Club Procedures for Late Day XC Flights

[Roy B.]

Friends:
I am trying to learn more about how different clubs with active XC pilots flying privately owned gliders handle the problem of determining "Is everybody back safely?" - before everybody at the airport goes home.

In my club we frequently shut down training operations around 5:00 pm or so and the day's Duty Officer, the instructors and tow pilots will all leave, but we will often still have pilots out on course sometimes as late as 7:00 pm or later. Some pilots have landed back to find that they are the only ones at the airfield. It has happened to me several times.

It seems that there is a real risk of an accident happening on course and nobody realizing it until the next day, or a risk that somebody lands out safely but that fact is not communicated back to the airfield (with a lot of unnecessary worry and confusion).

I'm trying to come up with a procedure that makes sense for our club and so I was hoping people would share here how they try to solve this problem.

Thanks
Roy B.
GBSC Chief Pilot

[Tango Eight]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 9:42:00 AM UTC-4, Roy B. wrote:
> Friends:
> I am trying to learn more about how different clubs with active XC pilots flying privately owned gliders handle the problem of determining "Is everybody back safely?" - before everybody at the airport goes home.
>
> In my club we frequently shut down training operations around 5:00 pm or so and the day's Duty Officer, the instructors and tow pilots will all leave, but we will often still have pilots out on course sometimes as late as 7:00 pm or later. Some pilots have landed back to find that they are the only ones at the airfield. It has happened to me several times.
>
> It seems that there is a real risk of an accident happening on course and nobody realizing it until the next day, or a risk that somebody lands out safely but that fact is not communicated back to the airfield (with a lot of unnecessary worry and confusion).
>
> I'm trying to come up with a procedure that makes sense for our club and so I was hoping people would share here how they try to solve this problem.
>
> Thanks
> Roy B.
> GBSC Chief Pilot

New for 2018... we've suggested to our XC pilots that they adopt cell phone, spot or inreach tracking and we will have a screen set up in the clubhouse that shows live tracks. Most are opting for cell based solutions (glidetrack for iOS and IGCdroid for Android). This is extra important at Post Mills because most of our cell phones do not receive calls or txt at the airport (however cell based tracking works fine in the traffic pattern and beyond).

best,
Evan Ludeman / T8

[[email protected]]

Practically in our club the late-flying XC pilots buddy up with specific people (whether they are flying, on the field, or at home) to be on call as crew for a potential retrieve. I.e. it is not seen as a club procedure. When a few people fly on a weekday that's the necessary procedure, and after-hours on a weekend can be handled the same way. Although of course if the call comes in early enough on a weekend any club member present may volunteer to do the retrieve. Also the last people to leave the field while somebody is still in the air sometimes try and reach that pilot by radio.

As Evan said we've been debating the tracking issue at the club. My personal opinion is that cellphone-based tracking is fun and games but not a solution for the late-day retrieval nor much of a safety bonus. If somebody lands where there isn't cell service, then the tracking just stops somewhere and there is no way to know whether that pilot landed or not, is safe or not. If they land where there is cell service or a landline, they can simply call after landing. That worked in 1968 and still works 50 years later.

Since we have no cell service at the club's airfield, but do have WiFi, some cellphones can operate via the WiFi, others can use the Google Voice app for texting, and we also installed a WiFi-based "landline" phone in the clubhouse. Many club pilots also carry a SPOT or PLB device in case of a real emergency.

[[email protected]]

In years past on any given day in Prescott I would be the last one out and come back to an empty field. Not much of an issue as I have always flown with a Spot tracker and my significant other would be watching at home. But more recently we have grown the xc contingent and few hang around till I get back (Im still usually last) for post flight debriefing and disassembly. The radio in our winch can be heard and recieve up to 50 miles away and if I hear them shutting down Ill Ill call and update my position and ETA back. Cold beer in the cooler helps keep people there longer too :)

[Martin Gregorie[_6_]]

On Thu, 05 Apr 2018 06:41:58 -0700, Roy B. wrote:

