Club Class gliders and Handicaps in Polish Nationals June 2018

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This interesting list shows what gliders will fly in Polish Nationals, Club Class, Leszno, Poland, June 8-16, 2018
http://www.aeroklub.leszno.pl/zawody/index.php/lista-zawodnikow/

Handicap table
http://www.aeroklub.leszno.pl/zawody/download/Tabela%20wspolczynnikow%20klub%20A%20-%202018.pdf

Andre

[Dan Daly[_2_]]

On Tuesday, May 8, 2018 at 6:54:57 PM UTC-4, wrote:
> This interesting list shows what gliders will fly in Polish Nationals, Club Class, Leszno, Poland, June 8-16, 2018
> http://www.aeroklub.leszno.pl/zawody/index.php/lista-zawodnikow/
>
> Handicap table
> http://www.aeroklub.leszno.pl/zawody/download/Tabela%20wspolczynnikow%20klub%20A%20-%202018.pdf
>
> Andre

The FAI Club classs list is at https://www.fai.org/sites/default/files/sc3ah_2018a.pdf . A lot of changes; SZD-55 and ASW-24 used to have the same handicap if I recall correctly.

Interesting that Poland has Club A and B; I guess it makes it more fair to have a closer range of gliders to race against.

[Paul T[_4_]]

>
>The FAI Club classs list is at
>https://www.fai.org/sites/default/files/sc3ah_2018a.pdf .

The new 'silly list' designed by guys with no common sense- based on
some asinine theory which ignores 20-30 years of RL competition
performance comparison.

Are they really still using this handicap list for the Worlds? Better get

an SZD55 if you want to win then..... - notice the Poles have, and are
not flying the usual Brawo/Jantar Std 3. Wouldn't want to be flying a
Mosqiuto though.

[Paul T[_4_]]

At 14:44 09 May 2018, Paul T wrote:
>
>>
>>The FAI Club classs list is at
>>https://www.fai.org/sites/default/files/sc3ah_2018a.pdf .
>
>The new 'silly list' designed by guys with no common sense- based on
>some asinine theory which ignores 20-30 years of RL competition
>performance comparison.
>
> Are they really still using this handicap list for the Worlds? Better ge
>
>an SZD55 if you want to win then..... - notice the Poles have, and are
>not flying the usual Brawo/Jantar Std 3. Wouldn't want to be flying a
>Mosqiuto though.
>
>
>

P.S. a SZD55 in good condition can p.ss all over a Discus.

[krasw]

On Wednesday, 9 May 2018 17:45:07 UTC+3, Paul T wrote:
> >
> >The FAI Club classs list is at
> >https://www.fai.org/sites/default/files/sc3ah_2018a.pdf .
>
> The new 'silly list' designed by guys with no common sense- based on
> some asinine theory which ignores 20-30 years of RL competition
> performance comparison.
>
> Are they really still using this handicap list for the Worlds? Better get
>
> an SZD55 if you want to win then..... - notice the Poles have, and are
> not flying the usual Brawo/Jantar Std 3. Wouldn't want to be flying a
> Mosqiuto though.

AFAIK at least one other team chose to change their gliders to 55's.

[ASM]

I saw a ****load of Jantar 2’s and 3’s on the list of competitors.

[krasw]

On Wednesday, 9 May 2018 18:00:07 UTC+3, Paul T wrote:
> At 14:44 09 May 2018, Paul T wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>The FAI Club classs list is at
> >>https://www.fai.org/sites/default/files/sc3ah_2018a.pdf .
> >
> >The new 'silly list' designed by guys with no common sense- based on
> >some asinine theory which ignores 20-30 years of RL competition
> >performance comparison.
> >
> > Are they really still using this handicap list for the Worlds? Better ge
> >
> >an SZD55 if you want to win then..... - notice the Poles have, and are
> >not flying the usual Brawo/Jantar Std 3. Wouldn't want to be flying a
> >Mosqiuto though.
> >
> >
> >
>
> P.S. a SZD55 in good condition can p.ss all over a Discus.

I have flown Discus in a team with friend flying 55 (several nationals + international comps). We found out that when gliders have no bugs, Discus has very small advantage, but during day 55 goes better and better (we did not have bug wipers those times). When it started to rain, 55 disappeared forward and up, Discus did not stand a chance. But to be honest, 95% of the time there was no difference between gliders. When flown dry 55 suffers a bit from very low empty weight (at least those first gliders from early 90's), it climbs like a balloon but I think 30-40 kg of water is needed unless you just try to stay airborne.

[Paul T[_4_]]

At 04:04 12 May 2018, ASM wrote:
>I saw a ****load of Jantar 2=E2=80=99s and 3=E2=80=99s on the
list of
>compe=
>titors.
>

For the Polish Nationals? To be expected.
For the Worlds - 3 listed at the moment - usually a lot more.
Anyway does not take away from the handicapping discrepancies in the
'new' FAI list.

[[email protected]]

For South African club class competitions, there are three handicap lists depending on the strength of the day. The strength (weak, intermediate or strong) and which list is applied depends on the speeds of the winning gliders. For example, the system recognises that on week days and slower speeds, there is little difference between a Std Class and 15m Class glider. As the speeds go up - the advantage of having flaps increases and so the handicap for the 15m gliders increases relatively to the Std gliders. It's an attempt to try get a very broad range of gliders to compete with some sort of fairness in a wide range of conditions. No handicap system will have all the pilots happy - but least the South African approach does take cognesence of the fact that the conditions of the particular day may favour one glider over another.