High Blood Pressure

[Jay Honeck]

Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
efforts aren't going to do the trick.

Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise: 30
minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood pressure.

The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight, which
isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although losing 15 pounds
would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec for me, which *is* on the
AOPA's list of FAA approved medications, thankfully.

For those who have already been down this road, did this medication cause
any side effects? The doc says the most common one is a nagging cough, for
no known reason.

Thanks!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Rod Madsen]

>
> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise:
30
> minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood
pressure.
>
> The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight,
which
> isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although losing 15
pounds
> would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec for me, which *is* on
the
> AOPA's list of FAA approved medications, thankfully.

I've had some concerns about blood pressure and it has been addressed br
doctors. Mine is just a little lower than yours, and has been higher on
accasion. I (and my doctor) wouldn't be as concerned as your doctor is.
I'm the same size as you, exercise 1 hour vigorously (free weights) every
other day, and don't take any meds for it.

I'v been told that many BP meds cause erectile disfuntion. Maybe you can
give us a report on that?

Rod

[Cecil Chapman]

I'm no M.D., but have you tried the weight loss first? I mean DO it as
opposed to 'I think I'll give it a go'. My BP wasn't high (I'm 44) but I
did notice the first 15 lbs I shed changed my BP rather noticably. I had
kind of got careless eating out at restaurants (Italian one's with yummy
pasta) and at one point a couple of years ago I found myself nearning 190
lbs [YIKES!] (I'm only about 5' 7''). I first moved to 175 and that was
still too much, now I'm at 167 and shooting for keeping and maintaining 155
lbs (150 -155). Anyway, when I dropped to 167 I noticed a further drop in
BP.

Pardon me for asking (but I have noticed this pattern with some docs) is
your doctor overweight?; I ask this because (in my experience anyways)
overweight doctors seem a lot less likely to propose weight loss than a
doctor that otherwise is trim and fit.

--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -
"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:Qgg0e.96810$r55.62998@attbi_s52...
> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
> over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
> coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
> efforts aren't going to do the trick.
>
> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise:
> 30 minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood
> pressure.
>
> The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight,
> which isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although losing
> 15 pounds would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec for me, which
> *is* on the AOPA's list of FAA approved medications, thankfully.
>
> For those who have already been down this road, did this medication cause
> any side effects? The doc says the most common one is a nagging cough,
> for no known reason.
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>

[W P Dixon]

You make a good point about overweight docs Cecil! I don't have blood
pressure problems but my weight had sure gotten away from me since I
retired. After seeing 201 on the scale ( I'm 5'10") I decided to cut back,
when I got to 194 the doc did a cholestoral test and well my blood was so
thick from the sat fats and stuff it could have dropped a rhino! Now I am
really watching sat fat and cholestoral intake and am down to 183 . 194 to
183 in two weeks!!!!! I am bound and determined to get back to 165, my
weight as a Marine.
But back to the docs, most of the fat ones may tell you to change your
diet but never tell you how. Hard for them to I guess because they are not
doing it either!!!
Everything I have read on high blood pressure pretty much has the
opinion that exercise is the key to getting it low. And of course evening
out stress and fun days can help as well. Problem with that is most people
still stress when they are doing something they love to do . Flying for
instance , we all love it ..but it can be stressful. Maybe a little country
airport with no tower and some good old fashined flying in a old Piper
without all the gizmos and gadgets may do the trick as far as keeping away
from rules rules rules and all the ATC crap that causes stress.
Years ago people used to go driving to relieve the tension of the day ,
now it's said people who drive more have more stress and heart attacks. I
forget where I read that , so don't get your panties in a wad Peter ;) look
it up somewhere!!! HAHAHA

Patrick
student SPL
aircraft structural mech

[Dan Youngquist]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005, Jay Honeck wrote:

> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'.
> Exercise: 30 minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and
> high blood pressure.

There have been some studies indicating that Vitamins C & E can help high
blood pressure by improving the function of the heart & blood vessels.
Might be worth looking into. A good place to start would be to plug the
following into your favorite search engine:

"high blood pressure" "vitamin c" "vitamin e"

-Dan

[[email protected]]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'.
Exercise: 30
> minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood
pressure.
>
Jay,
Are the systolic levels always in this range? You may want to
monitor your BP at home througout the day to see it you can determine
the contributing factors. Rick had borderline high BP levels which go
up with high sodium-content food, coffee and cold medications. The
B.P. typically stays in the normal range after exercise. One of his
doctors advised him to use medication for preventive measurement based
on family history (both of his parents suffered strokes late in their
life) but the other said it was not needed. So far, he has been trying
to control it mainly through exercise and diet. Potassium supplement
(and eating bananas) seems to help also.
It's interesting that different doctors have different views about
medications. We both had our annual checkups last month and were
surprised to see our cholesterol levels crept up to the mid 200s. His
doctor advised him to be more vigilant in monitoring his diets and
inreased exercise activities. My doctor immediately wanted to put me on
lipitor. Granted that we have been doing all the right things (having
low BMI, exercise daily, eating lots of fruits, vegetables, whole grain
foods, avoid red meats etc.) but we can certainly be more strict with
our diets and to increase physical activity level. Lipitor is on the
FAA approved medication list but I will have to get a statement from my
doctor for my upcoming medical exam. I am considering replacing
lipitor with some natural supplements such as policosanol. Will see if
my doctor agrees to this approach.
Hai

[Montblack]

("Jay Honeck" wrote)
> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
> over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
> coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
> efforts aren't going to do the trick.


Sodium, sodium, sodium!!!! It's everywhere. BTW, caffine too - as in caffine
bad. That'll take down those numbers a bit.

....and drop those 15 lbs lardbutt! (Name calling has proven 80% as effective
as the Grapefruit Diet :-)

Oh, watch out for diabetes!!! BTDT. High BP is a gateway to diabetes. They
used to call it Early-Onset Type 2, now they just say you're either preggers
or you're not. Glucose Tolerance test will tell.

Sodium, sodium, sodium, sodium, sodium... Like I'm going to preach diet and
exercise? <g>

Good luck, keep us posted.


Montblack

[oldal4865]

Jay Honeck wrote in message ...
.. . .>
>Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise: 30
>minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood
pressure.
>
>The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight, which
>isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although losing 15
pounds
>would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec for me, which *is* on
the
>AOPA's list of FAA approved medications, thankfully.
>
>For those who have already been down this road, did this medication cause
>any side effects? The doc says the most common one is a nagging cough, for
>no known reason.
>
>Thanks!
>--
>Jay Honeck
>Iowa City, IA
>Pathfinder N56993
>www.AlexisParkInn.com
>"Your Aviation Destination"
>
>

Vasotec is an ACE inhibitor. Persistent cough is a side effect of all
members of the ACE family. ARB are just as effective, don't have any
major side effects, but are more expensive.

Creeping b.p. is a sign of approaching diabetes and/or hidden high Insulin
Resistance. If your triglycerides/HDL ratio is 3.0 or higher, you
need some really good medical advice ASAP.

FWIW, ACE have marked beneficial effects on Type 2 Diabetics.

Umm. . .IMO, 155/85 is "waiting too long".

Regards
Old Al

[jsmith]

Is that the pot I hear calling the kettle black? :-))

> ("Jay Honeck" wrote)
>> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
>> over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
>> coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
>> efforts aren't going to do the trick.

> Montblack wrote:
> Sodium, sodium, sodium!!!! It's everywhere. BTW, caffine too - as in caffine
> bad. That'll take down those numbers a bit.
> ...and drop those 15 lbs lardbutt! (Name calling has proven 80% as effective
> as the Grapefruit Diet :-)
> Oh, watch out for diabetes!!! BTDT. High BP is a gateway to diabetes. They
> used to call it Early-Onset Type 2, now they just say you're either preggers
> or you're not. Glucose Tolerance test will tell.
> Sodium, sodium, sodium, sodium, sodium... Like I'm going to preach diet and
> exercise? <g>
> Good luck, keep us posted.

