FA: 1976 Citabria 7KCAB *no reserve*

[Larry]

starts at $25k, needs fabric work, good winter project!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2488219765

[Jay Honeck]

> starts at $25k, needs fabric work, good winter project!

If it "starts at $25k" -- that's a "reserve"...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[xyzzy]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>starts at $25k, needs fabric work, good winter project!
>
>
> If it "starts at $25k" -- that's a "reserve"...

I disagree. A reserve is naturally deceptive, as it's a minimum price
which is higher than the current bid, but which is not being revealed to
bidders. I never understood why people have a reserve rather than just
starting bidding at their "reserve" price, I guess they are hoping if
they start low a bidding frenzy will carry people past the reserve into
the stratosphere. It must work because it's such a commonly used tactic.

I never bid on reserve auctions unless the reserve has already been met.

JMO

[Jay Honeck]

> > If it "starts at $25k" -- that's a "reserve"...
>
> I disagree. A reserve is naturally deceptive, as it's a minimum price
> which is higher than the current bid, but which is not being revealed to
> bidders. I never understood why people have a reserve rather than just
> starting bidding at their "reserve" price, I guess they are hoping if
> they start low a bidding frenzy will carry people past the reserve into
> the stratosphere. It must work because it's such a commonly used tactic.

Right -- it's a semantic argument. The "starting bid" is the "reserve"
price, in real life.

If the "starting bid" on an auction is lower than the REAL "reserve" price,
that's just plain deceptive and stupid, in my opinion.

> I never bid on reserve auctions unless the reserve has already been met.

Me, neither.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Darrel Toepfer]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>>If it "starts at $25k" -- that's a "reserve"...

Flash from the past:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2487132482

[Robert Bonomi]

In article <puyXc.97922$TI1.33401@attbi_s52>,
Jay Honeck > wrote:
>> starts at $25k, needs fabric work, good winter project!
>
>If it "starts at $25k" -- that's a "reserve"...

In 'real-life' auctions, as well as eBay ones, there is a
significant difference, between 'starts at', and 'reserve'.

In real-life auctions, if there are no offers at the 'starting bid' price,
the auctioneer will lower the requested bid-point until somebody bites.

Unfortunately, this _doesn't_ happen in the artificial eBay environment.

A 'reserve' price can exist for either type of auction. It is _usually_
an *undisclosed* (to the bidders) _price_ (although the _existence of the
'reserve price' must be disclosed) below which the seller elects not to sell
the item. Prospective buyers must take the existence of a 'reserve' into
consideration, when deciding whether to expend the time/effort in bidding on
any particular item. Most real-world auction houses tie the _minimum_ starting
bid to a relationship to the reserve, if one exists. e.g. starting bid must
be at least 50% of reserve price. Seller can elect to have a starting bid
higher than that minimum, allowing auctioneer to drop the opening bid, if
no takers at the initial starter. If the opening bid _is_ the reserve
minimum, and no takers at that price, then the item is 'withdrawn', without
lowering the opening ask.

COMMENT: It would be *nice* if eBay would adopt a policy of that type, with
regard to reserves and opening bids. Also if they would let an auction
run -past- 'closing time' until there were no more bids for some reasonable
interval, e.g. 5 minutes. This requires 2 changes -- one to the language,
'auction closes _not_before_ {timestamp}'; the other to the bid handler,
where every successful bid updates the closing time to the current close
or 'now plus 5 minutes', whichever is later.

In real-world auctions, if there is a reserve price, and the reserve is -not-
met, when bidding -has- occurred, then the (non-)seller owes the auction house
the commission on the actual bid price. Note: if there were -no- bids, then
that's a different story.

'Reserve prices' work to the seller's advantage. UNDISCLOSED reserve prices
work to the advantage of the seller _and_ the advantage of the auction house.
The theory being that the 'frenzy of bidding' will carry the price to a point
above where one could _start_ the bidding at. There is *lots* of real-world
experience to support that theory. <grin>