stowing horizontal stabilizer on tail boom in trailer

[[email protected]]

I have seen a glider trailer in which the aircraft's horizontal stabilizer is strapped to the glider's tail boom for storage and transport. I can't recall where I saw this, and a google image search did not yield any hits.

At any rate, strapping the horizontal stabilizer to the tail boom is one solution I am investigating as my partner and I work to retrofit a new tube trailer to our DG-101. It seems to me that this could be a storage configuration that would not require the awkward stooped climb-and-carry maneuver that is required if the stabilizer is attached to the roof of the trailer.

I am seeking advice on whether this is generally a good idea and if there is a commercial product we could use.

Matt

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, September 6, 2018 at 10:14:01 AM UTC-4, wrote:
> I have seen a glider trailer in which the aircraft's horizontal stabilizer is strapped to the glider's tail boom for storage and transport. I can't recall where I saw this, and a google image search did not yield any hits.
>
> At any rate, strapping the horizontal stabilizer to the tail boom is one solution I am investigating as my partner and I work to retrofit a new tube trailer to our DG-101. It seems to me that this could be a storage configuration that would not require the awkward stooped climb-and-carry maneuver that is required if the stabilizer is attached to the roof of the trailer.
>
> I am seeking advice on whether this is generally a good idea and if there is a commercial product we could use.
>
> Matt

Most of the trailers like yours use a saddle assembly that slides into the trailer and is secured to the floor of the trailer. My experience is that this is less awkward than the aft fuselage type carrier. I have owned trailers with both types.
UH

[[email protected]]

We have that, but our stabilizer is thicker and much more strongly swept than the one that this piece was designed to hold. It might be possible to modify it with effort, but it looks like it would be quite involved.

Alternatively, if anyone has such an item that would more closely conform to the DG-101's stabilizer shape, please let me know!

Matt


> Most of the trailers like yours use a saddle assembly that slides into the trailer and is secured to the floor of the trailer. My experience is that this is less awkward than the aft fuselage type carrier. I have owned trailers with both types.
> UH

[Mike C]

On Thursday, September 6, 2018 at 8:14:01 AM UTC-6, wrote:
> I have seen a glider trailer in which the aircraft's horizontal stabilizer is strapped to the glider's tail boom for storage and transport. I can't recall where I saw this, and a google image search did not yield any hits.
>
> At any rate, strapping the horizontal stabilizer to the tail boom is one solution I am investigating as my partner and I work to retrofit a new tube trailer to our DG-101. It seems to me that this could be a storage configuration that would not require the awkward stooped climb-and-carry maneuver that is required if the stabilizer is attached to the roof of the trailer.
>
> I am seeking advice on whether this is generally a good idea and if there is a commercial product we could use.
>
> Matt

My DG100 had that setup and it worked well. The trailer and hor stab carrier were both homemade. If you search the FAA database and find the current owner of
N9994F maybe you could get some photos to fabricate one.

Mike

[[email protected]]

By the way, a scale drawing of the -101 can be found on John DeRosa's website here:
http://aviation.derosaweb.net/dg101/documentation/Scale_Drawing_DG-100.jpg

There are two different stabilizers shown in that picture; ours is the one on the left. Our -101 does not have the all-flying tail that the earlier DG-100s had.

Matt

> Alternatively, if anyone has such an item that would more closely conform to the DG-101's stabilizer shape, please let me know!

[[email protected]]

I have this set up on my Pegasus. I'm pretty sure the saddle is custom made as the stab is very snug in it and the saddle fits the boom and wing fairings precisely. It works well. I can get you photos if you like but I won't be at the airport for a couple of weeks, at least.

[[email protected]]

On Thursday, September 6, 2018 at 10:59:45 AM UTC-4, wrote:
> I have this set up on my Pegasus. I'm pretty sure the saddle is custom made as the stab is very snug in it and the saddle fits the boom and wing fairings precisely. It works well. I can get you photos if you like but I won't be at the airport for a couple of weeks, at least.

