Patty Wagstaff

[Mike Granby]

Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!

[Brad Zeigler]

???

"Mike Granby" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!
>

[Jay Honeck]

> Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!

So what did she say?
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Peter R.]

Jay Honeck > wrote:

>> Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!
>
> So what did she say?

My guess is that this poster was commenting on the picture in the article.
It was taken from above the cockpit looking down into it and Ms. Wagstaff
is wearing a slightly low cut shirt.


--
Peter













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[Bob Chilcoat]

Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)


"Peter R." > wrote in message
...
> Jay Honeck > wrote:
>
> >> Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!
> >
> > So what did she say?
>
> My guess is that this poster was commenting on the picture in the article.
> It was taken from above the cockpit looking down into it and Ms. Wagstaff
> is wearing a slightly low cut shirt.
>
>
> --
> Peter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
News==----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
Newsgroups
> ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
=----

[Jay Honeck]

> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.

Hmmm. Plane & Pilot is the ONLY flying magazine we don't subscribe to
anymore.

I may have to reconsider my choice!

:-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[George Patterson]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>
> I may have to reconsider my choice!

They run one racy photo every ten years or so, and that makes you want to
subscribe? Just staple the cover of Flying magazine to a copy of Playboy and be
done with it.

George Patterson
He who would distinguish what is true from what is false must have an
adequate understanding of truth and falsehood.

[Peter R.]

Jay Honeck > wrote:

>> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.
>
> Hmmm. Plane & Pilot is the ONLY flying magazine we don't subscribe to
> anymore.
>
> I may have to reconsider my choice!

Check your email...

--
Peter













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[Marco Leon]

Gimme a break guys. You could see more cleavage walking down the street
looking at billboards! I guess some folks here are turned on by the
combination of two disparate interests. There are much more interesting
examples of this combination over at the alt.binaries.pictures.aviation
channel. Jay will vouch for me ;) It's 99.9% aviation photos and 0.1% of
pictures under the title of "Hangar Queen."

Now, if you take that same pic of Patty doing some serious negative G's, she
may give Janet Jackson a run for her money and I'll have to rethink my
position...

Marco Leon


"Peter R." > wrote in message
...
> Jay Honeck > wrote:
>
> >> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.
> >
> > Hmmm. Plane & Pilot is the ONLY flying magazine we don't subscribe to
> > anymore.
> >
> > I may have to reconsider my choice!
>
> Check your email...
>
> --
> Peter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
News==----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
Newsgroups
> ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
=----



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[Peter R.]

Marco Leon <mmleonyahoo.com> wrote:

> Gimme a break guys.

Relax, chief. I was just speculating on the original poster's intent.

--
Peter













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[Mike Granby]

> You could see more cleavage walking
> down the street looking at billboards!

Sure, but it wouldn't be Patty! :)

[NW_PILOT]

Haaa, Women & Airplane Both Expensive Hobbies, A Nice Woman Costs $250.00 An
Hour. My Cessna 150 Costs me $20.00 An Hour. Sure One Can Woman For $20.00
An Hour But That's Like Flying A Run Out Airplane With Hidden Problems. If
You Marry The Woman The Maintenance On Her Can And Will Exceed An Airplane's
Maintenance Bill's Plus You Will have Mental Stress When She Break's Down
Once A Month.

With Woman Over The Years It Can Get Harder To Turn Her On You Just Cannot
Send Her Out For An Overhaul Or Have Her Starter Replaced Like You Can On An
Airplane.

An Airplane Dont Increase In Weight Over The Years Unless You Want It To For
Upgrades Ect. Speeking Of Upgrades

You Have to Pay To get Rid of A Woman And Cannot Sell Just Part Of Them.




