Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators

[private]

I downloaded the some good books from http://www.e-publishing.af.mil

thanks for the links C J C

Is there an online source for "Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators"?

Blue skies to all.

[Dudley Henriques]

"private" > wrote in message
news:RCyUd.524365$6l.57962@pd7tw2no...
>I downloaded the some good books from http://www.e-publishing.af.mil
>
> thanks for the links C J C
>
> Is there an online source for "Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators"?
>
> Blue skies to all.

One of the best manuals ever written on the subject matter. I don't know if
there is an online source for it, but just be aware, it's a 416 page book!
:-))

Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot; CFI; Retired
dhenriquestrashatearthlinktrashdotnet
(take out the trash :-)

[Blanche]

You're probably looking for the no-cost option, but let me offer another
option.

Disclaimer -- I'm in no way connected with the company but I've been
using the products for years. Most useful when I'm not near a high-speed
internet connection.

Summit Aviation has a CD product that comes out every 28 days (sound
familiar?) Most of the stuff isn't updated but items such as ADs and
TCDS, and the AIM are included.

Other things on the CD:

14 CFR -- what we know and love as the FARs.
Bunch of Handbooks - the 8083s (weight & balance, instrument
handbook, student pilot guide, etc) and the 8261 - Instrument
Procedures.
Bunch of Advisory Circulars (ACs)
Pilot/Controller Glossary
All the PTS (the 8081 series)
All the TSOs
Knowledge test questions
Legal interpretations
And....
Aerodynamics for naval aviators

And more stuff.

True, most of this stuff is available on the FAAs website. But if
you were going to buy the various books it would cost far more than
the cost of one CD. I update just once a year or so. It's great
when I'm traveling. I get to take all the books with me (and the
laptop only weighs 4 pounds). Best part - EVERTHING is searchable!

As I said, I'm in no way connected (other than by the interstate.
They're on the far west side of the Denver area and I'm on the far
east side...).

Just freaks the FAA and others when I'm in meetings and people are
trying to remember the citation or exact wording and I pop it up
in seconds....

(*evil laugh*)

summitaviation.com

[Dudley Henriques]

Hi Blanche;
Not sure who your post was meant for, but it appeared under mine. I'm
assuming you meant the OP here since I've had my copy of this book since
1960 :-))
Dudley


"Blanche" > wrote in message
...
> You're probably looking for the no-cost option, but let me offer another
> option.

[Blanche]

Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>Hi Blanche;
>Not sure who your post was meant for, but it appeared under mine. I'm
>assuming you meant the OP here since I've had my copy of this book since
>1960 :-))
>Dudley

Yup. the OP.

I've had my copy since 1997. But then, I started flying later in life.

[Dudley Henriques]

"Blanche" > wrote in message
...
> Dudley Henriques > wrote:
>>Hi Blanche;
>>Not sure who your post was meant for, but it appeared under mine. I'm
>>assuming you meant the OP here since I've had my copy of this book since
>>1960 :-))
>>Dudley
>
> Yup. the OP.
>
> I've had my copy since 1997. But then, I started flying later in life.

It's funny how the mind works sometimes.
Here I sit after all these years. and reading this. Just for a second I had
a flashback to the day I soloed.
I was seventeen. The airplane was a North American AT6 owned by a friend of
my father. For just a
second I could see it all in my mind's eye......the whole scene....I could
feel the heat from the sun and the
wind on my face as I taxied through that last left turn to face down the old
grass runway at an airport that is now a shopping center......the sounds of
the engine......even the smell of the old gray paint chipped
cockpit. Funny.
Thanks :-)))
Dudley

[private]

"Blanche" > wrote in message
...
> You're probably looking for the no-cost option, but let me offer another
> option.
>

> summitaviation.com

Thanks for the pointer. The CD has a LOT of information. There is a list
at http://www.summitaviation.com/publications.html I think I have most of
these publicactions, but if nothing else it is a good list of important
document numbers and descriptions. I suspect most of them are available at
http://av-info.faa.gov/ or
http://www.e-publishing.af.mil/mastercatalog/master_catalog.asp

Considering the extensive high quality government aviation publications
available on the net I have been hoping to find Aerodynamics for Naval
Aviators, but have failed on the USAF or FAA sites or using a Google search
on the title or government publishing number NAVWEPS 00-80T-80. The book
was issued by the USNaval operations training division in 1965 and I hoped
it was on a Navy publications site but I have no URL If the author has
retained some copywrite I would be surprised because of its inclusion on the
summitaviation CD. I have also not found a URL for the survival for downed
airman training manuals.