Photos would be helpful and much appreciated. Please send them to mmcbee at gmail dot com. Thanks!
Matt

[C-FFKQ (42)]

My Kestrel uses a saddle that straps onto the tail boom and is kept from rotating by a section that goes up the fin.

The horizontal stab fits into a full cuff at one end and an open cuff at the other, held in by bungee cord.

If I can get at the ship in the next day or so -- and remember -- I'll take pictures and forward them to you.

[Per Carlin]

When you are making the saddle to be strapped on the boom, also include a handle that allows you to pull the glider out of the trailer without you crawling into the trailer, it will cost you some hours in manufacturing once and it will save your back for the next 10 years. It can be as simple as a fitted tube that extends beyond the fin

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

On Thursday, September 6, 2018 at 7:44:09 PM UTC-5, C-FFKQ (42) wrote:
> My Kestrel uses a saddle that straps onto the tail boom and is kept from rotating by a section that goes up the fin.
>
> The horizontal stab fits into a full cuff at one end and an open cuff at the other, held in by bungee cord.
>
> If I can get at the ship in the next day or so -- and remember -- I'll take pictures and forward them to you.

Or, you can go to the Wings and Wheels classifieds, look in the "recently sold" for the Slingsby T59 Kestrel and see the cuff.

https://wingsandwheels.com/classifieds/?m=sold

Sorry, I can't pull it up by itself any more. It is on the first page, though. Can't miss it.

Steve Leonard

[C-FFKQ (42)]

Pictures of my boom-mounted stab.:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7vnlgujvtjvadwm/AADb_ZrAQlq0Irl4jO-itjlIa?dl=0

[Frank Whiteley]

On Friday, September 7, 2018 at 8:43:22 AM UTC-6, Steve Leonard wrote:
> On Thursday, September 6, 2018 at 7:44:09 PM UTC-5, C-FFKQ (42) wrote:
> > My Kestrel uses a saddle that straps onto the tail boom and is kept from rotating by a section that goes up the fin.
> >
> > The horizontal stab fits into a full cuff at one end and an open cuff at the other, held in by bungee cord.
> >
> > If I can get at the ship in the next day or so -- and remember -- I'll take pictures and forward them to you.
>
> Or, you can go to the Wings and Wheels classifieds, look in the "recently sold" for the Slingsby T59 Kestrel and see the cuff.
>
> https://wingsandwheels.com/classifieds/?m=sold
>
> Sorry, I can't pull it up by itself any more. It is on the first page, though. Can't miss it.
>
> Steve Leonard

That cuff design needs to be secured to the trailer floor also to keep it from sliding forward during stops. As displayed, that strap will not keep it from sliding forward and rolling to the weighted side, which is likely to damage the trim (anti-balance) tab.

Frank Whiteley

[Martin Gregorie[_6_]]

On Sun, 09 Sep 2018 09:20:28 -0700, C-FFKQ (42) wrote:

> Pictures of my boom-mounted stab.:
> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7vnlgujvtjvadwm/AADb_ZrAQlq0Irl4jO-itjlIa?
dl=0

Disclaimer: I don't use a boom mount - my Libelle's stab is carried in a
frame made of square steel tube and mounted on the trailer floor, but
there are a number of boom-mounts round my club - and they all look more
like an extension of the tail dolly, i.e. they close round the tail boom
immediately in front of the fin, can't jump off the boom or slide forward
along it.

So, if I was making the sort of tailplane mount you want, I'd start by
making or buying a tail dolly kit and modifying that.


--
Martin | martin at
Gregorie | gregorie dot org

[[email protected]]

On Sunday, September 9, 2018 at 12:20:30 PM UTC-4, C-FFKQ (42) wrote:
> Pictures of my boom-mounted stab.:
> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7vnlgujvtjvadwm/AADb_ZrAQlq0Irl4jO-itjlIa?dl=0


Thanks for those pics. What material is it made from?