"Marco Leon" <mmleon(at)yahoo.com> wrote in message
...
> Gimme a break guys. You could see more cleavage walking down the street
> looking at billboards! I guess some folks here are turned on by the
> combination of two disparate interests. There are much more interesting
> examples of this combination over at the alt.binaries.pictures.aviation
> channel. Jay will vouch for me ;) It's 99.9% aviation photos and 0.1% of
> pictures under the title of "Hangar Queen."
>
> Now, if you take that same pic of Patty doing some serious negative G's,
she
> may give Janet Jackson a run for her money and I'll have to rethink my
> position...
>
> Marco Leon
>
>
> "Peter R." > wrote in message
> ...
> > Jay Honeck > wrote:
> >
> > >> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.
> > >
> > > Hmmm. Plane & Pilot is the ONLY flying magazine we don't subscribe to
> > > anymore.
> > >
> > > I may have to reconsider my choice!
> >
> > Check your email...
> >
> > --
> > Peter
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
> News==----
> > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
> Newsgroups
> > ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
> =----
>
>
>
> Posted Via Usenet.com Premium Usenet Newsgroup Services
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> ** SPEED ** RETENTION ** COMPLETION ** ANONYMITY **
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.usenet.com

[Dudley Henriques]

Patty Wagstaff is a combination of fantastically talented pilot and
great marketing skills. She doesn't cross any lines, but is extremely
adept at using her feminity to enhance her overall market share in the
industry.
I consider her one of the best examples I've ever seen of individual
marketing skills.She uses all the tools available to her in a very nice
and straight forward way that as far as I can determine from the many
people I know in the industry, is totally respected and universally
accepted.
I commend Patty for being exactly what she is; one of the finest pilots
AND one of the most attractive personalities in the business.
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/CFI Retired
for private email; make necessary changes between ( )
dhenriques(at)(delete all this)earthlink(dot)net

"Mike Granby" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!
>

[Roger Long]

I can't believe with all this talk, nobody has committed copyright
infringement yet:)

--

Roger Long

[Marco Leon]

It wasn't towards you Peter. I should have replied to the original post.
Sorry 'bout that.


"Peter R." > wrote in message
...
> Marco Leon <mmleonyahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Gimme a break guys.
>
> Relax, chief. I was just speculating on the original poster's intent.
>
> --
> Peter
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
News==----
> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
Newsgroups
> ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
=----



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----------------------------------------------------------
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[W P Dixon]

Dang yall must be older than dirt! She doesn't do a thing for me. But of
course my Dad says I like to trade wives in when they hit 25. ;) Wife now
has made it to 29 , I guess she really is special! ;)

Patrick


"Roger Long" > wrote in message
...
>I can't believe with all this talk, nobody has committed copyright
>infringement yet:)
>
> --
>
> Roger Long
>
>
>
>

[Bob Moore]

"NW_PILOT" > wrote

> Haaa, Women & Airplane Both Expensive Hobbies, A Nice Woman Costs
> $250.00 An Hour. My Cessna 150 Costs me $20.00 An Hour. Sure One Can
> Woman For $20.00 An Hour But That's Like Flying A Run Out Airplane
> With Hidden Problems. If You Marry The Woman The Maintenance On Her
> Can And Will Exceed An Airplane's Maintenance Bill's Plus You Will
> have Mental Stress When She Break's Down Once A Month.

NW...Did you ever study English composition in school??

Bob Moore

[Morgans]

"W P Dixon" > wrote in message
...
> Dang yall must be older than dirt! She doesn't do a thing for me. But of
> course my Dad says I like to trade wives in when they hit 25. ;) Wife now
> has made it to 29 , I guess she really is special! ;)
>
> Patrick

Hey, for some of us (lots), Patty is almost too young! Ouch!
--
Jim in NC

[[email protected]]

Bob Moore wrote:
> "NW_PILOT" > wrote
>
> > Haaa, Women & Airplane Both Expensive Hobbies, A Nice Woman Costs
> > $250.00 An Hour. My Cessna 150 Costs me $20.00 An Hour. Sure One
Can
> > Woman For $20.00 An Hour But That's Like Flying A Run Out Airplane
> > With Hidden Problems. If You Marry The Woman The Maintenance On Her
> > Can And Will Exceed An Airplane's Maintenance Bill's Plus You Will
> > have Mental Stress When She Break's Down Once A Month.
>
> NW...Did you ever study English composition in school??
>
> Bob Moore

I hang out on some techie boards on the web. There are some Pakistani
kids who type everything this way on the board. Must be a fad over
there. The cheap humor added to the annoyance.