[Jack Allison]

Montblack wrote:
> Sodium, sodium, sodium!!!! It's everywhere. BTW, caffine too - as in
> caffine
> bad. That'll take down those numbers a bit.

Might be time for (dare I say) light beer Jay? :-) Oh no, now I've
done it, crossed serious line :-)
>
> ....and drop those 15 lbs lardbutt! (Name calling has proven 80% as
> effective
> as the Grapefruit Diet :-)
Hmmmm, does the pot calling the kettle black work too? <ducking> :-)


--
Jack Allison
PP-ASEL-IA Student-Arrow Shopping Student

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth
with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there
you will always long to return"
- Leonardo Da Vinci

(Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

[[email protected]]

Montblack,
You are right that "sodium, sodium, sodium" is everywhere.
Processed and restaurant foods are made for the average tastebuds which
favor high sodium content. Over the years, we have gradually weaned
ourselves from salty food to the point that we can no longer eat any
pre-processed food or enjoying dining out. In more than one occasions
where I could not eat some salty food only to see someone at the next
table shaking more salt on the exact dish.
Here is an interesting article on salt, the "Forgotten Killer"
http://www.cspinet.org/new/200502242.html

"Too much salt in the diet is boosting Americans' blood pressure and
is prematurely killing roughly 150,000 people each year.....Despite the
pleas of health experts to cut back, salt consumption has drifted
upward over the past 30 years to the point where Americans are now
consuming about 4,000 milligrams of sodium per day-about twice the
recommended amount"

[Dave Butler]

Dan Youngquist wrote:
> On Wed, 23 Mar 2005, Jay Honeck wrote:
>
>> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'.
>> Exercise: 30 minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and
>> high blood pressure.
>
>
> There have been some studies indicating that Vitamins C & E can help
> high blood pressure by improving the function of the heart & blood
> vessels. Might be worth looking into. A good place to start would be to
> plug the following into your favorite search engine:
>
> "high blood pressure" "vitamin c" "vitamin e"

When you do that, you'll find that vitamin E has recently been found to be not
as effective as previously thought, and has some negative effects.

DGB

[Dave Butler]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
> over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
> coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
> efforts aren't going to do the trick.
>
> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise: 30
> minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood pressure.
>
> The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight, which
> isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although losing 15 pounds
> would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec for me, which *is* on the
> AOPA's list of FAA approved medications, thankfully.
>
> For those who have already been down this road, did this medication cause
> any side effects? The doc says the most common one is a nagging cough, for
> no known reason.

I'm there, too, Jay, but not quite as high as yours. My dr prescribed the DASH
eating plan: http://www.nhlbi.nih.gov/health/public/heart/hbp/dash/ I'm trying
to follow it, but it's not easy. Cutting the sodium down to the levels they
recommend has so far eluded me. Everything has sodium. You've got to read the
labels.

I'm sure reducing my sodium intake is helping even if I never get to the
recommended levels. I've lost a few lbs., and I think the BP has come down a
little, it's really hard to pick out trends because there's so much noise in the
signal. Anyway, the DASH thing seems pretty sensible, it wouldn't hurt to take a
look at it.

Good luck.

DGB

[Montblack]

("jsmith" wrote)
> Is that the pot I hear calling the kettle black? :-))


Busted. Pot-bellied stove calling the kettle black - yup! <g-irth> .

My BP numbers are (just) below Jay's.
HbA1c (120 day) blood test is 6.5%. Could be lower but it's in the ok
percent.

(Healthy) HDL is a little low. Will come up with more exercise I'm told.
(Lousy) LDL is actually really quite good (thanks grandparents)

HOWEVER!!! Glucose tolerance test - preggers. But manageable w/o meds.

Now, that pesky weight....oh yeah, and something about sodium.


Mont[black]
(a.k.a. LA)

[Paul kgyy]

It's hard to find a circulatory system drug that doesn't have side
effects. You just have to experiment. I use a beta blocker
(atenolol), not primarily for HBP but for arrythmia but a very small
dose takes 10 points off BP. Only side effect is vivid dreams, not too
bad...;-)

Incidentally, the cholesterol theory of heart disease is pretty well
discredited these days. The cholesterol may actually be part of the
body's repair process for arteries damaged by unknown processes. Check
out www.thincs.org

[[email protected]]

Jay,

I'll second Dave recommendation. The DASH diet is very effective in
lowering BP. The key is sufficient calcium, magnesium and potassium
intake. And limit the sodium!

I also have some issues with BP. Mine is only high in the Dr. office.
At home it's around 130/75. I'm considering taking some flight lessons,
if I can scare up the $$$. I've been advised to get the medical out of
the way before the lessons. Wouldn't want to get held up in the event I
can't show a decent BP reading at the MD's office.

Cheers,
Mike

[Montblack]

("Jack Allison" wrote)
> Might be time for (dare I say) light beer Jay? :-) Oh no, now I've done
> it, crossed serious line :-)

> Hmmmm, does the pot calling the kettle black work too? <ducking> :-)


Mmm ...roasted duck at the Chines buffet.

I bet you ride your bike to work, don't you? Oh wait, you do. Well this
isn't going anywhere :-)

I'm the only (super-sized) one in the family - even cousins. (Adopted? I
always suspected)

Slightly less mass than last year's OSH, but not down by nearly enough -
yet.


Mont[black]

[Jim Burns]

So.... does this mean no OSH Pig?!!!
Jim

[Matt Whiting]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
> over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
> coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
> efforts aren't going to do the trick.
>
> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise: 30
> minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood pressure.
>
> The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight, which
> isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although losing 15 pounds
> would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec for me, which *is* on the
> AOPA's list of FAA approved medications, thankfully.
>
> For those who have already been down this road, did this medication cause
> any side effects? The doc says the most common one is a nagging cough, for
> no known reason.
>
> Thanks!

I had the same thing happen when I was 37 (I'm now 45). I started out
on Vasotec also as best I recall. I think this is in the class called
ACE inhibitors, right? I've taken a couple of different one's since
then, mainly due to requests by my insurance company, and am now taking
Atacand. I think most all of the ACE inhibitors are FAA approved and
I've never had a side-effect attributed to the BP meds. I've always
taken the smallest dose available and it has kept my BP under good control.


Matt

[Matt Whiting]

Rod Madsen wrote:

> I'v been told that many BP meds cause erectile disfuntion. Maybe you can
> give us a report on that?

I've never had a problem with any of the ACE inhibitors. :-)

Matt

[[email protected]]

Jay, I've been lurking and reading your posts for months. I'm a
student pilot but also happen to be a MD. Don't hesitate to treat your
BP with medication. It's highly effective and proven to reduce the
long term risks of hypertension. If you indeed have a strong family
history...all the weight loss and exercise in the world won't
necessarily do it for you (although it can't hurt either). Limit your
sodium intake, exercise regularly, reduce stress, and if you do it,
quit smoking.
There's no inherent personal weakness in having to take medication to
control your blood pressure.
I'm on two meds myself. One other thing...don't rely on just one blood
pressure measurement to determine your course of action. There are
some good home BP units out there...most notably the Omron. Keep a log
of your blood pressure at different times of the day and under
different circumstances. This will help your doc get an idea of your
"true" blood pressure and gauge the effect of any meds he (or she)
puts you on.
Good luck and I hope to fly in to your establishment some day soon!
CPW

[Morgans]

"Jim Burns" > wrote in message
...
> So.... does this mean no OSH Pig?!!!
> Jim
>
NOW you have gone too far! <g>
--
Jim in NC

[Morgans]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message

> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
> over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
> coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
> efforts aren't going to do the trick.
>
> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise:
30
> minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood
pressure.

