This is one for the books.

[airman]

Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?

See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559

[Gig 601XL Builder]

"airman" > wrote in message
om...
> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>
> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559
>
>

Well of course not. What it does do is add hours of sunlight when more
people are awake.

I remember back during the "Oil Crisis" when they didn't revert to standard
time in the winter. I loved it but I was between 10 & 12 years old at the
time.

Personally I hate it being dark in at 5:00 when I get off work in the
winter.

[Allen]

"airman" > wrote in message
om...
> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>
> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559
>

No, I think it just gives us less night ; >)

[Mark Hansen]

On 4/7/2005 11:09, airman wrote:

> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>
> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>
> http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559
>
>

As far as the aviation rules are concerned, night time is dependent on
the position of the Sun, and not an arbitrary time value. If you're
talking about whether your flight will be considered legal or not, the
wall-clock time has nothing to do with it.


--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL
Sacramento, CA

[Peter Duniho]

"airman" > wrote in message
om...
> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?

It's "daylight saving time".

"More"? No. "Later"? Yes. That's the whole point.

It's funny...there's a whole comment-fest going on at slashdot.org right now
on this very topic. Bottom line, if we want to conserve energy, there are
much better ways to do it than mucking around with daylight saving time.

For those of us pilots tied to our clocks, rather than the natural rhythm of
sunrise and sunset, extending daylight saving time would make it easier to
land before sunset. But we'd have more morning flights in the dark. Hard
to say it's better than a wash. I guess it depends on what time you
normally get up and go to sleep.

Pete

[John Theune]

Mark Hansen wrote:
> On 4/7/2005 11:09, airman wrote:
>
>> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>>
>> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>>
>> http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559
>>
>>
>>
>
> As far as the aviation rules are concerned, night time is dependent on
> the position of the Sun, and not an arbitrary time value. If you're
> talking about whether your flight will be considered legal or not, the
> wall-clock time has nothing to do with it.
>
>
However, I believe the times for sunset are given in local time not GMT
and all those tables would have to be updated.

[Mark Hansen]

On 4/7/2005 12:01, John Theune wrote:

> Mark Hansen wrote:
>> On 4/7/2005 11:09, airman wrote:
>>
>>> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>>>
>>> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>>>
>>> http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> As far as the aviation rules are concerned, night time is dependent on
>> the position of the Sun, and not an arbitrary time value. If you're
>> talking about whether your flight will be considered legal or not, the
>> wall-clock time has nothing to do with it.
>>
>>
> However, I believe the times for sunset are given in local time not GMT
> and all those tables would have to be updated.

Actually, the times are based on calculations that only know about
your latitude/longitude. The local time is added later when the
final table is printed.

In any case, what I meant was a change to the daylight time rule
would not result in more time during the day to fly under daylight
rules. It would simply shift the period forward or back a little,
based on the local offset from GMT.


--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL
Sacramento, CA

[Casey Wilson]

"airman" > wrote in message
om...
> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>
> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>
Depends on your perspective. The quote sounds really stupid, like
the farmer that sued the government for changing the day and making his
crops fail, or the dairy operator whose cows went berserk and didn't give
the milk at the assigned (DST) time.
Personally, I don't particularly like daylight savings time in the first
place. But, considering the logic of shifting the clock hands so more
daylight appears at the end of the day does make sense in conserving
electricity. Ask your municipality what are the costs for street lighting
and it won't make any difference over the year. But if all the house lights
don't go on for another hour into the evening, the energy savings could be
substantial.
There's two problems here. Hardly anybody understands the "savings" part
of DST, and legislators like Markey make stupid statements -- or, the
statement is taken out of context.

[John Galban]

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
>
> Well of course not. What it does do is add hours of sunlight when
more
> people are awake.

Probably a good reason that we don't have that Daylight Savings Time
nonsense here in Arizona. Around here, energy use is significantly
higher when the sun is shining.
>
> I remember back during the "Oil Crisis" when they didn't revert to
standard
> time in the winter. I loved it but I was between 10 & 12 years old at
the
> time.

You liked that? I remember having to go to school while it was
still pitch dark outside. I hated it.