[Morgans]

"Bob Moore" > wrote

> NW...Did you ever study English composition in school??
>
> Bob Moore

Toss him in the looney bin, and your quality of life will increase by 23.9%.
--
Jim in NC

[muff528]

"Peter R." > wrote in message
...
> Jay Honeck > wrote:
>
> >> Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!
> >
> > So what did she say?
>
> My guess is that this poster was commenting on the picture in the article.
> It was taken from above the cockpit looking down into it and Ms. Wagstaff
> is wearing a slightly low cut shirt.
>
>
> --
> Peter
>

Yet another example of the fundamental differences between pilots
and skydivers. A skydiver would have the decency to post a link
to a scan of the pic to put this thread into context. ;-)

[Bob Chilcoat]

Yeah, what Dudley said... and I don't even know her. Just respect her
tremendously and wish I was as good a pilot as she is.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)


"Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
nk.net...
> Patty Wagstaff is a combination of fantastically talented pilot and
> great marketing skills. She doesn't cross any lines, but is extremely
> adept at using her feminity to enhance her overall market share in the
> industry.
> I consider her one of the best examples I've ever seen of individual
> marketing skills.She uses all the tools available to her in a very nice
> and straight forward way that as far as I can determine from the many
> people I know in the industry, is totally respected and universally
> accepted.
> I commend Patty for being exactly what she is; one of the finest pilots
> AND one of the most attractive personalities in the business.
> Dudley Henriques
> International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
> Commercial Pilot/CFI Retired
> for private email; make necessary changes between ( )
> dhenriques(at)(delete all this)earthlink(dot)net
>
> "Mike Granby" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!
> >
>
>

[Bob Gardner]

Don't bother. The picture shows a tiny amount of cleavage, totally
overwhelmed by her acrobatic harness. I wouldn't have even noticed it if it
hadn't been pointed out.

Bob Gardner

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:ELnQd.133$kS6.70@attbi_s52...
>> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.
>
> Hmmm. Plane & Pilot is the ONLY flying magazine we don't subscribe to
> anymore.
>
> I may have to reconsider my choice!
>
> :-)
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>

[Morgans]

"Bob Chilcoat" > wrote

> Yeah, what Dudley said... and I don't even know her. Just respect her
> tremendously and wish I was as good a pilot as she is.
>
> --
> Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)

Yea, but I still liked her dark hair 1,000% more than her blond hair. I
wonder how many others feel the same.
--
Jim in NC

[Paul Tomblin]

In a previous article, "Morgans" > said:
>Yea, but I still liked her dark hair 1,000% more than her blond hair. I
>wonder how many others feel the same.

Me too. I met her when I was a student pilot and she was clearing
customs on the way back from an airshow in Canada. She was nice enough to
show me and my instructor her plane and answer questions before she
continued on her trip. And then she let the tower turn her close around
the tower so that they could get a good look at her. Very classy, very
friendly, very beautiful.

--
Paul Tomblin > http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
"Whoah, whoah! A fat sarcastic Star Trek fan? You must be a devil with the
ladies!" - Simpsons

[Steven Barnes]

You know your priorities have changed when the wife catches you holding a
flying magazine sideways at arms length, drooling over the G1000
centerfold...

Ah, times change.


"George Patterson" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Jay Honeck wrote:
> >
> > I may have to reconsider my choice!
>
> They run one racy photo every ten years or so, and that makes you want to
> subscribe? Just staple the cover of Flying magazine to a copy of Playboy
and be
> done with it.
>
> George Patterson
> He who would distinguish what is true from what is false must have an
> adequate understanding of truth and falsehood.

[John]

What could be better...if it was Svetlana Kapanina in the pic. Having met
and having seeing them fly akro, Svetlana is nicer, better looking and a
more talented pilot.

