences:
>
> Who benefits from annual SSA national convention?
>
>
> Do glider and electronics vendors benefit by annual
> show, vs the cost to them to go?
>
> Can you, vendor, afford to go annually and is it cost/benefit
> justified?
>
> Can you, SSA member, afford to go annually?
>
> How much debt or cash or debt do you lay out to go
> to SSA convention considering registration fees, dinners,
> party fees, hotel, transportation, incidentals: As
> a vendor? As an SSA member?
>
> Would you be satisfied with an every other year convention,
> as a SSA member or as a vendor ?
>
> Who makes out well by annual SSA conventions?
>
> Does SSA make money? If so, how much?
>
> Does host club or committee make money? If so, how
> much?
>
> Are annual SSA conventions sufficiently well attended
> to justify annual efforts?
>
> How many full registrants were in Atlanta AirExpo2004?
>
> Year before that?
>
> Understand, I love the conventions. Good, yes.
>
> Can I go annually. No way.
> Can others?
>
> Would every other year be just as good, and regional
> or state soaring efforts could host 1 or 2 day sessions
> like the Soaring Symposiums and similar efforts did.
>
>
> Would anyone, and any vendor suffer if there were every
> other year SSA National Convention? Would SSA suffer?
> How?
>
> Your ideas, preferences?
>
> Kindest regards.
>
> Dancing on clouds,
> Keep it up!
>
> Jim Culp USA
> Asw-20c/Std Libelle
> Gatorcity Florida
>
>

[Burt Compton]

>An outside air convention during the flying season would be great. Need good
>weather, willing host and no conflict with contests.

Summer Soaring Fly-In: Is this something the National Soaring Foundation at
Hobbs was originally created to accomplish? A national soaring site? Hobbs
would be a good venue for a summertime soaring "fly-in".

SSA Member's Work Week: We could all go to our HQ and personally thank the
current hard-working SSA Staff. Let's volunteer to stuff envelopes or repaint
the SSA building. Wouldn't that be something? Imagine dozens of SSA members
converging on Hobbs to do club-type work on our infrastructure. I'm sure SSA
Staff could come up with a list of "honey-do's" that would save our SSA money
and rekindle our "national soaring club" spirit. Been to Hobbs lately?
It's lookin' good with new restaurants, motels, culture. (I bought a ukelele in
the local music store!)

SSA Conventions: We should continue with our annual winter SSA Conventions. I
sure enjoy them, and the cost for my Marfa Soaring booth was reasonable.

Another day! I wish our annual SSA Convention was a day longer - perhaps into
Sunday mid-afternoon. Perhaps more local folks would attend on Sunday. So
many great seminars, vendors, people to meet and talk with - never enough time
for me to see / do it all at the SSA Convention.

So I'll see y'all in Ontario, CA for the 2005 SSA Convention, then Dallas in
2006.

Burt Compton
Marfa Gliders, west Texas

[Pete Russell]

>
> But wouldn't you miss those same potential customers if no convention
> was held?

The theroy is that if held every other year or every four years you would
have a higher concentration of people. There are lots of people that don't
go every year but if held on a longer cycle it would tend to force everoyone
to attend on that year.

Pete

[Dave Rolley]

I go when I have the time available to go and the event is within a
day's drive, or the airfare is cheap enough.

Since 1988 that has happened three times.

Shift to a two year or longer cycle and the likelihood of the stars
aligning just right decrease.

Dave Rolley

[Pete Russell]

Or you might make more of an effort as you would know you won't get a chance
the next year.

Pete

"Dave Rolley" > wrote in message
k.net...
> I go when I have the time available to go and the event is within a
> day's drive, or the airfare is cheap enough.
>
> Since 1988 that has happened three times.
>
> Shift to a two year or longer cycle and the likelihood of the stars
> aligning just right decrease.
>
> Dave Rolley

[Chris OCallaghan]

Eric,

I don't know. There's a part of me wanting to attend every convention.
But it's hard to complete the value proposition. The closer to home,
the easier it is to justify, if just to hang around with a bunch a
glider pilots for a few days. I guess I don't have a sense that I'm
missing anything important by not attending other than the chance to
see old friends and make new ones -- but I get alot of that during the
contest season. If the convention offered value I couldn't get
anywhere else, I'd be there every year. What constitutes value? I
guess I'm open to suggestions.