> Friends:
> I am trying to learn more about how different clubs with active XC
> pilots flying privately owned gliders handle the problem of determining
> "Is everybody back safely?" - before everybody at the airport goes home.
>
> In my club we frequently shut down training operations around 5:00 pm or
> so and the day's Duty Officer, the instructors and tow pilots will all
> leave, but we will often still have pilots out on course sometimes as
> late as 7:00 pm or later. Some pilots have landed back to find that they
> are the only ones at the airfield. It has happened to me several times.
>
> It seems that there is a real risk of an accident happening on course
> and nobody realizing it until the next day, or a risk that somebody
> lands out safely but that fact is not communicated back to the airfield
> (with a lot of unnecessary worry and confusion).
>
> I'm trying to come up with a procedure that makes sense for our club and
> so I was hoping people would share here how they try to solve this
> problem.
>
We have a sheet at the launchpoint (UK club). Everybody planning on going
XC puts an entry on it giving glider ID, mobile number, planned task
(which may be 'local') and mobile number for their crew. This, in
conjunction with the launch point log, lets the duty instructor check
whether everybody is back at the end of the day and, if people aren't
back, where they were planning to go and their mobile number.

The club also has a dedicated landout number which anybody can answer if
the office has closed for the day.

In addition the club is on the OGN network. All club gliders and almost
all our private gliders carry FLARM, so we can easily see if they're
still flying.

While I realise that the OGN/FLARM part of this may not work outside
Europe and the UK, our paper procedure should work everywhere.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 9:42:00 AM UTC-4, Roy B. wrote:
> Friends:
> I am trying to learn more about how different clubs with active XC pilots flying privately owned gliders handle the problem of determining "Is everybody back safely?" - before everybody at the airport goes home.
>
> In my club we frequently shut down training operations around 5:00 pm or so and the day's Duty Officer, the instructors and tow pilots will all leave, but we will often still have pilots out on course sometimes as late as 7:00 pm or later. Some pilots have landed back to find that they are the only ones at the airfield. It has happened to me several times.
>
> It seems that there is a real risk of an accident happening on course and nobody realizing it until the next day, or a risk that somebody lands out safely but that fact is not communicated back to the airfield (with a lot of unnecessary worry and confusion).
>
> I'm trying to come up with a procedure that makes sense for our club and so I was hoping people would share here how they try to solve this problem.
>
> Thanks
> Roy B.
> GBSC Chief Pilot

We ask that our pilots make sure someone has an idea where they are going during the day. This can be by contact with ground or by radio to a tug or other pilot.
Late in the day we check by radio as to status. It is expected that one of the other XC pilots will stick around for take apart or fetch. This works most of the time.
If a pilot expects that there will be a tug for a retrieve, he must check in and request. Otherwise tug pilots leave at the end of ops.
Virtually all our pilots have Spot or other trackers.
FWIW
UH

[Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)]

Hahahahaha...ROTFLMAO........
Seriously, this method has worked well......so far. May be better ways.

Why do I LOL?

I did an early spring flight. In the air, I found we had a radio issue in my ship. Also no glide computer, etc. I guesstimated about 7 miles/thousand feet altitude (poor for a decent ASW-28, no real wind).
Fine while flying close to another club member maybe 15 miles from home.
Then we split.

I had no contact to anyone from then on for the most part.

Rule one, I have to have a way to get home if I land out......my problem. Maybe stay more local.
Rule two, "what would MacGuyver do"?

I found I could "just see a cell tower" coming up in bars, then (keeping my cellphone above the carbon cockpit) hit "send" to my son (at the airport) and say......"5k' over Sussex, heading to the gap".
This send thang took about 5 tries until I got a sent message.

No, not good, although plenty of fields and some airports if I had no reply.
Eventually got a reply.
Home knew where I was and goal.
I hit a forest fire late in the day, went to about 8K above the field a little over silver distance away.
Final glide was made, no drama.

They knew I was up, but, until my text, had no clue where. Last club member visual on me was about 90* to my last course.

Yes, give peeps an idea where you are.

I am not sure if our club is looking at changing procedures...... But, good suggestion.

[[email protected]]

A note about texting in an environment of iffy connections or cellphones that are sometimes turned off (or to "airplane mode"): When one finally receives the text message, the time stamp on it is when it was received. There is no indication of when it was sent. That could have been much earlier, and even if the message says "I'm still flying" that pilot may have landed out since. When composing such a message you may want to add a time stamp into the body of the message: "still flying at 1740".