"Bob Chilcoat" > wrote in message
...
> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.
>
> --
> Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)
>
>
> "Peter R." > wrote in message
> ...
> > Jay Honeck > wrote:
> >
> > >> Plane and Pilot. March 2005. "What Pilots Say". Wow!
> > >
> > > So what did she say?
> >
> > My guess is that this poster was commenting on the picture in the
article.
> > It was taken from above the cockpit looking down into it and Ms.
Wagstaff
> > is wearing a slightly low cut shirt.
> >
> >
> > --
> > Peter
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
> News==----
> > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
> Newsgroups
> > ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption
> =----
>
>

[Jay Honeck]

> Yea, but I still liked her dark hair 1,000% more than her blond hair. I
> wonder how many others feel the same.

She signed my shirt (while I was wearing it, of course) at OSH '03 (?), back
when she was a brunette.

I've not washed the shirt since. :-)

She's a great pilot, and -- while not beautiful in the traditional sense of
the word -- she has a quality about her that makes her very attractive.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Dave Butler]

> Yea, but I still liked her dark hair 1,000% more than her blond hair. I
> wonder how many others feel the same.

Reminds me of Hillary's comment from the early White House times that the only
way she could get in the newspaper was to change her hair style.

[Jay Honeck]

> Reminds me of Hillary's comment from the early White House times that the
> only way she could get in the newspaper was to change her hair style.

Please. I was about to eat breakfast...

:-(
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Dave Butler]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>>Reminds me of Hillary's comment from the early White House times that the
>>only way she could get in the newspaper was to change her hair style.
>
>
> Please. I was about to eat breakfast...

Sorry I apparently hit your anti-Clinton reflex. The point is, no matter the
level of accomplishment, women are judged largely by their appearance.

[Dudley Henriques]

"Dave Butler" > wrote in message
news:1108566704.572762@sj-nntpcache-5...
> Jay Honeck wrote:
>>>Reminds me of Hillary's comment from the early White House times that
>>>the only way she could get in the newspaper was to change her hair
>>>style.
>>
>>
>> Please. I was about to eat breakfast...
>
> Sorry I apparently hit your anti-Clinton reflex. The point is, no
> matter the level of accomplishment, women are judged largely by their
> appearance.

You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many women,
tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics, aerospace..you
name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their pinnacles with their
looks.
I know one woman in particular, a friend of mine; a Navy Commander
flying F18's who would be right at home on the cover of Playboy however.
If I suggested to her what you have said here, I'm sure she would laugh
like hell!
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/CFI Retired
for private email; make necessary changes between ( )
dhenriques(at)(delete all this)earthlink(dot)net

[George Patterson]

W P Dixon wrote:
>
> But of
> course my Dad says I like to trade wives in when they hit 25. ;)

Friend of mine is an electrician. His wife just turned 40. He joked about
trading her in on two 20 year olds. She told him "Honey, you ain't wired for
220."

George Patterson
He who would distinguish what is true from what is false must have an
adequate understanding of truth and falsehood.

[Dave Butler]

Dudley Henriques wrote:
> "Dave Butler" > wrote in message
>>Sorry I apparently hit your anti-Clinton reflex. The point is, no
>>matter the level of accomplishment, women are judged largely by their
>>appearance.
>
>
> You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
> world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many women,
> tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics, aerospace..you
> name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their pinnacles with their
> looks.
> I know one woman in particular, a friend of mine; a Navy Commander
> flying F18's who would be right at home on the cover of Playboy however.
> If I suggested to her what you have said here, I'm sure she would laugh
> like hell!

Nope. Not kidding. Do you suppose a discussion about, say, Sean D. Tucker would
have evoked a comment about hair color?

[alexy]

Dave Butler > wrote:

>Dudley Henriques wrote:
>> "Dave Butler" > wrote in message
>>>Sorry I apparently hit your anti-Clinton reflex. The point is, no
>>>matter the level of accomplishment, women are judged largely by their
>>>appearance.
>>
>>
>> You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
>> world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many women,
>> tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics, aerospace..you
>> name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their pinnacles with their
>> looks.
>> I know one woman in particular, a friend of mine; a Navy Commander
>> flying F18's who would be right at home on the cover of Playboy however.
>> If I suggested to her what you have said here, I'm sure she would laugh
>> like hell!
>
>Nope. Not kidding. Do you suppose a discussion about, say, Sean D. Tucker would
>have evoked a comment about hair color?

