Validation problem

[Ian Cant]

Please advise a hapless victim of software technology.

My PC uses Windows XP. How can I validate an igc file
? I can find no way to open a DOS window. With vali-lxn.exe
installed, I can tell it to run vali-lxn on a named
file. Apparently it does so; I get a second or so
of a blue window as it prepares to run, then the whole
window disappears in a flash and a new file named DBG
is generated. This file has no extension, and XP does
not know how to open it. I have tried Word and get
mainly garbage with enough text to know it was related
to the igc file, tried LXNav Tools and get 'unknown
file', tried cursing in all known human languages with
little satisfaction.

Used to work in DOS and Windows 95/98, but my old machines
died. Perhaps I can resurrect one just for this.

As an aside, does anyone else have validation problems
when downloading using SeeYou ?

Ian

[f.blair]

Go to Start-Run and enter 'cmd', that will open a DOS window


"Ian Cant" > wrote in message
...
> Please advise a hapless victim of software technology.
>
> My PC uses Windows XP. How can I validate an igc file
> ? I can find no way to open a DOS window. With vali-lxn.exe
> installed, I can tell it to run vali-lxn on a named
> file. Apparently it does so; I get a second or so
> of a blue window as it prepares to run, then the whole
> window disappears in a flash and a new file named DBG
> is generated. This file has no extension, and XP does
> not know how to open it. I have tried Word and get
> mainly garbage with enough text to know it was related
> to the igc file, tried LXNav Tools and get 'unknown
> file', tried cursing in all known human languages with
> little satisfaction.
>
> Used to work in DOS and Windows 95/98, but my old machines
> died. Perhaps I can resurrect one just for this.
>
> As an aside, does anyone else have validation problems
> when downloading using SeeYou ?
>
> Ian
>
>
>
>
>

[Marc Ramsey]

Ian Cant wrote:
> As an aside, does anyone else have validation problems
> when downloading using SeeYou ?

Yes, there appears to be a problem with some recent versions of the
SeeYou software. Under some circumstances, the downloaded flight data
file will be corrupted such that it no longer validates. If you are
expecting to submit the flight for a badge or record claim, I would
encourage you to avoid using SeeYou to download the flight. At minimum,
make sure the file validates with the IGC-approved validation software
before erasing the flight from the recorder (which is a good idea, in
general). Hopefully, the SeeYou development team will someday find the
time and energy to address this problem...

Marc

[Mitch]

If you are using a Cambridge logger, simply open your .cai file with
SEEyou, and submit that rather than your .igc file. I was having some
problems too, and this worked for me.


-Mitch





Marc Ramsey > wrote in message >...
> Ian Cant wrote:
> > As an aside, does anyone else have validation problems
> > when downloading using SeeYou ?
>
> Yes, there appears to be a problem with some recent versions of the
> SeeYou software. Under some circumstances, the downloaded flight data
> file will be corrupted such that it no longer validates. If you are
> expecting to submit the flight for a badge or record claim, I would
> encourage you to avoid using SeeYou to download the flight. At minimum,
> make sure the file validates with the IGC-approved validation software
> before erasing the flight from the recorder (which is a good idea, in
> general). Hopefully, the SeeYou development team will someday find the
> time and energy to address this problem...
>
> Marc

[Steve Pawling]

Ian,

My XP has a DOS prompt under Program Files, Accessories. The easiest
way I have found to use the vali program is to have the vali and
flight files in the same folder. From the DOS prompt, type in
"vali-lxn.exe yourfilename.igc" and it should validate the file (or
not)or give you an error message. Be sure to use the original name of
your flight file.

I have not used SeeYou to download flight files, I always use the
manufacturer's program.