With a family history of stroke and heart attack, now is no time to mess
around while you "work on it". Get on an approved medicine, then try to get
the other things to where you can try a spell without medicine, and see if
it is still high. Simple diuretics are cheap, and effective for some
people..

Now the shock line. People younger than you, with blood pressure higher
than you, have died of heart attacks *at your age*.

Take care of it, no joke. Your family deserves to have you around.
--
Jim in NC

[Jay Honeck]

> Pardon me for asking (but I have noticed this pattern with some docs) is
> your doctor overweight?; I ask this because (in my experience anyways)
> overweight doctors seem a lot less likely to propose weight loss than a
> doctor that otherwise is trim and fit.

Nope, he's a short, thin guy.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> There have been some studies indicating that Vitamins C & E can help high
> blood pressure by improving the function of the heart & blood vessels.

Great idea! I take both every day. Have for many years.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> Might be time for (dare I say) light beer Jay? :-) Oh no, now I've done
> it, crossed serious line :-)

GAAAAHHH! I'd rather die.

Nevah, I say -- NEVAH!

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

>> So.... does this mean no OSH Pig?!!!

> NOW you have gone too far! <g>

Agreed. There WILL be pig in OSH, whether my BP is high, low, or in
between.

And real beer.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Morgans]

"Morgans" > wrote

> Now the shock line. People younger than you, with blood pressure higher
(oops, should read LOWER than you.

> than you, have died of heart attacks *at your age*.

[Jay Honeck]

> Jay, I've been lurking and reading your posts for months. I'm a
> student pilot but also happen to be a MD. Don't hesitate to treat your
> BP with medication. It's highly effective and proven to reduce the
> long term risks of hypertension. If you indeed have a strong family
> history...all the weight loss and exercise in the world won't
> necessarily do it for you (although it can't hurt either)

Thanks for the advice, Doc.

My father had strokes and high BP. (Of course, he also weighed 225 pounds,
at my height, was a heavy smoker, and refused to see doctors -- ever.)

His mother had a couple of strokes. She didn't drink, smoke, or have any
known bad habits, and lived to be 86 years old.

My father's grandfather died of stroke. (His father died young, in the
great 1918 flu epidemic).

In fact, our oldest ancestor in the US died of stroke in 1908. It's in the
genes, big time.

I haven't smoked since 1986, and work out daily with my 14 year old son.
And while 197 is a tad high for 6 feet tall, I don't have a paunch.

Dang. Guess I'm going to have to take the stupid drugs.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Blood pressure tip]

> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise:
> 30
> minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood
> pressure.
> <snip>


and here are some more facts---

My blood pressure was taken the other day for a routine yearly physical and
the reading was 120/80. the BOTTOM number, the one we all concern
ourselves with was 10 points higher than any other reading ever done on me
and my pulse was racing, called palpitations. This was all news to me!

You see, after I rang the bell at check-in, I told the staff I was going
(walking) to the post office (a two block walk each way.) I walked at a
brisk pace and by the time I returned to the clinic I was huffing and
puffing and thought nothing of it. The reading was taken almost
immediately after I had returned.

THEN IT HIT ME ABOUT AN HOUR LATER----

If a reading is to be given THE CORRECT WAY IS " NO EXERCISE FOR AT LEAST
A HALF HOUR prior to the reading.. SITTING OR LAYING DOWN IS IDEAL.

If this sounds like your situation, take it over!! Hope this helps and
good luck

[George Patterson]

Cecil Chapman wrote:
>
> Pardon me for asking (but I have noticed this pattern with some docs) is
> your doctor overweight?; I ask this because (in my experience anyways)
> overweight doctors seem a lot less likely to propose weight loss than a
> doctor that otherwise is trim and fit.

Jay has mentioned a few times that he's been keeping his son company in the
weight-training room. Now, my doc tells me that weight training won't do
anything for blood pressure or cholesterol, but it *does* build muscle mass. And
muscle weighs more than fat.

I think it likely that Jay's doctor didn't recommend that he go on a diet
because he knows that Jay isn't actually overweight. The papers in this neck of
the woods frequently carry a story about someone built like Arnold who fails the
weight/height requirements of his job.

George Patterson
Drink up, Socrates -- it's all-natural.

[William W. Plummer]

Matt Whiting wrote:
> Jay Honeck wrote:
>
>> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly
>> climb over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the
>> hotel -- coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective
>> weight loss efforts aren't going to do the trick.
>>
>> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'.
>> Exercise: 30 minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and
>> high blood pressure.
>>
>> The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight,
>> which isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although
>> losing 15 pounds would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec
>> for me, which *is* on the AOPA's list of FAA approved medications,
>> thankfully.
>>
>> For those who have already been down this road, did this medication
>> cause any side effects? The doc says the most common one is a nagging
>> cough, for no known reason.
>>
>> Thanks!
>
>
> I had the same thing happen when I was 37 (I'm now 45). I started out
> on Vasotec also as best I recall. I think this is in the class called
> ACE inhibitors, right? I've taken a couple of different one's since
> then, mainly due to requests by my insurance company, and am now taking
> Atacand. I think most all of the ACE inhibitors are FAA approved and
> I've never had a side-effect attributed to the BP meds. I've always
> taken the smallest dose available and it has kept my BP under good control.
>
It was my AME that spotted my sugar problem. My primary physician put
me on dyazide (diuretic) and later switched me to lisinopril, an ACE
inhibitor that also helps with diabetes. I am on 5 mg per day but the
AME said he starts patients on 40 mg!

There have not been any ED problems. The AME was completely satisfied
with my BG record that I bought in. I have a program that reads out the
data from my BG meter and lets me plot it over a selected date range.

I don't have full blown type-2 but am able to control blood glucose
and blood pressure through diet and exercise (uggggh). Avoid white
things: rice, bread, pasta. Avoid salt but it's almost impossible to
get your calories and keep Na down to 1500 mg per day (recommendation by
the ADA).

I haven't had a beer in 2 years because of the starch in it. "Low carb
beer" is an oxymoron anyway. However, alcohol does _lower_ blood
glucose and blood pressure. It's just fattening.

If anyone out there has an alternative to the treadmill and Nautilus
machines, please let me know. Exercise is the most mindless activity I
an imagine. A standard day involves 8 hour of sleep and 8 hours of
work, leaving 8 hours for everything else including exercise. An hour
of exercise wastes 12.5% of your "usable" life. As things stand, I can
stop exercising but would have to take a diabetes-specific drug for the
rest of my life. That would void my 3rd class Medical Certificate.

[Matt Whiting]

William W. Plummer wrote:

> If anyone out there has an alternative to the treadmill and Nautilus
> machines, please let me know. Exercise is the most mindless activity I
> an imagine. A standard day involves 8 hour of sleep and 8 hours of
> work, leaving 8 hours for everything else including exercise. An hour
> of exercise wastes 12.5% of your "usable" life. As things stand, I can
> stop exercising but would have to take a diabetes-specific drug for the
> rest of my life. That would void my 3rd class Medical Certificate.

I bought a good bicycle last summer and took several 25 mile rides in
hilly country. It helped me lose 10 lbs. over the summer and is much
more enjoyable than a stationary bike in a fitness center ... even with
the TVs and head phones. I'd always had really cheap 10-12 speed road
bikes before and they were a pain to ride. My new Fuji comfort style
bike is pretty comfortable even for a 45 year-old body. I'm looking
forward to the end of winter so I can get back on the road.