Not in a discussion primarily among men. But to use a comment about
hair color to support a claim that "women are judged largely by their
appearance" is quite a leap. Look at the substantive comments about
Ms. Wagstaff in this thread. Comments by guys pretending that they are
in a high school locker room are pretty clearly said in a light vein
(at least that is how I read them) not as a judgment of Wagstaff.

(P.S., I liked the brown hair better, too, but that is in no way a
judgment about her as a pilot or as a person!)
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

[W P Dixon]

Hee Hee,
That's funny! A good sense of humor is a requirement. Goodness knows I like
to laugh and cut up.

Patrick

"George Patterson" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> W P Dixon wrote:
>>
>> But of
>> course my Dad says I like to trade wives in when they hit 25. ;)
>
> Friend of mine is an electrician. His wife just turned 40. He joked about
> trading her in on two 20 year olds. She told him "Honey, you ain't wired
> for
> 220."
>
> George Patterson
> He who would distinguish what is true from what is false must have an
> adequate understanding of truth and falsehood.

[Doug Carter]

Dave Butler wrote:
>
>> Yea, but I still liked her dark hair 1,000% more than her blond hair. I
>> wonder how many others feel the same.
>
> Reminds me of Hillary's comment from the early White House times that
> the only way she could get in the newspaper was to change her hair style.

Your quite correct, the mainstream media gave infinitely better coverage
to Hillary's hair style than her conviction of violation of federal open
meeting laws, ducking records subpoenas, insider trading, swapping
pardons for votes in NY, etc...

Nevertheless, Ms. Wagstaff's dark hair was, IMHO, a much better
compliment to her fantastic flying ability.

[Dudley Henriques]

"Dave Butler" > wrote in message
news:1108570946.960251@sj-nntpcache-5...
> Dudley Henriques wrote:
>> "Dave Butler" > wrote in message
>>>Sorry I apparently hit your anti-Clinton reflex. The point is, no
>>>matter the level of accomplishment, women are judged largely by their
>>>appearance.
>>
>>
>> You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
>> world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many
>> women, tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics,
>> aerospace..you name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their
>> pinnacles with their looks.
>> I know one woman in particular, a friend of mine; a Navy Commander
>> flying F18's who would be right at home on the cover of Playboy
>> however.
>> If I suggested to her what you have said here, I'm sure she would
>> laugh like hell!
>
> Nope. Not kidding. Do you suppose a discussion about, say, Sean D.
> Tucker would have evoked a comment about hair color?

Thank you. You have made my point perfectly.
The people commenting on, or even discussing Ms. Wagstaff's hair color,
although nice enough people, are in no way even remotely qualified to
enhance her career, or even to judge the quality of her expertise.
Those of us who CAN make these judgments, including Sean Tucker and
myself, could care less what color her hair is.
I can assure you that if you approached Sean Tucker and asked about
Patty Wagstaff, her hair color would be the last thing mentioned.
My point is that people who are concerned with things like looks and
hair color are not the people who make and break careers in the
professional world. That is not to say that a woman with Patty
Wagstaff's professional talents would not use a little "good looks" to
appeal to that other market.
In fact, that is exactly what she does do..........she already has the
total respect of her professional peers. All Patty is doing is AFTER
achieving this respect through skill and talent, using all her available
tools to market herself to the people you are talking about........the
ones that make up her market base......her CUSTOMERS.......not her
peers!! :-))
HUGE difference!!!!
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/CFI Retired
for private email; make necessary changes between ( )
dhenriques(at)(delete all this)earthlink(dot)net

[Lakeview Bill]

Tempest in a teapot...

This is no dichotomy in a woman being the president of IBM AND giving the
best blow job in town.

Eye candy doesn't hurt, but how many HP stockholders even knew what Carly
Fiorina looked like. She lost her job because she didn't perform, even
though she is still quite beautiful.



"Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
> "Dave Butler" > wrote in message
> news:1108566704.572762@sj-nntpcache-5...
> > Jay Honeck wrote:
> >>>Reminds me of Hillary's comment from the early White House times that
> >>>the only way she could get in the newspaper was to change her hair
> >>>style.
> >>
> >>
> >> Please. I was about to eat breakfast...
> >
> > Sorry I apparently hit your anti-Clinton reflex. The point is, no
> > matter the level of accomplishment, women are judged largely by their
> > appearance.
>
> You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
> world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many women,
> tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics, aerospace..you
> name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their pinnacles with their
> looks.
> I know one woman in particular, a friend of mine; a Navy Commander
> flying F18's who would be right at home on the cover of Playboy however.
> If I suggested to her what you have said here, I'm sure she would laugh
> like hell!
> Dudley Henriques
> International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
> Commercial Pilot/CFI Retired
> for private email; make necessary changes between ( )
> dhenriques(at)(delete all this)earthlink(dot)net
>
>
>

[Dave Butler]

Dudley Henriques wrote:
> "Dave Butler" > wrote in message
>>Nope. Not kidding. Do you suppose a discussion about, say, Sean D.
>>Tucker would have evoked a comment about hair color?
>
>
> Thank you. You have made my point perfectly.
> The people commenting on, or even discussing Ms. Wagstaff's hair color,
> although nice enough people, are in no way even remotely qualified to
> enhance her career, or even to judge the quality of her expertise.
> Those of us who CAN make these judgments, including Sean Tucker and
> myself, could care less what color her hair is.
> I can assure you that if you approached Sean Tucker and asked about
> Patty Wagstaff, her hair color would be the last thing mentioned.
> My point is that people who are concerned with things like looks and
> hair color are not the people who make and break careers in the
> professional world. That is not to say that a woman with Patty
> Wagstaff's professional talents would not use a little "good looks" to
> appeal to that other market.
> In fact, that is exactly what she does do..........she already has the
> total respect of her professional peers. All Patty is doing is AFTER
> achieving this respect through skill and talent, using all her available
> tools to market herself to the people you are talking about........the
> ones that make up her market base......her CUSTOMERS.......not her
> peers!! :-))
> HUGE difference!!!!

Dudley, I agree substantially with your comments, except for "...people who are
concerned with things like looks and hair color are not the people who make and
break careers in the professional world."

I don't think "people who make and break..." are substantially different from
the general population.

I'm pleased to learn of your personal indifference to such matters.

[Jay Honeck]

>>>Reminds me of Hillary's comment from the early White House times that the
>>>only way she could get in the newspaper was to change her hair style.
>>
>>
>> Please. I was about to eat breakfast...
>
> Sorry I apparently hit your anti-Clinton reflex. The point is, no matter
> the level of accomplishment, women are judged largely by their appearance.

No, actually, I just find her to be one of the most repulsive women on
earth. Wouldn't really matter who her "husband" is... (and I use the term
loosely...)

Bottom line: To mention Hillary in the same thread as Patty Wagstaff ought
to be illegal!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[George Patterson]

Dave Butler wrote:
>
> Nope. Not kidding. Do you suppose a discussion about, say, Sean D. Tucker would
> have evoked a comment about hair color?

I think it would if Sean showed up at Oshkosh as a blond.

George Patterson
He who would distinguish what is true from what is false must have an
adequate understanding of truth and falsehood.

[RST Engineering]

Has anybody got a copy of that obscene recording somebody did about Sean's
airshow announcer (his son) doing an X-rated version of Sean and Patty doing
a "show" together? I had a copy and it got lost (or Gail erased it, you
never know {;-) ).

"There's MY daddy, Sean D. Tucker turning Patty upside down and there's ONE
roll, and then TWO rolls ..." ... you get the idea...

Jim

[Bob Fry]

"Dudley Henriques" > writes:

> You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
> world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many women,
> tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics, aerospace..you
> name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their pinnacles with their
> looks.

I'm an engineer...and I can think of several women in my agency that
are mediocre talents who clearly were promoted by their bosses on
their looks and personality, not their technical skills.