John Galban=====>N4BQ (PA28-180)

[Blueskies]

"Gig 601XL Builder" <wr.giacona@coxDOTnet> wrote in message news:dVe5e.3332$up2.668@okepread01...
>
> "airman" > wrote in message om...
>> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>>
>> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>>
>> http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559
>>
>>
>
> Well of course not. What it does do is add hours of sunlight when more people are awake.
>
> I remember back during the "Oil Crisis" when they didn't revert to standard time in the winter. I loved it but I was
> between 10 & 12 years old at the time.
>
> Personally I hate it being dark in at 5:00 when I get off work in the winter.
>
>

Then adjust your work schedule...

[Blueskies]

"Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in message news:x3g5e.889$hB6.333@trnddc06...
> Depends on your perspective. Personally, I don't particularly like daylight savings time in the first
> place.

That's about the only thing I agree with in this discussion. I don't like DST at all. It is an outdated primitive way to
control peoples actions. If you want more daylight at the end of your day, get up earlier!

[Peter Duniho]

"Casey Wilson" <N2310D @ gmail.com> wrote in message
news:x3g5e.889$hB6.333@trnddc06...
> [...] if all the house lights
> don't go on for another hour into the evening, the energy savings could be
> substantial.

I guess that depends on your definition of "substantial". 10,000 barrels
out of 20 million doesn't sound substantial to me, even if we could save
that every day of the year (rather than the two months daylight saving, no
"s", time would be extended). There are lots better, more practical and
more effective ways to conserve energy than this.

When we have no way to save 10%, 1%, 0.1%, 0.01%, and 0.001% of our daily
energy consumption, then maybe we can worry about something like this.
Until then, I'd say this is either a suggestion from someone without their
brain engaged, or it's a suggestion from someone with a hidden agenda (ie,
the change would profit someone other than the American people).

Since we're talking about a Congressperson here, it's hard to tell the
difference sometimes, but either way it ain't good.

Pete

[Morgans]

"Blueskies" wrote

If you want more daylight at the end of your day, get up earlier!

That assumes you have control (many people do not) over your assigned
working hours. You know what assuming means.
--
Jim in NC

[Blueskies]

"Morgans" > wrote in message ...
>
> "Blueskies" wrote
>
> If you want more daylight at the end of your day, get up earlier!
>
> That assumes you have control (many people do not) over your assigned
> working hours. You know what assuming means.
> --
> Jim in NC



Then the employer should work with their folks to set the hours, rather than having the gov't mandate it for all...

[Montblack]

("Blueskies" wrote)
> Then the employer should work with their folks to set the hours, rather
> than having the gov't mandate it for all...


A: That'll never happen.

B: We like DST.

We really, really like DST - there, I just voted twice.


Mont and Black

[Earl Grieda]

"Blueskies" > wrote in message
. com...
>
> "Morgans" > wrote in message
...
> >
> > "Blueskies" wrote
> >
> > If you want more daylight at the end of your day, get up earlier!
> >
> > That assumes you have control (many people do not) over your assigned
> > working hours. You know what assuming means.
> > --
> > Jim in NC
>
>
>
> Then the employer should work with their folks to set the hours, rather
than having the gov't mandate it for all...
>

Since the government "mandates" the time whether it is DST or not, what is
your point?

[Blueskies]

"Earl Grieda" > wrote in message
ink.net...
>
> "Blueskies" > wrote in message
> . com...
>>
>> "Morgans" > wrote in message
> ...
>> >
>> > "Blueskies" wrote
>> >
>> > If you want more daylight at the end of your day, get up earlier!
>> >
>> > That assumes you have control (many people do not) over your assigned
>> > working hours. You know what assuming means.
>> > --
>> > Jim in NC
>>
>>
>>
>> Then the employer should work with their folks to set the hours, rather
> than having the gov't mandate it for all...
>>
>
> Since the government "mandates" the time whether it is DST or not, what is
> your point?
>

I suppose that is true. Maybe we should all refer to Zulu? My point is changing the time around only throws things out
of whack, like jet lag...

[bob]

Does anyone ever wonder how a govt so notoriously incompetent and
unable to accomplish even minor tasks could have EVER pulled of
anything so incredibly convoluted and complex as manipulating TIME... I
still find it hard to believe...

[Jay Honeck]

> We really, really like DST - there, I just voted twice.

Add two more votes.

In fact, I would vote to get rid of "regular" time (whatever that is) and
just keep it on "daylight saving time" -- since it's all arbitrary anyway.