Good luck,
Steve


Ian Cant > wrote in message >...
> Please advise a hapless victim of software technology.
>
> My PC uses Windows XP. How can I validate an igc file
> ? I can find no way to open a DOS window. With vali-lxn.exe
> installed, I can tell it to run vali-lxn on a named
> file. Apparently it does so; I get a second or so
> of a blue window as it prepares to run, then the whole
> window disappears in a flash and a new file named DBG
> is generated. This file has no extension, and XP does
> not know how to open it. I have tried Word and get
> mainly garbage with enough text to know it was related
> to the igc file, tried LXNav Tools and get 'unknown
> file', tried cursing in all known human languages with
> little satisfaction.
>
> Used to work in DOS and Windows 95/98, but my old machines
> died. Perhaps I can resurrect one just for this.
>
> As an aside, does anyone else have validation problems
> when downloading using SeeYou ?
>
> Ian

[Steve Pawling]

To supplement my previous response -- at the DOS prompt, change to the
directory containing the vali and flight files before typing in the
vali command.
SP

[Ian Cant]

Many thanks to all who helped. For the record, this
is what works in XP:

1. Copy the data-xxx, vali-xxx and conv-xxx files onto
a clean new floppy [xxx is the FR makers ID, lxn in
my case] in drive A.

2. To open a DOS window, select RUN, type in 'cmd'
and 'enter'.

3. Connect the FR.

4. In the DOS window, type 'cd:A\'

5. In the DOS window, type 'data-xxx.exe'. You will
get a download of the available files from the FR.


6. Select the flight you want [with arrow keys] and
hit 'enter'. Flight file will download onto floppy.
Probably you will get both an igc and an xxx file.
Note the igc filename.

7. In the DOS window, type 'A:\vali-xxx.exe A:\igcfilename'.

8. Vali will run and a one-line response that ends
up by saying integrity check is OK will appear. Now
you can breathe again.

In Windows 95, there are several ways to open the DOS
window but RUN cmd is not one of them. Starting from
a DOS window, the data and vali files would run, but
refused to show any results except to say 'finished'!
So I went from 'my computer', double clicked 'floppy
A', double-clicked 'data-xxx.exe and went from there.
[This straightforward approach did not work in XP].

I think these sequences are repeatable, but bitter
experience tells me that the software combinations
are only marginally stable.

Once the files are safely on the floppy, they can be
copied for permanent storage onto your hard drive.
I suspect that the validation errors I was encountering
originated by downloading first to hard drive and then
copying the files from hard drive to floppy.

Thanks again,

Ian




At 04:30 04 December 2004, Steve Pawling wrote:
>To supplement my previous response -- at the DOS prompt,
>change to the
>directory containing the vali and flight files before
>typing in the
>vali command.
>SP
>

[Tim Newport-Peace]

X-no-archive: yes
In article >, Ian Cant <REMOVE_TO_REPLY.i
> writes
>Please advise a hapless victim of software technology.
>
>My PC uses Windows XP. How can I validate an igc file
>? I can find no way to open a DOS window. With vali-lxn.exe
>installed, I can tell it to run vali-lxn on a named
>file. Apparently it does so; I get a second or so
>of a blue window as it prepares to run, then the whole
>window disappears in a flash and a new file named DBG
>is generated. This file has no extension, and XP does
>not know how to open it. I have tried Word and get
>mainly garbage with enough text to know it was related
>to the igc file, tried LXNav Tools and get 'unknown
>file', tried cursing in all known human languages with
>little satisfaction.
>
>Used to work in DOS and Windows 95/98, but my old machines
>died. Perhaps I can resurrect one just for this.
>
>As an aside, does anyone else have validation problems
>when downloading using SeeYou ?
>
>Ian
>
Usage of the DOS programs under later operating has been a problem for
some time, not made any easier by laptops that have no serial port and
using DOS software via a USB <-> Serial adapter is problematic at best.

This problem as been recognised for some time by GFAC and in the current
version of the FR Specification Document (available from the IGC web
pages) it was required that for all recorders, Windows Download and
Validation Software in the form of a DLL is produced by 1st July 2004.

The DLL could be incorporated into any commercial software (Tasknav
SeeYou etc.) to allow these functions to be performed under windows and
a Stand-alone program written by Marc Ramsey is avail from the IGC web
page http://www.fai.org:81/gliding/gnss/freeware.asp

To date, only Peschges have done this, available from the above web
reference (congratulation to a company that is no longer in the FR
manufacturing business), and I understand that a Cambridge contractor is
working on a program for Cambridge recorders.