I also know a fair number of guys who got promotions by their people
(a.k.a. butt-kissing) skills. Eventually they hit their
Peter-principle limits and depending if they're simply mediocre, or
outright incompetent, they do little or considerable damage to the
organization below them.

Of course I also know women and men who were promoted because of their
engineering skill, leadership, and usefulness.

But so what? That's life in the real world. It's not just
Hollywood...it's everywhere.

[Dudley Henriques]

"Bob Fry" > wrote in message
...
> "Dudley Henriques" > writes:
>
>> You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
>> world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many
>> women,
>> tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics,
>> aerospace..you
>> name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their pinnacles with their
>> looks.
>
> I'm an engineer...and I can think of several women in my agency that
> are mediocre talents who clearly were promoted by their bosses on
> their looks and personality, not their technical skills.
>
> I also know a fair number of guys who got promotions by their people
> (a.k.a. butt-kissing) skills. Eventually they hit their
> Peter-principle limits and depending if they're simply mediocre, or
> outright incompetent, they do little or considerable damage to the
> organization below them.
>
> Of course I also know women and men who were promoted because of their
> engineering skill, leadership, and usefulness.
>
> But so what? That's life in the real world. It's not just
> Hollywood...it's everywhere.

Sure it is. Everybody knows SOMEBODY who fits into this scenario. What
I'm saying is that this type of thing is not the norm by a long shot;
not nearly prevalent enough to be considered systemic as you seem to be
implying; at least not in my experience anyway.
Look, if it pleases you to think this way about the professional world,
I'm the last guy to try and change your mind. I can only tell you that
I've been in the professional world all my life at the highest levels
and although there may be a few clowns in the batch, the vast majority
of professional people with whom I've been associated are definitely not
in the category you are describing.
But Usenet being what it is......naturally BOTH of us are completely
right and because of that, neither of us is wrong. :-)
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/CFI Retired
for private email; make necessary changes between ( )
dhenriques(at)(delete all this)earthlink(dot)net

[Montblack]

("Dudley Henriques" wrote)
<snip>
> Patty Wagstaff is a combination of fantastically talented pilot and great
> marketing skills. She doesn't cross any lines, but is extremely adept at
> using her feminity to enhance her overall market share in the industry.


Raquel Welch gave an interview a few years ago about the business of
Hollywood. She she was all wrapped up in the 70's idea: "Treat me like one
of the boys!" It wasn't until the late 80's that she really got it she
decided. It's all about accomplishing your goals.

Raquel Welch said, 'My mistake was, I kept playing by their rules, using
their tools and dealing with their power plays. Hey, I got tools too!'

Yes ...yes she does.


Montblack

[Dudley Henriques]

You are exactly correct about Ms. Welch. She is one intelligent woman
and has kept herself in the game for a very long time.
The thing about Rocky Welch is that she gets even more beautiful instead
of going the other way :-))
DH
"Montblack" > wrote in message
...
> ("Dudley Henriques" wrote)
> <snip>
>> Patty Wagstaff is a combination of fantastically talented pilot and
>> great marketing skills. She doesn't cross any lines, but is extremely
>> adept at using her feminity to enhance her overall market share in
>> the industry.
>
>
> Raquel Welch gave an interview a few years ago about the business of
> Hollywood. She she was all wrapped up in the 70's idea: "Treat me like
> one of the boys!" It wasn't until the late 80's that she really got it
> she decided. It's all about accomplishing your goals.
>
> Raquel Welch said, 'My mistake was, I kept playing by their rules,
> using their tools and dealing with their power plays. Hey, I got tools
> too!'
>
> Yes ...yes she does.
>
>
> Montblack
>

[William W. Plummer]

Montblack wrote:

> ("Dudley Henriques" wrote)
> <snip>
>
>>Patty Wagstaff is a combination of fantastically talented pilot and great
>>marketing skills. She doesn't cross any lines, but is extremely adept at
>>using her feminity to enhance her overall market share in the industry.
>
>
>
> Raquel Welch gave an interview a few years ago about the business of
> Hollywood. She she was all wrapped up in the 70's idea: "Treat me like one
> of the boys!" It wasn't until the late 80's that she really got it she
> decided. It's all about accomplishing your goals.
>
> Raquel Welch said, 'My mistake was, I kept playing by their rules, using
> their tools and dealing with their power plays. Hey, I got tools too!'
>
> Yes ...yes she does.
>
>
> Montblack
>
>
But they're made of plastic.