[Tango Eight]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 11:22:53 AM UTC-4, wrote:

> As Evan said we've been debating the tracking issue at the club. My personal opinion is that cellphone-based tracking is fun and games but not a solution for the late-day retrieval nor much of a safety bonus. If somebody lands where there isn't cell service, then the tracking just stops somewhere and there is no way to know whether that pilot landed or not, is safe or not.


At 7pm (or any other time), you'll see one of three things from a cell phone track, a) a track still being laid down, b) a track that stopped for some reason at near ground level, c) a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude. There is useful information here in all three cases.


-Evan / T8

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 1:10:39 PM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 11:22:53 AM UTC-4, wrote:
>
> > As Evan said we've been debating the tracking issue at the club. My personal opinion is that cellphone-based tracking is fun and games but not a solution for the late-day retrieval nor much of a safety bonus. If somebody lands where there isn't cell service, then the tracking just stops somewhere and there is no way to know whether that pilot landed or not, is safe or not.
>
>
> At 7pm (or any other time), you'll see one of three things from a cell phone track, a) a track still being laid down, b) a track that stopped for some reason at near ground level, c) a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude. There is useful information here in all three cases.
>
>
> -Evan / T8

Case "C" ("a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude") may mean: glider entered an area with no cellphone coverage even at higher altitudes. Or, maybe the glider descended too low for cellphone coverage in that area, and is currently on the ground - or working on a low save. Or, it may mean that the battery in the cellphone died. Or the app crashed (not the glider). Or the cellphone slipped under the pilot and lost GPS signal. In short, not a lot more info than having no tracking at all.

[Tango Eight]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 1:33:35 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 1:10:39 PM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> > On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 11:22:53 AM UTC-4, wrote:
> >
> > > As Evan said we've been debating the tracking issue at the club. My personal opinion is that cellphone-based tracking is fun and games but not a solution for the late-day retrieval nor much of a safety bonus. If somebody lands where there isn't cell service, then the tracking just stops somewhere and there is no way to know whether that pilot landed or not, is safe or not.
> >
> >
> > At 7pm (or any other time), you'll see one of three things from a cell phone track, a) a track still being laid down, b) a track that stopped for some reason at near ground level, c) a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude. There is useful information here in all three cases.
> >
> >
> > -Evan / T8
>
> Case "C" ("a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude") may mean: glider entered an area with no cellphone coverage even at higher altitudes. Or, maybe the glider descended too low for cellphone coverage in that area, and is currently on the ground - or working on a low save. Or, it may mean that the battery in the cellphone died. Or the app crashed (not the glider). Or the cellphone slipped under the pilot and lost GPS signal. In short, not a lot more info than having no tracking at all.

True. So what? Case C turns out to be rare in practice. But the additional point is that case C clearly indicates a system failure, not cause for immediate concern. That's preferable to the Spot failure I had over the boonies at the Canadian border.

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 2:12:57 PM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 1:33:35 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 1:10:39 PM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> > > At 7pm (or any other time), you'll see one of three things from a cell phone track, a) a track still being laid down, b) a track that stopped for some reason at near ground level, c) a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude. There is useful information here in all three cases.
> > >
> > >
> > > -Evan / T8
> >
> > Case "C" ("a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude") may mean: glider entered an area with no cellphone coverage even at higher altitudes. Or, maybe the glider descended too low for cellphone coverage in that area, and is currently on the ground - or working on a low save. Or, it may mean that the battery in the cellphone died. Or the app crashed (not the glider). Or the cellphone slipped under the pilot and lost GPS signal. In short, not a lot more info than having no tracking at all.
>
> True. So what? Case C turns out to be rare in practice. But the additional point is that case C clearly indicates a system failure, not cause for immediate concern. That's preferable to the Spot failure I had over the boonies at the Canadian border.

Not all the possible meanings of "case C" are a system failure.

Also, Case A ("a track still being laid down") doesn't tell you whether the pilot WILL land out later - which may or may not be reported later as a "Case B" - or a phone call. And Case B ("a track that stopped for some reason at near ground level") doesn't tell you whether the pilot is safe, and where exactly he is, and how to get there. Lacking post-landing communications you're always left in the semi-dark as to the real situation. I agree that in the bad case of an unsafe landing a "case B" truncated track might help search and rescue to some extent.

