FLARM

[John Galloway]

Seen this?

http://www.flarm.com/index_en.html

Radar and transponders are just so 20th century.

John Galloway

[Marc Ramsey]

John Galloway wrote:
> Seen this?
>
> http://www.flarm.com/index_en.html
>
> Radar and transponders are just so 20th century.

They are, that is why ADS-B exists:

http://adsb.tc.faa.gov/ADS-B.htm

Unfortunately, ADS-B shows all of the signs of being a classic case of
design by bureaucracy. As for FLARM, it's not clear when, or if, they
will get (communications) regulatory approval for use anywhere other
than Switzerland.

Marc

[Bert Willing]

And Austria, that is. That thing is spreading *very* rapidly throughout the
Alpine regions - 450 gliders already equipped another batch being delivered
in spring.

--
Bert Willing

ASW20 "TW"


"Marc Ramsey" > a écrit dans le message de news:
.. .
> John Galloway wrote:
>> Seen this?
>>
>> http://www.flarm.com/index_en.html
>>
>> Radar and transponders are just so 20th century.
>
> They are, that is why ADS-B exists:
>
> http://adsb.tc.faa.gov/ADS-B.htm
>
> Unfortunately, ADS-B shows all of the signs of being a classic case of
> design by bureaucracy. As for FLARM, it's not clear when, or if, they
> will get (communications) regulatory approval for use anywhere other than
> Switzerland.
>
> Marc

[Stefan]

Marc Ramsey wrote:

> As for FLARM, it's not clear when, or if, they
> will get (communications) regulatory approval for use anywhere other
> than Switzerland.

The story is this: In Switzerland, we had a couple of glider midairs
during the last couple of years. FLARM was developed by a group of
technically educated soaring pilots to address this problem. They didn't
try to develop a standard or something, but just went and built the
thing. If it works, publication of the protocol will and standardisation
may follow.

The Swiss FOCA was helpful, cooperative and unbureaucratic, maybe this
is simpler in a small country in which the soaring community is like a
small village and many people at the FOCA soar themselves. Many glider
clubs supported the development by blindly placing orders for FLARM
before it was even working. This was a crucial point, which only works
in a "small village envinronment" and in a club driven glider scene.

Last season, the first few FLARMs were installed. We expect many more to
be installed during the winter. We are looking at the next season to be
a big beta test of the thing. The key is that many glider clubs were
willing to risk some money and support the development, and that
Switzerland is relatively small (well... absolutely, to be honest), so
chances are high that the glider you'll meet enroute will be FLARM
equipped, too.

If the next year shows that FLARM really works, then I'm sure it will
make its way to the rest of Europe. Not sure about the US.

Stefan

[Bert Willing]

To add to that: There are already more than 130 orders from Austria, and I
know that at least as much will come from pilots/clubs in southern Germany.
French alpine pilots are also getting on the line - the competition in Vinon
next year will probably have all gliders (approx. 90) equipped during the
contest.

I think that it is the best step towards collision avoidance ever since the
introduction of eyeballs.

--
Bert Willing

ASW20 "TW"


"Stefan" > a écrit dans le message de news:
...
> Marc Ramsey wrote:
>
>> As for FLARM, it's not clear when, or if, they will get (communications)
>> regulatory approval for use anywhere other than Switzerland.
>
> The story is this: In Switzerland, we had a couple of glider midairs
> during the last couple of years. FLARM was developed by a group of
> technically educated soaring pilots to address this problem. They didn't
> try to develop a standard or something, but just went and built the thing.
> If it works, publication of the protocol will and standardisation may
> follow.
>
> The Swiss FOCA was helpful, cooperative and unbureaucratic, maybe this is
> simpler in a small country in which the soaring community is like a small
> village and many people at the FOCA soar themselves. Many glider clubs
> supported the development by blindly placing orders for FLARM before it
> was even working. This was a crucial point, which only works in a "small
> village envinronment" and in a club driven glider scene.
>
> Last season, the first few FLARMs were installed. We expect many more to
> be installed during the winter. We are looking at the next season to be a
> big beta test of the thing. The key is that many glider clubs were willing
> to risk some money and support the development, and that Switzerland is
> relatively small (well... absolutely, to be honest), so chances are high
> that the glider you'll meet enroute will be FLARM equipped, too.
>
> If the next year shows that FLARM really works, then I'm sure it will make
> its way to the rest of Europe. Not sure about the US.
>
> Stefan
>

[Janos Bauer]

It seems this box can provide nmea183 output. So you don't have to buy
a separate GPS;)

/Jancsika

[Nyal Williams]

At 21:30 25 November 2004, John Galloway wrote:
>Seen this?
>
>http://www.flarm.com/index_en.html
>
>Radar and transponders are just so 20th century.
>
>John Galloway
>
>

Does this device have a display that shows the direction
of an incursion?
>

[Stefan]

Nyal Williams wrote:

> Does this device have a display that shows the direction
> of an incursion?

Yes. It warns acoustically and displays the horizontal situation with
LEDs, similiar to "traffic at 10 o'clock". It has algorithms to filter
out gliders which thermal with you. They are still working to filter out
gliders which are flying at different altitudes, and of course are
working to improve the whole algoithm.

Stefan

[Sven Olivier]

In the Southern Cape region in South Africa we do lot of ridge and wave
flying (inbetween some thermal flying ;-) and we already have 11 gliders
equipped with FLARM (since about two weeks ago) - it our conditions (with
frequent head-on encounters on the ridges it is proving to be invaluable.
I really believe it is going to assist in avoiding mid-air incidents.
It is not intrusive in the cockpit and cleary indicates the direction of the
threat.
A convinced FLARM user

regards
Sven
O2

"Stefan" > wrote in message
...
> Nyal Williams wrote:
>
>> Does this device have a display that shows the direction
>> of an incursion?
>
> Yes. It warns acoustically and displays the horizontal situation with
> LEDs, similiar to "traffic at 10 o'clock". It has algorithms to filter out
> gliders which thermal with you. They are still working to filter out
> gliders which are flying at different altitudes, and of course are working
> to improve the whole algoithm.
>
> Stefan
>

[Bruce]

Sven Olivier wrote:
> In the Southern Cape region in South Africa we do lot of ridge and wave
> flying (inbetween some thermal flying ;-) and we already have 11 gliders
> equipped with FLARM (since about two weeks ago) - it our conditions (with
> frequent head-on encounters on the ridges it is proving to be invaluable.
> I really believe it is going to assist in avoiding mid-air incidents.
> It is not intrusive in the cockpit and cleary indicates the direction of the
> threat.
> A convinced FLARM user
>
> regards
> Sven
> O2
>
> "Stefan" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Nyal Williams wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Does this device have a display that shows the direction
>>>of an incursion?
>>
>>Yes. It warns acoustically and displays the horizontal situation with
>>LEDs, similiar to "traffic at 10 o'clock". It has algorithms to filter out
>>gliders which thermal with you. They are still working to filter out
>>gliders which are flying at different altitudes, and of course are working
>>to improve the whole algoithm.
>>
>>Stefan
>>
>
>
>
Must be working, if we look at the distances you guys are doing.
Congratulations on the 1000+

Just one question though - why are you not logging them on OLC?