Why do you say an hour of exercise wastes 12.5% of your usable life? If
it lets you live 10 years longer, then you'll likely at least break
even. :-)


Matt

[William W. Plummer]

Matt Whiting wrote:

> William W. Plummer wrote:
>
>> If anyone out there has an alternative to the treadmill and Nautilus
>> machines, please let me know. Exercise is the most mindless activity
>> I an imagine. A standard day involves 8 hour of sleep and 8 hours of
>> work, leaving 8 hours for everything else including exercise. An hour
>> of exercise wastes 12.5% of your "usable" life. As things stand, I
>> can stop exercising but would have to take a diabetes-specific drug
>> for the rest of my life. That would void my 3rd class Medical
>> Certificate.
>
>
> I bought a good bicycle last summer and took several 25 mile rides in
> hilly country. It helped me lose 10 lbs. over the summer and is much
> more enjoyable than a stationary bike in a fitness center ... even with
> the TVs and head phones. I'd always had really cheap 10-12 speed road
> bikes before and they were a pain to ride. My new Fuji comfort style
> bike is pretty comfortable even for a 45 year-old body. I'm looking
> forward to the end of winter so I can get back on the road.
>
> Why do you say an hour of exercise wastes 12.5% of your usable life? If
> it lets you live 10 years longer, then you'll likely at least break
> even. :-)
>
>
> Matt
One eighth = 0.125 or 12.5%
One hour of the 8 you have for this sort of thing.

[Eric Rood]

Backpacking works for me.
I have started making my own dehydrated meals.
This allows me to have total control over the contents.

William W. Plummer wrote:
> If anyone out there has an alternative to the treadmill and Nautilus
> machines, please let me know. Exercise is the most mindless activity I
> an imagine. A standard day involves 8 hour of sleep and 8 hours of
> work, leaving 8 hours for everything else including exercise. An hour
> of exercise wastes 12.5% of your "usable" life. As things stand, I can
> stop exercising but would have to take a diabetes-specific drug for the
> rest of my life. That would void my 3rd class Medical Certificate.

[Jack Allison]

Jay Honeck wrote:
> GAAAAHHH! I'd rather die.
>
> Nevah, I say -- NEVAH!
>
> ;-)

:-) Pretty much the response I figured. Hey, we all have our convictions.

--
Jack Allison
PP-ASEL-IA Student-Arrow Shopping Student

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth
with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there
you will always long to return"
- Leonardo Da Vinci

(Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

[Jack Allison]

Montblack wrote:

> Mmm ...roasted duck at the Chines buffet.
Actually...the local Chinese place tonight. Not a buffet but still
enough food to bring home...<burp>

>
> I bet you ride your bike to work, don't you? Oh wait, you do. Well this
> isn't going anywhere :-)
Especially since I rode home today and will ride to work tomorrow
morning. Only 7.5 miles each way (used to be 16.5 along the American
River bike trail...watch out for the squirrels).

> I'm the only (super-sized) one in the family - even cousins. (Adopted? I
> always suspected)
For whatever reason, I inherited Dad's height (and, unfortunately, his
hairline) and Mom's metabolism.

>
> Slightly less mass than last year's OSH, but not down by nearly enough -
> yet.
Every bit helps. Step away from the chips Mr. and nobody gets hurt. :-)


--
Jack Allison
PP-ASEL-IA Student-Arrow Shopping Student

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth
with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there
you will always long to return"
- Leonardo Da Vinci

(Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

[Scott D.]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 11:24:48 -0500, "Rod Madsen"
> wrote:

>>

>
>I'v been told that many BP meds cause erectile disfuntion. Maybe you can
>give us a report on that?
>
>Rod
>
And I was always told it was caused by marriage.

Scott D.
Scott D

To email remove spamcatcher

[Cockpit Colin]

Give us an insite as to what your diet is - that's where high BP starts.

[George Patterson]

Cockpit Colin wrote:
>
> Give us an insite as to what your diet is - that's where high BP starts.

Well, he keeps talking about brats and full-bodied beer. That should give you a
clue.

George Patterson
Drink up, Socrates -- it's all-natural.

[Tony]

Look up the DASH diet, it's been proven to reduce bp the order of
6mm/4mm. May be enough to reduce meds. Weight loss of 10 kG (22 pounds
or so) has been found to be worth about -10mm/-7mm or so.

BP does matter: things start happening more often once you start
running above 115/77 pr sp, and of course get worse the high it is.
Hey, the changes aren't dramatic, but it's your life. Even if the
likelyhood of a stroke in a given year goes from 3% to 2%, if it's YOUR
stroke that's avoided, you're ahead of the game.

Take responsibility!

[Jay Honeck]

>> Give us an insite as to what your diet is - that's where high BP starts.
>
> Well, he keeps talking about brats and full-bodied beer. That should give
> you a
> clue.

Hey, now. Those are only occasional pleasures.

Breakfast is usually a "sawdust bar" (one of those high-fiber, low fat
granola bars) or a piece of left-over bakery (muffin, bagel) from the hotel,
and "Half-and-half" coffee. (50% of the normal caffeine.)

Lunch is a half sandwich and bowl of soup, with chips and a diet pop.

Supper is whatever Mary makes, or whatever we eat at a restaurant. This is
obviously a dangerous meal, and one that I have the most trouble with.

Last night it was ribs, baked potato and sour cream, green beans, salad and
water. And, since it was my "Saturday night", a couple of Sprecher beers.

All and all, not a bad day -- but too much salt and fat. Still, I just
finished 30 minutes of lifting with my son, so hopefully I've offset some of
it!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jay Honeck]

> Jay has mentioned a few times that he's been keeping his son company in
> the
> weight-training room. Now, my doc tells me that weight training won't do
> anything for blood pressure or cholesterol, but it *does* build muscle
> mass. And
> muscle weighs more than fat.

My doc told me that weight training may actually *increase* blood pressure.

Which really sucks.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jim Burns]

Whew!!! Some things ARE still sacred! :)
Jim

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:SNm0e.97894$r55.42351@attbi_s52...
> >> So.... does this mean no OSH Pig?!!!
>
> > NOW you have gone too far! <g>
>
> Agreed. There WILL be pig in OSH, whether my BP is high, low, or in
> between.
>
> And real beer.
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>
>

[Jay Honeck]

> Whew!!! Some things ARE still sacred! :)

Absolutely. You can either live, or you are just waiting to die -- it's
your choice.

Passing on an OSH pig roast (with real beer) is tantamount to mounting a
deathwatch, IMHO...

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Jim Burns]

Live hard but die harder! :) Glad to see you're still a Wisconsin native.
Good food, good beer, and great airplanes.... God's Country!
Jim

[William W. Plummer]

Jay Honeck wrote:
>>>Give us an insite as to what your diet is - that's where high BP starts.
>>
>>Well, he keeps talking about brats and full-bodied beer. That should give
>>you a
>>clue.
>
>
> Hey, now. Those are only occasional pleasures.
>
> Breakfast is usually a "sawdust bar" (one of those high-fiber, low fat
> granola bars) or a piece of left-over bakery (muffin, bagel) from the hotel,
> and "Half-and-half" coffee. (50% of the normal caffeine.)
>
> Lunch is a half sandwich and bowl of soup, with chips and a diet pop.
>
> Supper is whatever Mary makes, or whatever we eat at a restaurant. This is
> obviously a dangerous meal, and one that I have the most trouble with.
>
> Last night it was ribs, baked potato and sour cream, green beans, salad and
> water. And, since it was my "Saturday night", a couple of Sprecher beers.
>
> All and all, not a bad day -- but too much salt and fat. Still, I just
> finished 30 minutes of lifting with my son, so hopefully I've offset some of
> it!
Of what you listed only the beans, salad, water and lifting are "good".
I do all the cooking and I serve things such as fish (2x per week),
bean salad (not baked beans), turkey, lots of vegetables, tomatoes, etc.
Try a can of "pink salmon" for lunch. Look on http://www.webmd.com
for discussion boards on high blood pressure, diabetes, diets for losing
weight. Dr. Ornish has a board there.