Now, pressure could be brought to bear on other manufacturers, by
threatening to rescind their approvals, but is this really practical?

I would encourage owners of other manufacturer's products to email their
manufacturer and apply pressure on them to fulfil this requirement to
provide Windows Support.

It is in your own interest!

Tim Newport-Peace

"May you be cursed with a chronic anxiety about the weather."

John Burroughs (1837-1921).

[Ian Cant]

At 23:30 04 December 2004, Tim Newport-Peace wrote:
>>
>Usage of the DOS programs under later operating has
>been a problem for
>some time, not made any easier by laptops that have
>no serial port and
>using DOS software via a USB Serial adapter is problematic
>at best.
>
>This problem as been recognised for some time by GFAC
>and in the current
>version of the FR Specification Document (available
>from the IGC web
>pages) it was required that for all recorders, Windows
>Download and
>Validation Software in the form of a DLL is produced
>by 1st July 2004.
>
>The DLL could be incorporated into any commercial software
>(Tasknav
>SeeYou etc.) to allow these functions to be performed
>under windows and
>a Stand-alone program written by Marc Ramsey is avail
>from the IGC web
>page http://www.fai.org:81/gliding/gnss/freeware.asp
>

Thankyou, Tim and Marc. It is reassuring to know that
the problems are at least recognized. I don't envy
you the headaches this must involve.


>I would encourage owners of other manufacturer's products
>to email their
>manufacturer and apply pressure on them to fulfil this
>requirement to
>provide Windows Support.
>

Yes. But equally, the third-party software providers
[like SeeYou] should be encouraged to ensure that their
download software is and remains fully compatible with
FAI validity checking requirements. I suspect that
in practice more people like to download with full
analysis software rather than download first with hardware
manufacturer's programs and then open into analysis
packages.

Ian

[Tim Newport-Peace]

X-no-archive: yes
In article >, Ian Cant <REMOVE_TO_REPLY.i
> writes
>Yes. But equally, the third-party software providers
>[like SeeYou] should be encouraged to ensure that their
>download software is and remains fully compatible with
>FAI validity checking requirements. I suspect that
>in practice more people like to download with full
>analysis software rather than download first with hardware
>manufacturer's programs and then open into analysis
>packages.
>
>Ian
>
The whole point Ian, is that third party software should use the latest
version of the manufacturers DLL (which is freeware), then the download
and validation performed by via program will be up to date by default.
In other words, the manufacturer's DLL becomes an integral part of the
analysis software.

I would expect that when these DLLs become available, writers of
analysis packages will not be slow to interface into them. The interface
is published in the Flight Recorder Specification Document and has been
for some time.

What is disappointing is poor take-up rate by manufacturers.

Tim Newport-Peace

"Indecision is the Key to Flexibility."

[Ian Cant]

At 12:30 05 December 2004, Tim Newport-Peace wrote:
>X-no-archive: yes
>In article , Ian Cant writes
>>Yes. But equally, the third-party software providers
>>[like SeeYou] should be encouraged to ensure that their
>>download software is and remains fully compatible with
>>FAI validity checking requirements. I suspect that
>>in practice more people like to download with full
>>analysis software rather than download first with hardware
>>manufacturer's programs and then open into analysis
>>packages.
>>
>>Ian
>>
>The whole point Ian, is that third party software should
>use the latest
>version of the manufacturers DLL (which is freeware),
>then the download
>and validation performed by via program will be up
>to date by default.
>In other words, the manufacturer's DLL becomes an integral
>part of the
>analysis software.
>
>I would expect that when these DLLs become available,
>writers of
>analysis packages will not be slow to interface into
>them. The interface
>is published in the Flight Recorder Specification Document
>and has been
>for some time.
>

If that were so, Tim, then downloads using e.g. SeeYou
would be identical in validity to those used by Filser's
latest freeware [even if that is not itself fully Windows-compatib
le]. But that is demonstrably not the case, to the
extent that the SSA specifically advises against using
SeeYou for badge/record downloads.

