Global Flyer Success

[Jan Nademlejnsky]

It is unbelievable achievement from those guys. Rutan is absolutely the best
engineer and unconventional dreamer. That's real engineering what he is
doing!

Congratulation to Steve for his remarkable success. I could not imagine to
be without sleep for so many hours with the jet engine screaming above your
head. I hope that Steve Fossett will stop now, because statistically he is
overdue to be killed in his risky adventures.

I was very disappointed with the Global Flyer website. The first day the GPS
coordinates were wrong, and it was almost impossible to access their site.
They posted very little information. I could get more info from CNN than
from their site. It took almost a day to mention anything about their fuel
problem.

The site was totally overloaded during the last few hours. Now 6 hours after
the touch down, there is still no update how it was during the final hours.
No pictures, clips, written text. I do not have access to CNN TV and the
local news show nothing.

Regardless, I hope the Rutan will live forever or that he is grooming
somebody as good as he is to continue in his unconventional designs.


Jan Nademlejnsky
http://members.shaw.ca/jannadem/home.htm

[Matt Whiting]

Jan Nademlejnsky wrote:

> It is unbelievable achievement from those guys. Rutan is absolutely the best
> engineer and unconventional dreamer. That's real engineering what he is
> doing!
>
> Congratulation to Steve for his remarkable success. I could not imagine to
> be without sleep for so many hours with the jet engine screaming above your
> head. I hope that Steve Fossett will stop now, because statistically he is
> overdue to be killed in his risky adventures.

Not another statistics thread. :-)

Actually, he is no more likely now than before and I'd venture even less
likely. He's shown the skill to handle dangerous missions so that
probably lessens his odds of hitting troubel.

Yes, it was a magnificient achievement for all involved.


Matt

[dpilot]

He just did the world's largest outside loop

dpilot



Matt Whiting wrote:
> Jan Nademlejnsky wrote:
>
>
>
> Matt

[Corky Scott]

On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 00:56:41 GMT, "Jan Nademlejnsky" >
wrote:

>I was very disappointed with the Global Flyer website. The first day the GPS
>coordinates were wrong, and it was almost impossible to access their site.
>They posted very little information. I could get more info from CNN than
>from their site. It took almost a day to mention anything about their fuel
>problem.

I gave up watching it on the Virgin Global Flyer website and went to
MSNBC where they had live coverage of the landing.

The airfield had been shut down while Steve was approaching, but he
was delayed while he dealt with a landing gear problem: his nose gear
would not show a green light.

He flew around outside the airport for about 45 extra minutes while he
tried to get three greens. The chase plane was informing him of
various leaks from the nose gear compartment and eventually
recommended he stop playing with the gear. About that time he
reported that he now had three greens and was ready to bring it in.

He was immediately cleared to land and flew an extended base leg for
the final approach. When he turned final, one of the pilots who was
holding for when the airport would be re-opened asked about him and
was told: "Global flyer 101 is on final". Whereupon the holding pilot
congratulated Fossett on the approach frequency. That opened a minor
floodgate of congratulatory, but brief calls, maybe six or eight in
total.

When he touched down, I was struck by how negative an attack the
airplane assumed when riding on all three landing gear. I can only
guess at the reasons, but seeing ahead out of the tiny bubble might be
one, the other might be to make SURE the airplane stays on the ground
once it touches down.

Corky Scott

[Rich Ahrens]

Corky Scott wrote:
> He was immediately cleared to land and flew an extended base leg for
> the final approach. When he turned final, one of the pilots who was
> holding for when the airport would be re-opened asked about him and
> was told: "Global flyer 101 is on final". Whereupon the holding pilot
> congratulated Fossett on the approach frequency. That opened a minor
> floodgate of congratulatory, but brief calls, maybe six or eight in
> total.

Did you hear the one anonymous call that said, "Fossett, you're a stud."?

[Blueskies]

"Corky Scott" > wrote in message ...
> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 00:56:41 GMT, "Jan Nademlejnsky" >
> wrote:
>
<snip>
> When he touched down, I was struck by how negative an attack the
> airplane assumed when riding on all three landing gear. I can only
> guess at the reasons, but seeing ahead out of the tiny bubble might be
> one, the other might be to make SURE the airplane stays on the ground
> once it touches down.
>
> Corky Scott

I imagine that the light weight at landing did not compress the main gear struts nearly as much as the heavy weight at
takeoff, thus the nose down attitude...

[[email protected]]

> I imagine that the light weight at landing did not compress the main
gear struts nearly as much as the heavy weight at
> takeoff, thus the nose down attitude...