Eric Greenwell > wrote in message >...
> Chris OCallaghan wrote:
>
> >
> > If I had the sense that a convention had many new, interesting
> > products and insights to offer, I might be enticed to make it a
> > regular pilgrimage. Under the current formula, I'm coming once every 8
> > years.
>
> But would holding it every two years result in more new things to see or
> talk about? I doubt that the manufacturers, vendors, or speakers would
> be making/doing more just because the conentions were held less often.
> Wouldn't it still take 8 years to get enough new things to entice you?

[Thomas Knauff]

Another possibility is to hold a mini-convention every other year with
speakers/meetings only. These could be held in most modest sized towns at a
fraction of the cost to the SSA and attendees.

The SSA convention historically attracts some 800 attendees, probably 600
who attend every year and only 200 or so fresh faces.

For those who support the organization with booths etc, it is almost never
possible to do better than break even. The present down-sizing of membership
makes future attendance questionable.

--
Thomas Knauff
Knauff & Grove, Inc.
Schempp-Hirth Sailplanes
3523 South Eagle Valley Road
Julian, Pa 16844
Phone (814) 355 2483
Fax (814) 355 2633
www.eglider.org
"Pete Russell" > wrote in message
...
> Or you might make more of an effort as you would know you won't get a
chance
> the next year.
>
> Pete
>
> "Dave Rolley" > wrote in message
> k.net...
> > I go when I have the time available to go and the event is within a
> > day's drive, or the airfare is cheap enough.
> >
> > Since 1988 that has happened three times.
> >
> > Shift to a two year or longer cycle and the likelihood of the stars
> > aligning just right decrease.
> >
> > Dave Rolley
>
>

[Mark James Boyd]

How about one year on one coast, one year on the other?
When will it be close to MY house?

I woulda gone, but 2000 miles is a Loooong way...

I think you'll find people vote with their feet...
--

------------+
Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA

[Eric Greenwell]

Mark James Boyd wrote:
> How about one year on one coast, one year on the other?
> When will it be close to MY house?

Ontario next year.
>
> I woulda gone, but 2000 miles is a Loooong way...
>
> I think you'll find people vote with their feet...

So far, there have been enough votes to make money for the convention,
though some of the exhibitors aren't so lucky. I did see large sales at
the SeeYou booth though. Nothing like announcing a new product at half
price!

--
-----
change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA

[Nolaminar]

Exhibitors can write off the cost/expanses for the trip. Not that such a "good
deal" makes it worthwhile. But it is a bit less painful for some that can have
the benefit of write-offs.
GA

[Harold Ennulat]

What about changing the schedule to start on Friday instead of Thursday and
run through Sunday instead of Saturday. Turnout on Thursdays is always the
lowest and most people can travel back Sunday evening if they want to stay
through the end. For exhibitors it doesn't matter if you shift one day to
the right (same number of days off), you just take off on a Monday after to
travel home instead of the Tuesday/Wednesday of the week before to get there
to set up beforehand.

HE
ENTEC
"Nolaminar" > wrote in message
...
> Vendors complain about the cost of SSA Conventions.I can't argue with them
but
> it is CHEAP when compared to any other conventions.
> Oshkosh cost is "off the chart'. It is a major money making event for
EAA.
> An outside air convention during the flying season would be great. Need
good
> weather, willing host and no conflict with contests.
> GA
>

[Paul Remde]

Hi,

Being somewhat new to the soaring supplies business (2 years), I really like
having a booth at the SSA convention every year. It is expensive and I
don't necessarily sell enough at the show to be worth my while, but I do get
a lot of sales after the event. The main benefit for me is that I get to
meet many of the customers I've been selling to, and establish relationships
with new customers. It is very nice to meet people face to face rather than
via e-mail!

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring Supplies

"Pete Russell" > wrote in message
...
> I think every other year would be best. I think some people out there may
be
> under the impression that you can actually make money off soaring speaking
> as a vendor look around do you see anybody in the business driving fancy
> cars most people just scrape buy. I work 51/2 days a week at a regular job
> just so I can pay all the bills. most of the people at the conventions
> aren't there to buy anything just see what's new and see old friends in
fact
> it's mostly the same people year after year. I am already on the at least
> every other year program the problem is that I may have missed some
> potential customers in the years I did not attend . I think you also need
to
> look at the design cycle of the new products I think if you went to two or
> three year cycles you would see more new products at each show and vendors
> would actually try to have new products ready for the show this would make
> it a much more exciting convention.
>
> Pete
> Sage Variometers
>
>