I hope that SeeYou and Filser both have someone who
reads ras !

Ian

[Robert Ehrlich]

While a publicly available DLL as free software may be part of a solution,
the problem is likely to happen again and again as hardware and software
evolve. It would be nice if IGC realised that computer and PC are not
synonyms nor operating system and DOS and rather than mandating some piece
of software for an arbirarily choosen computer and operationg system, or
beside that, they asked the manufacturer to publish the specifications of
the downloading protocol. BTW how do people writing analysis and downloading
software like SeeYou know these specifications?

[Tim Newport-Peace]

X-no-archive: yes
In article >, Ian Cant <REMOVE_TO_REPLY.i
> writes
>At 12:30 05 December 2004, Tim Newport-Peace wrote:
---snip--------
>>The whole point Ian, is that third party software should
>>use the latest
>>version of the manufacturers DLL (which is freeware),
>>then the download
>>and validation performed by via program will be up
>>to date by default.
>>In other words, the manufacturer's DLL becomes an integral
>>part of the
>>analysis software.
>>
>>I would expect that when these DLLs become available,
>>writers of
>>analysis packages will not be slow to interface into
>>them. The interface
>>is published in the Flight Recorder Specification Document
>>and has been
>>for some time.
>>
>
>If that were so, Tim, then downloads using e.g. SeeYou
>would be identical in validity to those used by Filser's
>latest freeware [even if that is not itself fully Windows-compatib
>le]. But that is demonstrably not the case, to the
>extent that the SSA specifically advises against using
>SeeYou for badge/record downloads.
>
When/if a DLL for LXNavigation products becomes available (not Filser,
they just market it) the DLL can be used by both SeeYou and other
programs as it should be invisible what program has performed the
download.

I don't use SeeYou, but TaskNav calls the DOS program to perform
downloads for various recorders. This can create problems and many
people have reported these, especially when the serial port connection
is via a USB adapter. When the application (whatever it may be) can
simply call a manufacturer's DLL and run the whole thing as a Windows
Task I expect to see a vast reduction in download failures.

>I hope that SeeYou and Filser both have someone who
>reads ras !
>
AIRC, SeeYou and LXNavigation are written by the same team. They have
been aware of the need to produce a DLL, but so far nothing has been
forthcoming. I would not dream of discouraging anyone from mailing them
@lxnavigation.si and @seeyou.ws

Perhaps some pressure from their clients would help concentrate their
minds. It is hard to see what more IGC can do to progress this.

OK, they could cancel their approval until they do conform, after all it
is now part of the specification for an Approved Recorder, but I would
guess that would be as welcome as a fart in a space suit.

Over to you...

Tim Newport-Peace

"Indecision is the Key to Flexibility."

[Marian Aldenhövel]

Hi
> When the application (whatever it may be) can
> simply call a manufacturer's DLL and run the whole thing as a Windows
> Task I expect to see a vast reduction in download failures.

If the manufacturer cannot produce a program that reliably works with
any connection, be it direct serial or via a USB-Adapter, why do you
expect he can produce a DLL that does?

Specifying a common interface (calls to make by the program) is a
very good thing and DLLs are the windows-way to do so. But the presence
of any program with its commandline-parameters is just as good to use
as well-defined interface.

This does not address the problem of missing serial ports at all I might
think.

Plus there is no support for different Operating Systems.

Have provisions been made for multiple loggers or will the user have to
copy/rename Interface-DLLs around?

Ciao, MM
--
Marian Aldenhövel, Rosenhain 23, 53123 Bonn. +49 228 624013.
http://www.marian-aldenhoevel.de
"Flying an An-2 is like making love to a fat lady who's had too much to drink:
there's a lot to work with, it's unresponsive, you're never quite sure when
you're there, and it's big-time ugly."