Also, for additional exercise, we do a couple of hours of
http://www.geocaching.com . It's enjoyable hiking through the woods,
with a goal. I've found trails and parks within two miles of my home
that I had not discovered in 18 years of living here!

[Corky Scott]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 23:10:05 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
> wrote:

>> There have been some studies indicating that Vitamins C & E can help high
>> blood pressure by improving the function of the heart & blood vessels.
>
>Great idea! I take both every day. Have for many years.

Jay, my information is that vitamin E has lost favor recently as a
benefit. It in fact may hurt more than help. Please check with an
expert before continuing with E intake.

Corky Scott

[Corky Scott]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:39:38 -0500, "Blood pressure tip"
> wrote:

>If a reading is to be given THE CORRECT WAY IS " NO EXERCISE FOR AT LEAST
>A HALF HOUR prior to the reading.. SITTING OR LAYING DOWN IS IDEAL.
>
>If this sounds like your situation, take it over!! Hope this helps and
>good luck

No coffee either. Drinking coffee prior to taking Blood Pressure
raises the values.

Corky Scott

[Casey Wilson]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:t_y0e.101078$Ze3.47168@attbi_s51...

> All and all, not a bad day -- but too much salt and fat. Still, I just
> finished 30 minutes of lifting with my son, so hopefully I've offset some
> of it!
> --

Hmmm, This needs a thread between anaerobic and aerobic exercises.
First off, any time the calorie output exceeds the calorie input the result
is a net loss in weight -- regardless of the type of exercise. So much for
that.
But the real answer to exercising to improve the cardiovascular system
lies in aerobic exercise. A minimum aerobic workout would be something
equivalent to walking at a pace that pushes your heart rate up to your
individual training range and sustaining that pulse rate for at least 20
minutes, followed by a gradual cool-down to prevent cramping.
The published minimum is three times a week, although I hear rumors that
both duration and frequency are being increased by the pundits. In any case,
start out at the minimums and increase gradually. What I discovered was
that, as I began to improve, I had to work harder and longer just to get the
pulse rate into the training range. I can't run because of a hip problem so
I had to keep extending the times, that works also.
You can do the same thing indoors with treadmills, stationary bikes,
elliptical trainers, stairstepper, etc., when the weather doesn't permit.
Personally, I like to see the sky and smell the flowers so I'm outside
whenever I can.
Anaerobic, free-weights, Nautilus, etc., are great for muscle
development. I do 3 days aerobic alternating with 2 days anaerobic.
I'm on a BP med and my doc just cut the dose in half. My BP, typically,
is 110/60, now.
In any case, DO NOT rely on exercise alone to improve your CV status.
Over a period of time, calories out has to exceed calories in if you are
going to reduce the weight. I'll bet though, that weight isn't your
problem, not working as an inn-keeper.

[SFM]

The nagging cough is an allergic reaction to vasotec and if you get it you
should be removed form the medication. For a person in your age and gender
group I am surprised that he did not suggest atenonol (Tenormin) as it is
also a beta blocker that will reduce slightly your pulse which has benefits
as well for heart attack crowd (men).

Atenonal and vasotect will require you to have a cardiac assessment so that
you can keep your medical. Not too much other than an EKG and CBC which you
should be having anyways and a letter stating that your BP is stable and
that there is no end organ damage.

Scott

--
------------------------------------------------------------------
Scott F. Migaldi, K9PO
MI-150972
PP-ASEL-IA

Are you a PADI Instructor or DM? Then join the PADI
Instructor Yahoo Group at
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PADI-Instructors/join
-----------------------------------
Catch the wave!
www.hamwave.com


"I can accept that Bush won the election. What I have a hard time
swallowing is that I live in a country where more than half the
population is willfully ignorant, politically obstinate, religiously
prejudiced, and embarrassingly gullible."

-------------------------------------
"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:Qgg0e.96810$r55.62998@attbi_s52...
> Well, I'm officially old. After watching my blood pressure slowly climb
> over the last three years (strangely, the years we've owned the hotel --
> coincidence? :-), my doctor has decided that my ineffective weight loss
> efforts aren't going to do the trick.
>
> Here are the facts: BP is 155/85. Weight: 197. Height: 6'. Exercise:
30
> minutes every day. Family has a history of strokes and high blood
pressure.
>
> The good doctor says the elevated BP isn't being caused by my weight,
which
> isn't too far out of line for a 46 year old guy. (Although losing 15
pounds
> would certainly help.) He has prescribed Vasotec for me, which *is* on
the
> AOPA's list of FAA approved medications, thankfully.
>
> For those who have already been down this road, did this medication cause
> any side effects? The doc says the most common one is a nagging cough,
for
> no known reason.
>
> Thanks!
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>
>

[Jack Allison]

> And real beer.
Anyone looking for a definition of Jay's "real beer" or "good beer"
comments...Google is your friend. :-)

Long live the Jay Honeck, grand beer pooh-bah of Oshkosh (and assorted
other locations I'm sure). :-)

--
Jack Allison
PP-ASEL-IA Student-Arrow Shopping Student

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth
with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there
you will always long to return"
- Leonardo Da Vinci

(Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

[jsmith]

When Jay gets worried about Mary doing all the flying, he will have the
incentive to do everything he has to do to get his BP down.
Of course, Mary is probably cooking all the meals.
Is this a conspiricy on her part?
When she states that it is time for her to get her instrument ticket, we
will have an answer.

[OtisWinslow]

That probably depends on what kind you're doing.


"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:n%y0e.99111$r55.405@attbi_s52...
>> Jay has mentioned a few times that he's been keeping his son company in
>> the
>> weight-training room. Now, my doc tells me that weight training won't do
>> anything for blood pressure or cholesterol, but it *does* build muscle
>> mass. And
>> muscle weighs more than fat.
>
> My doc told me that weight training may actually *increase* blood
> pressure.
>
> Which really sucks.
> --
> Jay Honeck
> Iowa City, IA
> Pathfinder N56993
> www.AlexisParkInn.com
> "Your Aviation Destination"
>

[Jim Burns]

Results 1 - 10 of 252 for "Jay Honeck" +beer.

Jim


"Jack Allison" > wrote in message
...
> > And real beer.
> Anyone looking for a definition of Jay's "real beer" or "good beer"
> comments...Google is your friend. :-)
>
> Long live the Jay Honeck, grand beer pooh-bah of Oshkosh (and assorted
> other locations I'm sure). :-)
>
> --
> Jack Allison
> PP-ASEL-IA Student-Arrow Shopping Student
>
> "When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth
> with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there
> you will always long to return"
> - Leonardo Da Vinci
>
> (Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

[Matt Whiting]

William W. Plummer wrote:
> Matt Whiting wrote:
>
>> William W. Plummer wrote:
>>
>>> If anyone out there has an alternative to the treadmill and Nautilus
>>> machines, please let me know. Exercise is the most mindless
>>> activity I an imagine. A standard day involves 8 hour of sleep and 8
>>> hours of work, leaving 8 hours for everything else including
>>> exercise. An hour of exercise wastes 12.5% of your "usable" life.
>>> As things stand, I can stop exercising but would have to take a
>>> diabetes-specific drug for the rest of my life. That would void my
>>> 3rd class Medical Certificate.
>>
>>
>>
>> I bought a good bicycle last summer and took several 25 mile rides in
>> hilly country. It helped me lose 10 lbs. over the summer and is much
>> more enjoyable than a stationary bike in a fitness center ... even
>> with the TVs and head phones. I'd always had really cheap 10-12 speed
>> road bikes before and they were a pain to ride. My new Fuji comfort
>> style bike is pretty comfortable even for a 45 year-old body. I'm
>> looking forward to the end of winter so I can get back on the road.
>>
>> Why do you say an hour of exercise wastes 12.5% of your usable life?
>> If it lets you live 10 years longer, then you'll likely at least break
>> even. :-)
>>
>>
>> Matt
>
> One eighth = 0.125 or 12.5%
> One hour of the 8 you have for this sort of thing.