Matt

[Steve Leonard[_2_]]

On Wednesday, September 12, 2018 at 9:29:35 AM UTC-5, wrote:
> On Sunday, September 9, 2018 at 12:20:30 PM UTC-4, C-FFKQ (42) wrote:
> > Pictures of my boom-mounted stab.:
> > https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7vnlgujvtjvadwm/AADb_ZrAQlq0Irl4jO-itjlIa?dl=0
>
>
> Thanks for those pics. What material is it made from?
>
> Matt

Pretty sure mine is polyester and fiberglass mat.

Steve Leonard

[C-FFKQ (42)]

On Wednesday, 12 September 2018 10:29:35 UTC-4, wrote:
> On Sunday, September 9, 2018 at 12:20:30 PM UTC-4, C-FFKQ (42) wrote:
> > Pictures of my boom-mounted stab.:
> > https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7vnlgujvtjvadwm/AADb_ZrAQlq0Irl4jO-itjlIa?dl=0
>
>
> Thanks for those pics. What material is it made from?
>
> Matt

Looks like run-of-the-mill GRP to me. Nice felt liner material to not scratch the gelcoat and bungee to secure it around the boom.

Someone earlier mentioned a possible problem of the cuff moving forward and then tipping on it's side. Can't easily happen as my boom is tapered and so the cuff doesn't slide forward. The rear support overlaps the fin a bit so it won't rotate.

[[email protected]]

We've had a few club trailers with this setup - much like the Kestrel picture functionally but made of two wood pieces with felt pads connected to each other by square section steel tube and strapped to the fuselage. The fuselage taper prevents the saddle from sliding. They work but I've never found it to be a desirable setup myself. Even in the box trailer my ship came in I found it much easier to use the hanging-from-the-ceiling type stowage the builder installed. I found the horizontal stabilizer both added weight to the tail when moving the fuselage out of or into the trailer and made it more awkward to get a grip on it. It does have the advantage over most mount-to-the-floor holders in that you don't need to remove it from the trailer and secure it somewhere before taking the fuselage out though. None of those club trailers were tall enough inside to use the overhead mount for the horizontal stabilizer though. We do have a privately owned Phoebus C at the field in a box trailer where the horizontal stabilizer sits in a floor mounted bracket to the left of the left wing and doesn't need to be taken out before the fuselage and wings - really convenient but unfortunately impossible on most box trailers I've seen due to lack of space.

[Charlie Quebec]

Hanging the tail plane near the top of a trailer can cause excess heat to,damage surface in hot environments.
Ive seen a tailplane that had severe gel coat damage on the surface nearest the top of the trailer, despite no signs of failure on any other part of the glider.

[Dan Marotta]

Coincidence, perhaps?

Cobra and Komet trailers have been carrying the horizontal stabilizer
attached to the underside of the top for as long as I can reall (the
mid-80s).Â* I've never seen the damage you described.

On 9/18/2018 6:13 PM, Charlie Quebec wrote:
> Hanging the tail plane near the top of a trailer can cause excess heat to,damage surface in hot environments.
> Ive seen a tailplane that had severe gel coat damage on the surface nearest the top of the trailer, despite no signs of failure on any other part of the glider.

--
Dan, 5J

[[email protected]]

On Wednesday, September 19, 2018 at 10:14:23 AM UTC-4, Dan Marotta wrote:
> Coincidence, perhaps?
>
> Cobra and Komet trailers have been carrying the horizontal stabilizer
> attached to the underside of the top for as long as I can reall (the
> mid-80s).Â* I've never seen the damage you described.

Mid 70s for me. Yeah, there must be thousands of trailers with the horizontal stab up against the top. I suspect UV was a big contributor. Early trailers didn't include a layer said to specifically block UV. The stab was often the first to go. The second area to craze was often the top of the fuselage behind the canopy: i.e., a big flattish area exposed to UV penetrating the trailer. Obviously other factors were at work (e.g., moisture, stress cracking of the brittle gel coat layer) since the underside of the wings also showed damage eventually.