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 9:42:00 AM UTC-4, Roy B. wrote:
> Friends:
> I am trying to learn more about how different clubs with active XC pilots flying privately owned gliders handle the problem of determining "Is everybody back safely?" - before everybody at the airport goes home.
>
> In my club we frequently shut down training operations around 5:00 pm or so and the day's Duty Officer, the instructors and tow pilots will all leave, but we will often still have pilots out on course sometimes as late as 7:00 pm or later. Some pilots have landed back to find that they are the only ones at the airfield. It has happened to me several times.
>
> It seems that there is a real risk of an accident happening on course and nobody realizing it until the next day, or a risk that somebody lands out safely but that fact is not communicated back to the airfield (with a lot of unnecessary worry and confusion).
>
> I'm trying to come up with a procedure that makes sense for our club and so I was hoping people would share here how they try to solve this problem.
>
> Thanks
> Roy B.
> GBSC Chief Pilot

The Aero Club Albatross drinking club sticks around while there is still flying going on. They keep drinking until the last pilot is down (and long thereafter).

The longer the last pilot is up, the bigger their challenge! They've never complained about my routine late landings, sometimes at sunset.

As such, there's always people around at Blairstown Airport. And then everyone goes out and gets dinner after a nice soaring day.

This is why a healthy social culture at a club is really important.

All the best,
Daniel

[Tango Eight]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 2:49:06 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 2:12:57 PM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> > On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 1:33:35 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> > > On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 1:10:39 PM UTC-4, Tango Eight wrote:
> > > > At 7pm (or any other time), you'll see one of three things from a cell phone track, a) a track still being laid down, b) a track that stopped for some reason at near ground level, c) a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude. There is useful information here in all three cases.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -Evan / T8
> > >
> > > Case "C" ("a track that stopped for some reason at some much higher altitude") may mean: glider entered an area with no cellphone coverage even at higher altitudes. Or, maybe the glider descended too low for cellphone coverage in that area, and is currently on the ground - or working on a low save. Or, it may mean that the battery in the cellphone died. Or the app crashed (not the glider). Or the cellphone slipped under the pilot and lost GPS signal. In short, not a lot more info than having no tracking at all.
> >
> > True. So what? Case C turns out to be rare in practice. But the additional point is that case C clearly indicates a system failure, not cause for immediate concern. That's preferable to the Spot failure I had over the boonies at the Canadian border.
>
> Not all the possible meanings of "case C" are a system failure.
>
> Also, Case A ("a track still being laid down") doesn't tell you whether the pilot WILL land out later - which may or may not be reported later as a "Case B" - or a phone call. And Case B ("a track that stopped for some reason at near ground level") doesn't tell you whether the pilot is safe, and where exactly he is, and how to get there. Lacking post-landing communications you're always left in the semi-dark as to the real situation. I agree that in the bad case of an unsafe landing a "case B" truncated track might help search and rescue to some extent.

We'll let you know when the tracking apps start accurately predicting the future and auto generating crew instructions.

[Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)]

Not disagreeing with you (assuming your post was directed at me.....).
I stated it was not the best.

Just saying our normal club method works, but may need improvement.
Also stated what I did "once" since the radio check was fine on the ground within a few hundred feet. Didn't know I had an issue until later in the flight.
I figured whatever I could send (via text) to give a general direction/flight plan was better than nothing.

I do believe I covered my bases in my first post. What I did, why I did it, why it was not the best, why our club may need to do something else.

I won't even go into a Friday flight way over trees (almost last leg, Sullivan County airport to CherryRidge, then home) with no crew on the ground, nobody (other than the two of us) on the ground having a clue where we had been, where we were going. Good thing we made it back home.
This way before trackers, I believe before cellphones you could fit in a large pocket.

Some on here will know the area......the crap some of us did way back when..........

[kirk.stant]

If a club member (even in his own plane) is still flying and unaccounted for, I think it is absolutely unacceptable for the club operations to shut down. That's why you join (and pay for) a club!