I may have to troll the bookstores. It appears to be a common book
available quite inexpensively but shipping and taxes and customs add up
quickly. The CD is an option or someone may have a file or pdf. (address
available)

Blue skies to all

[private]

"Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
> "private" > wrote in message
> news:RCyUd.524365$6l.57962@pd7tw2no...
> >I downloaded the some good books from http://www.e-publishing.af.mil
> >
> > thanks for the links C J C
> >
> > Is there an online source for "Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators"?
> >
> > Blue skies to all.
>
> One of the best manuals ever written on the subject matter. I don't know
if
> there is an online source for it, but just be aware, it's a 416 page book!
> :-))
>
> Dudley Henriques
> International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
> Commercial Pilot; CFI; Retired
> dhenriquestrashatearthlinktrashdotnet
> (take out the trash :-)
>
>

Everyone here seem to hold this book in high regard, I am looking forward to
reading it..

I have been reading Mechanics of Flight by A C Kermode, it is challenging
but interesting study. He claims AoA is American usage and speaks of angle
of incidence and riggers angle of incidence. I had previously noted that
Wilbur spoke of aoa as angle of incidence, I suspected changed usage but it
seems to still be current in England?

Blue skies to all

[private]

"Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
link.net...
>
> > I've had my copy since 1997. But then, I started flying later in life.
>
> It's funny how the mind works sometimes.
> Here I sit after all these years. and reading this. Just for a second I
had
> a flashback to the day I soloed.
> I was seventeen. The airplane was a North American AT6 owned by a friend
of
> my father. For just a
> second I could see it all in my mind's eye......the whole scene....I could
> feel the heat from the sun and the
> wind on my face as I taxied through that last left turn to face down the
old
> grass runway at an airport that is now a shopping center......the sounds
of
> the engine......even the smell of the old gray paint chipped
> cockpit. Funny.
> Thanks :-)))
> Dudley


Glad to have caused the recall of a happy memory.

May the skies in your mind always be blue.

[Dudley Henriques]

We define angle of attack as the angle formed between the leading edge of
the wing and the relative wind.
The angle of incidence would be the angular difference between the
longitidunal axis of the airplane and a line drawn through the leading and
trailing edges of the wing.(Chord Line)
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot; CFI; Retired
dhenriquestrashatearthlinktrashdotnet
(take out the trash :-)


"private" > wrote in message
news:UtOUd.528672$Xk.448356@pd7tw3no...
>
> "Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
> ink.net...
>>
>> "private" > wrote in message
>> news:RCyUd.524365$6l.57962@pd7tw2no...
>> >I downloaded the some good books from http://www.e-publishing.af.mil
>> >
>> > thanks for the links C J C
>> >
>> > Is there an online source for "Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators"?
>> >
>> > Blue skies to all.
>>
>> One of the best manuals ever written on the subject matter. I don't know
> if
>> there is an online source for it, but just be aware, it's a 416 page
>> book!
>> :-))
>>
>> Dudley Henriques
>> International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
>> Commercial Pilot; CFI; Retired
>> dhenriquestrashatearthlinktrashdotnet
>> (take out the trash :-)
>>
>>
>
> Everyone here seem to hold this book in high regard, I am looking forward
> to
> reading it..
>
> I have been reading Mechanics of Flight by A C Kermode, it is challenging
> but interesting study. He claims AoA is American usage and speaks of
> angle
> of incidence and riggers angle of incidence. I had previously noted that
> Wilbur spoke of aoa as angle of incidence, I suspected changed usage but
> it
> seems to still be current in England?
>
> Blue skies to all
>
>

[Blanche]

According to the cover page,

Issued by
The Office of the Chief of Naval Operations
Aviation Training Division
U.S. Navy, 1960
Revised January 1965

Which means the US Navy owns the copyright, not an individual.

The new cover on the book attributes

Naval Air Systems Command
US Navy

Looks like anyone is allowed to republish it, being a US Govt. doc.
I notice both ASA and Jeppesen have reprints available.

[lowflyer]

There seem to be a number of copies of Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators on
ebay.

"private" > wrote in message
news:BYNUd.528559$Xk.35572@pd7tw3no...

> available on the net I have been hoping to find Aerodynamics for Naval
> Aviators, but have failed on the USAF or FAA sites or using a Google
search
> on the title or government publishing number NAVWEPS 00-80T-80. The book
> was issued by the USNaval operations training division in 1965 and I hoped
> it was on a Navy publications site but I have no URL If the author

[Dudley Henriques]

"private" > wrote in message
news:auOUd.528675$Xk.275989@pd7tw3no...
>
> "Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
> link.net...
>>
>> > I've had my copy since 1997. But then, I started flying later in life.
>>
>> It's funny how the mind works sometimes.
>> Here I sit after all these years. and reading this. Just for a second I
> had
>> a flashback to the day I soloed.
>> I was seventeen. The airplane was a North American AT6 owned by a friend
> of
>> my father. For just a
>> second I could see it all in my mind's eye......the whole scene....I
>> could
>> feel the heat from the sun and the
>> wind on my face as I taxied through that last left turn to face down the
> old
>> grass runway at an airport that is now a shopping center......the sounds
> of
>> the engine......even the smell of the old gray paint chipped
>> cockpit. Funny.
>> Thanks :-)))
>> Dudley
>
>
> Glad to have caused the recall of a happy memory.
>
> May the skies in your mind always be blue.