[Foster]

There have been numerous studies showing a very strong correlation to
appearance and organizational success. I've seen numbers like in a
career, you'll earn $100,000 above average for every inch you're taller
than 6 feet, or $50,000 less for every 10 pounds overweight (damn, two
strikes against me). I'm sure these numbers aren't correct, but you get
the idea.

I've also seen business studies - and TV news magazine studies showing,
male or female, you're more likely to get hired, rent an apartment, get
help for a stalled car, etc., etc., etc., the more attractive you are
(three strikes, I'm out).

It's not a 100% correlation obviously but a very strong one.

Bob Fry wrote:
> "Dudley Henriques" > writes:
>
>
>>You've got to be kidding! That's not true at all in the professional
>>world. It's just true for the Hollywood set. I can think of many women,
>>tops in their fields of science, medicine, electronics, aerospace..you
>>name it, who I can guarantee did not reach their pinnacles with their
>>looks.
>
>
> I'm an engineer...and I can think of several women in my agency that
> are mediocre talents who clearly were promoted by their bosses on
> their looks and personality, not their technical skills.
>
> I also know a fair number of guys who got promotions by their people
> (a.k.a. butt-kissing) skills. Eventually they hit their
> Peter-principle limits and depending if they're simply mediocre, or
> outright incompetent, they do little or considerable damage to the
> organization below them.
>
> Of course I also know women and men who were promoted because of their
> engineering skill, leadership, and usefulness.
>
> But so what? That's life in the real world. It's not just
> Hollywood...it's everywhere.

[Steven P. McNicoll]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:ELnQd.133$kS6.70@attbi_s52...
>> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.
>
> Hmmm. Plane & Pilot is the ONLY flying magazine we don't subscribe to
> anymore.
>
> I may have to reconsider my choice!
>
> :-)
>

I had to examine a copy to see what the fuss was about. It's nothing.

[gatt]

"Bob Fry" > wrote in message

> I'm an engineer...and I can think of several women in my agency that
> are mediocre talents who clearly were promoted by their bosses on
> their looks and personality, not their technical skills.

Yes. I've worked in telecom for nearly a decade now, and unfortunately I
must agree. I've worked with some beautiful females of both the highest and
lowest caliber of employee and skill, and there are particular examples that
come to mind where they could have only been hired for their looks.
(Making a sysadmins out of people with Philosophy degrees and no previous
technical experience. No problem...the company will just pay for the
training.)

Patty Wagstaff strikes me as nothing less than a professional pilot by
virtue of the fact that she's still alive.

-c

[John E. Carty]

"Steven P. McNicoll" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
> "Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
> news:ELnQd.133$kS6.70@attbi_s52...
>>> Ah, yes. Pilot soft porn. What could be better.
>>
>> Hmmm. Plane & Pilot is the ONLY flying magazine we don't subscribe to
>> anymore.
>>
>> I may have to reconsider my choice!
>>
>> :-)
>>
>
> I had to examine a copy to see what the fuss was about. It's nothing.
>

Have to agree with you on this one. Even though Patty Wagstaff could
certainly make John's Tailwag, it certainly wouldn't be from seeing her
photo in the latest issue of Plane & Pilot :-)

[Montblack]

("William W. Plummer" wrote)
> But they're made of plastic.


They weren't back in the 50's and 60's!

I'm going with "spectacular."


Montblack

[Margy Natalie]

As far as I can tell, everyone except Patty likes the dark hair better.

Margy


Morgans wrote:

> "Bob Chilcoat" > wrote
>
> > Yeah, what Dudley said... and I don't even know her. Just respect her
> > tremendously and wish I was as good a pilot as she is.
> >
> > --
> > Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)
>
> Yea, but I still liked her dark hair 1,000% more than her blond hair. I
> wonder how many others feel the same.
> --
> Jim in NC