At our club, the "hard core" hangs around until the last ship is down or retrieved. Tracking is via Spot or Cell or radio calls. We more commonly do aero retrieves, so a tow plane and pilot will be ready until we are sure they are not needed (then, and only then, do we open the beer cooler).

The club I was a member of (for 3 months) before joining this one did not have that philosophy. After they asked me to come back and land on a windy but perfectly good XC day - around 2pm! - because they couldn't stay up and were all about to go home, I quit and moved to a much more accommodating operation. And haven't regretted it a minute. My wife/crew was surprised I lasted that long!

Kirk
66

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 5:17:26 PM UTC-4, kirk.stant wrote:
> If a club member (even in his own plane) is still flying and unaccounted for, I think it is absolutely unacceptable for the club operations to shut down. That's why you join (and pay for) a club!
>
> At our club, the "hard core" hangs around until the last ship is down or retrieved. Tracking is via Spot or Cell or radio calls. We more commonly do aero retrieves, so a tow plane and pilot will be ready until we are sure they are not needed (then, and only then, do we open the beer cooler).
>
> The club I was a member of (for 3 months) before joining this one did not have that philosophy. After they asked me to come back and land on a windy but perfectly good XC day - around 2pm! - because they couldn't stay up and were all about to go home, I quit and moved to a much more accommodating operation. And haven't regretted it a minute. My wife/crew was surprised I lasted that long!
>
> Kirk
> 66

The club wanted you down early so they can go home? Wow, that's amazing, Kirk.

Despite what I said above about it being the responsibility of "buddies" and not the club as a whole, it is generally the case in our club too that the "hard core" stick around until everybody's back home and de-rigged. But we don't have any firm "procedures" for that, AFAIK. At this point we have so many members with private gliders that on a good XC day there are usually several members flying XC, and some of those are the "hard core" that wait around. It wasn't always like that.

[George Haeh]

Seeyou, XCSoar and TopHat can Bluetooth to your phone which then sends
location updates to Livetrack24 and other soaring websites. It helps to
have an
auxiliary battery for the phone.

That's basically the backup to my PLB if I'm not able to get it out of my
pocket
and activate it.

Our last radio issue was that the club could hear me from ten miles away,
but I
couldn't hear them, even though I could hear another club 80 miles away in
the
same direction.

As for retrieves, I've found radio calls on the club frequency work quite
well. If
the lift is good enough to get you that far away, there's often other
pilots not
that far away who can hear you and get word to the club.

A couple times I've bummed a ride back from a local.

[SoaringXCellence]

Our club normally has an Opps Officer assigned each day, The normal club policy its to have the OO stay at the field, or find a substitute, until all the pilots are accounted for.

We also have a number of members that live very close to the field, less than a mile, and they often will take over if the OO has to leave before everyone is home, or a retrieve is in progress.

[[email protected]]

IIRC, back more than a few years ago when we had no tracking systems or cell phones We had a fairly new pilot trying for a gold distance flight out of Turf, while the rest of us were flying a racing task of around 200 miles. After landing everyone back except the newbie. we tied down and started the debriefing. Looking around we saw his wife sitting in the car waiting on him. It was very close to dark and we were getting worried, so the decision was made and straws drawn as to who was going to call flight service and report our missing pilot. The side of the conversation I heard went something like this. "Hi this Alan ------, Im calling to report a missing glider and pilot, what say again, yes yes thats the pilot, good, he is safe at Indian Hills, we will send his crew. Thank you very much" Turns out that as soon as he landed he switched to 121.5 and called a airliner passing overhead and they relayed back to Flight service his name and N number and location so that when we called to report him missing they had the info. Something I have never had to do, but ingenious just the same :)

[[email protected]]

Apps just need to figure out where the flight is going to end and order pizza that arrives at the field same time as the glider. Enter your task and toppings and go fly.

