Need recomendations for buying a welding /brazing torch...

[Wright1902Glider]

Hello everyone,

Just stepped in from the shop for a few moments. I need a recomendation and/or
input (based on actual experience please) regarding a BurnzOMatic Oxy/MAPP gas
torch. That's the one on the Home Depot shelf that uses two small cylinders and
sells for about $50. Has anyone ever used one of these, and are they capable
of doing work? Or are they mostly just a cruel joke? If they do work, what is
the actual capacity of a torch like this? My budget and girlfriend currently
will not permit the purchase of a standard Oxy/Actylene torch, and my MAPP
gas/air soldering torch will not quite generate enough heat to braze the parts
that I need to join. I tried a Actylene/air torch as well, but it wasn't hot
enough either.

The parts that I need to join are a 3/8" mild steel rod, and a 16-ga. mild
sheet-steel "saddle." The sheet-steel saddle is 1 1/2" long x 1 1/2" wide with
a "hump" in it 3/8" deep that fits over the 3/8" rod. On either side of the
hump are flanges about 1/2" wide with mounting holes drilled in them. In
cross-section, it looks like the Greek letter Omega. The saddle portion holds
the rod portion of the part to the wing spars. The flight loads on this part
will be mostly tortional, i.e. keeping the rod from turning inside the saddle.

Thanks for your help,
Harry Frey
Wright Brothers Enterprises

[Rich S.]

"Wright1902Glider" > wrote in message
...
> My budget and girlfriend currently
> will not permit the purchase of a standard Oxy/Actylene torch, and my MAPP
> gas/air soldering torch will not quite generate enough heat to braze the
> parts
> that I need to join. I tried a Actylene/air torch as well, but it wasn't
> hot
> enough either.

Harry..........

I just bought a portable (small) complete oxyacetylene cutting/welding torch
unit - with full tanks - for $7 at a garage sale. Stop shopping the big box
stores and look around. I find 2-3 deals like this every year.

Rich S.

[John Ammeter]

On 28 Sep 2004 21:09:06 GMT,
(Wright1902Glider) wrote:

>Hello everyone,
>
>Just stepped in from the shop for a few moments. I need a recomendation and/or
>input (based on actual experience please) regarding a BurnzOMatic Oxy/MAPP gas
>torch. That's the one on the Home Depot shelf that uses two small cylinders and
>sells for about $50. Has anyone ever used one of these, and are they capable
>of doing work? Or are they mostly just a cruel joke? If they do work, what is
>the actual capacity of a torch like this? My budget and girlfriend currently
>will not permit the purchase of a standard Oxy/Actylene torch, and my MAPP
>gas/air soldering torch will not quite generate enough heat to braze the parts
>that I need to join. I tried a Actylene/air torch as well, but it wasn't hot
>enough either.
>
>The parts that I need to join are a 3/8" mild steel rod, and a 16-ga. mild
>sheet-steel "saddle." The sheet-steel saddle is 1 1/2" long x 1 1/2" wide with
>a "hump" in it 3/8" deep that fits over the 3/8" rod. On either side of the
>hump are flanges about 1/2" wide with mounting holes drilled in them. In
>cross-section, it looks like the Greek letter Omega. The saddle portion holds
>the rod portion of the part to the wing spars. The flight loads on this part
>will be mostly tortional, i.e. keeping the rod from turning inside the saddle.
>
>Thanks for your help,
>Harry Frey
>Wright Brothers Enterprises

I owned one of these items..... note the word "owned" as in
past tense.

Actually, I may have it still somewhere around here but I
found it pretty much too expensive to use because of the
high cost of oxygen. Mapp is bad enough... oxy is even
worse. Plus it really didn't put out that much heat.

I'd strongly recommend that you find a friend with an
oxy/actylene setup and buy him a beer for his time and
troubles doing the job for you.

I've now got a portable oxy/actylene setup and it's been all
I've needed for the small jobs I have occasionally.

John Ammeter

[John Ammeter]

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 15:32:21 -0700, "Rich S."
> wrote:

>"Wright1902Glider" > wrote in message
...
>> My budget and girlfriend currently
>> will not permit the purchase of a standard Oxy/Actylene torch, and my MAPP
>> gas/air soldering torch will not quite generate enough heat to braze the
>> parts
>> that I need to join. I tried a Actylene/air torch as well, but it wasn't
>> hot
>> enough either.
>
>Harry..........
>
>I just bought a portable (small) complete oxyacetylene cutting/welding torch
>unit - with full tanks - for $7 at a garage sale. Stop shopping the big box
>stores and look around. I find 2-3 deals like this every year.
>
>Rich S.
>

Rich,

You should be ashamed of yourself!!! That's outright
theft!!

I'll offer you $50 for the setup and even let you use it
occasionally.

John

[Rich S.]

"John Ammeter" > wrote in message
...
> Rich,
>
> You should be ashamed of yourself!!! That's outright theft!!
>
> I'll offer you $50 for the setup and even let you use it occasionally.

John.........

I'd give it to you. but. . . enybody who can afford a gorgeous house like
that doesn't have time to use a torch!