[Marc Ramsey]

Marian Aldenhövel wrote:
> If the manufacturer cannot produce a program that reliably works with
> any connection, be it direct serial or via a USB-Adapter, why do you
> expect he can produce a DLL that does?

The programs required by earlier revisions of the flight recorder
specification were DOS programs. As such, some were written using older
DOS calls which are not fully compatible with serial support in the
current versions of Windows. The DLLs will be written using the Win32
API, which will eliminate most, if not all, of the compatibility issues
with USB serial adapters.

> Have provisions been made for multiple loggers or will the user have to
> copy/rename Interface-DLLs around?

Provisions have been made for multiple DLLs. They need only be placed
in a common directory. The application framework includes a call which
enumerates all available IGC interface DLLs, to allow the appropriate
one to be selected.

Marc

[Go]

A friend and I use SeeYou and Volksloggers. I had validation problems
but he shared his method with me. He has sucessfully used this to
submit valid data for state record verification. As a practice he first
copies the data from the VL using the Connection Wizard directly onto a
floppy. You can choose the destination with the Wizard, just browse to
the A: drive. Then you will have a clean copy before SeeYou starts
working on it.

I have attempted to use the VL Dos program for downloads during
contessts but the time it takes (am I doing something wrong here?) is a
serious problem considering you only have an hour from landing to
submittal of your data. So I used SeeYou instead. This method was
accepted at the Nationals and one Sports Class Regional, but
invalidated my Nevada state record attempt! Go figure.


Ian Cant wrote:
> At 12:30 05 December 2004, Tim Newport-Peace wrote:
> >X-no-archive: yes
> >In article , Ian Cant writes
> >>Yes. But equally, the third-party software providers
> >>[like SeeYou] should be encouraged to ensure that their
> >>download software is and remains fully compatible with
> >>FAI validity checking requirements. I suspect that
> >>in practice more people like to download with full
> >>analysis software rather than download first with hardware
> >>manufacturer's programs and then open into analysis
> >>packages.
> >>
> >>Ian
> >>
> >The whole point Ian, is that third party software should
> >use the latest
> >version of the manufacturers DLL (which is freeware),
> >then the download
> >and validation performed by via program will be up
> >to date by default.
> >In other words, the manufacturer's DLL becomes an integral
> >part of the
> >analysis software.
> >
> >I would expect that when these DLLs become available,
> >writers of
> >analysis packages will not be slow to interface into
> >them. The interface
> >is published in the Flight Recorder Specification Document
> >and has been
> >for some time.
> >
>
> If that were so, Tim, then downloads using e.g. SeeYou
> would be identical in validity to those used by Filser's
> latest freeware [even if that is not itself fully Windows-compatib
> le]. But that is demonstrably not the case, to the
> extent that the SSA specifically advises against using
> SeeYou for badge/record downloads.
>
> I hope that SeeYou and Filser both have someone who
> reads ras !
>
> Ian

[Papa3]

All,

I had high hopes when I googled and found this thread. I'm trying to
help a buddy solve his VALI problems with a Volkslogger. Sitting here
with my high-powered XP laptop I figured I'd be all set. However, it
looks like I'm screwed.

To recap:

1. Can't run some of the older DOS-based VALI programs (e.g. Garrecht
VL) under XP as the NT-based emulator throws an exception ("something
something something 16-bit something something error" CANCEL).

2. Would love to boot DOS from a floppy, except that the floppy drive
is SOOO 1990's; ie. there isn't one on this machine.

3. Not sure that I have the energy to create a DOS partition on my
hard-drive (nor that my quasi "locked down" image would be permissable
on the company network).

So, I'm hosed unless I un-crate the old desktop that runs 98. Correct?
P3

[basils27]

Try looking at
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;324767
If that is your problem then the above should fix it. Not reason why a vali
program shouldn't work. Any DOS program that uses the com posts is another
matter.