[Tom BravoMike]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 7:29:48 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> IIRC, back more than a few years ago when we had no tracking systems or cell phones We had a fairly new pilot trying for a gold distance flight out of Turf, while the rest of us were flying a racing task of around 200 miles.. After landing everyone back except the newbie. we tied down and started the debriefing. Looking around we saw his wife sitting in the car waiting on him. It was very close to dark and we were getting worried, so the decision was made and straws drawn as to who was going to call flight service and report our missing pilot. The side of the conversation I heard went something like this. "Hi this Alan ------, Im calling to report a missing glider and pilot, what say again, yes yes thats the pilot, good, he is safe at Indian Hills, we will send his crew. Thank you very much" Turns out that as soon as he landed he switched to 121.5 and called a airliner passing overhead and they relayed back to Flight service his name and N number and location so that when we called to report him missing they had the info. Something I have never had to do, but ingenious just the same :)

That's exactly what we were taught to do years ago (basically before cellphone era), and we actually did take advantage of airliner pilots in relaying our messages after outlanding when necessary. Many of them were/are glider pilots themselves, after all.

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 9:01:58 PM UTC-4, Tom BravoMike wrote:
> On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 7:29:48 PM UTC-5, wrote:
> > IIRC, back more than a few years ago when we had no tracking systems or cell phones We had a fairly new pilot trying for a gold distance flight out of Turf, while the rest of us were flying a racing task of around 200 miles. After landing everyone back except the newbie. we tied down and started the debriefing. Looking around we saw his wife sitting in the car waiting on him. It was very close to dark and we were getting worried, so the decision was made and straws drawn as to who was going to call flight service and report our missing pilot. The side of the conversation I heard went something like this. "Hi this Alan ------, Im calling to report a missing glider and pilot, what say again, yes yes thats the pilot, good, he is safe at Indian Hills, we will send his crew. Thank you very much" Turns out that as soon as he landed he switched to 121.5 and called a airliner passing overhead and they relayed back to Flight service his name and N number and location so that when we called to report him missing they had the info. Something I have never had to do, but ingenious just the same :)
>
> That's exactly what we were taught to do years ago (basically before cellphone era), and we actually did take advantage of airliner pilots in relaying our messages after outlanding when necessary. Many of them were/are glider pilots themselves, after all.

And even now that's an option to keep in mind if you land where there is no cellphone coverage nor a friendly farmer's landline. Just because we have newer technologies does not mean the old ones no longer work.

[Burt Compton - Marfa Gliders, west Texas]

At Marfa Gliders in southwest Texas, every pilot has to bring a dedicated crew. (Watch "The Sun Ship Game" filmed at the 1969 contest at Marfa to see effective old school crewing.) A crew that is hooked up to the trailer ready to hit the road late in the day towards the last known quadrant. Poor cell coverage around here and very few suitable landout places. The ranch strips depicted on the El Paso aero chart are usually too narrow. The high mountains surrounding the Marfa plateau may block a radio call from a low sailplane working the rocks.

Some pilots land after sunset which is only permitted if you turn on your position lights at sunset. That's when you gotta have lights by the regs in the USA. No heartburn from me, just sayin'.

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, April 5, 2018 at 9:42:00 AM UTC-4, Roy B. wrote:
> Friends:
> I am trying to learn more about how different clubs with active XC pilots flying privately owned gliders handle the problem of determining "Is everybody back safely?" - before everybody at the airport goes home.
>
> In my club we frequently shut down training operations around 5:00 pm or so and the day's Duty Officer, the instructors and tow pilots will all leave, but we will often still have pilots out on course sometimes as late as 7:00 pm or later. Some pilots have landed back to find that they are the only ones at the airfield. It has happened to me several times.
>
> It seems that there is a real risk of an accident happening on course and nobody realizing it until the next day, or a risk that somebody lands out safely but that fact is not communicated back to the airfield (with a lot of unnecessary worry and confusion).
>
> I'm trying to come up with a procedure that makes sense for our club and so I was hoping people would share here how they try to solve this problem.
>
> Thanks
> Roy B.
> GBSC Chief Pilot

Burt, most of the guys today do not remember the old ground crews of the past. Remember chasing the glider with the radio on trying to stay one stop ahead.

[Tony[_5_]]

We use tow tickets at KSA, so if there's any question I just look through the tickets in the towplane to see who took a tow, and compare with visual observation of who's not back.

I really don't like leaving the field until everyone's accounted for.

[Burt Compton - Marfa Gliders, west Texas]

Those were good times as the crews had a wonderful social bond. Getting out ahead of your pilot or driving to the center of the day's triangle task to meet on a hill for better radio reception. The sought for ideal was a place on a hill to accommodate the crew trailers, with trees for shade, by a Dairy Queen! The spring-fed natural pool at Balmorhea Park north of Marfa and the Davis Mountains was a favorite crew & trailer rendezvous. Being at the landing site to catch our pilot's wingtip and hand him a cool beverage.