Even here in Iowa, farmers are a tiny percentage. Why in the world we make
our whole world revolve around "milking time" anymore is just beyond me --
give me evening daylight!
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

[Blueskies]

"bob" > wrote in message ups.com...
> Does anyone ever wonder how a govt so notoriously incompetent and
> unable to accomplish even minor tasks could have EVER pulled of
> anything so incredibly convoluted and complex as manipulating TIME... I
> still find it hard to believe...
>

It took Benjamin Franklin's prowess and diplomacy...

[jsmith]

For the same reason our schools run September to June.

Jay Honeck wrote:
> Even here in Iowa, farmers are a tiny percentage. Why in the world we make
> our whole world revolve around "milking time" anymore is just beyond me --
> give me evening daylight!

[Matt Barrow]

"Jay Honeck" > wrote in message
news:Fwv5e.31289$NW5.30582@attbi_s02...
> Even here in Iowa, farmers are a tiny percentage. Why in the world we
make
> our whole world revolve around "milking time" anymore is just beyond me --

They'll miss reruns of "Hee Haw".

[Jay Masino]

In rec.aviation.piloting Jay Honeck > wrote:
>> We really, really like DST - there, I just voted twice.
>
> Add two more votes.
>
> In fact, I would vote to get rid of "regular" time (whatever that is) and
> just keep it on "daylight saving time" -- since it's all arbitrary anyway.

I agree! Let's keep DST in place all year around!

--- Jay




--
__!__
Jay and Teresa Masino ___(_)___
http://www2.ari.net/jmasino ! ! !
http://www.oceancityairport.com
http://www.oc-adolfos.com

[Blueskies]

"Jay Masino" > wrote in message ...
> In rec.aviation.piloting Jay Honeck > wrote:
>>> We really, really like DST - there, I just voted twice.
>>
>> Add two more votes.
>>
>> In fact, I would vote to get rid of "regular" time (whatever that is) and
>> just keep it on "daylight saving time" -- since it's all arbitrary anyway.
>
> I agree! Let's keep DST in place all year around!
>
> --- Jay
>
>

Yup, just shift all the time zones east one notch and wait for a few years, then do it again...

[Highflyer]

"Blueskies" > wrote in message
om...
>
> Yup, just shift all the time zones east one notch and wait for a few
> years, then do it again...

Great idea. When we get to the point where Central time is the same as Zulu
we can stop. Then I won't have to bother trying to remember the offset all
the time! :-)

Highflyer

[David CL Francis]

On Thu, 7 Apr 2005 at 14:11:07 in message
. com>, John Galban
> wrote:
>Gig 601XL Builder wrote:
>>
>> Well of course not. What it does do is add hours of sunlight when
>more
>> people are awake.
>
> Probably a good reason that we don't have that Daylight Savings Time
>nonsense here in Arizona. Around here, energy use is significantly
>higher when the sun is shining.
>>
>> I remember back during the "Oil Crisis" when they didn't revert to
>standard
>> time in the winter. I loved it but I was between 10 & 12 years old at
>the
>> time.
>
> You liked that? I remember having to go to school while it was
>still pitch dark outside. I hated it.

In the UK during WW2 we had 'summer' time all the year round and
'double' summer time during the normal summer time period. I think the
idea then was to help boost factory production. I was at school then and
had to ride a mile to the rail station to catch an 07:35 train to
school. Mind you T think that almost all of the UK (except perhaps the
Channel Islands) are well north of all of the USA. So we get shorter
winter days.
--
David CL Francis

[David CL Francis]

On Fri, 8 Apr 2005 at 13:18:29 in message
<Fwv5e.31289$NW5.30582@attbi_s02>, Jay Honeck >
wrote:

>Even here in Iowa, farmers are a tiny percentage. Why in the world we make
>our whole world revolve around "milking time" anymore is just beyond me --
>give me evening daylight!

I believe in the UK it was claimed that it reduced road accidents
particularly to children coming home from school.
--
David CL Francis

[Steve Foley]

No, but it would give all the software companies a new reason to sell us an
upgrade.


"airman" > wrote in message
om...
> Would extending daylight savings time give us more daylight?
>
> See Rep. Ed Markey's comments:
>
>
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=5&u=/ap/20050407/ap_on_go_co/daylight_time&sid=84439559
>
>