Basil

"Papa3" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> All,
>
> I had high hopes when I googled and found this thread. I'm trying to
> help a buddy solve his VALI problems with a Volkslogger. Sitting here
> with my high-powered XP laptop I figured I'd be all set. However, it
> looks like I'm screwed.
>
> To recap:
>
> 1. Can't run some of the older DOS-based VALI programs (e.g. Garrecht
> VL) under XP as the NT-based emulator throws an exception ("something
> something something 16-bit something something error" CANCEL).
>
> 2. Would love to boot DOS from a floppy, except that the floppy drive
> is SOOO 1990's; ie. there isn't one on this machine.
>
> 3. Not sure that I have the energy to create a DOS partition on my
> hard-drive (nor that my quasi "locked down" image would be permissable
> on the company network).
>
> So, I'm hosed unless I un-crate the old desktop that runs 98. Correct?
> P3
>

[Robin Birch]

In message . com>,
Papa3 > writes
>All,
>
>I had high hopes when I googled and found this thread. I'm trying to
>help a buddy solve his VALI problems with a Volkslogger. Sitting here
>with my high-powered XP laptop I figured I'd be all set. However, it
>looks like I'm screwed.
>
>To recap:
>
>1. Can't run some of the older DOS-based VALI programs (e.g. Garrecht
>VL) under XP as the NT-based emulator throws an exception ("something
>something something 16-bit something something error" CANCEL).
>
>2. Would love to boot DOS from a floppy, except that the floppy drive
>is SOOO 1990's; ie. there isn't one on this machine.
>
>3. Not sure that I have the energy to create a DOS partition on my
>hard-drive (nor that my quasi "locked down" image would be permissable
>on the company network).
>
>So, I'm hosed unless I un-crate the old desktop that runs 98. Correct?
>P3
>
Yup,
You won't get real historic DOS progs to run on XP anyway, your best bet
is to set an old fashioned box up with 95 or 98, or (scary thought) find
one that's archaic enough to run real MSDOS.

MSDOS it's self won't actually run properly on a lot of the new boxes as
there are bits of the architecture that need the new OSs to work.

Robin
--
Robin Birch

[Tim Newport-Peace]

X-no-archive: yes
In article . com>,
Papa3 > writes
>All,
>
>I had high hopes when I googled and found this thread. I'm trying to
>help a buddy solve his VALI problems with a Volkslogger. Sitting here
>with my high-powered XP laptop I figured I'd be all set. However, it
>looks like I'm screwed.
>
>To recap:
>
>1. Can't run some of the older DOS-based VALI programs (e.g. Garrecht
>VL) under XP as the NT-based emulator throws an exception ("something
>something something 16-bit something something error" CANCEL).
>
>2. Would love to boot DOS from a floppy, except that the floppy drive
>is SOOO 1990's; ie. there isn't one on this machine.
>
>3. Not sure that I have the energy to create a DOS partition on my
>hard-drive (nor that my quasi "locked down" image would be permissable
>on the company network).
>
>So, I'm hosed unless I un-crate the old desktop that runs 98. Correct?
>P3
>
Hi Erik,

I am afraid that problems running DOS are not going to go away, but are
likely to increase, the use of USB <=> Serial converter is a case in
point.

For this reason, some while ago GFAC wrote a specification for a DLL and
required all manufacturers to provide such a DLL by 1st July 2004. Marc
Ramsey also provided a shell program, see the IGC web page:
http://www.fai.org:81/gliding/gnss/freeware.asp

It is also anticipated that analysis programs would also use the DLLs to
enable the support for downloading etc.

So far only Peschges have complied even though it is mandatory, nor just
an option.

If Volkslogger had complied, your problem would not exist as what you
want to do could be done in a 32-bit Windows environment.

I encourage you, and anyone else who perceived the continued use of DOS
programs to be a problem (all lap-top owners?), to email the
manufacturer concerned and lobby them to supply the windows DLL, which
they should have done by last July.

Perhaps customer pressure will work without the need for IGC to resort
to more draconian measures (suspension of IGC approval).

Best regards,

Tim Newport-Peace

"Indecision is the Key to Flexibility."