Anybody heard how much fuel he had left when he landed? The world wants
to know.

David Johnson

[Jan Nademlejnsky]

Thanks Corky for very good update. I did not know that.

Thanks

Jan
"Corky Scott" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 04 Mar 2005 00:56:41 GMT, "Jan Nademlejnsky" >
> wrote:
>
>>I was very disappointed with the Global Flyer website. The first day the
>>GPS
>>coordinates were wrong, and it was almost impossible to access their site.
>>They posted very little information. I could get more info from CNN than
>>from their site. It took almost a day to mention anything about their fuel
>>problem.
>
> I gave up watching it on the Virgin Global Flyer website and went to
> MSNBC where they had live coverage of the landing.
>
> The airfield had been shut down while Steve was approaching, but he
> was delayed while he dealt with a landing gear problem: his nose gear
> would not show a green light.
>
> He flew around outside the airport for about 45 extra minutes while he
> tried to get three greens. The chase plane was informing him of
> various leaks from the nose gear compartment and eventually
> recommended he stop playing with the gear. About that time he
> reported that he now had three greens and was ready to bring it in.
>
> He was immediately cleared to land and flew an extended base leg for
> the final approach. When he turned final, one of the pilots who was
> holding for when the airport would be re-opened asked about him and
> was told: "Global flyer 101 is on final". Whereupon the holding pilot
> congratulated Fossett on the approach frequency. That opened a minor
> floodgate of congratulatory, but brief calls, maybe six or eight in
> total.
>
> When he touched down, I was struck by how negative an attack the
> airplane assumed when riding on all three landing gear. I can only
> guess at the reasons, but seeing ahead out of the tiny bubble might be
> one, the other might be to make SURE the airplane stays on the ground
> once it touches down.
>
> Corky Scott

[Dan Nafe]

In article >,
Matt Whiting > wrote:


> Yes, it was a magnificient achievement for all involved.


Is it safe to say that there are no more distance records to be broken?

;->

[Montblack]

("Dan Nafe" wrote)
> Is it safe to say that there are no more distance records to be broken?


Manned Earth orbit - private company

(Solar powered) around the globe.


Montblack

[Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired]

Montblack wrote:

> ("Dan Nafe" wrote)
>
>> Is it safe to say that there are no more distance records to be broken?
>
>
>
> Manned Earth orbit - private company
>
> (Solar powered) around the globe.
>
>
> Montblack

Human powered trans Atlantic...

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

[Richard Isakson]

"Dan Nafe" wrote ...
> Is it safe to say that there are no more distance records to be broken?

Both the Voyager and the Global Flyer claim to have "flown around the world"
on the basis of a rather broad and arbitrary definition of that goal. That
definiton includes a minimum distance of 19,863.7 NM. A very long distance
indeed and the Global Flyer went 19,880 NM.

But wait a minute, the circumference of the earth is 21,639 NM. A much
longer mission and neither the Voyager nor the Global Flyer had that sort of
range. So, yes, there is still a distance record out there. That of truely
"flying around the world" unrefueled. A true circumnavigation requires that
you pass through at least two points on the earth that are opposite each
other on the globe.

Rich

[Corky Scott]

On Tue, 8 Mar 2005 10:30:33 -0800, "Richard Isakson" >
wrote:

>But wait a minute, the circumference of the earth is 21,639 NM. A much
>longer mission and neither the Voyager nor the Global Flyer had that sort of
>range. So, yes, there is still a distance record out there. That of truely
>"flying around the world" unrefueled. A true circumnavigation requires that
>you pass through at least two points on the earth that are opposite each
>other on the globe.
>
>Rich

And let's not forget, the non stop circumnavigation by glider has yet
to be accomplished. Around the world without refueling by Moller air
car? Flying boat around the world without refueling? Heck, we're
just getting started here.

Corky Scott

[Richard Isakson]

"Corky Scott" wrote in message ...
> And let's not forget, the non stop circumnavigation by glider has yet
> to be accomplished.

I've often wondered if there's enough lift on one side of a jet stream to
hold up a glider.

>Around the world without refueling by Moller air car?

Wrong record. That's around the block by Moller air car.

Rich

[Morgans]

"Corky Scott" > wrote

> Around the world without refueling by Moller air
> car? Heck, we're just getting started here.

Dang, Corky! Gotta stop drinking coke while reading the newsgroup. It
burns on the way out the nose!
--
Jim in NC

[Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired]

Morgans wrote:
> "Corky Scott" > wrote
>
> > Around the world without refueling by Moller air
>
>>car? Heck, we're just getting started here.
>
>
> Dang, Corky! Gotta stop drinking coke while reading the newsgroup. It
> burns on the way out the nose!