Folks - you ought to see it. It's about a hunnert feet long and overlooks
Puget Sound. I tell you that Ampmeter knows how to live!

John - you gonna have a roof on it before the rains come?

Rich S.

[John Ammeter]

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 15:58:28 -0700, "Rich S."
> wrote:

>"John Ammeter" > wrote in message
...
>> Rich,
>>
>> You should be ashamed of yourself!!! That's outright theft!!
>>
>> I'll offer you $50 for the setup and even let you use it occasionally.
>
>John.........
>
>I'd give it to you. but. . . enybody who can afford a gorgeous house like
>that doesn't have time to use a torch!
>
>Folks - you ought to see it. It's about a hunnert feet long and overlooks
>Puget Sound. I tell you that Ampmeter knows how to live!
>
>John - you gonna have a roof on it before the rains come?
>
>Rich S.
>

Aw, quit exaggerating... it's only 68' 2" long ( I just
checked the plans) and the deck across the front is only 58'
long.

The roof was about half done when I was over there last
Saturday. It's probably all roofed by now.

I'm going over Thursday to deliver the fan motor assembly to
the HVAC guy to install. I'm also going to be mowing the
front acre if possible.... I haven't been able to mow it
since I broke my knee last August 10th and, with the recent
rains, it's really started to grow again... About 10" and
thick, too. I'd better bring a six-pack along with me on
the riding mower... should be at least 2 1/2 hours of
mowing...

John

[JH]

Harry:

If this is the only application, you might consider a friend or local shop
to get this job done and move on. Unless you are making a lot of joints, it
probably isn't worth the time/money.

[Jim Carriere]

Wright1902Glider wrote:
> Hello everyone,
>
> Just stepped in from the shop for a few moments. I need a recomendation and/or
> input (based on actual experience please) regarding a BurnzOMatic Oxy/MAPP gas
> torch. That's the one on the Home Depot shelf that uses two small cylinders and
> sells for about $50. Has anyone ever used one of these, and are they capable
> of doing work? Or are they mostly just a cruel joke? If they do work, what is
> the actual capacity of a torch like this? My budget and girlfriend currently
> will not permit the purchase of a standard Oxy/Actylene torch, and my MAPP
> gas/air soldering torch will not quite generate enough heat to braze the parts
> that I need to join. I tried a Actylene/air torch as well, but it wasn't hot
> enough either.
>
> The parts that I need to join are a 3/8" mild steel rod, and a 16-ga. mild
> sheet-steel "saddle." The sheet-steel saddle is 1 1/2" long x 1 1/2" wide with
> a "hump" in it 3/8" deep that fits over the 3/8" rod. On either side of the
> hump are flanges about 1/2" wide with mounting holes drilled in them. In
> cross-section, it looks like the Greek letter Omega. The saddle portion holds
> the rod portion of the part to the wing spars. The flight loads on this part
> will be mostly tortional, i.e. keeping the rod from turning inside the saddle.

I have one of these, I got it about 10 years ago.

I was happy with using it for cutting.

I would not use this torch to weld anything used on an aircraft. For
making a jackstand, jig, or some other odds-and-ends for use around
the shop, I personally don't see anything wrong with that. The torch
has one head for all jobs (from cutting to welding) regardless of the
size of the workpiece, and what little knowledge I have of gas
welding gives me a bad gut feeling about it.

One of John Ammeter's covers one of my biggest points- the oxygen is
very expensive and uses up quick in these. I remember using up a few
cylinders (the O2 cylinder can empty in about 5 minutes) before I
figured out a good technique to set the oxygen flow.

The flame temperature is as hot as you'll ever need. Back when I got
the set, I looked up adiabatic flame temperatures for various gases.
ISTR that propylene and oxygen is only about 100F cooler than
oxyacetylene. Propylene (aka methyl acetylene) very similar to
acetylene and is a major component of MAPP gas.

The flame size is also very small, but I would say it is just large
enough to weld the workpieces you describe.

The big picture is as the other replies have stated, there may be
better ways to skin this cat.

[Barnyard BOb -]

>Folks - you ought to see it. It's about a hunnert feet long and overlooks
>Puget Sound. I tell you that Ampmeter knows how to live!
>
>John - you gonna have a roof on it before the rains come?
>
>Rich S.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

If not...
Maybe, you'll get an invite to drain the swimming pool.


Barnyard Bob

[Wright1902Glider]

Thanks for the input fellas. Believe me, I'd pawn my television if I found a
Lincoln Port-a-torch rig like that one at a garage sale... even if it was $100.
But the thing is, that here in Covington, GA, there just aren't a whole lot of
guys that weld. And the ones that do all think that they're custom motorcycle
builders right now. And so finding tools at a garage sale is next to
impossible... I've never even seen a cordless drill for sale, much less a
torch rig or a MIG. Believe me I've been looking. If anyone has one for sale
within 100 miles of Atlanta, please let me know.

Thanks for the input on the small torch as well. I assumed that the cost of
the cylinders at $8 each would be tremendous. But I don't have a lot of work
to do.

Harry Frey
Wright Brothers Enterprises