[Todd Pattist]

Papa3 wrote:

> high-powered XP laptop I figured I'd be all set. However, it
> looks like I'm screwed.
> 2. Would love to boot DOS from a floppy, except that the floppy drive
> is SOOO 1990's; ie. there isn't one on this machine.
>
> 3. Not sure that I have the energy to create a DOS partition on my
> hard-drive

How about a bootable CD with DOS creating a ram drive? Nero will write
a bootable CD. Then you just need to get the file off the ram drive.
There are some DOS to USB methods and drivers out there (try
bootdisk.com) that might talk to a USB pen drive or you could run DOS
network drivers and send it to another machine.

(I hope this post gets out, it's my first in a new Mozilla Thunderbird
installation)
Todd

[Papa3]

Thanks to all. I opted for plan C - find someone running an older NT
machine. Turns out we have a bunch of old, worthless laptops in the
office. I'm picking one up on Monday.

Regards,

P3

[Paul Remde]

Hi,

I haven't been following every post in this thread so I may be off base, but
if you want to download IGC approved flight logs from a Volkslogger, why not
use the StrePla software that came with the Volkslogger. SeeYou should be
able to download valid flight logs also. There is no need for a DOS
program.

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.
http://www.cumulus-soaring.com

"Papa3" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Thanks to all. I opted for plan C - find someone running an older NT
> machine. Turns out we have a bunch of old, worthless laptops in the
> office. I'm picking one up on Monday.
>
> Regards,
>
> P3
>

[Tim Newport-Peace]

X-no-archive: yes
In article <7wpvd.494954$wV.355049@attbi_s54>, Paul Remde
> writes
>Hi,
>
>I haven't been following every post in this thread so I may be off base, but
>if you want to download IGC approved flight logs from a Volkslogger, why not
>use the StrePla software that came with the Volkslogger. SeeYou should be
>able to download valid flight logs also. There is no need for a DOS
>program.
>
>Paul Remde

Hi Paul,

The issue was one of validating a file previously downloaded.

While Strepla may be able to do this, it's not much help to a third
party (such as competition organisers etc.) if they have to go and buy a
copy. Asking the pilot to supply a copy would involve copyright theft,
so is not an answer.

The IGC Flight Recorder specification requires manufacturers to supply
specific freeware. In this instance, a DLL which can be used with the
shell program available free from the IGC website, and in the future
with any third party software.

All manufacturers were required to supply this by 1st July 2004 and yet
here we are in December and the only manufacturer that has complied gave
up manufacturing Flight Recorders some time ago.

Tim Newport-Peace

"Indecision is the Key to Flexibility."

[Papa3]

>
> Hi Paul,
>
> The issue was one of validating a file previously downloaded.
>
> While Strepla may be able to do this, it's not much help to a third
> party (such as competition organisers etc.) if they have to go and
buy a
> copy. Asking the pilot to supply a copy would involve copyright
theft,
> so is not an answer.
>
>

I want to thank Tim for several offline communications helping to work
around this problem. However, it has raised another question - do
Strepla and SeeYou currently have the source code for the VALI
(checksum) algorithms used by the manufacturers? Or, to put it another
way, if I download from the logger using application a (e.g. Cambridge
download utility) which creates the G-Record, can I then Validate using
another third party's application? Obviously, that would be the goal
of supplying the DLLs, but I'm not clear on whether that is currently
the case...

P3

[Papa3]

Just to clarify, I did RTFM, at least the online Help from SeeYou. It
seems to imply that the only Validation routine it has is one for "G
Records created by SeeYou" and those available from G7toWin for Garmin
devices. That would lead me to believe that it doesn't know to call
the DLLs for other manufacturers, though I'm sure that was what the IGC
was originally hoping by specifying the naming convention for these
DLLs (ie. "if header record contains FR manufacturer code of VL, then
call DLL VLxxx-gcs ... or whatever the precise syntax is). I'm just
wondering if any of the uber-programs like Strepla and SeeYou actually
do this.

Since I do validations after the fact (ie. I'm the State Record Keeper,
so I wasn't there when the files were first downloaded), this problem
is becoming a real headache.

P3