I understood the calculation, but I don't agree with the assumption.
The underlying assumption is that the exercise has no affect on your
lifespan and I don't think that is a valid assumption. You only lose
12.5% if the exercise has no redeeming value on your lifespan.

Matt

[Matt Whiting]

Cockpit Colin wrote:

> Give us an insite as to what your diet is - that's where high BP starts.
>
>

It also can start from heredity.

Matt

[Mike]

> Good food, good beer, and great airplanes....

isn't a religious statement, IMHO, but damned if it ain't spiritual!!

[Bob Noel]

In article >, jsmith >
wrote:

> When Jay gets worried about Mary doing all the flying, he will have the
> incentive to do everything he has to do to get his BP down.
> Of course, Mary is probably cooking all the meals.
> Is this a conspiricy on her part?
> When she states that it is time for her to get her instrument ticket, we
> will have an answer.

Probably Mary's revenge for Jay blaming the worn brakes on her.

--
Bob Noel
looking for a sig the lawyers will like

[Jay Honeck]

> Probably Mary's revenge for Jay blaming the worn brakes on her.

Tires, Bob, tires.

Jeez...

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Cockpit Colin]

My experience is that excessive amounts of high glycemic index carbohydrates
will be causing most of your problem. (breads / potatoe / muffins / beers /
even most "sawdust bars" / the soup - and the caffeine in the coffee and
diet coke have much the same effect as the bad carbs in that they raise
insuline levels and promote fat storage.

There are a zillion diets out there - all of them different, and yet in many
ways, many of them are remarkably similar in both what they recommend you
eat and recommend you avoid.

Most recommend ...

Fruit - vegetables (pref not root vegetables) - lean meat (fish, chicken
etc)

Most discourage such things as bread / pasta / potatoe / anything with
caffiene.

For me the zone diet lowered my BP lowered my cholesterol lowered my weight
and a whole lot more - Atkins works well too once you understand that
although they say a high fat content is OK it doesn't mean that your protein
source HAS to be pork chops with saturated fats literally dripping from
them.

Just my 10c worth!

[Cockpit Colin]

Yes and no - yes in that there can be a tendency towards hypertension passed
in the genes, no in that it's been proven that diet affects the way in which
those genes choose to express themselves.

Personally, I have to wonder if the reason grandma + mum + the kids have
similar medical problems (including hypertension / obesity / type 2
diabeties etc) is that they've all eaten similar diets - passed down from
one generation to the next.


"Matt Whiting" > wrote in message
...
> Cockpit Colin wrote:
>
>> Give us an insite as to what your diet is - that's where high BP starts.
>>
>>
>
> It also can start from heredity.
>
> Matt

[Bob Noel]

In article <abN0e.16808$fn3.9993@attbi_s01>,
"Jay Honeck" > wrote:

> > Probably Mary's revenge for Jay blaming the worn brakes on her.
>
> Tires, Bob, tires.

You are blaming her for worn tires too?!

;-)

--
Bob Noel
looking for a sig the lawyers will like

[Jay Honeck]

> Personally, I have to wonder if the reason grandma + mum + the kids have
> similar medical problems (including hypertension / obesity / type 2
> diabeties etc) is that they've all eaten similar diets - passed down from
> one generation to the next.

No doubt. I was raised on meat, potato, gravy, fried eggs, butter -- the
traditional German-American diet.

I probably eat 30% of the red meat my parents did. I certainly am more
aware of fat, and am at least 20 pounds lighter than my Dad was at the same
age because of it.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[George Patterson]

Cockpit Colin wrote:
>
> Personally, I have to wonder if the reason grandma + mum + the kids have
> similar medical problems (including hypertension / obesity / type 2
> diabeties etc) is that they've all eaten similar diets - passed down from
> one generation to the next.

I would bet on this. It also ought to be easy to test. Just locate enough men
who've been married for, say, 20 years to a woman who cooks differently from the
food on which they were raised. See if they show significant differences in
health from that of their parents.

George Patterson
Drink up, Socrates -- it's all-natural.

[Matt Whiting]

Cockpit Colin wrote:
> Yes and no - yes in that there can be a tendency towards hypertension passed
> in the genes, no in that it's been proven that diet affects the way in which
> those genes choose to express themselves.
>
> Personally, I have to wonder if the reason grandma + mum + the kids have
> similar medical problems (including hypertension / obesity / type 2
> diabeties etc) is that they've all eaten similar diets - passed down from
> one generation to the next.

My hypertension came in in just 3 months. I went from 115/60 to 165/105
during one summer when I was 37. The doc was pretty worried at first
and checked all sorts of things (EKG, chest x-ray, every blood test
known to man, etc.). He found nothing wrong and my diet didn't change
during that 3 months. And diet changes and exercise since then have had
no appreciable affect. The doc said it was heredity and a low dose of
ACE inhibitor has kept the BP in check for nearly 8 years now.

Sure, diet affects a lot of things, but you simply can't blame every ill
on diet.


Matt

[Montblack]

(Scott D wrote)
>>I'v been told that many BP meds cause erectile disfuntion. Maybe you can
>>give us a report on that?

> And I was always told it was caused by marriage.


High BP or ED ...or both?


Montblack
"Go, get the butter."

[Cub Driver]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:52:16 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
> wrote:

>He has prescribed Vasotec for me,

I don't know this one. By all means ensure that you get a BP
medication that does not affect your ability to get a high pulse rate.
Otherwise you ruin your ability to maintain cardiovascular fitness.

My own BP was never so high that it would have caused the FAA to deny
me a medical, but it has proved very resistant to lowering by
medications. I have taken four different sorts over the years; oddly
enough, the most dramatic effect was from hydrochlorothiazide or HCTZ,
which also happens to be dirt cheap. If you must pay for your meds,
ask your doc about HCTZ. BJ's Wholesale Club prices it at eight bucks
for 100 tablets! You get a year for about $30. It's a diuretic.

I took the list of FAA disapproved BP meds to my doctor, who laughed
hugely. Said that nobody had prescribed any of that stuff since he'd
been practicing :)

However, I did get a bad reaction from one BP med when I was a student
pilot. Scared me enough that I never took it again. Alas, I can't
remember its name. Diovan is benign but expensive. Cardura
(doxy-something) is a great med if you have an enlarged prostate; it
lowers your BP while making it easier to empty your bladder. HCTZ as I
say is a blockbuster med that is dirt cheap.

Your mileage of course will vary.





-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net

[Cub Driver]

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 13:10:43 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
> wrote:

>My doc told me that weight training may actually *increase* blood pressure.

It lowers mine!

My doc says this is impossible, but I often take my BP three times
during a workout. I might go in there and have it read 135/75. After
20 minutes on an ellipitical trainer, it might drop to 120/70. Then
after half an hour on the weight machines, it will drop to 110/60.

It was so predictable that when I took my flight physical, I would
drive to the doc's an hour ahead of time. Then I would walk away from
his office for 30 mins, turn around, and walk back. I was sweaty for
my physical, but my BP was low.

Now I am NOT lifting my own body weight! This is weight training I'm
talking about, not weight lifting. And I use the machines, not free
weights. I choose a weight with which I can do 8-10 repetitions.



-- all the best, Dan Ford

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[Cub Driver]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:31:00 -0500, Dave Butler > wrote:

> Everything has sodium

Well, there's always Bite Sized Shredded Wheat. Of course, you'll have
to eat it without milk ...



-- all the best, Dan Ford

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[Cub Driver]

On 23 Mar 2005 12:54:17 -0800, wrote:

>Wouldn't want to get held up in the event I
>can't show a decent BP reading at the MD's office.

Your doc should accept readings taken at home, especially if you go in
and correlate your machine with his.