Serious crewing is an aspect of soaring that somehow faded away. We rarely stayed on the airport because restarts were permitted if you landed out early in the day. On a hot summer day it was cooler in the freon charged air-conditioned 1966 Plymouth station wagon when out on the road.

Listening for a radio call from your pilot using secret codes (and secret frequencies) as to his location and altitude. Speeding off to be there if he landed off-airport. Once I was on site to stand on the only tree stump in a distant field while 6 sailplanes landed, knowing that I was marking the stump.

Another important crew person duty was preparing the sailplane early in the day since many pilots preferred to de-rig into the trailer at night. The crew (often two) would be busy assembling and cleaning it, stocking it with water and apples, filling the oxygen tank, while your pilot rested alone in the quiet of the air-conditioned crew car, studying the task (on paper back then) along with the aero chart, marking it with course lines and final glide circles.

I got pretty good at being a professional crew person, getting paid for my work and accommodations. Learned so much while crewing, listening to the pilots discussing their flights around the hotel pool in the evening. The late great Johnny Byrd would volunteer to crew at the World's if he didn't qualify as a pilot on the US Team, so he could listen, watch and learn from the other world-class pilots.

Nothing is preventing a pilot from having a dedicated crew these days . . . a fellow club member, a partner in the sailplane, a youngster with a drivers license motivated to learn cross-country soaring . . .

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

On Friday, April 6, 2018 at 7:29:13 AM UTC-5, Tony wrote:
> We use tow tickets at KSA, so if there's any question I just look through the tickets in the towplane to see who took a tow, and compare with visual observation of who's not back.
>
> I really don't like leaving the field until everyone's accounted for.

And like most places, there is a central place where all wing and tail dollies are deposited after launch. If there is something still there, someone is still out. If you put all your stuff back in your car, park your car where it will certainly be noticed by those that are still there.

And, thank you for sticking around for some of my late returns, Tony! I don't like to leave until everyone is back, either. I have been on a few sunset and after retrieves of others, too.

Steve Leonard

[Jonathan St. Cloud]

Ah, the drinking club that sounds like every Yacht Club I have ever visited or been a member of!

[Tony[_5_]]

That might be the only thing that ACA has in common with a Yacht Club...

[Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot)]

Fitch and others during liars dice?!?!
Could be.

[[email protected]]

Roy,

I run into this often here in Alaska. So when I'm soaring on Wednesday alone. I file an FAA VFR flight plan and make position reports on the RCO's. Kinda old school.

I know they are watching out for me when I get the phone call....Are you planning to close your flight plan? : )

Jeff

[WaltWX[_2_]]

In recent years (5-10 years or so), I've taken up this habit when flying cross country away from my home field, Mountain Valley Airport, Tehachapi, CA. First I try to arrange a "back up crew" before take off. But, since I have a lot of friends on the airport I do this.

Fill out a 3x5 card with my name, aircraft N number, call sign, emergency contacts, backup crew and mobile numbers, flight intentions. For the last 10-15 years, I also carry a Satellite tracker (latest one is a Garmin InReach) with the shared web link that is also on the 3x5 card.

So if I don't come back and the inevitable "... what happened to "WX"..." comes up, people on the airport will find my car keys in the console (trailer hooked up) with a 3x6 card prominently displayed.

Walt Rogers WX

[Blue Whale]

I belong to the same club as Roy (GBSC) and I think the issue is not so much what the policy should be (pretty obvious that one or two of the duty crew must stay until all are accounted for), but rather that the club just hasn't articulated the need for that. On any given day most of the duty crew are not x-country pilots, they are students, juniors, or entry-level pilots, with the exception of the duty field officer in charge. So, let the crew go home and make the rule simple, "the duty officer, or a qualified designee, stays until the last ship is accounted for."

[Nick Kennedy]

I think Walts WX, procedure is a good one, and I think I'm going to start doing the same thing.
Simple, easy to do and all the info you need in one spot.
Remember to leave you vehicle with a full tank of full also helps.