Chip Bearden

[Charlie Quebec]

If you have a glass top trailer you won’t. The normal home built aluminium type commonly seen here in Oz, where
the glider has been stored for a couple of years with the tailplane within an inch of the metal......

[Dan Marotta]

Aha!Â* You're talking /_heat_/.Â* No argument there.Â* I thought you were
talking /_UV_/...

I got my initial winch training at Bond Springs, NT, and know how hot it
can get there.

On 9/19/2018 10:03 PM, Charlie Quebec wrote:
> If you have a glass top trailer you won’t. The normal home built aluminium type commonly seen here in Oz, where
> the glider has been stored for a couple of years with the tailplane within an inch of the metal......

--
Dan, 5J

[Morgan[_2_]]

I built one of these for the DG-101 we used to own. Now owned by the Central California Soaring Club.

Pretty simple build out of 3/8" plywood if I remember right. Maybe 1/2". I can't seem to find a photo of it unfortunately.

Definitely could have been better built, but it's lasted many years with only a few repairs.

The front "bulkhead" has the larger radius half circle cutout for the tailboom and a vertical notch for the horizontal to drop into.

The aft "bulkhead" has a smaller radius half circle for the tailboom and a full airfoil cutout for the horizontal to slide into.

The bulkheads I mocked up in cardboard to make a template, then dropped that onto plywood and cut it out.

I made something of a box frame to join the fore and aft bulkheads and it extends into a V type of fork that slips around the vertical stabilizer.

All surfaces of wood that touch fiberglass were wrapped with a soft boat carpet and I made some steel v cuffs from sheet metal to secure the horizontal and the rudder.

The whole thing just secures with bungees and is quite stable on the road.

Not the easiest thing to describe, but it wasn't too hard to build with wood and a jigsaw. Just get the cutouts for the fuselage close and then use thin foam and carpet to pad it.

I started with wood as a simple prototype. Of course, I never went back and made a new one.

One unanticipated downside is that it adds a fair bit of weight to the tail.. So if you've got to lift the tail out of the wheel cup or carry it out of the trailer over the ramp, you've got a fair bit more weight to deal with.. That's not surprising, but how much harder it can be to extract from a tube trailer due to the extra weight was. I added a third rail ramp to allow the glider to be rolled out until the tailwheel was on the ground. That helps a lot.

Morgan

On Thursday, September 6, 2018 at 7:14:01 AM UTC-7, wrote:
> I have seen a glider trailer in which the aircraft's horizontal stabilizer is strapped to the glider's tail boom for storage and transport. I can't recall where I saw this, and a google image search did not yield any hits.
>
> At any rate, strapping the horizontal stabilizer to the tail boom is one solution I am investigating as my partner and I work to retrofit a new tube trailer to our DG-101. It seems to me that this could be a storage configuration that would not require the awkward stooped climb-and-carry maneuver that is required if the stabilizer is attached to the roof of the trailer.
>
> I am seeking advice on whether this is generally a good idea and if there is a commercial product we could use.
>
> Matt

[Charlie Quebec]

Mine for the very similar DG200 is made in much the same way, however I changed from bungees to Velcro to secure to the boom, works much better.

[Matt McBee]

I did end up constructing a tail stab carrier out of cedar and pine. I cut the cuffs from the roof of my old trailer with an oscillating saw. I measured the circumference of the tail boom at three stations and printed circular templates in powerpoint, and used those with my jigsaw to cut out the three supports out of pine. I made a cardboard template of the base of the vertical tail and used that to notch the base. The carrier is secured in place with a bungee across the tailwheel fairing and three straps around the tail boom.

Overall I am very happy with this arrangement. It has shown no tendency to shift or move during transport. Being mostly made of cedar, it is quite lightweight.

I posted pics of the construction and final product here in case anyone else wants to make something like this.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/52279054@N06/sets/72157709158710712

Matt