My doc handled it this way: he wrote a letter to me describing my
medical regimen, and saying: "In a recent series of BP readings, you
showed xx/xx, xx/xx, and xx/xx." Those were MY readings!

The FAA accepted that letter, though it did take three months to shake
the cert out of St Louis or wherever they hide them.



-- all the best, Dan Ford

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[Cub Driver]

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 18:39:38 -0500, "Blood pressure tip"
> wrote:

>he BOTTOM number, the one we all concern
>ourselves

Er .. no.

Both numbers are important, but most people are more concerned about
the top one. (Perhaps wrongly so, but in any event, the important
number is the one that is high for its range. 160/70 ought to worry
you, and so should 130/110.)


-- all the best, Dan Ford

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[Jay Honeck]

> Now I am NOT lifting my own body weight! This is weight training I'm
> talking about, not weight lifting. And I use the machines, not free
> weights. I choose a weight with which I can do 8-10 repetitions.

Same here. I go for maximum reps, not maximum weight.

With bench press I do 100 reps every other day, in 5 sets of 20 -- but it's
only 70 pounds. The idea is to build stamina and cardiovascular, not bulk.

Lower body (which we do on the "off" days from upper body) is a bit more
strenuous, but we're still talking 50 reps of all exercises, in 5 sets of
10 -- which tells you that we're not lifting the max weight possible.

And I walk a mile every morning, briskly.

And my BP is still high, dang it. :-(
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

['Vejita' S. Cousin]

In article >,
Cub Driver > wrote:
>On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:52:16 GMT, "Jay Honeck"
> wrote:
>
>>He has prescribed Vasotec for me,

This is an ACEI (aka ACE Inhibitor, aka angiotensin converting enzyme
inhibitor). It's works by affecting your BP at your kidneys. Most people
are posting about experiences they have had with beta-blockers (eg.
atenolol, metopolol) which can slow down your heart and cause other side
effects.
There's no logical reason an ACEI should affect your ability to fly.
As always talk to your primary MD for more info.

['Vejita' S. Cousin]

In article >,
Cub Driver > wrote:
>On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 15:31:00 -0500, Dave Butler > wrote:
>> Everything has sodium
>
>Well, there's always Bite Sized Shredded Wheat. Of course, you'll have
>to eat it without milk ...

It's important to remembe than when it comes to BP that sodium control
is not as important as people think. Of people that have high BP only 25%
respond to a low salt diet, that is the majority of with people high BP
(75%) salt intake as no (serious) affect on thier BP. And it has never
been shown that people that do not have high blood pressure will develop
it on a high salt diet.
However, salt those affect your kidneys and how much 'fluid' you carry
around in your body. Many people that have high BP also have other
medical conditions that make having lots of fluid less than ideal.
THe point I wanted to make was that you should cehck to see IF your
have high BP IS you respond to salt. If you (like most) do not then it's
ok to eat salty foods. However, edema (swelling, normaly of the feet and
hands) can occur if your high BP is due to certain causes or you have
other medical issues that often are seen at the same time as HTN (eg. CHF,
past MI, CAD, renal problems, etc.).

['Vejita' S. Cousin]

In article >,
>>he BOTTOM number, the one we all concern
>>ourselves
>
>Er .. no.
>
>Both numbers are important, but most people are more concerned about
>the top one. (Perhaps wrongly so, but in any event, the important
>number is the one that is high for its range. 160/70 ought to worry
>you, and so should 130/110.)

Both numbers are important, so is the difference between the numbers.
Worst outcmes have been observed with wide pulse pressures. The upper
number is the systolic blood pressure, and the lower number is the
diasytolic blood pressure. SBP and DBP. DBP reflects the pressure at
rest, and SBP reflects the increase in pressure when your heart
squeezes/pumps blood. High DBP is bad for 'end organ damage' (kidneys,
eyes, liver, etc). High SBP is bad for 'popping things': stroke, heart
attack, ulcers, etc.
A wide difference between the numbers (low resting pressure, but high
pressure to pump/move blood) normally means theres a 'blockage' somewhere
(often in the heart, eg. aortic stenosis; CAD leading to a blockage to the
brain, etc).
A lot of 'older' citizens will develop only high SBP. There's some
debate about the risk factors for having a normal DBP with a high SBP, but
on the whole we try to treat everyone. The problem is that most meds drop
both, so you don't have a lot of room to play with if someone is 160/75 :)

[George Patterson]

Cub Driver wrote:
>
> Now I am NOT lifting my own body weight! This is weight training I'm
> talking about, not weight lifting. And I use the machines, not free
> weights. I choose a weight with which I can do 8-10 repetitions.

According to a weight-training course I took in the dark ages for college PE,
this is the perfect weight for any exercise.

George Patterson
Drink up, Socrates -- it's all-natural.

[jsmith]

I have a dog.
Some studies have shown that pets help reduce one's BP.

[George Patterson]

jsmith wrote:
>
> I have a dog.
> Some studies have shown that pets help reduce one's BP.

Those studies obviously didn't involve my cats. MEERCAT, STOP THAT!!!!!!

George Patterson
Drink up, Socrates -- it's all-natural.

[Cockpit Colin]

What I constantly see is a situation where it's 95% diet and 5% hereditary -
and yet all of the 95% think they belong to the 5% - ie "it's not my fault -
and nothing can be done about it"




"Matt Whiting" > wrote in message
...
> Cockpit Colin wrote:
> > Yes and no - yes in that there can be a tendency towards hypertension
passed
> > in the genes, no in that it's been proven that diet affects the way in
which
> > those genes choose to express themselves.
> >
> > Personally, I have to wonder if the reason grandma + mum + the kids have
> > similar medical problems (including hypertension / obesity / type 2
> > diabeties etc) is that they've all eaten similar diets - passed down
from
> > one generation to the next.
>
> My hypertension came in in just 3 months. I went from 115/60 to 165/105
> during one summer when I was 37. The doc was pretty worried at first
> and checked all sorts of things (EKG, chest x-ray, every blood test
> known to man, etc.). He found nothing wrong and my diet didn't change
> during that 3 months. And diet changes and exercise since then have had
> no appreciable affect. The doc said it was heredity and a low dose of
> ACE inhibitor has kept the BP in check for nearly 8 years now.
>
> Sure, diet affects a lot of things, but you simply can't blame every ill
> on diet.
>
>
> Matt

[Jay Honeck]

> What I constantly see is a situation where it's 95% diet and 5%
> hereditary -
> and yet all of the 95% think they belong to the 5% - ie "it's not my
> fault -
> and nothing can be done about it"

Well, we're gonna have a serious go at discerning the difference. Day One
of my new diet is complete -- lots of fruit and vegetables, very little
salt, no red meat. I feel positively *burp* fruity...

I'm going to forego taking the meds for now, and go to my follow-up doctor's
visit in a month. We'll see if the BP is any different.

If it's not, after a serious month of dieting, I'll quietly take my
medicine, dammit.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Montblack]

("George Patterson" wrote)
> Those studies obviously didn't involve my cats. MEERCAT, STOP THAT!!!!!!


There are any number of lines...


Montblack :-)

[[email protected]]

In addition to the diet, exercise, and meds discussed in this thread,
I've always been curious whether there is any incremental benefit from
devices like these?:

www.cardiogrip.net
http://www.intercure.com/products.asp

[Cub Driver]

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 17:18:25 +0000 (UTC),
('Vejita' S. Cousin) wrote:

> A wide difference between the numbers (low resting pressure, but high
>pressure to pump/move blood) normally means theres a 'blockage' somewhere
>(often in the heart, eg. aortic stenosis; CAD leading to a blockage to the
>brain, etc).

I ran across the concept of "pulse pressure" on the internet and
sprang it on my doc. He scoffed at it. I think the differential was
anything greater than 40, meaning that one should be alarmed by a BP
of 130/60, which otherwise sounds admirable. (That's my BP on meds.)