Awww, Jim, you should have expected it :) In this NG there was bound to
be someone to say it.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

[UltraJohn]

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired wrote:

>
> Human powered trans Atlantic...
>
> Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired
Nah! The fuel weighs too much!
I'd take about 6 days with at least
40 big mac's a day that's a lot of
fuel to carry around.

John

[Bob Kuykendall]

Earlier, Richard Isakson wrote:

> I've often wondered if there's enough lift
> on one side of a jet stream to hold up a
> glider.

It's been two or three decades, but I know I've seen an article in
Soaring or Technical Soaring that discusses the feasability of a
related soaring flight technique. Specifically, the article suggested a
theoretically feasable technique involving maneuvers in the shear zone
at the edge of the jet stream. I remember thinking that it was one of
those "sure, it works in theory..." kinds of things.

Thanks, Bob K.
http://www.hpaircraft.com

[Bob Kuykendall]

Earlier, T o d d P a t t i s t wrote:

> The main problem is that it's hard to pressurize a leaky
> cockpit without an engine.

A couple years ago when I was putting together a business plan for a
Perlan competitor I did design studies and a couple of low-dollar
experiments that explored several ways of reducing leakage to very
managable rates. Given those leakage rates, it seemed quite feasable to
supply pressurization from compressed gas reservoirs for a twelve-hour
flight profile.

I wonder what they did for the Spaceship One? Of course, their flight
profile is relatively brief...

Bob K.

[Richard Isakson]

"T o d d P a t t i s t" wrote ...
> "Richard Isakson" > wrote:
>
> >I've often wondered if there's enough lift on one side of a jet stream to
> >hold up a glider.
>
> I've wondered that too. I've also wondered if you could
> milk it for dynamic lift (fly racetrack pattern and pull up
> on each leg).

That's an interesting idea. I've never thought about dynamic lift on that
scale. I'll try running some numbers to see if it makes any sense. I was
thinking that a jet stream core, as it moves up and down in latitude on a
spinning globe, might end up with some lateral vorticity that could be used
to surf on.

Rich

[Richard Isakson]

"Bob Kuykendall" wrote ...
> Earlier, T o d d P a t t i s t wrote:
>
> > The main problem is that it's hard to pressurize a leaky
> > cockpit without an engine.
>
> A couple years ago when I was putting together a business plan for a
> Perlan competitor I did design studies and a couple of low-dollar
> experiments that explored several ways of reducing leakage to very
> managable rates. Given those leakage rates, it seemed quite feasable to
> supply pressurization from compressed gas reservoirs for a twelve-hour
> flight profile.

Many years ago, here in Western Washington, someone was cold molding a
glider fuselage out of rosewood veneers. He was going to pressurize it and
use it to set high altitude records. I don't know what became of the
project.

Rich

[Bob Kuykendall]

Earlier, Richard Isakson wrote:

> Many years ago, here in Western
> Washington, someone was cold molding a
> glider fuselage out of rosewood veneers.
> He was going to pressurize it and use it
> to set high altitude records. I don't
> know what became of the project.

At a guess, I'd say that the man was Robert Lamson, and the aircraft
was the Alcor. It was eventually used as a research aircraft in the
Chinook project, flown on those missions by Tony Burton. It currently
hangs in the Seattle Museum of Flight.

I spoke with Tony Burton about the pressurization system when he gave a
talk on the Chinook project at the SHA Western Workshop '04. It was
based on an A-14 pressure-demand regulator and a modified mask.
Unfortunately, the pressurization system never was disabled for the
Chinook project; apparently the cockpit sealing wasn't effective
enough.

I think that the Chinook project is also discussed in the Ursula Weise
book _Stalking the Mountain Wave_.

Thanks, and best regards to all

Bob K.
http://www.hpaircraft.com

[Richard Isakson]

"Bob Kuykendall" wrote ...

> At a guess, I'd say that the man was Robert Lamson, and the aircraft
> was the Alcor. It was eventually used as a research aircraft in the
> Chinook project, flown on those missions by Tony Burton. It currently
> hangs in the Seattle Museum of Flight.

It's been a long time but that sure sounds right. Thanks Bob.

Rich

[Dave Hyde]

Todd Pattist wrote:

> As I suspect you know, it's usually
> referred to as "dynamic soaring."

Radio control glider guys use this technique on
upslope lift and the resulting shear layer to get
phenomenal speeds (250 mph+).

Dave 'if I wanted to fly in circles I'd fly control line' Hyde