Thank you. Best of luck with your book quest.
DH

[CryptWolf]

"private" > wrote in message
>news:RCyUd.524365$6l.57962@pd7tw2no...
> I downloaded the some good books from http://www.e-publishing.af.mil
>
> thanks for the links C J C
>
> Is there an online source for "Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators"?

If you dig a lot, you can come up with the Navy
Fixed Wing Performance Flight Test Manual.
I think it tops the Aerodynamics For Naval Aviators for page count
but most of it is geared more for flight testing and the last
section is a bunch of mission profiles. Uses nearly a ream of paper
if you make a hard copy.

You may also try for:
Olson, Aircraft Performance Flight Testing (AFFTC-TIH-99-01)
I think I found this from a link off of the Edwards web pages.

Another free source is selected notes and papers found on the
NASA/NACA pages. The information is there but some of the
notation is an older style and harder to follow if you are used
to the more modern texts. You'll have to do a lot of digging to
get the same information since many of the papers are very specific
to certain areas such as propellers. This is the only place I've ever
seen the math with a factor for biplanes.

I bought the book. Aerodynamics For Naval Aviators
will be generally easier to understand if you don't already have
a good foundation in aerodynamics.

Another easy book is:
Smith, The Illustrated Guide To Aerodynamics.
This one is geared more toward general aviation aircraft.

[Jose]

> We define angle of attack as the angle formed between the leading edge of
> the wing and the relative wind.
> The angle of incidence would be the angular difference between the
> longitidunal axis of the airplane and a line drawn through the leading and
> trailing edges of the wing.(Chord Line)

Isn't the "angle of attack" as defined above really the angle between
the chord line and the relative wind? The leading edge is a line in a
totally different direction.

Jose
--
Nothing is more powerful than a commercial interest.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[Dudley Henriques]

You are right. Chord line is absolutely correct. (Senior moment :-)
DH

"Jose" > wrote in message
. com...
>> We define angle of attack as the angle formed between the leading edge of
>> the wing and the relative wind.
>> The angle of incidence would be the angular difference between the
>> longitidunal axis of the airplane and a line drawn through the leading
>> and trailing edges of the wing.(Chord Line)
>
> Isn't the "angle of attack" as defined above really the angle between the
> chord line and the relative wind? The leading edge is a line in a totally
> different direction.
>
> Jose
> --
> Nothing is more powerful than a commercial interest.
> for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

[private]

"Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
ink.net...
> We define
> The angle of incidence would be the angular difference between the
> longitidunal axis of the airplane and a line drawn through the leading and
> trailing edges of the wing.(Chord Line)

That was how I have always defined the term, Kermode calls this the riggers
angle of incidence and says it is a left over from rag wing biplanes that
adjust the riggers angle to tune handling. It is my understanding that some
ac have slightly differing angles of incidence on each side.

Blue skies to all

[Bob Moore]

"private" > wrote
> The book was issued by the USNaval
> operations training division in 1965


Hmmmm.... I was issued my copy in 1958 at NAS Pensacola.

Bob Moore

[Dudley Henriques]

It would be interesting to know the angles of incidence on each wing of the
Griffon powered Mk 14 Spitfire.
DH
"private" > wrote in message
news:FVPUd.530947$6l.188198@pd7tw2no...
>
> "Dudley Henriques" > wrote in message
> ink.net...
>> We define
>> The angle of incidence would be the angular difference between the
>> longitidunal axis of the airplane and a line drawn through the leading
>> and
>> trailing edges of the wing.(Chord Line)
>
> That was how I have always defined the term, Kermode calls this the
> riggers
> angle of incidence and says it is a left over from rag wing biplanes that
> adjust the riggers angle to tune handling. It is my understanding that
> some
> ac have slightly differing angles of incidence on each side.
>
> Blue skies to all
>
>

[Dudley Henriques]

H.H. Hurt did the original for the Navy I think. I'm showing the original
printing in 1960 when I got mine. There was a revision printed in 65.
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot; CFI; Retired
dhenriquestrashatearthlinktrashdotnet
(take out the trash :-)

"Bob Moore" > wrote in message
. 122...
> "private" > wrote
>> The book was issued by the USNaval
>> operations training division in 1965
>
>
> Hmmmm.... I was issued my copy in 1958 at NAS Pensacola.
>
> Bob Moore

[Mike W.]

Sporty's sells it.

http://www.sportys.com/acb/showdetl.cfm?&Product_ID=7154&DID=19
Item # M367S, $16.95 USD


"private" > wrote in message
news:RCyUd.524365$6l.57962@pd7tw2no...
> I downloaded the some good books from http://www.e-publishing.af.mil
>
> thanks for the links C J C
>
> Is there an online source for "Aerodynamics for Naval Aviators"?
>
> Blue skies to all.
>
>