But I certainly agree that it would be hard to treat in any event.


-- all the best, Dan Ford

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[Larry Dighera]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 02:31:36 GMT, George Patterson
> wrote in >::

>MEERCAT


You keep these? http://www.oaklandzoo.org/atoz/azmeerkat.html

[George Patterson]

Larry Dighera wrote:
>
> On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 02:31:36 GMT, George Patterson
> > wrote in >::
>
> >MEERCAT
>
> You keep these? http://www.oaklandzoo.org/atoz/azmeerkat.html

Nope. My stepson had just seen some of those at the Philly zoo when Elisabeth
found a kitten in a culvert - hence the name. We have a total of six cats, all
of which were strays. We also get to yell at our coonhound sometimes (the
neighbors are used to hearing "G*dammitt Ruby" at odd hours). Our conures yell
at us.

None of which leads us to believe reports that keeping pets reduces blood
pressure. Unless the pets are fish.

George Patterson
Drink up, Socrates -- it's all-natural.

[Matt Whiting]

Jay Honeck wrote:

>>What I constantly see is a situation where it's 95% diet and 5%
>>hereditary -
>>and yet all of the 95% think they belong to the 5% - ie "it's not my
>>fault -
>>and nothing can be done about it"
>
>
> Well, we're gonna have a serious go at discerning the difference. Day One
> of my new diet is complete -- lots of fruit and vegetables, very little
> salt, no red meat. I feel positively *burp* fruity...
>
> I'm going to forego taking the meds for now, and go to my follow-up doctor's
> visit in a month. We'll see if the BP is any different.
>
> If it's not, after a serious month of dieting, I'll quietly take my
> medicine, dammit.

I hope it works for you. It didn't for me. The good news is that the
ACE meds are very effective and, for me, have had no side affects, not
even the cough often mentioned.


Matt

[Corky Scott]

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 01:30:38 GMT, jsmith > wrote:

>I have a dog.
>Some studies have shown that pets help reduce one's BP

I'm not positive but I think studies have shown that it's not so much
having the dog that makes the difference, it's the excersize you get
walking it...

Although petting your adoring dog might have some palliative effect.

Corky Scott

[Jay Masino]

Corky Scott > wrote:
>>I have a dog.
>>Some studies have shown that pets help reduce one's BP
>
> I'm not positive but I think studies have shown that it's not so much
> having the dog that makes the difference, it's the excersize you get
> walking it...

I think the same "relaxation" effect can be obtained with other types of
pets (like cats), too, so I don't think they were refering to walking it.

--- Jay



--
__!__
Jay and Teresa Masino ___(_)___
http://www2.ari.net/jmasino ! ! !
http://www.oceancityairport.com
http://www.oc-adolfos.com

[Cub Driver]

On Mon, 28 Mar 2005 12:21:38 -0500, Corky Scott
> wrote:

>Although petting your adoring dog might have some palliative effect.

I detest dogs, for the most part. Cats the same. I used to say: "Men
and their dogs! Women and their cats!"

Then a year ago, Sally bought two Maine Coon Cat kittens. One of them
is just a plan dumb feline, or smart feline, but anyhow the sort of
critter you'd kick out of your way if you were sure your wife would
never know about it.

But the other is the most endearing animal I've ever met. I just enjoy
having him around. I'm a bit shy to say it, but we like to butt heads.
I will also pick him up, inverted, and he will box my face with his
claws tucked in.

This is the first time I've experienced what others seem to get from
pets, and I must say that to the extent that being overtly happy will
translate to a longer life, then pets are a good thing. (Unless
they're the kind you want to kick :) Harry Potter (such is his name)
makes me happy.




-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
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the blog: www.danford.net

[Cockpit Colin]

> Well, we're gonna have a serious go at discerning the difference. Day One
> of my new diet is complete -- lots of fruit and vegetables, very little
> salt, no red meat. I feel positively *burp* fruity...

Nothing wrong with red meat as a protein source - just cut off the visable
fat. Fish / Chicken still rate slightly better though.

Good luck with it - let us know how you get on.

Just one thing to keep in mind - your body will always take the path of
least resistance when it comes to carbs (ie sugar) - it's no good eating
lots of meat / veges / fruit etc, then (for example) washing it down with a
Coke (or devouring a Moro bar if your peckish).

If you're doing it right you'll probably get a headache later in the day for
a couple of days as your body adjusts to the lower sugar levels - you often
lose around 10 pounds in the first week too, although around 80% of this is
water (1 part glycogon stored in the liver binds with around 4 parts water -
so as the glycogon is used up first the water "passes through" - and the
weight comes off - insulin levels drop - BP drops - less free radicles -
less sleep needed - more consistant energy - no indigestion - and less
farting!

[Jay Honeck]

>> Well, we're gonna have a serious go at discerning the difference. Day
>> One
>> of my new diet is complete -- lots of fruit and vegetables, very little
>> salt, no red meat. I feel positively *burp* fruity...
>
> Good luck with it - let us know how you get on.

Well, I'm right at 184 pounds today, down from 192 (197 with clothes on at
the doctor's office).

I'm never hungry, because I'm absolutely stuffed with apples, pears and
bananas. Fruit, coffee, a vitamin C, and a multi-vitamin are what I
subsist on for breakfast and lunch. I then allow myself a "normal" dinner,
although I've tried to stick with salad bars and chicken.

The fresh lake perch Mary brought back from Wisconsin the other day was a
terrible, wonderful exception. ($23 a POUND that stuff is now -- and it
used to be considered a "cheap" meal, when I was a kid!) With sand-dollar
potatoes, and hush puppies. Mmmmmmm, grease... ;-)

One thing I've noticed -- I can't run as far without stopping. I can't run
a mile without walking, so I suppose my body is just not used to the lower
caloric intake yet. I hope it adapts soon -- it was positively embarrassing
at CAP the other night, when I ran a mile almost a full minute slower than I
did just two months ago!

Dunno. It's a neat way to diet, though, cuz (a) I'm never hungry, and (b) I
get a normal dinner, so I don't feel deprived.

I'll let you know if the BP improves as the fat melts away!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Cockpit Colin]

I admire the effort - but to be honest, I think your planning sounds a
little "hit and miss" at the moment. What lowers blood sugar levels - which
inturn lowers insulin levels - which in turn reverses the "sugar to fat"
storage process and lowers BP is low-glycemic-index food.

Aim for foods with a glycemic index of less than 50 (apples = good; bananas
= bad; off memory pears = bad too). Coffee has the same simulant effect as
sugar, so the more you drink of it, the more you're working against your
other efforts.

Most people don't realise how little effect green vegies and lean meat has
on metabolism - you could eat 2 chicken breasts and 5 cups of vegies 3 times
a day and still lose weight (and gain the other benefits).

If you're lacking energy then you're body is still trying to run on stores
of "easy fuel" - you first need to deplete the liver stores of excess
glycogon (which is what's happeneing - weight is dropping off (it's just
water)) - but your body hasn't adapted to processing the low-density carbs
yet (takes about 3 days) - what speeds up the process is being particularly
careful to stay away from "bad carbs" during this time

[Cub Driver]

On Sun, 3 Apr 2005 00:45:39 +1200, "Cockpit Colin" >
wrote:

>you often
>lose around 10 pounds in the first week too,

And then, without change in your diet, and after a month or six months
of stable weight, you begin to gain a pound a month until you weigh
slightly more than you did at the beginning.

The body is a very efficient mechanism for warding off starvation,
which it sees lurking arund every corner.


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
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the blog: www.danford.net

[George Patterson]

Cockpit Colin wrote:
>
> Coffee has the same simulant effect as
> sugar, ....

Coffee, or caffeine?

George Patterson
Whosoever bloweth not his own horn, the same shall remain unblown.